FH Mini #111 - Film Programming, with Cristina Cacioppo

Elliott Kalan

[0:00] Hey, everybody. Remember FlopTV, the one-hour online video version of the Flophouse podcast that we produced last year?

[0:06] Well, I'm excited to tell you it is coming back.

[0:09] FlopTV 2, the sequel, will be broadcasting live to your computer screen the first Saturday of every month from September through February.

[0:17] We're talking only about sequels this season.

[0:20] RoboCop 2, Breaking 2, Highlander 2, Caddyshack 2, Ski School 2, and Ninja Turtles 2, The Secret of the Ooze.

[0:27] It's going to be all new jokes, all new presentations, movies we have never covered on the show before, all in a tight one-hour-ish package.

[0:36] Can't join us the night of the show? That's okay.

[0:38] The videos for every episode will remain online through the end of February, so you can binge them or dole them out as you prefer.

[0:44] So that's FlopTV 2, the first Saturday of every month from September through February.

[0:50] For tickets and more information, go to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

[0:54] Again, that's flophousepodcast.com slash events.

[0:57] FlopTV 2, everything you loved about FlopTV, but again.

Dan McCoy

[1:06] Hey, everyone, and welcome to another Flophouse Mini.

[1:09] I'm Dan McCoy.

[1:11] I'm Stuart Wellington.

Elliott Kalan

[1:13] And I'm Elliot Kalin.

[1:16] I'm floating away.

[1:18] Sorry about that.

[1:18] Let him go.

[1:20] I turn around, but I don't know how it works.

Stuart Wellington

[1:22] You know, I always thought Elliot was full of hot air.

Dan McCoy

[1:25] Okay, I'm coming back down now to face these allegations.

[1:30] Face, yeah.

[1:31] Okay, well, today we have our special guest, Christina Cacioppo, director of programming at Nighthawk.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42] I'm only laughing because Dan had this told to him a moment ago and then had it reminded to him a moment ago.

Dan McCoy

[1:47] Yeah, and you could hear and you could see in my face that I had already forgotten the specifics of the title.

[1:53] And that is one of the many short-term memory problems.

Elliott Kalan

[1:57] What I was imagining was you as a pith-helmeted explorer with a machete, hacking your way through all the commercial jingles and TV theme songs you do remember instantly to get to the information that you just found out and needed to say.

Stuart Wellington

[2:11] Yeah, he got through that intro like he had a driving instructor right off his shoulder.

Dan McCoy

[2:16] Anyway, welcome, Christina.

[2:18] We haven't even let you say anything.

[2:20] Welcome.

[2:20] Hello.

[2:21] Hello.

[2:22] Thank you for having me.

[2:23] Yes, thank you for being here.

[2:25] Now, regular listeners, of course, will know that we've referenced you a lot.

[2:32] You've been a friend to the pod for a long time.

[2:35] As we said, you're a programmer at Nighthawk.

[2:39] You've programmed movies a lot of different places.

[2:41] But we're going to start off with personal history.

[2:44] And by personal history, I mean personal history with the flop house.

[2:47] Yeah, yeah, okay.

Stuart Wellington

[2:49] Tell me about your history, but how it's important to me.

[2:52] How it affects the three of us particularly.

Elliott Kalan

[2:54] Christina, for anyone who is not part of the New York film scene, especially the New York film theater revival scene and revival screening scene, you want to know that Christina is a very important kind of staple, linchpin, kind of central figure in, I feel like, that New York scene.

[3:13] It has been for many years.

[3:14] So I'm very excited to have her.

[3:15] Yeah.

[3:16] Thank you.

[3:16] That's very kind of you to say.

Dan McCoy

[3:19] Yes.

[3:19] And a very important place in flop house lore because.

Elliott Kalan

[3:24] Keep bringing it back to the flop house.

Stuart Wellington

[3:26] There's no compliment that can't be tied back to the flop house.

[3:28] Yeah, if we're talking about New York film stuff, we're like what?

[3:31] Like, did you have a Kim's video membership card?

[3:35] Is that how you check somebody's film bona fides in New York?

Dan McCoy

[3:39] Allie, you saw my list of questions.

[3:42] You know how they're arranged.

[3:44] That's true.

[3:45] There will be non-flop house questions later.

[3:47] Eventually, we'll get to the other stuff.

[3:49] But I just wanted to acknowledge that Christina was the first person to sort of get us to do live shows.

[3:56] I think that she programmed us first.

[4:00] And I was going to ask, can you remember which was the very first one and how it came about?

[4:05] Why?

S4

[4:06] Well, I did have to study and cheat a little bit.

[4:09] Because I was like, do I remember this?

[4:13] You know, was the first one?

[4:14] Don't tell her it's me.

[4:15] But, you know, luckily I have access to my old 92 I Tribeca calendar.

Elliott Kalan

[4:20] Oh, cool.

S4

[4:21] And also spoke to Matt and Ksenia.

[4:24] So, yes, I think our first thing was Twin Sitters.

Elliott Kalan

[4:27] Oh, right.

[4:28] Does that sound right?

[4:28] I think you're right.

S4

[4:30] And, you know, thinking about how it came about, you know, Elliot, we had your series.

Elliott Kalan

[4:37] That was what, Closely Watched Films?

[4:39] Closely Watched Films.

[4:40] I had met Christina because 92 I Tribeca, which used to be a downtown film screening space and live show space.

[4:49] Christina, you were the programmer there.

[4:51] And I'm trying to remember who matched us up.

[4:53] But I went over and I met you.

[4:55] We had kind of like a cold meeting just about like.

S4

[4:58] Yeah, you had pitched me on that series and I really liked the idea of it.

[5:02] And so we had started out that way.

[5:04] And I think at the same time Matt and Ksenia were doing I Love Bad Movies.

[5:08] Yes.

[5:09] And so, you know, you guys can fill in the gaps for me from your point of view because I sort of remember maybe talking to Matt and Ksenia first.

[5:17] Like I don't really even remember when I met Dan and Stuart, you know.

[5:20] Yeah.

[5:20] Because they're eternal.

Stuart Wellington

[5:21] They just like.

[5:22] Well, yeah, I've always been with you.

Dan McCoy

[5:24] Let's introduce the listening audience to Matt and Ksenia.

[5:28] Yes, we should.

[5:28] These characters who have been mentioned.

[5:31] Matt.

[5:32] Carmen.

[5:33] Matt Carmen.

[5:34] Art man.

[5:35] Art car.

[5:36] Is known to people but not known to people who listen to the show as our man behind the scenes.

[5:41] You have enjoyed his work without knowing it probably because he does a lot of tech stuff for us.

[5:47] He helps assemble like the presentation decks for a live show.

[5:52] He runs Flop TV.

Elliott Kalan

[5:54] Any streaming show we've ever done where we're doing live over the internet, Matt is heavily involved in the tech.

[6:00] And his wife, Ksenia Roche, who I would have introduced first because I've known her longer.

[6:05] She's one of my oldest friends, is also an incredibly valued member of the kind of this Flophouse adjacent, let's say, kind of New York film community.

[6:18] And the two of them, they put out a zine called I Love Bad Movies for quite some time.

[6:21] And they would do bad movie screenings also.

[6:24] And so there are people who have had a big impact on this podcast in particular, even if the audience is not fully aware of them.

Dan McCoy

[6:31] I thought you were going to say like incredibly important to sort of like the nerd world in New York because that's true.

Elliott Kalan

[6:37] I decided to take a page out of the Dan McCoy playbook and only relate things to the Flophouse and the Flophouse's history.

Dan McCoy

[6:43] Well, they ran the Brooklyn Zine Fest for several years.

[6:49] You know, creative folks.

Stuart Wellington

[6:50] Wait, are zines for nerds, Dan?

[6:51] Is that what you're implying?

[6:52] Yes.

[6:53] Okay.

[6:54] Zines used to be for cool people, but now they're for nerds.

Dan McCoy

[6:57] Yeah.

[6:59] I don't use that pejoratively anyway.

S4

[7:01] So, yeah, from your point of view, do you remember how the show got pitched?

[7:06] I feel like because twin sitters seem to really be kind of Matt and Ksenia's thing.

[7:12] Put their bag, baby.

[7:14] So, yeah, what do you guys remember about that?

[7:17] Because, you know, I just remember it was like, yeah, I was into the idea because we talked about doing this kind of show.

[7:22] Because you did do the live commentary right off the bat.

[7:25] Yeah.

[7:26] Yeah, yeah.

[7:26] So, the idea was that we were going to do this show that would have this sort of presentation element, which I think ended up being kind of babysitter related, maybe.

[7:36] And then you guys were going to do the commentary.

[7:39] So, yeah.

[7:39] What are your memories?

Dan McCoy

[7:41] Well, I mean, it was a riff show, like you say.

[7:45] Like, our early shows were usually us cracking wise over the movies.

[7:50] Which is hard.

[7:51] Mystery Science Theater or Riff Tracks.

S4

[7:53] Because you weren't scripting it, right?

[7:54] Like, you were being off the cuff.

[7:56] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[7:58] And we put that aside partly because it was hard, but partly because when we started touring with shows, like, when you do that kind of show, you have to clear the screening.

[8:07] Like, you have to do it with a movie theater, usually, who has a programmer like you who can do all this stuff for us.

[8:13] And we wanted to be more mobile than that.

[8:16] I don't know.

[8:16] I mean, it was in what, like a 70-seat theater?

[8:18] Really small, yeah.

[8:19] Yeah.

S4

[8:20] And the thing that they reminded me of, because I forgot that we eventually moved to that big, not really movie theater space.

[8:26] For Jaws the Revenge.

[8:28] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[8:28] This last show.

[8:30] And the joke was that it, because that capacity, I think we maybe could seat, like, 150 or something.

[8:37] And the joke was that it sold out before an event we had with Peter Bogdanovich.

[8:43] Do you remember that?

Stuart Wellington

[8:44] Oh, that's right.

[8:45] I forgot about that.

[8:46] Oh, man.

[8:47] There's a long history of the Flophouse fucking over, Peter Bogdanovich.

[8:51] Yeah, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[8:52] We're really the ones who have been wrecking, who were wrecking his life for decades.

[8:55] Yeah, yeah, sure.

Dan McCoy

[8:56] I feel like you guys met someone at the Jaws.

[8:58] Was it Adam Rifkin?

[8:59] Was that who was there?

[9:00] It was Adam Resnick.

[9:01] Adam Resnick.

[9:02] Adam Resnick.

[9:02] I guess his name's mixed up.

Elliott Kalan

[9:03] Adam Resnick, the co-creator of Get a Life and someone who was a very important kind of, like, comedy writer figure for me.

[9:11] Yeah, Cabin Boy.

[9:12] We had hosted him for Cabin Boy.

S4

[9:13] So he had brought maybe his daughter?

Elliott Kalan

[9:15] Yep.

[9:15] His daughter was a listener.

[9:17] Cabin Boy fan?

[9:17] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[9:17] And I think he wasn't familiar with the show.

[9:19] I forgot about that.

[9:19] Yeah.

[9:19] And it was really cool to meet him at first.

[9:21] And he was like, that was a really funny show.

[9:22] You guys obviously put a lot of thought into the jokes.

[9:25] And I want to be like, no, we didn't.

[9:27] Barely.

Stuart Wellington

[9:28] But that was a very exciting moment for me.

[9:30] We did a couple of, how many shows?

[9:32] We did, like, two or three shows in that smaller venue?

[9:35] Because we did.

S4

[9:35] Maybe even more.

[9:36] Because I was looking it over.

[9:39] And so it was Twin Sitters.

[9:40] It was 12 Rounds.

[9:41] I forgot we did 12 Rounds.

[9:43] Rats at some point.

[9:43] Rats.

[9:44] We did Quiet Cool.

[9:44] Don't Tell Her It's Me.

[9:45] Quiet Cool.

[9:46] Quiet Cool.

[9:46] Yeah, so it might have been, like, five or six in that space.

Dan McCoy

[9:50] Man, that was fun.

[9:51] And then we moved up to the big leagues.

[9:53] The bigger room in the same.

[9:54] And then the venue closed.

[9:55] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[9:56] I do have to say, one of the things that I remember most about when we made the move

[10:03] to the larger venue there was, every time we did one of those shows, I was bartending.

[10:08] And for me to do a show, I would have to take a night off work.

[10:12] And that's not like, oh, I'm still getting paid.

[10:15] I'm getting sick pay.

[10:16] It's like, no, I'm just not making money that night.

[10:18] Yeah, you were taking a financial hit to do this.

S4

[10:19] Yeah, because I think 92i never let us pay anybody anything.

Stuart Wellington

[10:23] Sorry about that.

[10:24] I feel like that was the, I could be wrong, but I feel like that might have been the first

[10:28] time where I'm like, oh, no, I basically made the same amount of money I might have made

[10:33] if I'd been bartending for eight hours that night.

[10:36] Which was, I mean, as a performer, is huge.

[10:39] That's a huge deal to be like, oh, I'm making more doing this than my day, like, literally

[10:44] than my day job in this thing.

Elliott Kalan

[10:45] Yeah, although your day job was technically a night job.

Stuart Wellington

[10:48] Yeah.

[10:49] Oh, wow.

[10:50] Makes you think, right?

Elliott Kalan

[10:52] Well, you were.

[10:53] It's like that whole thing.

[10:54] Why do we park on a driveway?

[10:55] But we drive on a parkway, you know?

Dan McCoy

[10:57] You referred to this kind of in passing, but.

[10:59] What?

[11:01] Oh, God.

[11:02] He broke his brain.

[11:04] But I wanted to ask more outright.

[11:07] You know, you talked about the Bogdanovich thing.

[11:09] I know that when Elliot had closely watched films, he would complain about, like, I can't

[11:13] get people to come to this good movie.

[11:14] But they'll come out in droves for a bad movie.

[11:16] Does that ever frustrate you as a programmer?

[11:19] Or what are your feelings on those things?

S4

[11:21] Yeah.

[11:22] I mean, it's definitely a funny thing.

[11:24] Because it's like, I know there are audiences for, you know, more intense stuff.

[11:28] Like, other venues, you know, I think sort of.

[11:31] I think the thing is when you try to do so many things, like, you get known for one thing

[11:36] and then not the other.

[11:38] So, like, when you're a venue that only shows experimental film, like, you're probably getting

[11:42] your audience.

[11:42] But if you try to do a lot of things, different types of things.

[11:45] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[11:46] Experimental film like, what, like, Memento or Forrest Gump or something?

[11:50] Yes.

[11:50] Yeah, yeah.

[11:51] Experimental.

Elliott Kalan

[11:51] Shown together with one soundtrack over the other.

[11:54] Oh, wow.

[11:56] Slow down so it takes 24 hours to watch the entire movie.

[11:59] Yeah.

[11:59] Exactly.

[12:00] Exactly.

S4

[12:00] But, I mean, I think it's definitely always been a thing where it's like the movie that

[12:04] you sort of covet and love the most.

[12:06] Like, less people are going to come out for it.

[12:08] And it was a lesson I learned very early into doing all this.

[12:11] And, you know, I kind of learned to just stop having my heart broken by stuff like that.

[12:16] Because sometimes there's a good win, you know?

[12:18] And it's not always that way.

[12:21] So, yeah.

[12:22] I think that when that, you know, happens is kind of frustrating.

[12:26] But it's just about kind of like building your audience and knowing who you're reaching

[12:29] and having some consistency, you know?

Dan McCoy

[12:32] This is totally off topic, but sorry.

[12:34] Speaking of 24-hour movies, did you happen to see the Letterboxd Paul Schrader review

[12:39] where he talked about he went to see The Clock and he's like, I decided I'm going to stay

[12:43] here until I see one of my own movies.

[12:46] And he was rewarded after 45 minutes.

[12:49] He finally saw American Giglio.

[12:50] So, that was pretty good.

[12:51] That's really good.

Elliott Kalan

[12:52] I mean, The Clock is a, for anyone who's not familiar with it, it is a 24-hour movie made

[12:57] up of scenes from other movies where you see the time.

[13:00] And it is timed so that when you are watching it, it functions as a clock.

[13:06] So, like, you are watching it and you're like, oh, it's 10, 11 a.m.

[13:09] And you look on screen and it's the clock say 10, 11 a.m. in whatever scene.

[13:12] And I remember when that was, when that finally made it to New York, I was playing at Lincoln

[13:16] Center for a certain amount of time.

[13:18] I was like, I went to see like an hour and a half of it before work one day.

[13:21] And I was like, if I was in college right now, I would stay for 24 hours.

[13:25] I'd watch this whole thing.

[13:25] I want to see all the nighttime clock scenes, but it's hard to do.

[13:29] I have to find, someone has to send me a bootleg of it so I can watch it in chunks at the

[13:32] wrong times.

[13:33] Mm-hmm.

[13:33] Yeah, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[13:34] So, I'm going to close out this solipsistic section of it with the most self-serving question

[13:41] in the section.

[13:42] Uh-huh, yeah.

[13:42] How are we to work with?

[13:44] You know, you kept inviting us back.

[13:46] Was it just because we put butts in seats?

[13:48] And you're like, oi, are these three goobers?

[13:50] Or did you, what's our goober quotient?

[13:53] GQ.

S4

[13:53] It's funny because, you know, you kindly sent me these questions in advance so that I could

[13:59] be prepared.

[13:59] And I feel like this should have been one that you just like sprung on me, like put me on

[14:04] the spot.

[14:05] No, of course you were wonderful to work.

[14:05] Spoken like a true programmer, making the show better.

[14:07] Of course you were wonderful to work with.

[14:08] Like, you know, there was, it's not like there were demands or drama or anything.

[14:13] Like, it was always like, you know, we would maybe have a little bit of a back and forth

[14:16] about what movie to do.

[14:18] But yeah, of course, like it was always an event that I looked forward to.

[14:22] Even once we moved over to Alamo, like, you know, I was always really glad.

[14:26] I mean, you guys even, you know, made it up to Yonkers, which, you know.

Elliott Kalan

[14:30] Multiple times.

S4

[14:31] Yeah, so.

[14:32] That's right.

Elliott Kalan

[14:33] After, because after 9 to I closed, yeah, you were programming the Yonkers Alamo because

[14:37] there wasn't an Alamo in New York City yet, right?

[14:39] Yeah, yeah.

S4

[14:39] I got, you know, a little bait and switch.

[14:42] And there had to be in Yonkers for three dark years.

[14:45] That I try not to think about.

[14:47] But yeah, it was a very bright spot to be able to bring you guys up there.

[14:52] And then, you know, even continuing to Brooklyn.

Stuart Wellington

[14:55] You also, you organized that screening of Castle Freak.

[14:58] Yeah, and I was thinking about that too.

[14:59] Yeah.

[14:59] Yeah, Jonathan came up.

[15:01] Because that was such.

[15:02] He was an awesome guest.

S4

[15:03] Yeah, I mean, I drove him around.

[15:04] Like, I got him from the airport.

[15:05] I brought him from Birmingham, Alabama.

[15:08] And yeah, I was thinking about that too.

[15:09] In addition to, you know, the, like, you know, commentary events.

[15:13] That doing something like that was just like.

[15:15] Because it was just kind of a lark to be like, we're going to show Castle Freak.

[15:18] Because I could get a film print.

[15:20] And I could get just.

[15:21] Yes.

[15:21] Like, for some reason, Alamo let me fly this guy out.

[15:24] You know?

[15:24] Like, I don't know.

Elliott Kalan

[15:26] How.

[15:26] Because he's the.

[15:27] This was the titular Castle Freak.

[15:28] Yeah, Georgia.

[15:29] Yeah.

[15:29] Who played Georgia the Castle Freak.

[15:30] And yeah, it was amazing to have him there.

Stuart Wellington

[15:32] And he was a sweetheart.

[15:33] And like, I remember.

[15:34] Nothing like the character.

[15:34] Yeah.

[15:35] Yeah.

[15:35] I drove Dan and Elliot up there.

[15:37] It was in the middle of a snowstorm.

[15:39] And it was like.

[15:40] The theater was like half full.

[15:42] But he was.

[15:42] He was such a sweetheart.

[15:43] And he had so many good stories.

[15:45] Yeah.

[15:45] About like the makeup effects.

[15:46] And like just running around Charles Band's castle.

S4

[15:48] Yeah.

[15:49] So having an excuse to do something like that was definitely great.

[15:52] So yes.

[15:52] Of course.

[15:53] If anyone's looking to book you guys.

[15:55] I sign off on you.

[15:57] Thank you.

Stuart Wellington

[15:58] Like that time we did the.

[15:59] The Don't Tell Her It's Me screening.

[16:01] And the print was in Italian.

S4

[16:03] Yeah, that's definitely worth bringing up.

Stuart Wellington

[16:06] Yeah.

S4

[16:07] That's worth bringing up because it is such a funny detail.

[16:10] That, you know, when you get a film print.

[16:12] Like normally you're checking it out.

[16:14] And there's, you know.

[16:15] We just didn't have the luxury of looking at stuff that far in advance.

[16:20] So we had only kind of put it on screen right before the show was about to start.

[16:24] And then, you know, I was like.

[16:26] Something is wrong here.

[16:28] And realized it was Italian.

[16:29] Dubbed in Italian.

[16:30] But luckily Matt had like a file or something.

[16:33] So we just like.

[16:34] Yeah, yeah.

[16:34] He had it on the go.

[16:36] Yeah.

[16:36] Luckily we didn't have to stream it.

[16:37] He had a thumb drive with it.

Elliott Kalan

[16:39] Cash to his key chain.

[16:40] Yeah, such a weird detail.

[16:41] He just always happens to carry a thumb drive with Don't Tell Her It's Me on him at all times.

S4

[16:46] In case of emergency.

[16:47] Yeah.

[16:47] But that's the thing that I always think about now.

[16:50] When I get a film print that I know probably hasn't screened in forever.

[16:54] Like I'm always like.

[16:55] It might look good.

[16:56] But I want to.

[16:57] I want to see it on screen.

[16:58] Because it might be dubbed in Italian.

[17:00] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[17:01] And then we riffed in Italian.

[17:03] Yeah.

[17:04] So moving into more just general film programming.

[17:08] I think that this is sort of a dream job for a lot of movie nerds.

[17:12] Because there's something in the movie nerd DNA that makes us want to share movies we love.

[17:18] Or force them on people.

[17:20] Because I think the most annoying version of that is like me being like Audrey.

[17:26] Audrey.

[17:26] Let's watch this.

[17:27] And her being like I have my own things.

[17:30] But you know yours is sort of the best case scenario of that impulse.

[17:35] And I don't know.

[17:37] Like it seems like such a rarefied great job.

[17:42] Like how did you get here?

[17:44] Like what led you here?

S4

[17:47] Yeah.

[17:47] I mean it's not a thing that you automatically.

[17:49] Like no little girl is like I want to grow up to be a programmer.

[17:53] You know.

Stuart Wellington

[17:53] But I'm assuming a bunch of our listeners do want to be programmers.

[17:57] Yeah.

[17:58] They might.

S4

[17:59] But I think I you know.

Dan McCoy

[18:01] So keep back a key piece of information.

[18:03] So you don't have to fight them.

S4

[18:04] First of all there's probably only like a hundred of those jobs in the entire country.

[18:08] So you know maybe think about.

[18:10] And all those people are going to do them until they die.

[18:12] So yeah.

[18:14] Don't don't pursue it.

Elliott Kalan

[18:15] It's like it's like film criticism that way.

[18:17] Where it's like oh I'd love to be a film reviewer.

[18:19] And it's like okay well there's ten people who do it.

[18:21] And they get paid nothing.

Stuart Wellington

[18:25] Dan has a pretty good letterbox to everybody.

Elliott Kalan

[18:28] Yeah.

[18:28] And that draws him what?

[18:30] I mean it's no Paul Schrader's letterbox.

[18:32] But still yeah.

S4

[18:34] So yeah.

[18:35] I was actually kind of lucky.

[18:36] You know I was going to school for film in Florida.

[18:40] And you know it was sort of a vague degree I was pursuing in film studies.

[18:44] But we had a campus cinema.

[18:46] And when I first started going to school the campus cinema was great.

[18:50] Like I actually had come up to see Pink Flamingos before I was even going to school there.

[18:54] I had seen Bitter Tears of Petra Van Kant.

[18:56] And then all of a sudden it was something was off.

[19:00] And it's funny because this being sort of the 25th anniversary of The Mummy.

[19:04] This is like when I was programming.

[19:07] The Mummy showing in second run to me was like the epitome of the theater going downhill.

[19:11] It's so funny because I know it's kind of a classic now.

[19:14] But back then it was like why are they showing The Mummy?

[19:17] And so I came to find that it was student run and that you could join this thing.

[19:24] And so I joined it probably my junior year.

[19:26] And then by my senior year I became the director of the programming for that cinema.

[19:32] And that's where I learned about working with distributors and getting catalogs.

[19:36] Like back then you would get sort of a printed catalog from the distributor.

[19:40] And you would book movies.

[19:41] And I would learn about booking 35mm because that's basically all there.

[19:44] Maybe you could get a DVD or something.

Stuart Wellington

[19:46] So you took it over just in time to program The Mummy Returns.

[19:51] The superior of The Mummy series.

S4

[19:55] I mean it's crazy to think of that time because it was like they came to us with a preview screening of this movie called Velvet Goldmine.

[20:01] And we were like what is this thing?

Elliott Kalan

[20:05] There's no goldmine in this movie.

[20:08] You're thinking of gold with Roger Moore.

[20:10] Yeah, yeah.

[20:11] Just the title sequence.

[20:12] I think about it a lot.

S4

[20:14] So that's where I started to learn about programming.

[20:17] Some for them, some for yourself.

[20:20] The idea was that you didn't want to lose money.

[20:25] But you didn't want it to just be sort of like The Mummy in second run.

[20:30] So, you know, so that's kind of where I was learning about that.

[20:34] And, you know, when I moved to New York, you know, I moved right after I graduated.

[20:40] And I wasn't really sure that programming was a job.

[20:42] Like, you know, like I was kind of like, you know, I had started by, you know, I was interning at Killer Films.

[20:48] I was thinking I was going to like devote myself to like indie productions.

[20:52] And that very quickly proved to just like be a terrible idea.

[20:57] So at the same time, I was volunteering with this collective called Ocularis that used to do screenings that were largely like experimental or local filmmaker things.

[21:06] And from them, I learned sort of about kind of building community and stuff like that.

[21:11] And then, yeah, I just was kind of like, wait, maybe this can, you know, be a living.

[21:16] And it, you know, it took a while and a lot of like volunteering and stuff.

[21:20] But eventually, you know, it proved to be something that I could actually get paid for, you know.

Dan McCoy

[21:26] Well, that leads you to the next question because, of course, like we said, we first knew you at 92.

[21:31] Why Tribeca sort of follows you through the Alamo to Nighthawk where like, you know, Elliot's out of town.

[21:39] But occasionally, Stuart and I will be having the pleasure of introducing something.

[21:45] It seems like we're there all the time.

Elliott Kalan

[21:47] Okay, because I was saying half the Flophouse.

[21:48] Yeah, you guys are there more than me, I think.

[21:50] Yeah, I'm there all the time.

[21:51] Half the Flophouse text, Jane, is the two of you talking about the movie you just saw at Nighthawk together

[21:55] or the movie you're about to go see at Nighthawk together.

Stuart Wellington

[21:58] Or when we go on a hot dog date.

[22:00] Dan and I have a lot of fun, okay?

Elliott Kalan

[22:01] That hot dog date really confused Elliot.

[22:04] Yeah, because nobody explained anything about it to me.

[22:07] Just all you said was how you wienerfied each other.

Dan McCoy

[22:10] Yeah, we wienerfied our life, yeah.

[22:12] Honestly, there's not much more to it than we got some hot dogs together.

Stuart Wellington

[22:16] But I got Dan to admit that a Chicago-style hot dog has value.

[22:21] I was never a fan.

Dan McCoy

[22:23] Too many veggies for me.

[22:24] I was like, give me the unadorned hot dog with a little mustard and maybe some onions.

[22:29] But anyway, it was good.

Stuart Wellington

[22:31] It was good.

[22:31] He was singing a different tune after that wiener, let me tell you.

S4

[22:35] You're talking about dog days?

[22:37] Yeah, we went to dog day afternoon, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[22:39] Right down the street from the Nighthawk.

Dan McCoy

[22:42] Well, I think that started out as a question about are there other places sort of along the way that you were working as a programmer or that I missed?

S4

[22:53] It took some time.

[22:55] You know, like I said, I was doing the volunteer thing in New York with Ocularis.

[22:59] That was at a space called Galapagos, which was in Williamsburg on 96.

[23:03] Oh, yeah.

[23:04] I remember Galapagos for sure.

[23:05] And they were sort of like a, you know, it was all volunteer run.

[23:09] And then, you know, the thing is I moved to Boston for a few years.

[23:13] And so I was kind of trying to get something going there.

[23:16] And I had this job at this, like, women in film organization, which it was sort of, I was kind of the only employee.

[23:23] And I worked with the board, but they let me do programming.

[23:26] And so I just would sort of do programming wherever I could because we didn't have a venue.

[23:30] So I do programming at the library or in an outdoor garden or at a gallery.

[23:35] And then I also got a job with the Boston Jewish Film Festival.

[23:38] And that was sort of, you know, like an assistant to the main programmer doing, like, watching submissions and stuff like that.

[23:46] And then, yeah, I moved back to New York and, you know, pretty much just got kind of lucky as, you know, 92nd Street Y was going to open this venue in Tribeca and had posted this job that was, like, film related.

[24:00] So that was sort of, like, my trajectory over those years.

Stuart Wellington

[24:07] Just to interrupt, is there, outside of obviously scheduling really fun Flophouse related shows, do you have any, like, highlights from your career as a,

[24:16] like, any screenings that you're particularly proud of for organizing?

[24:19] Yeah, yeah.

S4

[24:20] I mean, I know that Dan wanted to get there eventually, so I don't know if you want to just jump.

Dan McCoy

[24:24] Oh, do I jump in there?

[24:25] Sorry.

[24:26] Well, I don't know what the, I don't know what the question was.

[24:30] There's one layer on that kind of relates to that, but you can answer now.

[24:32] Yeah, yeah.

S4

[24:33] I mean, the funny thing is that I remember a lot of the 92Y stuff, like, kind of most fondly.

[24:38] You know, there was a show that we did where we invited Amy Sedaris to watch the 70s, like, drug scare movie Go Ask Alice.

[24:49] You know, it was, you know, based on the sort of famous anonymous book.

[24:53] They had made a TV movie.

[24:55] And, you know, I knew there was, like, this 16 million dollar print, and I was like, I want to show it.

[25:00] And I bet that she is into it because of Strangers with Candy.

[25:03] And it turns out she's like, yeah, we stole from that.

[25:05] And she was happy to come.

[25:06] And then because she came, the actress who was in the movie as, like, the main star, like, flew herself to New York.

[25:15] You know, I think she had become, like, an interior designer to the stars or something.

[25:19] Like, you know, but she was, like, so psyched that Amy Sedaris was going to do this show.

[25:25] So she ended up coming.

[25:27] And so that was a really fun one because, you know, Amy Sedaris was sitting behind me watching the movie and just, like, cracking up the whole time.

[25:34] And then we just kind of did the Q&A with them, which Tom Blunt had hosted.

[25:42] Yeah, there are so many other things that I've done over the years that were really fun.

[25:47] You know, even more recently at Nighthawk, doing the screening of Book of Shadows, Blair Witch 2, with the director, Joe Berlinger, was really great.

[25:57] Because, you know, it was a movie that was, like, really, obviously, like, disliked when it came out.

[26:03] And, you know, Joe Berlinger was, like, a famous, you know, documentary filmmaker.

[26:07] And this was his, you know, foray into fiction.

[26:12] And the movie's actually got a lot of good stuff in it.

[26:15] You know, it got taken away from him.

[26:17] And doing a screening like that because he came for the Q&A and he felt it was sort of cathartic for him.

[26:23] And, like, I really like when, you know, when you invite a director and they're actually into it.

[26:28] Because, you know, so many directors have to do so many Q&As and they're kind of over it.

[26:32] But, you know, like, he actually was, like, really, like, into revisiting it and feeling sort of like, you know, it was, like, validated in some way.

Dan McCoy

[26:45] That would have been interesting.

[26:46] I missed that screening, but I saw it for the first time recently.

[26:50] I knew that it was taken away from him.

[26:52] So it's not exactly what he would have wanted, per se.

[26:55] But I feel like at the time, people were mad at it for not being the first movie.

[26:59] I'm like, well, that's a trick you can play once, you know?

S4

[27:03] Yeah, and the whole idea for him was to play on that.

[27:06] Yeah, exactly.

[27:07] You know, that it wasn't going to be like that.

[27:10] Yeah, what else?

[27:11] I mean.

Stuart Wellington

[27:11] I remember, I think you programmed this, but it was a screening with Don Cascarelli.

[27:17] It was a screening of Phantasm and John Dies at the end, the double feature.

[27:20] And Don Cascarelli came out and I was, like, so psyched.

[27:24] And I, in between screenings, I, like, went to go get an autograph on a Phantasm poster.

[27:29] And I was behind, I was in line behind, like, dudes that were getting, like, Japanese VHS tapes of, like, Phantasm II autographed.

[27:37] I'm like, I can't measure up to these guys.

[27:39] They're too nerdy for me.

[27:41] Uh-huh, uh-huh.

S4

[27:42] Yeah, I mean, I also, you know, I got Hal Needham out for a screening.

[27:46] Wow.

[27:46] Which was really great.

[27:48] You know, he, I think he died, like, only a year or two after that.

[27:51] Because I remember I was, you know, switching over to Alamo.

[27:54] You had nothing to do with his death.

[27:55] Nothing, yeah.

[27:56] He hadn't seen me for years.

[28:00] I can prove it.

Elliott Kalan

[28:00] It was a very slow acting poison.

[28:02] Very slow.

S4

[28:04] Um, yeah, I mean, there's, there's just kind of so many that it's, it's sort of hard to pinpoint.

[28:10] But, um, you know, I feel lucky that I got to do any of it.

Elliott Kalan

[28:15] Uh.

[28:15] So, if I can interrupt, when you were programming at 92i Tribeca, it felt like such a special place.

[28:22] And I'm sure Nighthawk does now, too.

[28:23] But I remember at that time, it felt like there was a real, there was such a cool sense of community around there that you were creating with the way you were programming it.

[28:31] And, like, Kevin Marr would do his show, would do his Kevin Geeks Out shows there.

[28:34] And we could do stuff there.

[28:36] And I was hosting my screening stuff.

[28:38] And I, and Max and he would do I Love Bad Movies stuff.

[28:40] And it felt like it was a, um, this, it became such a beautiful combination of, like, a theater that was showing really fun, interesting stuff.

[28:47] And, like, a clubhouse that, like, people really felt comfortable being at and hanging out at.

[28:52] And it was just great.

[28:52] There was, there was one screening, I don't know if you remember, when we showed Little Murders and Jules Pfeiffer came and talked about it.

[28:59] And it was amazing.

[29:00] That was, I think about that all the time.

[29:01] It was such an amazing thing to get to talk to him and, and to have him there for that.

[29:05] It was so cool.

S4

[29:05] Yeah.

[29:05] I mean, sometimes it was kind of miraculous.

[29:07] Because, again, we didn't pay anybody to do anything.

[29:09] So, you know, people, getting people to come out just by me saying, like, hey, will you, we're showing this movie.

[29:15] Will you do this?

[29:16] You know?

[29:16] And, yeah, Little Murders is definitely one of the more memorable ones, too.

Elliott Kalan

[29:21] That was amazing.

[29:21] And I do remember that one of the first things you said to me, I think, when I met you, when we first started talking about me hosting something there, you were like, by the way, we don't pay any money.

[29:29] And I was like, uh.

[29:30] You were like, if you really demanded it, maybe we could come up with some kind of, like, very small honorarium.

[29:37] And me being a young, dumb person, I was like, but you don't need to pay me money to do it.

[29:41] I don't even want that.

[29:42] As opposed to being like, yeah, yeah, give me whatever I can get, you know.

S4

[29:44] I mean, it was crazy.

[29:45] Because when I first started the job, I was kind of like, what's my budget?

[29:50] And they were like, well, nothing.

[29:52] And I was like, well, but I have to pay for films.

[29:56] Like, you know, you have to pay for film rights and to get films.

[29:59] And they were like, but we're a nonprofit.

[30:00] And I was like, that doesn't matter.

[30:02] So, I mean, that's the thing.

[30:04] Even in that small room, you know, if we were paying for film rights and film shipping, there was, we were not breaking even, you know.

[30:10] So, there's not even like we were raking it in and just, like, not sharing money.

[30:14] It just, like, it just didn't break even, you know.

Elliott Kalan

[30:16] You did a great job of shielding, I think, the people doing shows and hosting things there from all of that stuff.

S4

[30:24] Yeah.

[30:24] I mean, it was kind of ridiculous, you know.

[30:27] But, yeah, eventually, like, you know, when I got to Alamo, it was like, yes, I could pay people.

[30:32] So, I tried to continue working with whoever I had worked with so that, you know, there was some compensation finally.

Stuart Wellington

[30:39] We did, and I feel like one of the first shows we did up in Yonkers was the Flophouse Prom where we rented a couple of buses to take people from Charlene's up to Yonkers.

[30:53] Yeah, I forgot about that.

[30:53] And then back.

[30:54] Yeah.

[30:55] Was that Sleepwalkers?

[30:56] It might have been Sleepwalkers.

[30:56] I think it was Sleepwalkers.

[30:57] That was really fun.

Dan McCoy

[31:00] Yeah.

[31:00] Maybe.

[31:01] I mean, we've had, like, arguably bigger successes since then.

[31:05] But to me, like, that was, like, the peak of, like, we've rented two buses, like, school buses.

Stuart Wellington

[31:11] We put garbage bags with ice and Coors Light in them and put them in the back of the bus.

Elliott Kalan

[31:18] And guess what?

[31:18] You're going on an expenses paid trip to Yonkers.

Dan McCoy

[31:23] Beautiful Yonkers as immortalized and hello, Dolly, as a place you want to leave.

[31:28] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[31:28] Anyway.

[31:29] Or if you're in Lost in Yonkers, a place you can get lost in.

[31:31] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[31:32] This is kind of a broad question, but after so many years, do you have, like, an idea of, like, what, like, audiences respond to, like, get people out?

[31:40] Like, what puts butts in seats?

[31:41] What's, like, the hook?

[31:43] Whether it's, like, something beyond the movie or just a certain type of thing.

[31:46] And she's going to say Deadpool.

[31:48] She's just going to say Deadpool, Dan.

[31:49] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[31:49] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[31:50] Listeners, if you notice, that's also the second question Dan has asked that involves putting butts in seats.

[31:54] That's where butts go.

S4

[31:54] I mean, it's kind of hard to say, you know, like, for me, it's, like, I feel like if I'm excited about something, somebody else is bound to be excited about it.

[32:07] So that's sort of the first approach.

[32:09] You know, like, I'm somebody who abhors marketing and, like, I hate the idea that you have to figure out how to market something.

[32:15] I feel like if it's just good, like, people will figure it out and come.

[32:19] So, yeah, when it comes to hooks, you know, like, for a time I was doing things like sing-alongs and stuff like that.

[32:26] And I think that was really appealing.

[32:28] And having movies that have, like, a nostalgic value is, you know, is nice.

[32:32] But, you know, I think the bottom line is that it has to be something that just seems fun or interesting.

[32:39] You know, like, I don't want to think about, like, oh, people are going to be excited because, you know, they're going to, like, have a food special or something.

[32:47] You know, like, that's sort of not the line of thinking that I like to be on.

Dan McCoy

[32:51] Well, we're going to take a little break to talk about Flop TV Season 2 and possibly a couple of other things.

[32:59] And we'll be back in just a little bit.

Stuart Wellington

[33:07] Hey, everybody.

[33:08] I'm Jeremy.

[33:09] I'm Oscar.

[33:09] I'm Dimitri.

[33:10] And we are the Eurovangelists.

S5

[33:12] We're a weekly podcast spreading the word of the Eurovision Song Contest, the most important music competition in the world.

Dan McCoy

[33:18] Maybe you already heard Glenn Weldon of NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour talk up our coverage of this year's contest.

[33:23] But what do we talk about in the offseason?

Stuart Wellington

[33:25] The rest of Eurovision, duh.

[33:27] There are nearly seven decades of pop music history to cover.

S5

[33:30] Mm-hmm.

[33:31] We've got thousands of amazing songs, inspiring competitors, and so much drama to discuss.

[33:36] And let me tell you, the drama is juicy.

Stuart Wellington

[33:39] Plus, all the gorillas and bread-baking grandmas that make Eurovision so special.

Dan McCoy

[33:43] Check out Eurovangelists, available everywhere you get podcasts.

[33:46] And you could be a Eurovangelist, too.

John Hodgman

[33:47] Ooh, I want to be one.

[33:48] You already are.

[33:49] It's that easy.

[33:50] Oh, okay.

[33:50] Cool.

[33:51] Most of the plants humans eat are technically grass.

S6

[33:55] Most of the asphalt we drive on is almost a liquid.

John Hodgman

[33:59] The formula of WD-40 is San Diego's greatest secret.

S6

[34:04] Zippers were invented by a Swedish immigrant love story.

John Hodgman

[34:08] On the podcast, Secretly Incredibly Fascinating, we explore this type of amazing stuff.

S6

[34:13] Stuff about ordinary topics like cabbage and batteries and socks.

John Hodgman

[34:18] Topics you'd never expect to be the title of the podcast, Secretly Incredibly Fascinating.

S6

[34:24] Find us by searching for the word secretly in your podcast app.

John Hodgman

[34:28] And at MaximumFun.org.

Dan McCoy

[34:33] Hey, it's Dan popping in here with a word from our sponsors and some words from us.

[34:39] So, please don't skip all of it or any of it.

[34:42] Who knows?

[34:44] Hey, we're sponsored in part this week by Factor.

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[35:31] I've talked about it before.

[35:32] I'm a fan of cooking.

[35:34] You may have seen one of the Slop House Twitch streams that I do with Stuart on occasion where I cook a meal.

[35:41] Stuart makes some cocktails.

[35:43] Love to cook, but I don't love to cook all the time.

[35:46] And I have a high standard for what I eat.

[35:50] So, it was kind of surprising to me, honestly, that, like, I really like these Factor meals that I sampled.

[35:58] And they're really convenient for those times when you're just tired.

[36:01] You just don't want to do it.

[36:03] So, head over to factormeals.com slash learn50 and use code learn50 to get 50% off your first box plus 20% off your next month.

[36:14] That's code learn50 at factormeals.com slash learn50 to get 50% off your first box plus 20% off your next month while your subscription is active.

[36:27] And now the Flop House business.

[36:28] And now the Flop House business.

[36:29] We've promoted Flop TV a lot, so I'll make it short.

[36:33] From September 2024, that is this year, to February 2025, that is early next.

[36:39] On the first Saturday of each month, we are going to be broadcasting live with a series of shows about bad movie sequels.

[36:48] These will be video streams, ticketed video streams.

[36:51] If you go to theflophouse.simpleticks.com, you can get individual show tickets for $7 plus fees or $35 for the whole season,

[37:02] which is the equivalent of getting an extra episode for free.

[37:06] Well, not an extra episode, just one of the six episodes.

[37:10] And the shows will all stay up, available to watch, on demand until the end of February.

[37:15] So if you want to catch up later in the run, you can get a season pass at any point during the Flop TV run

[37:21] and get access to everything you missed in the past.

[37:24] So again, more details and tickets are available at theflophouse.simpleticks.com.

[37:30] And if you want to know about stuff like this, but also our side projects, plus some silly extra writing that I throw in there,

[37:37] and get that in your inbox a couple of times a month,

[37:41] why not hop over to flophousepodcast.com and put your email in the email box on the front page

[37:49] so you can get our newsletter, Flop Secrets.

[37:53] And also, on top of that, I have my own newsletter that I launched a little ways back now called Dan McCoy's Special Interests,

[38:04] named after the tendency for neurodivergent people to have interests that they hyper-focus on,

[38:10] a group I only learned I was a member of myself late in life.

[38:14] And over there, I write a couple of installments per month that are a combination of pop culture commentary,

[38:20] personal essay, and, of course, humor.

[38:23] So if you're curious to read those, you can sign up for that over at danmccoyinterests.com.

[38:30] Now, let us get back to the show.

[38:33] And we're back with Christina Cacioppo, Nighthawk Programmer.

Elliott Kalan

[38:38] I love, Dan, that you said, we'll be back, and then we'll be back, as if the ads are not also done by us.

Dan McCoy

[38:44] Yeah. I mean, specifically, probably me.

[38:49] But, you know, I don't know.

[38:51] It's a good mention of the form.

[38:53] Maybe you'll do a silly voice.

[38:54] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[38:55] You'll play one of those characters.

[38:57] Because you're a man who has a lot of different characters.

[38:59] Oh, yeah, yeah.

[38:59] Character voices, stuff like that.

[39:01] Dan, do one of your characters.

[39:03] Attentional voice acting casting directors.

[39:06] Dan, do one of your favorite famous characters.

Dan McCoy

[39:09] Hey, it's me, the guy who talks like this.

[39:12] I don't really have another hook.

[39:14] It's just that I talk like this.

[39:15] I really talk about pretty normal things, like tax breaks that you can get, or, you know, city planning.

[39:24] Oh, shit.

Stuart Wellington

[39:25] I just got an email from DreamWorks Animation.

[39:28] Now, normally, they only hire big-name stars to play these roles.

[39:32] But I feel like they want to take a chance with you, Dan.

[39:34] Oh, wait.

Elliott Kalan

[39:34] Stuart, you haven't responded yet.

[39:36] So, they're texting me, and they said they want to do at least a four-film franchise for a guy who talks like this.

[39:44] Well, that's great.

[39:46] So, getting back.

[39:48] Dan very casually dismisses the offer of a lifetime.

Stuart Wellington

[39:52] Yeah, yeah.

[39:52] Steve Carell will take it, I guess.

[39:54] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[39:55] I'll franchise it out.

[39:56] You know, my real passion is asking questions here on The Flophouse.

[40:02] And the next one is this one.

[40:05] Christina, some people love Q&As with filmmakers.

[40:09] But even though I've seen some great ones that I have enjoyed, I always kind of dread them because they are so dependent on the speakers being good and engaging,

[40:18] and the audiences not getting up and doing a lot of comments rather than questions.

[40:25] Do you have tips for good Q&As?

[40:27] Like, what do you think heads off those issues?

S4

[40:30] Yeah, I mean, let me say that I agree with you.

[40:32] I tend to kind of be the person that's, like, running out before the Q&A.

[40:37] Like, I don't – I'm not usually – it has to be just sort of, like, the most exciting thing, which recently one that I went to was the new Lee Daniels movie.

[40:46] Lee Daniels was in conversation with Bradley Cooper.

[40:49] So I feel like that sort of stunt moderators maybe is a tip.

[40:55] Yeah, I think for me it's, like, you know, the moderator should mostly let the, you know, director or cast do the talking.

[41:04] That's not how I do it.

[41:05] When a moderator is talking too much, it's, you know, it's kind of like, yeah, you don't want to hear from that person.

[41:11] You want to hear from the talent.

[41:14] And, you know, if they're kind of stalling, because sometimes you do get, you know, talent who maybe aren't necessarily, like, that psyched about it.

[41:22] I think it's just, like, making sure that you know the movie and you're not asking the most generic questions.

[41:28] You know, we do this shorts festival at Nighthawk and –

Elliott Kalan

[41:33] Everybody wears shorts.

S4

[41:35] Yes, everybody wears short shorts.

[41:38] And, you know, I've actually gotten complimented on my questioning because I think all these shorts filmmakers go to other festivals where, like, people are just kind of like, tell us why you made this.

[41:49] And I actually try to sit down and write something, like, very tailored to each movie, you know, because, like, otherwise it's just kind of like, you know.

[41:58] I mean, this Q&A, it'll be like there's, like, 10 people and you have 20 minutes.

[42:02] So you're kind of going down the line and it has to be, you know, pretty compact.

[42:06] Yeah.

[42:07] But, you know, people have complimented me that, you know, I put a lot of thought into it.

[42:11] And I think that's part of it, too, is, like, just, you know, you know the questions you avoid.

[42:15] Like, don't ask about if it was improvised.

[42:16] Don't ask about the budget.

[42:18] Don't ask if, you know, if they'll read your script, especially if you're the moderator.

[42:25] And then, yeah, try to keep the audience questions to a minimum.

Dan McCoy

[42:29] Slip from the script backstage.

[42:30] Does this haircut work for my face?

[42:33] Yes.

[42:33] That would be a, I would be so interested in that question.

Elliott Kalan

[42:37] There was a, this question reminds me of a thing that Stuart and I witnessed, which was not at one of Christina's venues.

[42:45] But this was at, we went to see a, when, we went to see when Only God Forgives came out.

[42:52] It was Nicholas Wending Reifen and.

[42:55] Premier at BAM.

[42:56] And, why am I forgetting the name?

Stuart Wellington

[42:58] It was the whole cast.

[42:59] He's a huge star.

[42:59] And Ryan Gosling was up there.

[43:01] Yes.

[43:01] And Wending Reifen.

[43:02] And the only native, like, the only native English speaker was Ryan Gosling.

Elliott Kalan

[43:06] Yeah.

[43:07] And it was.

[43:07] Even the moderator, I think, was French, maybe?

[43:11] I think so.

[43:11] And there was, there were two moments that always stuck with me.

[43:14] And one was when a guy got up and he goes, you know, as a, as a young aspiring filmmaker myself, do you have any advice?

[43:22] And the audience just started booing him.

[43:24] Booing the questioner.

[43:25] Because they did not want to hear it.

[43:27] But then, but then Wending Reifen had a really good answer to it.

[43:29] And then, and then someone, someone goes, someone said, I wanted to ask Ryan Gosling, is there any role that you would like to play that you haven't gotten to play yet?

[43:39] And he just goes, Freddy Krueger.

[43:41] And that was his whole answer.

[43:42] And the audience went crazy.

[43:43] And the audience lost their mind.

Stuart Wellington

[43:44] Like, people were, like, tearing their hair off their heads.

S4

[43:47] Yeah.

[43:47] I mean, that guy, that guy's just bred to be an entertainer.

[43:50] Like, he just, he just knows, he knows what he's doing.

Stuart Wellington

[43:53] I don't have a lot of regrets in my life, but one of them is that I didn't wait in that long line to get my picture taken with Ryan Gosling.

[43:59] Yeah.

[43:59] That screening.

Elliott Kalan

[44:00] He was, that was, that he was, he was just famous enough that, like, it would have been cool to do it, but it wasn't impossible.

[44:05] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[44:06] Yeah.

[44:08] So it's my impression from talking with you that you, you rewatched the prints before you, you screened them to, to, you know, check various things.

[44:17] Are you ever like, oh, I thought this was going to be good.

[44:20] Like, I had an impression of like, like, oh, I liked this.

[44:23] And now rewatching it, I, I, I'm not wild about screening this thing.

[44:28] All the time.

[44:29] Really?

S4

[44:29] I mean, I think it's more of like a self-doubt thing where I'm like, oh, it's not like, do I like this?

[44:34] It's like, oh, is the audience going to be into this?

[44:36] Like, am I crazy that this is good?

[44:39] You know?

[44:40] And, and it'll just sort of be self-doubt.

[44:42] And that's even in the room sometimes, you know, like, cause I do watch things in advance.

[44:46] Maybe not necessarily the film print itself, but.

[44:49] You know, cause I'll, I'll write the synopses or, you know, or, or something like that.

[44:54] So, but yeah, it's, it's, it's sometimes that, or then in the room where I'm kind of like, are people enjoying this?

[45:00] I can't tell, you know?

Dan McCoy

[45:02] I, I have to say that I was so, I forget the details of it, but when we screened up the boyfriend school,

[45:11] AKA don't tell her it's me recently.

[45:13] Uh-huh.

[45:14] Like, I don't know whether it's Stockholm syndrome, like affection over time, but like watching it with a crowd,

[45:20] like that movie played so well that I'm like.

[45:23] People were loving it.

[45:23] Maybe it's good actually.

[45:25] And there's a guy afterwards, was he, he was from like Australia or something.

[45:31] Do you remember what I'm talking about?

[45:33] Like there's a guy.

S4

[45:33] The guy with like the mullet and like the pink top.

[45:36] And he was there on a chain.

[45:37] He was just going nuts for it.

[45:37] The actual Lobo Merengue was there?

[45:39] He seemed like, like that.

[45:42] It was definitely sort of like that.

[45:44] But yeah, he was, he was sitting in the row in front of me and he was loving it.

[45:48] Like he was losing his mind.

[45:49] And after he's like, you know, I just came here randomly, like on a date.

[45:52] Like that movie was really good.

[45:55] And it was just like so deeply into it.

[45:57] And yeah, you're right.

[45:58] The crowd.

[45:58] Cause I, I, I think that is one where I was like, you know, especially comedy sometimes.

[46:03] It's like, you just never know.

[46:05] And it really played so well.

Stuart Wellington

[46:07] Yeah.

[46:08] It could have been like the four or five drinks I'd had, but man, that movie rocks.

Elliott Kalan

[46:12] I had the opposite experience of that in a screening last year or the year before.

[46:16] I was involved in a riff screening of the movie Rotor, the RoboCop ripoff.

[46:21] And I think that movie is hilarious.

[46:24] It's just the way it's made.

[46:25] It's so funny.

[46:26] And then watching it with a bunch of people and them all hating it and being so bored and me being like, but isn't it like, isn't it funny the way they did this?

[46:34] Like this whole scene, you never hear what the characters are saying.

[46:37] It's just a montage of them eating a meal together with music over it.

Dan McCoy

[46:40] I think so much of that, Elliot, honestly, is people like us who have seen so many movies end up valuing like such weird things in movies just because it's like, of course, if you're a quote unquote normie, you're like, I just want a good movie that I'm going to enjoy.

[46:58] And everyone can agree it's good.

[46:59] And like, that's my movie that I saw this year and we're going to have fun.

[47:03] Whereas we're like, yeah, yeah.

[47:05] What weird texture is in this thing?

[47:07] Yeah.

S4

[47:07] I feel that too.

[47:08] And I think the new sort of element in the Letterboxd age is that sometimes against my better judgment, I'll look to see if people review and, you know, like, and just to kind of see the reaction.

[47:19] And, you know, sometimes people even review like my intros, which is really upsetting.

[47:26] But I mean, I just can't help myself.

[47:28] Usually I just want to see what people have to say about people say mean shit about women on the Internet.

Stuart Wellington

[47:32] This is the first I'm hearing about this.

Dan McCoy

[47:36] I recently discovered in Letterboxd that I could search our names within the reviews.

[47:42] Whoops.

[47:42] That was when I sent you those things.

[47:43] Whoopsie doodle.

[47:44] It was all nice stuff.

[47:46] It was just, it was more like, oh, Flop House sent me here.

[47:49] This is good.

[47:49] You know, like, I'm interested in this thing.

Elliott Kalan

[47:51] Oh, here's another way for me to judge my worth online.

[47:54] Great.

[47:55] Yeah.

[47:56] I'm not going to make a habit of it.

Stuart Wellington

[47:57] Dan, has Letterboxd added a DM feature for you yet?

[48:00] No.

[48:01] A Dan McCoy feature?

[48:02] Yeah.

[48:02] Yeah, that's right.

Dan McCoy

[48:04] So this is sort of a broader thing.

[48:07] Thoughts about curation in general.

[48:10] Because, and here is where I'm going to make a question that's more of a comment for a long part of it.

[48:16] But we'll get around to a question.

[48:17] Cool.

[48:18] Which is, I sort of feel like the world was steering away from curation for a while because there are a couple reasons.

[48:25] One, it was often self-proclaimed experts who are curating these things that looked kind of like, say, the Flop House.

[48:34] Name names, Dan McCoy.

[48:35] Don't be a coward.

[49:10] I guess the question, which is not much of one, is like, do you agree with that sort of road we've taken or not?

[49:19] And what are your thoughts about curation as a thing?

S4

[49:22] I mean, at the theater, it's necessary.

[49:25] You know, when you have a streaming service and just sort of like a library, like maybe the algorithm is a thing.

[49:32] But, you know, I've never found that any algorithms on any streaming service, like, deliver me.

[49:37] Save for maybe Tubi, which is obviously the exception to everything.

[49:41] Yeah.

[49:42] But yeah, you know, curation, I think, is important.

[49:45] And especially in, you know, if we didn't have that for movie theaters, you know, you would just end up showing, you know, it's like studios will send you like a list of their DCPs.

[49:54] And like, and it'll be like, here's a combo drive that has like Forrest Gump.

[49:58] And, you know, I mean, I'm bringing that up again.

Stuart Wellington

[50:00] Oh, man, that's like a DVD, like three pack that you'd get at the gas station.

[50:03] You're like, okay, I guess I'll watch.

S4

[50:05] I mean, this sort of happened actually, like, you know, movie theaters closed for COVID lockdown.

[50:10] And when they opened, you were able to rent a theater, like for a private party, but it was like you could choose from these 10 movies.

[50:17] And like Forrest Gump was one of them.

[50:20] So, yeah, I feel like when it comes, you know, and that's the idea is that you want people who are diverse.

[50:25] And so, you know, when I've done screenings, like, you know, I'm one person of one type.

[50:31] But, you know, I also invite other people to pick movies because maybe they'll pick something that's outside of my wheelhouse because of their different background.

[50:39] And I think that's kind of an important part of it, too, is to make sure that if there's, you know, if you sort of have your lane to bring other people in who maybe have like a more expansive knowledge or a more particular thing that you maybe like haven't, you know, you've overlooked for whatever reason.

[50:56] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[50:59] One thing I wanted to ask was knowing that you are so committed to as much as you can showing movies on film, although you were saying, I think earlier before we were on, we were recording that you're loosening up on that.

[51:13] But because of that, like, are there any sort of white whales of movies that you've wanted to screen and have never been able to because you're like, oh, there's no way to get a print of this thing?

S4

[51:23] There are, you know.

[51:24] The day the clown cried.

[51:26] That kind of changes over the years, you know, because there have been things that I've found.

[51:32] There's also been things that used to be available and aren't anymore, and that gets super frustrating that there was like a time that I was able to show something like Heavenly Creatures, like is now there's not a film print of that.

[51:43] Really?

[51:44] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[51:45] Is that because it's unavailable or they've just deteriorated and they haven't struck a new one?

S4

[51:49] So there was kind of like libraries change hands sometimes when they're not, you know, if it's not just Universal or Warner Brothers, like there are these libraries like Miramax and things like that where the libraries kind of move.

[52:00] And like I don't think that they account for the inventory or the new distributor just doesn't care enough to like look into it.

[52:07] So it's a number of things, you know, or the prints get damaged or go missing or something like that.

[52:15] The movies that I've sort of been like for a long time, the one that I've been after is this French movie called Don't Deliver Us from Evil from 1971.

[52:25] That's like this like evil teenage girl type of movie.

[52:29] Sounds a lot like Heavenly Creatures.

[52:31] It's kind of based on the same true story.

[52:34] Oh, wow.

[52:36] But yeah, I mean, if I'm talking about my lane in my wheelhouse, it is like specifically teenage girls who kill people type of movies.

[52:44] But yeah, I think I once tracked down a print that was maybe in France, but like it was a bad print and, you know, it would be expensive to ship overseas.

[52:54] There's this movie called Thief of Hearts, which isn't the best movie, but it stars Stephen Bauer, if you know who that is.

[53:01] That's his like stage name.

[53:03] He's the Cuban from Scarface, like the cousin character or whatever, like super handsome.

[53:09] So this is like a 1980s movie where, you know, it's just sort of an erotic thriller of sorts.

[53:15] And then it's kind of topical, but, you know, I'm doing a series with the director, John McNaughton, who did Henry Portrait of a Serial Killer in Wild Things.

[53:24] And he did this movie called The Borrower.

Stuart Wellington

[53:27] What a career.

[53:28] Just those two alone.

S4

[53:30] Yes, exactly.

[53:31] And I mean, the reason I'm doing it is because he has this other this body of work that is kind of been overlooked and including this movie called The Borrower, which is sort of a sci fi movie he did in the early 90s.

[53:41] And, you know, when I first talked to him, he was like, if you could find a film print of this, because, you know, basically it had a little life at the music box in Chicago because that's where he's from.

[53:52] And he told me that, you know, when they were done with it, they were like, we have this film print.

[53:57] Do you want it?

[53:58] And he's like, I didn't feel like it was mine.

[53:59] So I said no.

[54:00] And now there's no film print.

[54:02] Yeah.

[54:03] So he was like, if you could find it.

[54:06] And I tried, actually.

[54:08] And the only thing I could find was the Library of Congress has.

[54:10] Oh, wow, with Ray Dawn Chong in it.

[54:11] Yeah, it's a great cast, Antonio Vargas.

[54:14] Yeah.

[54:15] There's a copyright print at the Library of Congress, but that's like unloanable.

[54:20] Yeah.

[54:21] And then, you know, there's a lot of other stuff.

[54:23] Like, you know, lately, I mean, maybe forever, but, you know, I get really deep into these, like, direct-to-video action movies that I believe have film prints.

[54:32] So there's, like, this director, Joseph Merahee, who had PM Entertainment was his, you know, his production company.

[54:39] And it's all just, like, a lot of cheap, like, L.A. action movies.

[54:42] And I'm like, I know that there are film prints of this somewhere.

Dan McCoy

[54:46] I feel like I know that name.

[54:47] Like, what are some of the movies?

S4

[54:50] I'm trying to think of, like, what would be the thing that you would know.

[54:53] Because it was actually, like, a very recent discovery for me where I was like, how did I not know about this guy?

[54:59] A lot of these are on M-E-R-H-I.

[55:03] Yeah.

[55:04] Yeah, Spartan is a good one.

[55:07] A lot of them.

[55:08] There's a bunch that star Wingshauser.

Dan McCoy

[55:12] The Sweepers.

[55:13] Oh, I recommended Last Man Standing.

[55:15] Yes.

[55:15] The non-Arthur Hiller last night.

[55:18] Yes.

[55:19] Or Walter Hiller.

[55:20] Walter Hill.

[55:21] Walter Hill.

[55:21] Yeah.

[55:21] Either one.

[55:22] Yeah, I recommended that because...

[55:24] Don't die on that hill, Dan.

[55:26] Tom screened that in person for friends.

[55:32] And it was...

[55:32] Run of the Flophouse, Tom Sylvester.

[55:33] Yeah.

[55:34] It was so much fun, that movie.

S4

[55:35] There's a lot, like, the Sweeper you should watch that has C. Thomas Howell and, like, Jeff Fahey.

[55:41] Jeff Fahey.

[55:42] But I just have, you know, I'm like...

Stuart Wellington

[55:44] Body parts, Jeff Fahey.

S4

[55:46] And even, you know, Doppelganger and other movies by that director, Avi Nesher, like this one.

[55:50] Yeah.

[55:51] Like, things that...

[55:52] It's not like they were, like, in wide circuit on 35mm, but I'm like, you know, I know they're out there somewhere.

Elliott Kalan

[55:58] Yeah.

[55:59] Well, that's the amazing thing about film prints is, like...

[56:02] And I'm sure this is something you come up against or maybe it's beneficial a lot in this kind of programming.

[56:09] It's like, film prints, like, they seem to have this mercurial existence where they are either disappeared and deteriorating or they're turning up in places that you wouldn't expect.

[56:19] And so, like, I feel like there was this period where every five years they suddenly found a new print of Metropolis that had more footage in it than was available before.

[56:26] And I was just listening to a thing not too long about how there are these film archives in Eastern Europe that have original release, potentially versions of the Marx Brothers movies with stuff that was cut out from the prints for re-releases.

[56:38] Oh, wow.

[56:38] And it's just, there's all these prints floating around around the world everywhere, and there's just no systemized way to handle them, and there's no money for someone to go and actually look at everything.

S4

[56:48] Yeah, you need someone who cares.

[57:18] People are always, like, every once in a while someone's like, I want to do a Bollywood series.

[57:23] And I'm like, there's just, there's, like, no, there's no repertory for Bollywood.

[57:28] Like, those movies, they just get cranked out, and then, like, you know, there has to be, it's like, did they really destroy?

[57:34] Can you imagine all the film prints that existed?

[57:37] Like, where did they go?

[57:38] Are they just landfill, you know?

Elliott Kalan

[57:39] It's amazing how much of this stuff that is objectively has a financial value to it just either got thrown away or mislabeled or mishelled, just not taken care of and not organized.

[57:51] It's just really, and maybe it's just because I come from a long line of librarians, but the idea that, like, a company makes a thing, and they're just like, throw it in the room, and nobody, it's in cans that are not labeled and things like that, and it's just crazy to me.

Dan McCoy

[58:03] Or, like, just be like, let's delete it, let's tape over it, no one cares, you know?

Elliott Kalan

[58:09] Yeah, that's the BBC way of doing things, is you're like, it's expensive to buy videotape, let's tape over Dudley Moore and Peter Cook's television show.

[58:17] No one will ever want to watch it again, you know, that kind of thing.

Dan McCoy

[58:20] Well, before we finish, I'd like to highlight Ridiculous Sublime, a series we've mentioned a lot in the Flophouse because Stuart and I have gone to multiple installments, either together or not.

[58:33] Sometimes eating hot dogs also.

[58:34] That's guaranteed entertainment right there, guaranteed entertainment.

[58:38] These are movies that aren't, they aren't quote-unquote bad, but I do think that they're kind of what people who listen to the Flophouse, like, bad movie nuts, really want to see a lot of the time, is movies where what is good about them, what genuinely works, is sort of inexorably tied to also what is maybe silly about them.

[58:57] And they wouldn't be better if they were, like, better.

[59:03] So, they walk, yeah, they walk this line, and what do you look for when you're programming that?

[59:08] Like, what is your sort of criteria for that?

S4

[59:12] I think that, you know, if I've watched something and haven't seen it with an audience, like, there's sometimes when I'll watch or re-watch a movie and be like, I want to see this with the crowd, you know?

[59:23] And, or just for me, you know, my personal enjoyment is just, like, when there's something that makes my jaw drop because it's just, like, it's just something I've never seen before.

[59:33] Or, you know, like, when I finally watched Dreamcatcher.

[59:36] Like, there's so much in that movie that I was just, like, like, whose idea was this?

[59:41] Like, where did this come from?

[59:41] Yeah, Stephen King.

[59:43] You know, it's just, like, just knowing that somebody, like, made their own rules or, like, just, like, didn't care about, like, what the sort of status quo was.

[59:51] That's usually what does it for me.

[59:53] It's just, it's, like, I don't think about it as being good or bad.

[59:55] I'm just, like, somebody took a swing here, and I'm glad they did, and it might not make any sense, and it maybe didn't make any money, and it maybe, like, lost people jobs.

Stuart Wellington

[1:00:05] But, you know.

[1:00:06] What would have been some of the Ridiculous Sublime movies?

[1:00:08] So, like, The Ambulance we saw?

[1:00:10] Yeah.

[1:00:11] That was a fucking banger.

[1:00:12] Saw that.

[1:00:13] We saw Prison.

[1:00:14] Prison, yep.

[1:00:15] Was the Manitou part of that?

[1:00:16] Yes.

[1:00:17] Oh, hell yeah.

[1:00:17] It better be.

Elliott Kalan

[1:00:18] If you're going to show the Manitou, you better put it in the Ridiculous Sublime series.

Stuart Wellington

[1:00:21] Is that the one you described as being the worst print you've ever shown?

S4

[1:00:24] Yeah, because I've shied away from showing, like, stuff from the 70s because, you know, the usual rule is that it was, like, anything from 82 or before has probably faded.

[1:00:35] Um, just based on the film stock that they used.

[1:00:38] Yeah, I mean, I started this series, you know, by now it was, like, over two years ago with Action Jackson.

[1:00:45] And I think for me, part of this was, you know, the idea for the series is that I wanted to encompass action movies, which are some of my favorite things.

[1:00:54] And, you know, any other type of thing that could fit into that.

[1:00:57] I wanted there to be sort of a broad, you know, like, I didn't want to narrow it down to just action movies.

[1:01:03] I had also, you know, been doing this erotic thriller series and that felt sort of too narrow.

[1:01:08] Um, so, yeah, it started with Action Jackson, which is, you know, it's just, like, a ton of fun.

[1:01:12] Like, just, like, completely over the top.

[1:01:14] Just, like, you know, total nonsense.

[1:01:17] Like, crazy stunts.

[1:01:19] Uh, all that, you know?

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:20] It's one of the few movies that feels like it lives up to the ridiculousness of its title.

[1:01:24] Yeah.

[1:01:25] In that kind.

[1:01:25] Where they, clearly the title seems to have come first before anything else.

[1:01:29] And they were like, how do we earn the name Action Jackson?

Dan McCoy

[1:01:31] Yes, exactly.

[1:01:33] That erotic thriller series was great.

[1:01:35] Uh, I have to, I, uh, and it sort of, you were sort of right in tune with the pulse.

[1:01:41] Because I feel like you were programming it.

[1:01:43] Dan's pulse.

[1:01:43] And then there was, well, but then there's, like, this sort of cultural, like, like, reassessment and, like, enjoyment of the erotic thriller.

[1:01:51] Like, like, hey, like, people discovered it again.

[1:01:55] People were like, wait, there can be sex in movies?

[1:01:57] What?

[1:01:58] I don't think so.

[1:01:58] But there's that one with, uh, Banderas and, uh, was it Rebecca Bomarney?

[1:02:03] Yeah, Never Talked to the Dangerous.

[1:02:04] That one is so wild.

[1:02:05] Yeah.

S4

[1:02:06] Yeah, and I mean, that, you know, that could have been in Ridiculous to Sublime, uh, as well, you know?

[1:02:11] Yeah, I miss doing that series.

[1:02:12] I, you know, it didn't get as much of an audience as I would have liked, you know?

[1:02:16] Like, some obviously did better than others.

[1:02:19] And I did really enjoy, you know, I would do this bingo game that was just sort of like, you know, erotic thriller tropes or whatever.

[1:02:26] Um, but yeah, I, I, Ridiculous to Sublime kind of fit more, you know, just was a better umbrella.

[1:02:33] And, you know, I was glad to also fit more comedies, like doing The Boyfriend School as part of that.

[1:02:39] Um, you know, it just, it just works, you know?

Dan McCoy

[1:02:42] Uh, as we close out, I don't know how far ahead you can say, but like, what's up for Ridiculous to Sublime in the future?

S4

[1:02:50] Uh, I've got Poltergeist 3 coming up.

[1:02:52] Ooh.

[1:02:53] Uh, the Jean-Claude Van Damme hockey movie, Sudden Death.

[1:02:56] Oh, hell yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:02:57] That's one of my brother's favorites.

[1:02:58] Oh, baby.

S4

[1:02:59] And, you know, actually, my first experiment in doing something just kind of digitally, uh, Turbulence.

[1:03:07] Are you guys familiar with the Ray Liotta?

[1:03:09] Yeah, yeah.

[1:03:09] Of course.

[1:03:10] It's a Christmas movie, everybody.

[1:03:12] Uh, so, I'm trying to do that for, in December.

[1:03:16] Uh, and, yeah, if you haven't seen it, it's, you know, it might not be as good as Turbulence 3 Heavy Metal, uh, but.

Dan McCoy

[1:03:24] That's what I was going to say.

[1:03:25] It's one of those movies that, uh, you know, was, you know, was mildly successful, but then went on to spawn, uh, a bunch of direct-to-video sequels.

[1:03:34] Uh, yeah, Turbulence 3 is a lot of fun, too.

[1:03:37] Yeah.

[1:03:38] Um.

Elliott Kalan

[1:03:39] Turbulence 3 is a lot of fun, too.

[1:03:41] I'm confused, Dan.

[1:03:42] Oh, boy.

[1:03:42] Which Turbulence is this?

Dan McCoy

[1:03:43] Well, we'll explain off mic.

[1:03:45] We should, uh, we should, we should close up, because, uh, we've, we've talked Christina's ear off.

[1:03:51] She was nice enough to come to my apartment and sit between Stuart and I in this hot room.

[1:03:57] Truly an incredible cost to have to pay to get her message out.

[1:04:02] Yeah, well, I mean, she also lives in the neighborhood.

[1:04:05] It's not that.

[1:04:06] Wow.

[1:04:07] Don't dox her, Dan.

[1:04:08] What are you doing?

[1:04:09] Uh, people don't know where I am, I hope.

[1:04:11] Uh, anyway.

[1:04:12] I would like to thank Christina so much for being here.

[1:04:15] This was really interesting.

[1:04:17] Um, I would like to thank our producer, Alex.

[1:04:20] Alex Smith.

[1:04:21] Howell Dottie is, uh, the name he goes by on the internet.

[1:04:24] I'm wearing one of his shirts right now, but it's blocked by, it's blocked by, uh, the microphone.

[1:04:31] Why don't you, why don't you do a turn?

[1:04:31] So we probably can't see it on the...

[1:04:31] And most people are listening to this, too, so they won't fit.

[1:04:34] Well, we'll describe, describe the garment.

[1:04:36] So it fits perfectly.

[1:04:38] Alex does little, uh, videos for us, so...

[1:04:41] What kind of cotton blend is it?

[1:04:43] It's a pretty heavy shirt, actually, as t-shirts go.

[1:04:46] But if you like that sort of, like, bulkier style, you know, I would recommend it.

[1:04:49] The design's great.

[1:04:50] Um, anyway.

[1:04:51] So Alex, uh, thank you for being our producer.

[1:04:55] Um, thank you for making shirts.

[1:04:58] Uh, yeah, thank you for being a friend.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:59] Uh, yeah.

[1:05:00] But as long as we're thanking people.

[1:05:01] Before Christina goes, I want to say, Christina, thank you so much for the work you've been doing for years now, showing movies to people that they wouldn't have otherwise seen, they might not have heard of, they might not have known it existed.

[1:05:11] And I know that for, one of the things I regret about not living in New York anymore is that I don't have access to the stuff that you're showing.

[1:05:19] Because there's, over the years, there were so many things that I saw because you programmed it that really meant a lot to me and that opened my eyes a lot.

[1:05:25] And it's just, I think you're, you're, um, doing something that you enjoy doing.

[1:05:31] But what you're also doing is, it's just great.

[1:05:34] It's just, it's, it's spreading kind of new things to people and, and inspiring them in ways that I don't know if you are fully aware of.

[1:05:40] So thank you for doing that.

S4

[1:05:41] Oh, I appreciate it.

[1:05:42] Thank you, Elliot.

[1:05:43] And, you know, I, I also miss having you around to host stuff.

[1:05:46] So, you know, you gotta, you gotta come back sometime.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:49] Maybe someday I'll come back and I'll, I'll be like, here I am, Nighthawk.

[1:05:53] And now you're going to watch Scanners.

[1:05:56] You know, I don't know.

[1:05:58] Wow.

[1:05:59] Maybe Scanners 3.

[1:06:00] Heck yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:06:01] Uh, well, thank you all for listening.

[1:06:04] Uh, we'll close up this mini for the Flophouse.

[1:06:07] I've been Dan McCoy.

[1:06:08] I've been Stuart Wellington.

Elliott Kalan

[1:06:10] I've been Elliot Kalin.

[1:06:12] Now sinking into the earth rather than floating into the air.

[1:06:16] And our special guest has been.

S4

[1:06:18] Christina Cacioppo.

[1:06:20] Thank you.

[1:06:21] Bye.

[1:06:22] Bye.

[1:06:29] Maximum Fun.

Dan McCoy

[1:06:30] A worker-owned network.

[1:06:31] Of artists-owned shows.

[1:06:33] Supported.

[1:06:34] Directly.

[1:06:35] By you.

FH Mini #111 - Film Programming, with Cristina Cacioppo

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