Ep.#454 - The Garfield Movie

Dan McCoy

[0:00] On this episode, we discuss the Garfield movie.

Elliott Kalan

[0:03] The story of a farm boy who rose to become America's president before being felled by a madman's bullet.

[0:09] Love lasagna, hates Mondays.

[0:30] Hey, everyone. I'm Dan McCoy.

Dan McCoy

[0:36] Hey, I'm Stuart Wellington.

Elliott Kalan

[0:38] My name's Elliot Kalin.

[0:40] Welcome to the Flophouse.

[0:41] I was just laughing at the way Stuart said his name, which seems like you put a little extra sauce on it.

[0:45] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[0:46] Put some stank on it.

[0:47] That's what Dan told me to do.

[0:48] Yeah, I said, make it extra stanky.

Elliott Kalan

[0:52] Ask and shall receive.

[0:53] He was my favorite of the original Little Rascals.

[0:55] Extra stanky.

Dan McCoy

[0:57] Pull that bottle that says stanky off of the counter and squirt it all over that bad boy.

[1:03] Put a little extra on there.

[1:04] This is a podcast where we watch a bad movie and then we talk about it.

[1:08] And this time around, boys, so it's a well-known thing in Dan McCoy lore.

[1:15] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1:15] So much as anything is a well-known thing in Dan McCoy lore that my birthday is also the birthday of one Garfield T-Cat.

[1:24] What's the T stand for?

[1:25] The.

[1:26] Oh.

[1:27] And not just, you know, like, not just the day, but the first Garfield strip was on the day I was born.

[1:35] And he celebrates his birthday every year on my birthday.

[1:39] So it's an extra treat.

[1:42] I'll open the newspaper.

[1:43] I'll be like, what sort of half joke exists here?

[1:47] What a non-humorous but, you know, sort of slightly smile-inducing thing has Garfield done.

[1:56] Pleasant.

[1:57] Mostly pleasant.

[1:58] Yeah.

[1:58] Yeah, you're really celebrating Garfield already.

[2:01] Except for that.

Elliott Kalan

[2:01] Oh, I thought you were talking about your birthday.

Dan McCoy

[2:04] No, no.

[2:04] I like my birthday.

Elliott Kalan

[2:05] That your birthday is mostly pleasant, kind of a half joke, you know.

Dan McCoy

[2:08] I mean, other than, you know, the March to the Grave that it represents, I'm a big fan.

[2:14] But, yeah.

[2:15] Yeah, but March to the Grave is a great title for your metal album, Dan.

[2:17] Mm-hmm.

[2:18] March to the Grave.

[2:19] Yeah.

[2:19] So this episode will be coming out a couple days after, but it's close.

[2:24] And I said, hey, guys.

[2:25] A couple days after your birthday.

[2:26] Yeah, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[2:27] Because the audience doesn't know, unless the audience already knows the date of the first Garfield strip or your birthday.

[2:32] They don't know that this is topical.

Dan McCoy

[2:34] My birthday is Juneteenth.

[2:35] A more significant holiday than either my or Garfield's birthday.

Stuart Wellington

[2:39] I don't know, Dan.

[2:40] You do have an NAACP Image Award.

[2:42] That's true.

[2:43] Not a joke.

[2:43] That is not a joke.

Elliott Kalan

[2:44] I got it from writing for Trevor Noah.

[2:46] You're saying that Juneteenth is not commemorating the day when the last enslaved people of the United States saw Garfield for the first time.

[2:54] No, no, no.

[2:54] More important.

Stuart Wellington

[2:55] They don't have fucking flipped their lids.

[2:57] Yeah.

[2:57] This cat's so lazy.

Dan McCoy

[2:59] Far more significant holiday.

[3:02] But, yeah, that's the day of my birth.

[3:05] I was not born on Juneteenth itself.

[3:07] That would make me very old.

[3:09] You'd be very old, yeah.

[3:10] Very, very old, yeah.

[3:11] But I said, hey, there was a new Garfield movie out.

[3:14] But, you know, just why don't you pander to me, guys, for once, for once in your lives.

[3:19] Let's do this Garfield.

[3:20] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[3:21] Yeah, you really had to twist our arms.

[3:23] You really had to bleed.

[3:24] Yeah.

[3:25] The man who I think sent out his birthday RSVP three months ago.

Dan McCoy

[3:29] Hey, you know why that is, though?

[3:32] I know so many people who have birthdays within, like, ten days of mine.

[3:38] So I really need to stake a claim if I want to do anything.

Elliott Kalan

[3:41] You really need to stake a claim on people's Juneteenth plans.

[3:43] Yeah.

[3:43] Because he didn't want them to celebrate freedom when they could be celebrating Dan McCoy.

Dan McCoy

[3:46] We're not doing it on a date.

[3:49] That would be crazy.

[3:49] It's a Thursday.

[3:50] No, no.

Stuart Wellington

[3:52] Yeah, he needs maximum attendance so that people can fauna all over him.

Dan McCoy

[3:57] Okay.

[3:57] All right.

[3:58] Yeah, yeah.

[3:58] You don't like attention, Stuart.

[4:00] I love it.

[4:03] This is when the cracks start to show.

Elliott Kalan

[4:05] Yeah, this is.

[4:05] Who knew that this was going to be the thing that drove us apart was the existence of Dan's birthday?

Stuart Wellington

[4:09] Honestly, guys, can I, before we get into the summary of Garfield the movie.

[4:14] The Garfield movie.

[4:15] Can I, can I give a little bit of setup here?

[4:19] Okay.

[4:19] It's been a really long week for me.

[4:21] I've been working a lot at my various bars.

[4:24] I'm physically exhausted.

[4:26] Yeah.

[4:27] And I'm also emotionally exhausted from looking at my little rectangular glass thing in my pocket that shows me images of, yeah, my phone.

Elliott Kalan

[4:34] That's what you're talking about.

[4:35] I thought you meant your scrying glass that shows you the future of the people you meet.

[4:39] I call it a palantir.

[4:40] Thank God.

[4:40] Yeah, you can call it a scrying glass.

[4:42] You approached it in the most obvious way.

[4:44] I look at it and it, you know, it shows me images.

[4:46] I thought you meant one of Father in Erie's mirrors that you carry with you.

[4:49] Yeah.

[4:49] Wait, what?

[4:50] You haven't read those books, Dan?

[4:52] You haven't read those books?

Stuart Wellington

[4:53] Okay, sorry.

[4:53] You know, showing me constant images of war crimes and civil unrest and just the worst people in the world stoking, like, stoking tensions on the world to enrich themselves.

[5:04] Coupled with various other capitalism type stuff.

[5:08] You know, things that bum me out.

[5:10] And for me, movies are an escape.

[5:12] Yeah.

[5:12] So, firing up the Garfield movie, I see filmmakers take the simplest idea, a cat that is very lazy, likes to eat, and is sarcastic.

[5:26] And somehow, they deliver what might be one of the most soulless things I've seen.

[5:33] Just such a fundamental misunderstanding of a very simple character.

Elliott Kalan

[5:38] Yes.

[5:39] And.

[5:40] Wait, so you're saying that when you imagined a Garfield movie, a character that the audience knows well.

[5:46] This character has been around for nearly 50 years at this point.

[5:48] You didn't think the best story for Garfield, the lazy orange cat, is to sneak into a dairy in order to reunite two cows that have fallen in love and been separated?

Dan McCoy

[5:58] I have the same problem.

[5:59] Despite having no particular love for Garfield other than a fondness, you know, for a birthday and growing up in the 80s reasons, just like a vague sort of warm feeling.

[6:08] Yeah.

[6:09] I don't think it's a funny strip.

[6:11] I don't particularly like it.

[6:12] But I have a fondness for him, so I still have the same problem.

[6:15] It's certainly no mutts.

Elliott Kalan

[6:16] It's no mutts by Patrick McDonald.

[6:18] That's for sure.

[6:18] Yeah.

[6:18] I definitely have the same problem that Stewart had.

Dan McCoy

[6:20] He's more of a shoe guy.

[6:22] Yeah, Dan loves shoe.

[6:23] This is a very simple premise that this movie seems to have no interest in.

[6:27] I will argue with you on one thing.

[6:29] I don't know that, like, people know, like, youngsters know Garfield these days, Elliot.

[6:34] Like, no young person is reading the comics page.

Elliott Kalan

[6:38] Certainly not the same way they did when I was a kid where every year that new Garfield collection would come out and it was the top seller of the Scholastic Book Fair at school.

[6:47] Everyone was buying it.

[6:48] Garfield was everywhere.

[6:49] Certainly Garfield is not.

[6:50] Just sitting around the house, you know.

[6:52] Certainly Garfield mania is not what it once was.

[6:54] But that being said, if you're going to make a movie for kids about a lazy orange cat that loves to eat, this is – as original IP, this is not the movie that you make.

Dan McCoy

[7:05] We should say, like, Elliot, you know, for the young people in the audience, Elliot is not overstating the popularity of Garfield.

[7:12] There was a time in which you could not pass a car without seeing that furry orange cat suctioned to the back car.

Elliott Kalan

[7:20] Garfield was very close to being elected president of the United States.

[7:24] I feel like.

Stuart Wellington

[7:24] Yeah, I mean there was a president named Garfield, but I guess they can have two, right?

[7:29] The Bushes did it.

Elliott Kalan

[7:30] We could do it.

[7:31] Yeah, there's two Adams, two Bushes.

[7:32] And they would have been father.

[7:33] There were two Adams?

[7:34] Yeah, and they would have been father and son.

[7:35] Scott Adams was president?

[7:36] Yeah, Dilbert, Scott Adams was president.

[7:39] Ugh, what a terrible president he would make.

[7:41] Not that different from the current one.

[7:42] Exactly.

[7:43] Ugh.

[7:44] Anyway, but the – but he'd be like, if our current president was a vegetarian, that's basically the only difference.

[7:50] But, yeah, because Garfield the Cat was the son of James Garfield, the original president, so it would have been similar.

[7:55] But, you know, Garfield was the most popular comic strip other than Peanuts for years and years.

[8:01] Right, guys?

[8:02] I feel like other than the Charlie Brown characters, there was no one more recognizable on the comics page than Garfield.

Dan McCoy

[8:07] You know, and television specials.

[8:10] We watched a TV show.

[8:12] We had a whole TV series, Garfield and Friends, which is a great cartoon show.

[8:15] Yeah, with U.S. Acres.

[8:17] Yeah, hell yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[8:18] Yeah, the U.S. Acres, the cartoons, which were like – it's like they were just saying to America, hey, kids, use the bathroom for a little bit.

[8:23] Now's your chance.

Dan McCoy

[8:24] The Macy's Thanksgiving Day balloon with the meme that I love of whoever the announcer was saying, ah, here comes that son of a gun, that cat, that Garfield, that gigantic thing.

Stuart Wellington

[8:38] Part of it is, I think for me, the – Jim Davis is a really fucking talented draftsman.

[8:46] Like, he's delivering super crisp, clean art that I found very appealing.

[8:50] Well, his assistants are now delivering that.

[8:52] Whoever's working for Jim Davis is doing a great job.

[8:54] At the beginning.

[8:55] Yeah, okay, yeah.

[8:56] Like, you're not going to knock various manga artists because they have a league of uncredited assistants.

Dan McCoy

[9:01] I laugh at the idea that Jim Davis has drawn a Garfield strip since I don't know.

Stuart Wellington

[9:06] But I mean, like, he probably drew some of the ones in the 80s.

[9:10] Yes, sure.

[9:11] For sure.

Elliott Kalan

[9:12] But this is not a Charles Schultz level of devotion to being in a single man's artistic statement.

Stuart Wellington

[9:18] I mean, he wasn't in the fucking movie programming the digital models and stuff.

Dan McCoy

[9:23] That's a good point.

[9:24] It's a very good point.

Stuart Wellington

[9:25] He was like, how can I make this look worse than my drawing?

Dan McCoy

[9:28] I mean, again, a fondness for Garfield.

[9:31] And Garfield has a second life now, I think, in, like, memes.

[9:34] Stuff like Garfield without Garfields and, like, early –

Elliott Kalan

[9:38] Yeah, because he's such an enormous cultural artifact, you know.

Dan McCoy

[9:40] But he did start out, too.

[9:42] Like, you know, Stuart has praised Jim Davis.

[9:45] Now I come to bury him.

[9:46] Like, he designed Garfield – the stated purpose of Garfield was what would be good for merchandising.

[9:52] He, like, looked around.

[9:53] He was like, okay, well, there's a dog.

[9:56] There's no big cat, you know.

[9:57] And he was like, let me give it a few traits that will be good for, you know, coffee mugs and whatnot.

Elliott Kalan

[10:03] I may have read this wrong, but I read somewhere, I think, that it was either inspired by Charles Schultz or Charles Schultz giving him this advice that it was like, you should have Garfield stand on two legs.

[10:14] Because in those early Garfield strips, he stands like a cat.

[10:16] He's on four legs all the time.

[10:17] And then it was like a lightning bolt, you know, inspiration revelation that if he stands on two feet, he can be that much more kind of, like, smaller, rounder, expressive, cuter, you know.

[10:28] That's part of the secret.

[10:29] He's a bipedal cat, you know.

Stuart Wellington

[10:31] Guys, let's get into the Garfield movie and find out why it has upset Stuart so much.

[10:35] Why this might have been the thing that broke Stuart Wellington.

[10:38] We're going to find out.

Elliott Kalan

[10:39] And we should make it very clear we're not talking about Garfield the movie from 2004.

[10:43] No.

[10:43] That is a 21-year-old live-action movie.

[10:45] That's the one where Bill Murray does the voice of Garfield.

[10:47] Uh-huh.

[10:47] That was the movie which, while promoting it, Jennifer Love Hewitt went on The Daily Show and John made her feel bad by accident by talking about what a dumb movie it was.

[10:58] But this is the Garfield movie, not Garfield the movie.

[11:02] So we should own that.

Dan McCoy

[11:04] And Stuart, to set the stage for Stuart's madness, and not my madness, I don't mean, you know, insanity, I mean his anger.

[11:11] It could be both.

[11:13] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[11:13] It did drive it.

[11:14] He did call me up after watching it and say something about how he could see the Fnords, and there was non-Euclidean geometry all around him.

[11:20] And I was like, this movie's driven you mad, Stuart.

Dan McCoy

[11:22] There's some very key things about Garfield.

[11:25] Garfield is lazy.

[11:26] Garfield is sarcastic.

[11:28] Garfield does not particularly seem to like his owner, John.

[11:31] These are all things that are not true of this movie's Garfield.

Elliott Kalan

[11:34] So they touch on it briefly.

[11:35] Garfield is lazy.

[11:37] He's gluttonous.

[11:38] He loves lasagna.

[11:39] He hates Mondays.

[11:39] He hates spiders.

[11:41] He hates this cute cat named Nermal.

[11:43] And he is very condescending towards his ostensible owner.

[11:47] He is clearly the one who runs the house.

[11:49] And that's Garfield.

[11:50] Like, that's it.

[11:51] That's all of what's Garfield.

[11:52] That's a Garfield.

[11:52] That's what Garfield means to me.

[11:55] When a cat hits your eye with, like, a big lasagna pie, that's a Garfield.

[11:58] So, and this movie kind of hits some of those bullet points early on and then is like, forget everything you knew about Garfield.

[12:03] Time to do something different.

Stuart Wellington

[12:04] Yeah.

[12:04] So before we get a bunch of backstory, we see, like, Garfield lives with John.

[12:09] They live in a house.

[12:10] He lives – they also have a dog named Odie.

[12:13] Now, Odie is one of, I would say, the biggest mischaracterizations in the movie.

Elliott Kalan

[12:18] They make Odie smart in this movie.

Dan McCoy

[12:20] Yes.

[12:20] And they make them, you know, compatriots rather than, you know, Garfield tolerates Odie at best.

[12:28] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[12:28] I feel like the running gag is him kicking Odie.

[12:31] Yes, indeed.

[12:32] And also that Garfield uses a phone for quite a bit of the opening of this movie, which seems like a real fuck you to the audience.

[12:38] Like, hey, guess what?

[12:39] You're going to go out to this character just using a screen for a little bit.

Stuart Wellington

[12:43] So we get – then we get a little bit of backstory.

[12:45] How did we get here?

[12:46] How did we get ourselves in this mess where this cat is running this man's life?

[12:51] Well, it begins with Garfield as a baby, which I'm like, already we have a baby – a cute baby Garfield.

[12:57] And I'm like, that was fucking normal, dude.

[12:59] And the whole existence of normal was Garfield hating him.

[13:02] Like, why do we have, like, a cute version – a cuter version of Garfield?

[13:05] Don't like it.

Elliott Kalan

[13:05] We've got to make – Garfield is an incredibly popular character for 40 years.

[13:10] We've got to make him likable, Stu.

[13:12] We've got to get the audience on his side.

[13:14] We've got to give Nicholas Holt more chances to the voice of John Arbuckle with – I have to say, one of the stranger performances that I've seen from Nicholas Holt, who is an actor I love.

[13:24] I've seen him do so many great performances.

[13:25] I've seen him do so many different interesting voices.

[13:27] And this whole time I was like, this is not the best use of Nicholas Holt.

Dan McCoy

[13:30] Well, also, we have to see Garfield as a kid so we can give him daddy issues, which is the only thing that Hollywood understands.

[13:36] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[13:36] Yeah, yeah.

[13:37] Daddy issues or – actually, that's true.

[13:40] It's two kinds of daddy issues.

[13:41] Either your dad left you or you're a dad and you don't have time for your kids because you're working all the time.

[13:47] Those are two things that Hollywood understands.

Stuart Wellington

[13:48] The only daddy issues I like are the People Magazine special issue focusing on Pedro Pascal.

Elliott Kalan

[13:55] So –

Stuart Wellington

[13:56] It's much more wholesome than I thought it was going to be.

Elliott Kalan

[13:58] Yeah, I thought it was going to be much more overtly sexual.

[14:00] Yeah, yeah.

[14:01] Don't ask Stuart about his bear issues.

Stuart Wellington

[14:05] So –

[14:06] They keep stealing my honey.

[14:07] So in Garfield's backstory, he has a father who is a large alley cat named Vic who abandons him in an alleyway.

[14:17] Go on.

Dan McCoy

[14:17] I don't want to stop you right away, but I will.

[14:20] And so the cat – Garfield's voice, as all voices are these days, is Chris Pratt.

[14:28] Yes.

[14:29] And the dad is Samuel L. Jackson.

[14:31] And I was torn between being like, well, I'm pro-colorblind casting and being like, is it racist that we're giving him a black-sounding father who abandoned – like the deadbeat dad is the black father of a white cat.

[14:46] Wow.

Elliott Kalan

[14:47] Wow.

[14:47] Dan, you are noticing a problematic thing that I feel bad I did not pay attention to maybe because I was already so not looking for meaning in a Garfield movie.

[14:56] Yeah, yeah.

[14:56] I will say Chris Pratt has a hard – has got a hard row to hoe here because Garfield's voice – it's a couple different people have done the job.

[15:04] For me, it will still always be Lorenzo Music who did his voice in the early specials.

Stuart Wellington

[15:08] He gets a little Easter egg in the back story.

[15:10] There's a music store in the back called Lorenzo's Music.

[15:12] Which I had to explain to Charlene and she – her eyes glazed over immediately.

Elliott Kalan

[15:16] She was like, wait, Lorenzo Music?

[15:18] You mean Carlton, your doorman?

[15:19] And you go, oh, he was more things than just Rhoda's doorman.

[15:21] She's like the voice of Peter Fankman in the real Ghostbusters.

[15:26] Exactly.

[15:27] But yeah, it's – how do you guys feel about Chris Pratt's performance as Garfield?

[15:30] He's really putting on an interesting new voice, right?

Dan McCoy

[15:32] He is not.

[15:34] I – you know, I –

[15:34] Just doing his regular voice.

[15:36] Like Chris Pratt has done good voice performances in the past.

[15:40] Yeah.

[15:40] Drop a couple on us.

[15:41] No, the Lego movie I think is good.

[15:43] And then like I was not – you know, I did not really care about like the whole like Mario controversy.

[15:50] I'm like, eh, whatever.

[15:52] It's – like it's not great but like –

[15:54] Pratt is an Italian-American name, right?

Elliott Kalan

[15:57] Well, I mean the fact – I think the fact – to be honest, the Mario character as a –

[16:01] as a New York Italian-American probably does sound more like Chris Pratt than,

[16:06] it's-a me, Mario, which is not a – which is itself a cartoonishly Italian voice.

Dan McCoy

[16:10] I'm just saying that like I don't think it was like a great voice performance but it was certainly –

[16:14] it certainly had energy whereas this has, to my mind, very little energy or effort.

[16:20] Which, I mean, on some level fits the character Garfield.

[16:24] Yeah, but not – it doesn't seem intentionally lazy.

Elliott Kalan

[16:26] When he is surfing on food being delivered by a drone because he's fighting evil dogs on top of a train,

[16:32] you do want a little bit of energy from the character.

[16:35] Okay, so –

[16:36] Oh, remind me – by the way, I watched this movie with my younger son.

[16:39] Remind me to get – when we get to the later movie to tell you about when my younger son pitched a punch-up on one of the jokes in it

[16:45] that I thought was much better than what they had in the movie.

Stuart Wellington

[16:46] I was very proud of him, yeah.

[16:47] So, we get some backstory.

[16:51] A baby Garfield goes looking for food.

[16:53] He finds, what, Mama Leone's Pizzeria.

[16:56] He sees John Arbuckle about to tuck into some food and he is like licking the window and –

Elliott Kalan

[17:04] John Arbuckle is noticeably sad when he sees the families at Mama Leone's and he's all by himself.

Stuart Wellington

[17:09] He is – yeah, he's a lone diner.

[17:12] And I mean, I feel like that's also like a kind of a weird restaurant to go eat by herself.

[17:16] Like go to the bar.

Elliott Kalan

[17:17] A family – go to the place from Nighthawk.

[17:19] From Nighthawk's the painting.

[17:20] Like that's where you go when you're lonely is an Edward Hopper restaurant.

[17:24] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[17:24] But he, you know, he takes pity on this baby cat.

[17:27] Or go to Nighthawk, the movie theater.

[17:28] Why not?

Elliott Kalan

[17:28] It's a great theater.

[17:29] Yeah, why not?

[17:29] Edward Hopper never painted it, but that doesn't mean it's bad, you know?

Stuart Wellington

[17:32] You don't – you can just order food in the movie and then leave when you're done eating.

[17:36] You don't have to –

Dan McCoy

[17:37] Yeah, no one sees you're alone because the movie's going on and it's dark in there.

Stuart Wellington

[17:41] Especially like if you eat gross like Dan does sometimes.

[17:44] What?

[17:44] It means it's dark.

[17:45] No one can see you, yeah.

[17:46] I'm just joking.

[17:47] Gross.

[17:47] We all eat gross sometimes, right?

[17:49] I mean when you're watching The Substance, you got to eat gross, right?

[17:51] I don't know.

[17:52] Yeah, that's the special ad with The Substance, gross.

[17:55] Yeah.

[17:55] Eat gross the way you want to at The Substance.

[17:58] Okay, so there's some like hijinks in the restaurant where Garfield's eating everybody's food.

[18:04] Doesn't matter.

[18:05] John takes him home.

[18:06] He's like, maybe I'll give this cat up.

[18:08] And Garfield's like, no, no, no.

[18:09] They love each other.

[18:10] Takes him home.

Elliott Kalan

[18:11] The scene where Garfield is eating all the food and John is trying to stop people from noticing it.

[18:15] I turned to my son and I said, so is this funny to you?

[18:18] Like, do you find this like funny?

[18:20] Are you laughing?

[18:20] Is this like a clown?

[18:21] Does it amuse you?

[18:22] Yeah.

[18:22] And he just turned to me and shrugged and went, eh.

[18:24] So it's like, I don't think he knew that it was supposed to be funny.

[18:27] Like, that's how not successful it is as like a joke, you know?

Stuart Wellington

[18:30] So it does highlight kind of the general like scene structure in a lot of this movie is just make it fast.

[18:38] Make a lot of stuff happening fast, which I feel like on some level it goes against a very lazy cat like Garfield.

Dan McCoy

[18:45] Now, can I mention that the director of this picture, so on the low end.

[18:50] Sidney Lumet?

[18:51] Yeah.

[18:51] Wow.

[18:52] Lumet.

[18:54] Wow.

[18:55] Continental of you.

[18:57] On the low end, directed Chicken Little.

[19:00] On sort of the neutral end, Cats Don't Dance.

[19:03] And on the high end, Emperor's New Groove.

[19:07] Same screenwriter too, right?

[19:08] For Emperor's New Groove.

[19:09] I don't know.

[19:10] I don't know about that.

Elliott Kalan

[19:12] It's this Mark Dindle.

[19:13] He's a longtime Disney animator.

Dan McCoy

[19:15] Yeah.

[19:15] And I think that this movie has some moments of like successful slapstick.

[19:23] And the problem is it's just tied into a movie that it should not be part of.

[19:28] Like there's stuff in here that I'm like, well, I could see myself enjoying this if this was not a Garfield movie, which is part of the problem with like the obsession with IP.

[19:36] Because like this doesn't feel like a Garfield movie in the first place.

[19:38] So if it's just an unrelated kids movie, I'd be like, yeah, whatever.

[19:42] I mean, it's not really for me, but there's a couple of like laughs in there.

[19:45] Kids would like it.

Elliott Kalan

[19:46] If it was called Cat's Son or something like that.

[19:48] Yeah.

[19:48] Cat Junior.

[19:49] Cat Williams.

[19:50] Something like that.

[19:50] Yeah.

[19:51] But there's a part at the end where Garfield keeps stepping in the way of traffic and all the cars have to stop short and they're getting annoyed at him.

[19:58] That's the funny part.

[19:58] That was timed really well.

[19:59] You know?

[20:00] Yeah.

[20:00] But it doesn't feel like Garfield.

[20:01] It feels like something a different character would do.

Stuart Wellington

[20:03] So we see the passage of time.

[20:05] They move – John moves out of an apartment, moves into a house.

[20:08] They gain a dog named Odie.

[20:11] We see them getting into all kinds of goofy situations where Garfield basically is now running this house.

[20:17] He has a nice big lazy boy.

[20:19] All this stuff.

Elliott Kalan

[20:20] This shows you – this is another thing.

[20:22] I feel like people who make – obviously adults make these movies, not kids.

[20:26] But I think they sometimes don't really get what kids will be interested in because the transition from an apartment to a two-bedroom, two-bathroom house is something that I don't think kids need mentioned or to see necessarily.

[20:38] John Arduckle could just be in a house the whole time.

[20:41] It's not something that a kid cares about.

Dan McCoy

[20:44] You're coming out in favor of child labor.

[20:46] You're saying that more children should have been involved.

[20:48] Yes.

[20:48] Very much so.

[20:49] Exactly.

Elliott Kalan

[20:49] With their little hands, they can draw things better.

Stuart Wellington

[20:51] Dude, all we need to do – I think it's pretty straightforward.

[20:54] We take kids.

[20:55] We shove them in front of that Zoltar machine or whatever.

[20:58] Make them big.

[20:58] Okay?

[20:59] Then they can give us their fucking ideas and we can make money.

[21:01] Get around child labor laws that way.

[21:03] That's why –

[21:04] Roger Loja.

[21:07] Robert Loja knew what was going on.

Elliott Kalan

[21:09] Robert Loja knows.

[21:10] That's how you get good toys.

[21:11] It's like there was a – in the Dogman movie, which we did not do for this podcast, I believe, but which I saw with my children.

[21:17] There's a –

[21:17] How was it?

[21:18] Yeah, yeah.

[21:19] Give us a –

[21:19] Miss that movie.

Dan McCoy

[21:20] I kind of stopped paying attention partway through.

Elliott Kalan

[21:22] But it's fine.

[21:23] I mean the Dogman books I came to really appreciate eventually.

[21:26] They get very emotionally rich at a certain point.

[21:29] But the movie –

Stuart Wellington

[21:30] They're about the supporting character who eventually becomes King of the North from the First Law series by Joe Abercrombie.

[21:36] Exactly.

[21:37] Yeah, exactly.

Elliott Kalan

[21:38] That's what it is.

[21:38] But there's a part in it where Dogman is like sad because his – before he became a Dogman, he had a girlfriend and now she has left him.

[21:46] And I was like, what kid cares about this?

[21:48] Like who – what kid wants there to be a romantic subplot in their movie about a cop with a dog's head who fights a cat who makes robots?

[21:54] Like, come on.

Stuart Wellington

[21:55] It's – there is – like as soon as they started giving us backstory about how Garfield was abandoned as a child, I'm like, what the fuck are you doing, movie?

[22:02] Yeah.

[22:03] Like, we don't need this.

[22:04] And what we also don't need is a sequence where Garfield explains why he hates Mondays.

[22:10] Yeah.

[22:10] Like, bitch, part of what makes Garfield so approachable is that he hates – he doesn't – this dude doesn't even have a job and he hates Mondays.

[22:16] And the thing is, we – everybody identifies with that.

[22:19] Everybody on the planet hates fucking Mondays.

[22:21] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[22:21] This was not – this is not certainly a unique observation.

[22:25] I believe I've seen this out in the universe.

[22:28] But it is odd that Garfield hates Mondays seeing that he does not have a job.

[22:33] And the reason most people hate Mondays is that they work a regular work week.

[22:40] You know, not everyone, but, you know, many people.

[22:42] And so Monday represents –

Elliott Kalan

[22:44] That makes sense.

[22:45] That makes sense, Dan.

[22:45] But if I could ask you just one question.

[22:47] Thank you.

[22:47] Isn't there something inherently comical in a cat hating Mondays when it does not have a job?

[22:53] Isn't it almost a ridiculous juxtaposition leading to a humorous reaction or an ironic standpoint?

Stuart Wellington

[22:59] So much of Garfield is to elicit a – like a gentle nod and being like, yeah, Garfield, food is delicious or whatever.

[23:08] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[23:08] I don't feel like –

[23:09] Mondays are bad.

[23:10] The comic ever makes that sort of connection though.

[23:13] No, you're right.

Elliott Kalan

[23:15] Comics are better when they explain the jokes and they don't let the audience find them.

[23:18] Yeah, like it's –

[23:19] Like it's Ag Me Novel.

Dan McCoy

[23:20] Maybe I'm poisoned by knowing that Jim Davis wanted this to be, you know, a merchandising bonanza.

[23:27] But I feel like it's hatred of Monday.

[23:28] It's like Ag Me Novel.

[23:29] It feels like something that's just like, oh, this would be good for posters.

[23:32] You're right.

Elliott Kalan

[23:33] Merchandising is always bad.

[23:35] Like, don't the peanuts shill for MetLife, Daniel?

[23:38] Don't you love them?

[23:39] Yeah.

[23:39] But that's not part of the strip.

Dan McCoy

[23:41] They're like – Snoopy isn't like going up to like Shermie.

[23:45] Like you got to get a policy.

Elliott Kalan

[23:48] Yeah, that's right.

[23:49] That's right.

[23:49] Because Garfield does a lot of product placement in its comic strip.

[23:52] You make a good point.

[23:53] You make a good point.

Dan McCoy

[23:53] No, my point is the Monday thing is from the comics.

Elliott Kalan

[23:58] But yeah.

[23:58] So what – do you think he's being paid by the No Mondays council?

[24:01] Like I understand.

Dan McCoy

[24:02] I'm saying this will be a good thing to put on a shirt or whatever.

Elliott Kalan

[24:07] Because art that seeks to connect with humans based on their own personal frustrations.

[24:12] That's bad.

[24:13] I guess that's bad now.

Dan McCoy

[24:14] You know, Columbo, you're getting really irritated.

Stuart Wellington

[24:17] Wow.

[24:17] It sounds like one of the – like the most famous person in the cast.

[24:20] He was clearly the murderer.

[24:23] Columbo, you're getting really annoying.

[24:25] You know, Lieutenant, this is getting a little annoying right now.

Dan McCoy

[24:30] You're picking apart everything.

[24:31] You're right, Dick Van Patten.

[24:33] I shouldn't be asking you all these questions.

[24:36] Okay.

[24:38] Columbo, could you just go?

[24:39] I don't want to be in this conversation anymore.

[24:40] I literally can't.

Elliott Kalan

[24:41] I'm investigating a crime and you're the suspect.

[24:44] Okay.

[24:45] Well.

[24:45] Okay.

[24:46] So Garfield and Nody –

[24:47] I should stop investigating the crime and do something else as a police detective.

Stuart Wellington

[24:52] Garfield and Nody –

[24:52] Maybe I should stop reviewing restaurants.

[24:56] I guess Stuart Garfield.

[24:57] Garfield and Nody go to get – I'm still on my first block.

[25:01] Yeah.

[25:02] I'm just trying to apply to this thing.

[25:04] There's too much.

[25:05] Someone say too much for a Garfield movie.

[25:07] I 100% would say that.

[25:08] I feel like if this is a movie, this should have just been a collection of incidents.

[25:11] Too much, but we can bullet point it.

Dan McCoy

[25:13] I think a collection of incidents would be harder to – anyway.

Stuart Wellington

[25:16] Well, that's – I mean, that's basically what the Garfield collections were and those things rocked my shit.

[25:23] They're bad.

[25:24] I'm just saying it's harder to summarize something when nothing's important.

[25:27] So Garfield and Nody are trying to get Garfield a late-night snack.

[25:30] And when they get kidnapped by Roland, Nolan, and Barry, a large Shar-Pei, a Whippet, and a Bird, who are goons.

[25:43] It's always goons around the Flophouse.

[25:45] Yeah.

[25:45] It should be called the Goon House.

[25:47] It's a different podcast.

[25:49] Okay.

[25:49] It's mostly about lube.

[25:50] Yep.

[25:51] They – I mean, there's a lot to talk about there.

[25:54] Yeah, there's a lot to talk.

Elliott Kalan

[25:55] Yeah, that makes sense.

[25:56] It's a complicated subject.

Stuart Wellington

[25:59] They kidnapped Garfield and Nody for their master, Jinx, a – what kind of cat is that?

Elliott Kalan

[26:07] It's a white Persian cat.

Stuart Wellington

[26:09] White Persian cat voiced by Hannah Waddingham.

[26:11] Now, these are all celebrity voices because Roland is Brett Goldstein.

Elliott Kalan

[26:15] Nolan is Bowen Yang.

[26:16] Like, there are – some would say that there are unnecessarily famous voices, as with many animated movies.

Dan McCoy

[26:23] Now, I thought you were going to point out these are all new characters.

[26:26] Instead of hanging around with Garfield and Odie and John and Liz, the veterinarian that John annoys.

[26:35] What about Arlene?

[26:35] Nermal.

[26:36] Arlene, yeah.

[26:37] The waitress, right?

[26:39] Yeah.

[26:39] Oh, no, that's his girlfriend, right?

[26:41] His cat girlfriend, yeah.

[26:42] His cat girlfriend.

[26:42] But, yeah, there's also a waitress.

[26:44] Like, any of these characters, it's just like, no, no, no, no.

[26:46] Like, here's a bunch of other characters from whatever unrelated script this started out as.

Elliott Kalan

[26:52] Now, I would say –

Stuart Wellington

[26:53] Well, we'll address each of these characters in turn, I'm sure.

[26:56] Yes.

[26:57] We'll give them a real ranking.

Elliott Kalan

[26:58] And I would say as much as –

[27:00] A real hotter non-ranking, yeah.

[27:02] As much as giving Garfield a sad backstory I think is a misstep.

[27:05] This is where the movie really – I was like, oh, okay.

[27:08] I don't know what this movie is going to be.

[27:10] Like, I don't know what's going on here.

[27:11] When Garfield and Odie are kidnapped by these genuinely, like, genuinely menacing, unpleasant characters.

Stuart Wellington

[27:18] Garfield and Odie get kidnapped by Jinx using her – through her henchmen as an attempt to draw out Garfield's absentee father, Vic, who is some kind of, like, ne'er-do-well type scoundrel cat.

[27:32] A real macavity.

[27:34] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[27:35] Well, he's like a low-level macavity.

[27:38] Maybe even more of a bust for Jones.

Stuart Wellington

[27:40] Now, Vic is the absentee father who abandoned baby Garf and Garf found John.

[27:49] Jinx needs them to –

[27:50] We've done jokes about the world according to Garf at some point, right?

[27:52] Yeah, of course.

[27:54] Now, also, there's some additional backstory where we learn that Jinx wanted to be, like, a special cat but wasn't successful and then fell in with a bad crowd stealing things.

[28:04] This is all dumb bullshit.

[28:06] Unnecessary.

[28:06] So much backstory.

[28:08] Just be a villainous cat.

[28:09] We don't need to know the tragic reasons that pushed this cat towards crime.

[28:14] I do like some of the character design on Jinx.

[28:17] I like the way that she has – I like her kind of, like, bell-shaped body and I like that she has this, like, string of gems that glow different colors based on her mood.

[28:28] I think that's interesting.

[28:29] They do some –

[28:29] Everything else I don't like.

Elliott Kalan

[28:30] Every time she switches from friendly to evil very quickly and back and the lighting changes, that all looks really cool.

[28:37] I think it's fun, yeah.

[28:37] Yeah.

[28:38] It does feel like a character from a different movie but it looks cool.

[28:40] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[28:41] And they occasionally, like, play that up by, like, showing her henchmen actually using, like, a flashlight to cause lighting effects.

[28:46] I think that's fun.

[28:47] Yeah.

[28:48] But Jinx needs –

Elliott Kalan

[28:49] Do you ever wonder how they – like, how they made their base in this abandoned mall and how they got Garfield Noti hanging, it seems, 200 feet in the air, you know, from the ceiling of this mall?

Dan McCoy

[29:00] I did not wonder that despite my –

[29:03] Love that shit.

[29:04] The lines that you say about how I love backstory.

[29:07] Oh, yes.

[29:07] You must have been loving all this Jinx stuff.

[29:09] You must have been so excited about it.

[29:10] I was not wondering about any of it.

[29:12] I just accepted it because it was a cartoon.

Stuart Wellington

[29:16] So, in part of her backstory, Jinx was running around with Vic committing crimes and while she was betrayed by Vic when they were trying to steal some milk from, what, Lactose Farms is the name of the thing.

[29:30] And as a lactose intolerant person, I am not a fan of this.

[29:34] This makes me upset.

[29:35] Also, it makes me upset to see a cat drinking milk all the time because I know that gives cats diarrhea.

Dan McCoy

[29:39] Yeah, it's bad for cats.

[29:40] But, I mean, I would think that you're happy that this milk is being stolen and thus taken out of the ecosystem.

[29:44] That's true.

[29:45] Yeah, it's less likely to go into my mouth.

Elliott Kalan

[29:46] I mean, I know this was all cat milk.

[29:48] You know, this is –

[29:49] What?

[29:51] Okay, well –

[29:51] I think humans who can process lactose probably were going to get some of this milk.

Dan McCoy

[29:55] Yeah.

[29:56] No, I'm saying it won't go to stew.

Elliott Kalan

[29:57] Yeah, it won't go to me.

[29:58] That's the important thing.

[29:59] Because if cats aren't stealing it out of the factory, stew has to drink it.

[30:02] That's the law.

[30:03] Legally.

[30:04] Yes.

[30:05] So, she –

[30:07] The deal –

[30:07] Whenever America and Russia signed the first salt treaty, stew always lactose tasting, that stated that Stewart, to keep peace between the two nations, Stewart had to drink a lot of milk.

[30:18] Yeah.

[30:18] You know.

[30:19] It's always bad for you.

[30:20] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[30:21] So, using some questionable leverage at this point, Jinx convinces Vic, Garfield, and Odie to go back to lactose farms and steal a very large quantity of milk as kind of payment for the time she spent in the pound.

Elliott Kalan

[30:40] This was something that my younger son also explained to me was that he said, why does she want all that milk?

[30:44] It's going to go bad before she can drink it.

[30:47] I'm like, that's a good point.

[30:48] That's a very good point.

[30:49] You can't –

[30:50] One cat can't drink that much milk.

[30:51] No.

[30:52] It's not the most shelf-stable treasure.

Dan McCoy

[30:55] Well, also, the street value of milk is almost nothing because if someone tries to sell you some milk in the street, you're like, where did this milk come from?

[31:02] Well, it's like a car.

Elliott Kalan

[31:02] The minute you take it off the lot, the blue book value goes way down.

[31:06] Just drops.

[31:07] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[31:07] So, our heroes set off riding the rails.

[31:13] They sneak aboard a train car.

[31:16] Yep, Dan.

Dan McCoy

[31:17] Now, this was like the moment in my life where I felt the most like the comic book guy, like the nerd.

[31:25] I guess it wasn't the comic book guy, but it was in the one Simpsons episode where it's like you hit the skeleton in the same place and it made two different sounds.

[31:36] Yeah.

[31:36] It sounds like I hope someone got –

Elliott Kalan

[31:37] Someone was fired over that.

Dan McCoy

[31:39] Yeah, yeah.

[31:39] Yeah.

[31:39] I was watching this.

[31:41] There's a part where Garfield is shot from like a tree limb through the train.

[31:49] He goes through an open train car, goes out the other side, and then bounces back and goes through the same train car.

[31:54] And I'm like, no, that train car would have gone forward.

[31:57] Yeah.

[31:58] Like there's no way he could go through the same train car.

[32:00] And I was – and then I was like, what am I doing?

[32:02] Why do I care?

Elliott Kalan

[32:04] Dan, I hate to say it.

[32:05] I had the exact same thought process where I was like there's no – he wouldn't have been able to fly back to the same train.

[32:10] But then I was like, you know, it doesn't matter.

[32:11] It's the Garfield movie.

[32:13] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[32:14] So, yeah, as we've addressed, he flies through the same train car multiple times.

[32:18] It's totally hilarious.

Elliott Kalan

[32:20] This is one of the times when I started to say it also, and my younger son turned to me and he goes, don't just complain through the whole movie.

[32:28] Don't just tell me you don't like the movie.

[32:30] And then he wasn't enjoying it.

[32:31] When it was over, I was like, how was it?

[32:32] And he goes, eh.

Stuart Wellington

[32:33] But he was like, don't just tell me what's wrong with the movie.

[32:36] Oh, wow.

[32:36] So, yeah, so your son's a polite Midwesterner who doesn't want to speak up.

[32:41] Exactly.

[32:41] You got to break him in that habit.

[32:43] Okay.

[32:44] Oh, trust me.

[32:44] He speaks up.

[32:46] So, we arrive at the farm, Lactose Farm.

[32:50] Unfortunately, security has increased quite a bit since the last time Vic was here.

[32:55] It's all high tech and intense.

[32:58] Luckily, they meet Otto, a purple bull, who I thought was a yak for a while, but I think he's a bothy former Ving Rhames.

[33:07] Yeah.

[33:08] Who I can guarantee you recorded all his lines while seated.

[33:13] But I'll say this.

Elliott Kalan

[33:13] And while wearing a cool hat.

[33:15] I'll say this.

[33:16] I think my favorite performance in the whole movie.

[33:18] Yes.

[33:18] I think he does.

[33:18] I think you're right.

Dan McCoy

[33:19] It's the funniest voice performance, for sure.

Stuart Wellington

[33:21] He, so this character was the former mascot of Lactose Farms, Otto the Bull, who, it was him and a cow, Ethel.

[33:34] And they were deeply in love, but something happened and he got kicked out.

[33:40] And she remains, I guess, under lock and key by the farm.

[33:45] Is that correct?

[33:45] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[33:45] So, they want to heist the milk and he's going to help them if they can heist the cow as well, essentially.

Elliott Kalan

[33:51] Why heist the cow if you can heist the milk for free, you know?

Stuart Wellington

[33:56] While they're training and preparing.

[33:58] I doubt it myself.

[33:59] While they train and prepare, Vic, I think we get Vic's backstory here.

[34:04] I think this was involved.

[34:05] They get tied up to a tree and Garfield and his dad get in an argument.

[34:10] And we get Vic's backstory where he didn't actually abandon Garfield.

[34:15] He went off trying to get food, but then he showed up too late and then he saw Garfield with John and, like, it's fucking stupid.

[34:23] And he was like, oh, I guess my son's better off with this human, which I'm like, yeah, he probably is.

[34:29] Yeah.

[34:30] He won't be in a box in the rain.

Dan McCoy

[34:31] Rather than having to scavenge it.

[34:33] But I don't know.

Stuart Wellington

[34:35] He'll probably get fixed.

Dan McCoy

[34:36] In so much as anything in the Garfield movie elicited any sort of pathos for me.

[34:42] There were some mild twinges when I saw, like, the dad being, like, looking at Garfield being adopted basically in front of his eyes and being like, I guess it is for the best.

[34:51] Mm-hmm.

Elliott Kalan

[34:53] Not since the story of Moses has someone had to see their son be taken for their own safety.

[35:01] And it had such pathos to it, you know, and such importance.

[35:04] Yep.

Dan McCoy

[35:06] Garfield is sort of the Moses of cats.

Stuart Wellington

[35:10] So Otto, who has an understanding of the layout but is much too large to sneak in, stays back.

[35:17] They all put acorns in their ears, which work as, like, radios.

Elliott Kalan

[35:22] Yeah, they're like little walkie-talkies, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[35:24] Our cats and dog friend all sneak in pretending to be backpacks.

[35:29] They go around inside this high-tech facility, which is very much like a bunch of modern animation bullshit.

[35:37] Like, there's a scene where, like, Garfield is almost getting chopped up or shredded like cheese.

[35:43] And you're like – it's all the fucking – the, like, the mayhem conveyor belt sequence from episode two, Attack of the Clones, right?

[35:51] Where, like, stuff's about to smash them all the time.

Elliott Kalan

[35:53] I got so mad.

[35:53] There's a part – he's on a big block of cheese, and these big cleavers are chopping it up.

[35:58] And he keeps running back and forth along the block of cheese.

[36:00] And I was like, Garfield, you exist in three dimensions.

[36:02] Go forward off the cheese.

[36:04] Yes.

[36:04] Get out so you're not within reach of the blades.

[36:07] And I was like –

[36:08] Elliot, Garfield can't hear you.

[36:09] I kept shouting and shouting, but he couldn't hear me, Dan.

[36:12] He couldn't hear me.

[36:13] What was going on?

[36:13] I was worried about him.

Stuart Wellington

[36:15] And I'm like, we have strayed so far from the just sarcastic cat who sits around complaining about shit.

Elliott Kalan

[36:23] The fact that he is running through a high-tech action sequence.

[36:26] I hate it.

Stuart Wellington

[36:27] Meanwhile, Jinx makes a phone call to Marge Malone, the head of security at Lactose Farms, voiced by Cecily Strong, who, you know, gives a pretty fun performance, I guess.

[36:40] She's fun.

[36:41] She's fun.

[36:41] It's fine.

[36:41] And using a phone app that will be used repeatedly throughout the movie where the cats and dogs can change their voice to sound like a human voice.

Elliott Kalan

[36:52] So here's the thing.

[36:53] And this really got to me because what this means is when Garfield is talking, he's talking.

[36:59] Like he's speaking out loud.

[37:00] And in the Garfield comics, again, I hate to be the comic book guy, Garfield – John cannot understand Garfield.

[37:06] Garfield doesn't – he can speak to other animals or spiders or whatever while he's thinking.

[37:10] But the idea that if the animals can use this app to change their voices, why doesn't he just talk to John?

[37:15] Why doesn't he talk to any human being?

[37:17] Yeah.

[37:17] Part of the joy is –

Dan McCoy

[37:18] Humans can use it to translate the animals.

[37:20] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[37:21] And part of the joy is that John – like it's Garfield reacting to John being an idiot.

[37:27] Yes.

[37:27] Like it's him like running a monologue and like talking shit.

Dan McCoy

[37:31] Well, also like I understand why the security person needs to be able to translate this for plot reasons.

[37:39] But it was a much funnier – I mean not that I was like ha ha ha ha ha.

[37:44] But it's a much funnier joke when the jinx is like calling up and like trying to frame the cat.

[37:51] And like then you cut to the person on the other line and they just hear meow, meow, meow, meow, meow.

[37:54] Meow, meow, meow, meow, meow.

Elliott Kalan

[37:55] But like this app, it just – it fundamentally changes the nature of human-animal relations in a way that this movie – it's like in Zookeeper, how we talked about how the lion is like we could always talk.

[38:06] We just don't say it because it freaks people out.

[38:08] It's like really?

[38:08] You don't want to tell people to stop killing you and putting you in zoos?

[38:11] Because it seems like that's a good use of language.

[38:14] Yeah.

[38:14] One of the top uses.

[38:15] Yeah.

[38:16] They don't – being freaked out is worse.

[38:18] It's a little bit like watching a romantic comedy.

[38:19] If there's a romantic comedy where the guy is like I really got to impress my date and he goes I guess I'll fly and he just starts flying through the air, I would be like whoa, whoa, whoa.

[38:29] This movie has just fundamentally changed what it's about.

[38:31] Like I can no longer care whether these two get together now that I know that man has conquered gravity in this movie.

Stuart Wellington

[38:38] So yeah, they infiltrate the complex.

[38:41] They think they're about to close in on the keys but it turns out that Marge Malone, head of security, is there.

[38:47] She talks some shit and then Vic manages to snatch the keys and leave Garfield and Odie behind.

[38:55] He betrays them and he drives away with the milk truck.

[38:59] Again, questions of how a cat is able to drive a car is not really addressed but that's fine.

Elliott Kalan

[39:04] Yeah, it seems like he's big enough to fit in the seat and hit the pedals and also the truck itself, this milk truck, it looks like one of the war rakes.

[39:10] So the size of the cat was the issue for you, Elliot.

Dan McCoy

[39:13] Can I –

[39:14] Not the fact that the cat knows how to drive.

Elliott Kalan

[39:16] I mean at this point I got to buy a certain amount.

[39:19] I know it bothered me that you have an animal translating app and it has not revolutionized human society.

[39:25] But at a certain point it is a cartoon and I got some things I got to just go along with, you know.

Stuart Wellington

[39:29] The – I mean well, I'm sure we'll talk about each of these OCs in time.

[39:34] But I do want to point out that I think it's a –

[39:36] Orange County?

[39:36] Original characters.

[39:37] Okay.

[39:38] Oh.

[39:39] Yeah.

[39:40] Is the – I think it is a design flaw to make Garfield's dad just bigger than Garfield.

[39:48] Garfield should be the biggest of them.

[39:51] He should not be –

Elliott Kalan

[39:51] It certainly makes Garfield look less like a lazy, out-of-shape cat if his dad is – if he's one of the smaller characters in the movie.

[39:57] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[39:58] Okay.

[39:59] So they're –

Elliott Kalan

[40:01] I will say it is a little weird also that Garfield at the end of the movie cooks dinner for everybody and John is not like, holy shit, my cat is cooking?

Dan McCoy

[40:11] And then it turns into one froggy evening.

Elliott Kalan

[40:14] He opens a restaurant.

[40:16] My cat can cook.

S4

[40:16] You've got to see this cooking cat.

Elliott Kalan

[40:17] He won't do it for anybody else.

[40:19] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[40:19] Not on Mondays, John.

[40:21] What?

[40:22] Oh, that's a good joke.

Elliott Kalan

[40:23] We shouldn't have called the restaurant Mondays, the restaurant that's only open Mondays.

Stuart Wellington

[40:28] So –

[40:29] TGI Mondays.

[40:30] For their crimes, Garfield and Odie are stuck in the pound.

[40:36] And they – while they're in the pound, they connect with a few of Vic's former crew who are all there, all voiced by more celebrity voices.

[40:46] Snoop Dogg is one of them.

[40:47] You got Snoop Dogg, you got Janelle James, and you got Angus Cloud, RIP, in a final performance, which is wild.

[40:55] The – and that basically just kind of fills out a little more of Vic's backstory, more time spent talking about a character that isn't Garfield.

[41:06] The – John shows up and he springs Garfield and Odie from the pound.

[41:12] They're about to tuck into a massive lasagna feast that John has prepared.

[41:17] He had been going out of his mind, missing his pets, which I understand.

[41:19] If my pets were missing, I would be devastated.

[41:22] Yeah.

[41:23] And that's when Garfield pauses.

[41:26] He stops eating lasagna for a moment because he remembers the words that his – that Vic may have been watching him while he was growing up.

[41:36] So he goes out to the tree that he believes Vic was hanging out in and he sees a plethora of hash marks that Vic had made every single time he came to visit his son, which is also a weird thing to do.

[41:49] That every time he came to watch Garfield, he put a slash and then he would – you know, he would bundle his sticks.

[41:57] He would do full like fives as a bundle all over this tree.

Dan McCoy

[42:01] This is how long I've been in prison, Mark.

[42:03] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[42:04] It's kind of wild.

[42:05] Well, he was always – there's a cut scene where he talks about how much he was influenced by the Batman villain Zaz.

[42:10] Yes.

[42:10] So that's why.

[42:11] He loves those hash marks.

Stuart Wellington

[42:13] Yeah.

[42:13] If you were to shave Vic, you would see that his body is covered in this.

[42:17] Exactly.

[42:17] I mean like –

[42:18] Exactly, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[42:18] I get that he's like supposed to be ashamed of everything or whatever and like he wants to keep his – he doesn't want to confuse Garfield maybe by like reentering his life.

[42:28] But this like revelation like feels pretty empty.

[42:32] He's like, oh, oh, he was here watching me from a distance this whole time, never, you know, making contact.

[42:39] Great.

[42:39] That Josie loves me.

Elliott Kalan

[42:40] Not since the story of Moses when Moses' own mother was, I guess, I believe hired as his nursemaid and could not reveal her identity to him.

Stuart Wellington

[42:47] I would say the idea of a shameful cat father is fundamentally not cat-like.

[42:55] No.

[42:55] I feel like cats are – that's part of Garfield's appeal is that cats are kind of jerks.

[43:01] I love them for it just like I love Garfield.

[43:05] But cats are not like – that's more of a dog trait.

Elliott Kalan

[43:09] What I think is really the bad thing is that they didn't take this opportunity to do a parody of the song Somebody's Watching Me by Rockwell called Some Daddy's Watching Me, which I think would have fit this scene perfectly.

Stuart Wellington

[43:21] Or a Cats in the Cradle bit because, you know, they're cats.

[43:24] Cats, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[43:25] Damn, other songs that could have fit this?

Dan McCoy

[43:27] They could have changed it to Garfs in the Cradle.

[43:29] I was too busy internally arguing with the idea that cats are jerks.

Elliott Kalan

[43:32] You know, they –

[43:34] And the normal spoon.

Dan McCoy

[43:35] You have to meet them at their level.

[43:37] They're not going to give their love unconditional.

Elliott Kalan

[43:40] Feline eyes are watching you.

[43:41] That could be another one.

[43:42] Yeah, it took you a little while, but you got there.

[43:44] Yeah, I got there.

[43:45] It took me a little time to think about it.

Stuart Wellington

[43:46] So with this revelation that Vic actually loves him and was a good dad.

[43:50] Well, not a bad dad.

[43:51] Not a good dad.

[43:52] Soccer dad.

[43:52] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[43:52] But that he cared about him.

Stuart Wellington

[43:54] Yeah.

[43:54] So they rush over to the mall that was Jinx's hideout.

[43:58] And using the evidence dungeon that Jinx had left, they discover that Jinx's plan is to get on a train and throw Vic off of a bridge.

[44:08] Off the mile-high bridge.

[44:09] Yeah.

[44:09] What a clever plan.

Elliott Kalan

[44:11] And also – but it's playing off of the famous Garfield landmark, the mile-high bridge.

[44:16] We remember all the amazing Garfield stories that are set around this famously high bridge, right?

[44:20] Mm-hmm.

Stuart Wellington

[44:21] So they – using their acorn earpieces, they contact Otto the bull, and they get Otto to agree to help them save Vic by doing a train job.

Elliott Kalan

[44:35] Otto's help seems not really necessary.

[44:38] And here's one of the things about this.

[44:39] Until the very end.

[44:40] But they wouldn't have known that was going to happen.

[44:42] But so that – he's like, you're going to get on that train, and then just as it hits the bridge, you'll jump out with your dad, and you'll land in a net that Odie is tying.

[44:50] And while they get on the train, it takes them a little bit of time to get to the bridge.

[44:53] So I was like, why don't they just jump off the train before they get to the bridge so they don't have to fall a mile into a net?

[44:59] That seems like a better plan in some ways, you know.

Stuart Wellington

[45:01] So this leads to a bunch of action and silliness.

[45:07] Hijinks.

[45:08] And Garfield saves the day by calling in 6,000 food delivery drones.

[45:14] So he's like surfing around on pizza boxes and eating – I think he eats hot sauce and breathes fire on people.

Elliott Kalan

[45:20] This is really just a holding action though because by the time he's done with this whole action sequence of using food as weapons, everything is exactly back where it started.

[45:27] He's still dealing with the same bad guys on the same train.

[45:30] So he's really – he's accomplished very little with this same piece.

Dan McCoy

[45:33] There's a lot of also product placement in this film.

[45:37] At the end, I believe he like explicitly orders online from like – like FedEx delivers it.

[45:45] Yes.

[45:45] But there's like – is it Walmart?

[45:47] I forget what – like Target or something.

[45:48] Like it's all branded very obviously for an animated movie.

Elliott Kalan

[45:54] And all that free advertising for Mama Leone's pizza.

[45:57] Sure.

Stuart Wellington

[45:58] Is that a real pizzeria?

[46:00] Okay.

[46:00] No, I don't think so.

[46:01] You never know, man.

[46:03] I don't know all the flyover states.

[46:06] Yeah.

[46:06] You don't know where the cool cats eat.

[46:08] Okay.

[46:09] So by the end of this train adventure, Jinx's goons turn on her.

[46:18] They don't want to do her dirty work no more.

Elliott Kalan

[46:20] In what some would call an arbitrary plot twist.

Dan McCoy

[46:23] I just want to highlight that I teased to you guys on text that there was one time when I actually laughed out loud.

[46:30] It was when they jump off the thing, the train.

[46:34] They go to the net and they said like – like Garfield meets Vic on the – like Vic is bouncing back up and they meet in the middle and he goes, net's too tight or something like that.

[46:42] And they both just like go right back onto the train after escaping the train.

[46:47] I thought that was a funny bit.

[46:48] Good joke.

Elliott Kalan

[46:49] Yeah.

[46:50] One time I did not laugh was when Garfield goes, that's right.

[46:53] I do my own stunts and then pause.

[46:56] Me and Tom Cruise.

[46:58] And it was like – yeah.

[47:00] Like it's not funny to say Tom Cruise does his own stunts.

[47:02] Like that's not a joke.

[47:03] That's just a –

[47:04] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[47:04] Did you just put that in there in case Tom Cruise is watching the movie and the movie he did?

[47:09] I also do my own stunts.

[47:09] He does the Leonardo DiCaprio meme.

[47:11] Yeah, so he would then after the movie go up to somebody – some employee at the movie – at the AMC and be like, hey, they mentioned me in the movie.

[47:19] Yeah, he's talking popcorn in his mouth like a madman.

Dan McCoy

[47:22] He's like, did you see Garfield?

[47:23] The Garfield movie talked about me.

Elliott Kalan

[47:25] He'd have to go to David Miscavige and say, make all the Scientologists go see the Garfield movie.

[47:29] They mentioned my name in it.

[47:31] If you're going to do that joke, make a joke about an actor who you don't expect to do all their own stunts.

[47:35] That would be – that's a joke, you know.

Dan McCoy

[47:37] Yeah, who would that be, Dan?

[47:39] Oh, I don't know.

[47:41] Paul Giamatti.

[47:43] I mean, Paul Giamatti can do anything.

[47:44] I feel like he might do it, actually.

Elliott Kalan

[47:46] But if he was like, I do all my own stunts, me and Tyne Daly, I'd be like, okay, that's a joke.

[47:51] Uh-huh.

Stuart Wellington

[47:53] Okay, so in the process, not only do they survive –

Elliott Kalan

[47:56] Oh, wait, I apologize.

[47:57] We missed where I want to tell you about my son's punch-up.

[48:00] Oh, yeah, please.

[48:00] I was fucking aching for this one.

[48:02] Yeah, sorry.

[48:03] Garfield is about – Otto is about to launch Garfield onto the train, and Garfield says to him, if I don't make it back, tell my story, which is kind of like –

[48:11] Okay, it's kind of a boilerplate line.

[48:13] Yeah.

[48:13] And my son turned to me and he goes, he should have said, if I don't make it back, serve lasagna at my funeral.

Stuart Wellington

[48:17] I was like, that's a much better line.

[48:19] Yeah.

[48:19] It's a better line.

[48:20] It's more Garfield.

[48:21] Yeah.

[48:22] So they managed to, in the process, they survive and they capture Jinx.

[48:26] They trade Jinx to Marge Malone, again, using the voice changer app.

[48:33] It's amazing animal translating voice changer app.

[48:36] They trade this criminal cat in exchange for the cow mascot, Ethel, for some – this is a wild idea that –

[48:44] Yes.

[48:45] The head of security is like, okay, yeah, you can have this cow because I need to punish this cat.

Elliott Kalan

[48:50] You can have the mascot to the company whose worth is – you know, must be in the millions.

[48:56] It's a big company.

[48:57] Millions, yeah.

[48:57] In exchange for this criminal cat who I'm going to do what with?

[49:01] Why is this of use to me?

[49:02] Yep.

Stuart Wellington

[49:03] So, of course, they trade Ethel the cow who walks over there, sees Otto, and then let's get it on plays.

[49:12] And we're like, I guess they're fucking –

[49:14] Yeah.

[49:15] Yep.

[49:15] That's what they're doing.

[49:16] All right.

[49:16] Those cows are getting it on.

[49:17] I mean, I get it.

[49:18] Like, again, Ving Rhames gives a really good performance.

[49:21] And, I mean, I'd say that's a pretty hot cow.

[49:24] I mean, I guess.

[49:26] I don't have –

[49:26] I've seen hotter.

[49:27] I've seen less hot.

[49:28] Thank you.

[49:29] Okay.

[49:30] And then – so they get back home with John.

[49:33] And after a moment's hesitation, Garfield invites Vic to live with them.

[49:38] So now we have this new character all the fucking time.

[49:40] That was –

Dan McCoy

[49:41] Yep, yep.

[49:41] That –

[49:42] Part of the family.

[49:42] That really blew my mind.

[49:44] Again, I have, like, this base level of familiarity fondness with Garfield.

[49:49] But I don't really give, like, a shit about Garfield as, like, an artistic endeavor because I don't believe it is.

[49:57] But it still blew my mind.

[49:57] What about the nine lives of Garfield?

[49:59] That's a pretty –

[49:59] That's a good one.

[50:00] That's actually good.

[50:01] They do some strange things with that book.

[50:03] Yeah.

[50:03] But it blew my fucking mind that this movie ends with, like, and now this new character, Garfield's dad, lives with them.

Stuart Wellington

[50:11] You're going to love this.

[50:12] It's canon.

[50:13] And there's – in the, like, montage, there's the briefest moment where you see Nermal.

[50:17] And I'm like, where the fuck was Nermal this whole movie?

[50:20] Yeah.

[50:21] What?

[50:21] Okay.

[50:22] There's a part where they're eating cereal and it's –

Elliott Kalan

[50:23] Abu Dhabi, probably.

[50:25] Yeah, that's a good point.

Stuart Wellington

[50:26] He's still coming back from Abu Dhabi.

Elliott Kalan

[50:27] Yeah, there's a part where they're eating cereal and Binky the Clown is on the cereal box.

[50:30] And I'm like, can't wait to see that clown in this.

[50:32] Oh, wait.

[50:33] No.

[50:33] Not going to happen.

[50:34] Not in the movie.

[50:34] Just an Easter egg for the fans.

Stuart Wellington

[50:36] So, again, Nermal's barely in it.

[50:38] We get none of the U.S. Acre dudes, including that fucking shell with the legs sticking out.

[50:43] Oh, he's the best, yeah.

[50:44] So, let's talk about the OCs.

[50:46] Is that his name?

[50:47] Okay.

[50:47] I'm assuming these are all original characters.

[50:49] I think it's Orson.

[50:50] I know that.

[50:50] So, we have Vic.

[50:51] Yeah, yeah.

[50:52] What are our thoughts on Vic's?

[50:53] I've already said I don't like him.

[50:55] I think he's bigger than Garfield.

[50:57] I don't care for Vic.

[50:58] I don't care about him.

Dan McCoy

[50:59] It's not Vic's fault so much as it's just like I don't like this like, oh, we got to have a dad problem.

[51:05] Who has like so much time.

Elliott Kalan

[51:07] If it's a Garfield movie, why are you introducing a new character and giving them kind of equal weight with the main character?

[51:13] Like why are you doing that?

[51:14] We got Roland the Muppets.

[51:17] Yeah, it's a very Walter situation.

[51:19] Hey, people love the Muppets.

[51:21] You know who they want to see?

[51:22] A new character who's not even a fucking animal.

Stuart Wellington

[51:26] You got Roland and Nolan, the two goons.

[51:30] They're like Sharpay and the Whippet.

Elliott Kalan

[51:32] I mean, I'll give them credit for having one big guy, one little guy.

[51:35] Like that's a classic comedy, physical dynamic.

[51:38] Otherwise, they seem to have very little personality.

[51:40] There's nothing particularly funny about them.

Dan McCoy

[51:42] Yeah, I mean like it's kind of a first thought idea to have Brett Goldstein be like a growly character.

[51:50] But he did a good job at it.

[51:52] Ray Winstone wasn't available.

Elliott Kalan

[51:54] Yeah.

[51:54] Nolan, I feel like, is a sub-weasel from Roger Rabbit type of villain.

[51:59] Yeah, I mean, but those are fucking S-class villains.

[52:03] Those guys are great.

[52:03] Yeah.

[52:04] Those are like they're up there with salacious crumb when it comes to bad guys.

Stuart Wellington

[52:07] If those guys showed up in almost any movie, I'd be like, hell yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[52:11] You're watching Oppenheimer.

[52:13] Will, we got the scientists for the project and it's those weasels from Roger Rabbit.

[52:16] I mean, those suits would fit, dude.

[52:18] It's the time period.

[52:19] They would fit right in there.

[52:20] It's the right time period.

Stuart Wellington

[52:23] We need these zoot suit weasels.

[52:25] They would get along so well with fucking Robert Downey Jr.'s character.

Elliott Kalan

[52:29] For sure.

[52:30] Yeah.

[52:30] Do we really need the one who's just brandishing a straight razor all the time?

[52:34] You know we do.

[52:35] You know we do.

[52:36] He's going to use that to split and at them.

[52:37] Yeah, of course.

[52:38] Yeah, exactly.

[52:39] God damn it.

Stuart Wellington

[52:40] And you know when they show up in any movie, I'd be like, char, char, char.

[52:43] I know we're watching Portrait of a Lady on Fire, but the weasels just showed up.

Elliott Kalan

[52:50] Paul Giamatti, there's a couple of students you have to chaperone over Christmas at the school.

[52:54] Oh, no.

[52:55] It's those weasels.

Stuart Wellington

[52:57] Even the one that's just laughing and bonking himself on the head all the time?

Elliott Kalan

[53:01] Okay.

[53:01] The one with the beanie?

[53:02] Sure.

[53:03] Yeah.

[53:04] They're all students at this private boarding school.

[53:06] Yeah.

[53:07] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[53:08] Oh, man.

[53:09] If you've got rich weasel parents, you can get in anywhere no matter how goofy you are.

Elliott Kalan

[53:13] And most of them end up leaving, so it's just Paul Giamatti and that one weasel.

[53:16] Yeah.

[53:17] Yeah, yeah.

[53:17] Sure.

Stuart Wellington

[53:17] Just the one weasel.

[53:20] He has a name.

[53:21] Okay.

[53:21] So we've talked about them.

Elliott Kalan

[53:23] What about-

[53:23] I feel like this is a whole mini we should do is just inserting those weasels into other

Stuart Wellington

[53:27] movies.

[53:27] What about Otto and Ethel, our cow characters?

Dan McCoy

[53:31] I don't get to know Ethel that much, but I'm sure she's wonderful because I'm fond of Otto,

[53:37] you know?

[53:38] So, you know-

Stuart Wellington

[53:39] I will say-

[53:39] Ving Rhames' performance is strong.

Dan McCoy

[53:41] I feel like they do not belong in this movie.

[53:45] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[53:45] No, but his performance is strong.

[53:47] And also, I will say this, Otto's personality, which is kind of like bitter and resentful and

[53:53] sarcastic and condescending, that fits in a Garfield story.

[53:57] Yes.

[53:58] Like that's the kind of personality that Garfield should have.

[54:01] As opposed to smiling all the time and being like, I love my life.

[54:05] I'm Garfield.

[54:06] But the- I think that Otto, at least, it doesn't make sense for them to be helping- again, for

[54:10] them to be helping a bull rescue his girlfriend from a lactose- from a milk farm doesn't make

[54:16] sense for a dairy.

[54:17] But his personality, at least, I could see-

Stuart Wellington

[54:19] Yeah, in like a sub-Ardman animation style milk factory.

Elliott Kalan

[54:23] Yes.

[54:24] Very sub.

[54:24] Yeah.

[54:25] But I could see a couple weeks of the Garfield strip where they like go to a farm and Garfield

[54:30] is dealing with Otto the bull for whatever reason.

[54:32] Like they're on vacation or something like that.

[54:34] Yeah.

[54:34] You know.

Stuart Wellington

[54:35] And I think- Oh, I guess, and Jinx the cat.

[54:38] I've mentioned I like some of the design elements of Jinx, but also very unnecessary character.

Elliott Kalan

[54:43] Very Secret Life of Pets rather than Garfield.

[54:46] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[54:47] Yeah.

[54:47] This is like a- I don't know.

[54:50] This is like a Beverly Hills chihuahua about a cat and mean.

[54:53] Mm-hmm.

Stuart Wellington

[54:53] Yeah.

[54:54] So I think it's time for- What's that?

[54:56] What's that, Dan?

Dan McCoy

[54:57] It's Final Judgments, whether this was a good, bad movie, a bad, bad movie, or a movie we

[55:02] kind of liked.

[55:04] I'm going to say bad, bad.

[55:06] It is not a Garfield movie, let alone the Garfield movie.

[55:12] Dan, check the poster.

[55:13] It's the Garfield movie.

[55:16] And, again, like, I think if it wasn't billed as a Garfield movie, I'd be a little easier

[55:21] on it just because I have no preconceived notions about what something should be.

[55:25] And normally, I don't really care, but it's like, why do it this way?

[55:29] Why approach it this way?

[55:30] It's so weird.

[55:32] There's some- Like, there's stuff in here that I'm like, oh, you know, like, this would

[55:36] be perfectly fine for a small child.

[55:38] There's nothing offensive in here.

[55:40] Like, there's some, like, fun slapstick stuff.

[55:43] But, you know, for full-grown men such as us, who should not be watching it anyway, I'd say

[55:49] it's a bad, bad movie.

Stuart Wellington

[55:51] We're all big boys here.

[55:52] We're grownups.

[55:53] Bevy boys.

[55:54] Mm-hmm.

[55:56] Yeah.

[55:56] So, I don't, you know, I don't work in animation.

[56:00] I don't have a lot of experience working in animated things that might involve talking animals.

[56:06] Of the three of us, I have the least experience with that.

[56:09] But there was just something that felt so, like, they took Garfield, a character that

[56:15] I really cared about a lot for some weird reason.

[56:18] And obviously, I know it's like, it's a brand.

[56:21] Garfield is this weird cultural icon.

[56:23] But it just feels so strange to see this, like, just to see this character misrepresented this

[56:29] way.

[56:30] And this character just kind of, like, stuck into a movie that he does not belong.

[56:35] And he is not, it's like, it'd be one thing if it was like, we're going to take Garfield,

[56:39] but we're going to put him in, like, Barry Lyndon or something.

[56:42] I'm like, well, that, he doesn't fit in there, but it's still Garfield.

[56:45] But, like, he's not, he doesn't feel like Garfield.

[56:47] But if you put those weasels in Barry Lyndon, oh, man.

[56:49] Oh, my God.

[56:50] It'd be so much fun.

[56:51] Typically, okay, so yeah, this is a bad, bad movie.

[56:56] And I don't know, like, it just feels so emblematic of a, of, like, an industry that

[57:03] is built around, like, cut and paste style stories and just, like, churning out garbage.

[57:09] That's what it felt like.

Dan McCoy

[57:10] Like, not to be too cruel to the people making it.

Elliott Kalan

[57:15] No, yeah, no churning out garbage.

[57:17] I think that sounded very, very constructive criticism.

Stuart Wellington

[57:20] I feel like the people who worked on it, I feel like there is most likely an executive

[57:24] department that is more to blame than the people who worked on it.

[57:27] Oh, almost certainly.

Elliott Kalan

[57:28] So I will, I'm also going to call this a bad, bad movie.

[57:32] You know, like Dan's saying, it's not offensive.

[57:34] I don't love, like, there's not that much of, like, here's a joke for the grownups, wink,

[57:40] wink, in it.

[57:41] Yeah, yeah.

[57:42] It just, it feels like a misreading of what the things that people like about Garfield,

[57:47] the character are.

[57:48] Now, I could be wrong.

[57:49] Again, the movie made, according to Wikipedia, it made $250 million of the box office.

[57:54] What?

[57:54] $60 million budget.

[57:56] So it did okay.

Stuart Wellington

[57:57] There were no other kids movies that same weekend, I would imagine.

Elliott Kalan

[58:00] Probably, probably.

[58:01] But judging also by my, so like, my older son, he was with us when he was little, when we

[58:07] did the Boss Baby family business movie.

[58:10] He really enjoyed that.

[58:11] My younger son really enjoys that movie.

[58:13] I don't love it, but they really enjoyed it.

[58:14] This one, watching with my younger son, he just was not that into it.

[58:17] It was not that entertaining to him.

[58:18] It was not that funny to him.

[58:19] So I could almost buy it on the level of, it's not for me, but a kid would like it.

[58:24] If I saw a kid liking it, that it feels like it, it didn't reach that bar either.

[58:28] And so, again, it's not, it's not so offensively bad that I'm like, ugh, ugh, ugh, ugh.

[58:34] But it just, it fails to justify its existence in a way, other than that there's money to be

[58:40] had in Garfield.

[58:42] So next time, Hollywood, when you do a Garfield movie, maybe just try to make it more Garfield-y.

[58:46] Like, he doesn't need, he doesn't need a big backstory.

[58:48] Don't need big action stakes.

Stuart Wellington

[58:50] Paul Giamatti would be a great Garfield.

Elliott Kalan

[58:52] Paul Giamatti would be a great Garfield.

[58:55] Don't animate him.

[58:56] Put him in a cat suit.

[58:57] Yeah.

[58:57] Live action, Paul Giamatti Garfield.

[59:01] It's right on the shelf there with the Wallace Shawn Ziggy that they should have made.

[59:04] Like, Paul Giamatti would be a great Garfield.

[59:07] Yeah.

S4

[59:12] Hi, everybody.

[59:14] It's Ellen Weatherford.

Dan McCoy

[59:15] And Christian Weatherford.

S4

[59:17] People say not to judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree.

Dan McCoy

[59:21] But we can judge a snake by its ability to fly, or a spider by its ability to dive.

S4

[59:26] Or a dung beetle by its ability to navigate with the starlight of the Milky Way galaxy.

Dan McCoy

[59:31] On Just the Zoo of Us, we rate our favorite animals out of 10 in the categories of physical effectiveness, behavioral ingenuity, and, of course, aesthetics.

S4

[59:39] Guest experts like biologists, ecologists, musicians, comedians, and more join us to share their unique insights into the animal kingdom.

Dan McCoy

[59:47] Listen with the whole family on MaximumFun.org, or wherever you get your podcasts.

S5

[59:54] The wizards answer eight by eight.

[59:59] The cornclaves call to demonstrate their arcane gift, their single spell.

[1:00:07] They number 64 until a conflagration.

[1:00:14] 63 and 62 they soon shall be, as one by one the wizards die, till one remains to reign on high.

[1:00:30] Join us for Taz Royale, an Oops All Wizards Battle Royale season of The Adventure Zone, every other Thursday on MaximumFun.org, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Dan McCoy

[1:00:40] Hey, this podcast is brought to you overwhelmingly by the support of listeners like you who are members at MaximumFun.org.

[1:00:51] But we do also have a sponsor this week, and it is Squarespace.

[1:00:57] You know, maybe you want a website.

[1:00:58] Maybe, like, Garfield without Garfield has already been done.

[1:01:01] But maybe Garfield with extra Garfield.

[1:01:03] Like, just stick a ton of more Garfields in the strips.

[1:01:07] You can do that with Squarespace, which gives you everything you need to offer services and get paid all in one place.

[1:01:14] Now, I don't know how you're going to get paid from this extra Garfield situation, especially because that's IP that's not owned by you.

[1:01:20] You can't get sued.

[1:01:20] Yeah, yeah.

[1:01:21] No, but you can think of an idea that's almost as good as that.

Stuart Wellington

[1:01:25] Like a pizzeria restaurant that's Garfield-themed?

Dan McCoy

[1:01:28] Again, that was shut down for copyright reasons.

[1:01:32] But you can get paid on time with professional on-brand invoices and online payments.

[1:01:36] You can streamline your workflow with stuff like appointments, scheduling built right in, and email marketing tools.

[1:01:43] And also, you don't have to know how to design something.

[1:01:46] You can be as lazy as Garfield because Squarespace also offers a complete library of professionally designed, award-winning website templates with options for every category and use, drag-and-drop editing, styling options, visual design effects, no experience required.

[1:02:05] So head to squarespace.com slash flop for a free trial, and when you're ready to launch, use offer code FLOP to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

[1:02:17] Elliot, you do a lot of stuff.

[1:02:19] I bet there's something you want to mention.

[1:02:21] Oh, on Squarespace?

[1:02:22] Well, just your own personal plug.

[1:02:24] Oh, just the stuff that I do.

Elliott Kalan

[1:02:25] Yeah, I'll just plug the same stuff I've been plugging, you know?

[1:02:28] There's a picture book I have out now called Sadie Mouse Wrecks the House.

[1:02:31] It's a fun romp for kids of all ages.

[1:02:34] If you like that one, maybe you'd like to try one of my other picture books that I've been out for a little bit, Horse Meets Dog or Sharko and Hippo, but Sadie Mouse Wrecks the House is a new one.

[1:02:43] Also, I still have Harley Quinn coming out from DC Comics every month.

[1:02:46] I've been enjoying writing that.

[1:02:48] I just handed in a script for what's going to be the 200th issue of all – if you combined all of Harley Quinn's series together.

[1:02:55] And it made me realize that this is already the longest run I've got to do on a series.

[1:03:01] Oh, cool.

[1:03:01] And if you keep buying them, I'll just be able to keep doing them.

[1:03:04] So I'm excited to be on a book for a fair amount of time.

[1:03:07] And I also have another book coming out in November, but I'll talk more about that later in the year.

[1:03:12] Stuart, what about you?

[1:03:14] What do you have to say?

Stuart Wellington

[1:03:14] Well, I'll always promote my three bars here in Brooklyn, New York.

[1:03:18] That's Hinterland's Bar, Minnie's Bar, and now Commonwealth Bar.

[1:03:21] And also, if you are interested in kind of like hanging out chill zone style, I do a regular weekly painting stream on Twitch, usually at 1 o'clock p.m. New York time, where I just hang out on Twitch.

[1:03:36] And I paint little Warhammer guys and I yap for a while and I answer questions in the chat.

[1:03:41] And it's a nice, fun, chill afternoon.

[1:03:45] And my Twitch name is Stuart Wellington.

[1:03:49] Easy to remember.

Dan McCoy

[1:03:50] Sometimes I'll throw that on just so I can hear Stuart's – my friend Stuart's voice.

[1:03:54] Yeah, it's nice.

[1:03:55] Being like, and Dan did this.

[1:03:56] And I was like, what?

Elliott Kalan

[1:03:58] And I'm sure, Dan, you also throw on my other podcast, Smartless Presents Clueless, to hear my voice, right?

[1:04:04] Yeah, sure.

[1:04:05] Yeah, Smartless Presents Clueless, my puzzle podcast that I host and Sean Hayes is the star of.

[1:04:08] That's right, Sean Hayes from Will & Grace and Smartless.

[1:04:11] And the episodes are only about 12 to 15 minutes long and it comes out twice a week, although I think we're going to a once a week schedule.

[1:04:18] Check out that one too if you like puzzle podcasts.

Dan McCoy

[1:04:21] Guys, I need to have something else going on.

[1:04:23] You do.

[1:04:24] We've told you that.

[1:04:25] I mean, it's not like I'm not trying, but maybe we can figure something out.

[1:04:28] Maybe we can brainstorm.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:29] I mean, maybe use Squarespace to make a website where you just insert those weasels into all the different movies.

[1:04:33] Oh, extra weasels.

Stuart Wellington

[1:04:35] I think you should do a series of cooking videos on TikTok.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:39] Yeah, I think you should do those.

Dan McCoy

[1:04:40] That's the route to success for me, I'm sure.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:44] I mean, it's either that or videos where you eat ice cream out of a toilet and people don't realize it's a joke and they get really mad about it online.

Stuart Wellington

[1:04:51] There's gold to be added in that toilet.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:53] I mean, it's a very popular genre of video.

Dan McCoy

[1:04:58] How did I cut off the names of these people who sent us letters?

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:06] I mean, usually we just say the first name.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:09] No, I know, but...

[1:05:12] Did Cher send in a letter so you don't know how to say last name withheld because there's no last name?

[1:05:16] No, I just...

[1:05:17] Madonna.

[1:05:18] When I cut and pasted this this time around, I somehow did not get the names in here.

[1:05:24] What's going on, guys?

[1:05:25] What's going on with my brain?

[1:05:27] What happened to it?

[1:05:27] Oh, boy.

[1:05:29] That's the side text that Elliot and I have.

[1:05:31] Okay.

[1:05:32] Well, maybe you can let me in on what conclusions you come to.

[1:05:36] You can come up with anything.

[1:05:37] Come to.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:37] So far, it's just been a lot of question marks.

[1:05:39] Yeah.

[1:05:40] Oh, I apologize.

[1:05:41] And shrug emojis.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:42] I apologize very much to people who are not going to get their proper credit.

[1:05:48] So this first letter is from question mark.

Stuart Wellington

[1:05:52] Question mark, question mark.

[1:05:53] If this is you, feel free to give us a zero-star review.

[1:05:57] Question mark.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:59] Hi, floppers.

[1:06:00] I'm a faithful flop listener since 2014.

[1:06:04] And as a Parisian resident, I was so excited when I saw your Under Paris episode drop into my feed.

[1:06:12] Uh-huh.

[1:06:13] At one point, you were all wondering...

Elliott Kalan

[1:06:15] What did we get wrong about Paris?

Dan McCoy

[1:06:17] Oh, boy.

[1:06:17] No, no, no.

[1:06:18] At one point, you were all wondering if Jaws ever got released in France.

[1:06:21] And Stuart posited that it was called Le Jaws.

[1:06:25] It's actually known as Donte de la Mer, which you could translate literally as the teeth of the sea.

[1:06:31] Ooh.

[1:06:32] Pretty cool.

[1:06:32] Anyway, the real mayor...

[1:06:33] Very poetic.

[1:06:34] The real mayor of Paris, Anne Hidalgo, took a swim in the Seine to prove to everyone that the river is swimmable,

[1:06:42] as it would be the site of the triathlon for the upcoming Olympic and Paralympic Games.

[1:06:47] Afterward, a newspaper ran a picture with her coming out of the water with a particularly toothy smile on her face.

[1:06:53] The headline read,

[1:06:55] Le Jaws d'Aident de la Mer, spelled M-A-I-R-E, meaning mayor.

[1:07:01] So...

[1:07:02] Damn.

[1:07:03] Question.

[1:07:04] Got to move.

[1:07:05] What's the best or worst pun you've ever seen from a movie critic about a movie they've seen?

[1:07:10] Or do you have any punny headlines for any of your Flop House movies?

[1:07:14] Saved Gene Shallot headlines.

[1:07:18] Thanks for a decade of great content.

[1:07:20] Here's one more.

[1:07:21] Two at this point.

[1:07:22] Here's ten more.

[1:07:24] Come to Paris.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:26] We should do a show in Paris.

[1:07:27] Yeah.

[1:07:27] Uh-huh.

Stuart Wellington

[1:07:28] Yeah, what's stopping us?

[1:07:30] I have to start finding venues in Paris to reach out to you.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:34] If any venue in Paris would like to pay our travel fees and have us come over, we'll be happy to do it.

Dan McCoy

[1:07:39] Do a show in the catacombs.

[1:07:41] Yeah, that would be super cool.

[1:07:44] I don't know that I have actually an answer to this, but this was pretty...

[1:07:47] I like that.

Stuart Wellington

[1:07:48] I'm a sucker for all pun-related news or reviews.

[1:07:54] Mm-hmm.

[1:07:55] So, do you remember any?

[1:07:57] No.

[1:07:57] I'm an idiot.

[1:07:58] Of course not.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:00] I also...

[1:08:00] Yeah, I'm also having trouble remembering once.

Stuart Wellington

[1:08:01] I kind of assumed you guys would be all over this shit because you're like pun maniacs.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:05] I think the one that sticks with me the most...

Stuart Wellington

[1:08:08] I feel like your eulogies are going to be filled with puns.

[1:08:11] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:12] Probably, yeah.

[1:08:12] I mean, we're not giving our own eulogies, but...

Dan McCoy

[1:08:15] You're not going to write...

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:15] I'm giving Dan's and Dan's giving mine.

[1:08:17] Yeah, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:08:18] Yeah, we'll swap eulogies.

[1:08:20] Crisscross.

[1:08:20] Yep.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:21] It's Crisscross.

[1:08:21] Crisscross.

[1:08:23] No motives.

[1:08:23] They can't catch whose eulogy it is.

[1:08:25] Yeah.

[1:08:26] I remember when I was a kid and I was a huge fan of those Ninja Turtles.

[1:08:30] I really loved them.

[1:08:31] The Ninja Turtles movie came out and I cut out one of the newspaper ads because back in the

[1:08:35] old days, kids, if you wanted to know when a movie was playing, you had to look in the

[1:08:39] listings in the newspaper and there'd be little ads.

[1:08:40] Next to Garfield.

[1:08:41] Yeah, next to Garfield.

[1:08:42] And there'd be little ads for each of the movies that would have quotes on them.

[1:08:46] And one of the quotes was from, I think, Joel Siegel for the Ninja Turtles movie.

[1:08:50] And I cut out and it said, like, a shell of a good time.

[1:08:53] Oh, yeah.

[1:08:54] And as a kid, I, like, didn't quite get it.

Dan McCoy

[1:08:56] So, was that...

[1:08:57] Was he saying it was negatively?

[1:08:59] No, no.

[1:09:00] He was saying it's a hell of a good time.

[1:09:01] Okay.

[1:09:02] Because, like, you know, the pun, like, it seems like a shell of a good time would mean,

[1:09:06] like, it's a husk of a good time.

[1:09:08] Yeah.

[1:09:08] It's not actually a good time.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:09] I don't think anyone was thinking that deeply about it.

[1:09:11] Yeah.

[1:09:12] But that was the one that, that's the one that sticks in my mind the most just because I

[1:09:14] think I had it on my room, on the wall of my room when I was a kid.

[1:09:17] Yeah.

[1:09:18] Well, that works.

[1:09:19] Did you learn the whole Ninja Rap when you were a kid or no?

[1:09:21] No, I did not learn the whole Ninja Rap.

[1:09:23] By that, by that point, I think I was no longer such, I mean, I did go see it in the theaters

[1:09:27] multiple times.

[1:09:27] With your grandma, right?

[1:09:28] I made her go to see it when I wanted to see it a third time, I think.

[1:09:32] But I did not memorize.

[1:09:34] I, even, even by the time the Ninja Rap came on, I was like, uh, this is not what I come

[1:09:38] to the Ninja Turtles for.

[1:09:39] Sure.

[1:09:39] Is Vanilla Ice rapping this song.

[1:09:41] Now I love it, though.

Dan McCoy

[1:09:42] Yeah.

[1:09:42] Come to this place for Ninja Turtles.

[1:09:45] Uh-huh.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:45] Yeah, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:09:46] Somehow raps about ninjas feel good in a place like this.

[1:09:51] Um, okay, well, again, apologies, this is from Question Mark.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:55] And I just want to mention, again, this is not a matter of editorial control, this is not

[1:10:00] because we don't want to say your names, this is merely that Dan made a mistake.

Dan McCoy

[1:10:03] Yeah, and I could not find, I did make an effort to try and find the unedited emails.

[1:10:09] Afterwards, he's going to have to, well, we're taping right now, he sort of wanted to keep

[1:10:15] us moving.

Elliott Kalan

[1:10:15] Because that last one seemed like there was very specific French words you could have

[1:10:19] searched for and not a lot of emails would have come up.

Stuart Wellington

[1:10:21] Yeah, after this, he's going to have to put on the Flophouse official hair shirt.

[1:10:27] Yeah, write in, guys.

[1:10:29] What's that thing where you have to sit on the, like, boomerang?

[1:10:32] On a pole in the desert?

[1:10:33] Yeah, or like, and they put weights on your ankles.

[1:10:36] Oh, that's a different thing.

Dan McCoy

[1:10:37] If these emails are from you, please write in and I will rectify it later on.

Elliott Kalan

[1:10:43] If someone could get some stolen valor, write in and say it was their email and really it

[1:10:46] wasn't, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:10:47] I've wanted to write in forever as your podcast was one of my saving graces when I was getting

[1:10:51] chemo for Hodgkin's disease in my late 20s.

[1:10:54] And again, when I required mental health services, it truly helped me through some trying times

[1:10:59] and I've wanted to thank you for years.

Elliott Kalan

[1:11:01] I really appreciate that we could be there for you.

[1:11:03] I hope you're feeling better now and I just wish you had a name that we could know about.

[1:11:08] That's what I was going to say.

[1:11:09] It's just too bad your identity is lost to history.

[1:11:13] Unfortunately, we've played a very meaningful part in your life and that means a lot to me.

[1:11:18] It really, it makes my heart swell and I just wish that Dan felt the same amount of importance

[1:11:22] towards you and could even remember to put your name in.

Dan McCoy

[1:11:25] Uh-huh.

[1:11:27] I'm really, let's see.

Stuart Wellington

[1:11:29] Oh, now he's, oh, now he's, he's spiraling, dude.

Dan McCoy

[1:11:32] Oh, no.

[1:11:33] Now I can't find it.

[1:11:35] I mean, here's, here's the real reason.

[1:11:37] I, like, I, we have so much mail in the inbox that I need to clear it out and once I do a letter,

[1:11:44] it gets deleted.

[1:11:46] So that's, I thought maybe it would be safe.

Elliott Kalan

[1:11:48] Whoever you are, I can't wait to hear the rest of your letter and I, and thank you very much

[1:11:52] for listening to us during those times.

[1:11:54] I'm glad that we could help you through them.

[1:11:55] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:11:55] Uh, I guess it was.

Elliott Kalan

[1:11:58] I just, I just wish, I just wish that we would ever find who this person was.

Dan McCoy

[1:12:02] I appreciated hearing this so much and I, I feel so bad.

[1:12:06] Anyway, unfortunately, I felt that I needed to tie that into, these things into a real question,

[1:12:12] which I could never come up with.

[1:12:14] I finally got it.

[1:12:16] Roy Scheider.

[1:12:17] Or more precisely, Scheider had an epic run.

Elliott Kalan

[1:12:20] More precisely, Shoy Ryder, his mirror name.

Dan McCoy

[1:12:24] Uh, Scheider had an epic run in the 70s with Clute, The 7 Ups, The French Connection,

[1:12:32] The Marathon Man, or just Marathon Man, Jaws, Sorcerer, and all that jazz.

[1:12:38] Perhaps my favorite film.

[1:12:40] I don't feel that he's ever really gotten his due for that.

[1:12:43] Do you folks?

[1:12:44] Can you think of any other actors or actresses with so much greatness and so little recognition?

[1:12:49] I actually, uh, just recently watched The 7 Ups for the first time and, uh, saw the, uh, amazing car chase sequence.

[1:12:59] Yeah.

[1:12:59] In that thing.

[1:13:00] Like, I, I think I liked it more than, like, the famous, like, Bullen and French Connection ones, actually.

[1:13:07] Uh, and I had the same thought.

[1:13:09] I was like, oh, Roy Scheider was on fire for, like, a very, like, this, like, span of time.

[1:13:14] And now, I don't think he's, like, talked about.

[1:13:16] I can see in your, in your eyes, Elliot, you're imagining Roy Scheider literally being on fire.

Stuart Wellington

[1:13:21] I just remember when they put him in NBA Jam.

Elliott Kalan

[1:13:27] Yeah, Roy Scheider turbo mode was on fire, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[1:13:30] Yeah, he's crazy.

Dan McCoy

[1:13:32] But I had the same thought.

[1:13:33] Like, he, he, he isn't really talked about the same way.

Stuart Wellington

[1:13:36] I, I was literally just talking to one of my bar regulars today.

[1:13:40] Uh, he was, I think he was either a camera operator or a PA on something with Roy Scheider.

[1:13:47] And he was, he was talking about how Roy Scheider was very professional and, like, he was very calm.

[1:13:53] Like, he was a very still guy on set until the, you know, action rolled.

[1:13:58] He was, uh, my, my regular was really impressed working with him.

[1:14:00] Mm-hmm.

Elliott Kalan

[1:14:01] I mean, I think it's a, there's a, I think it, what it speaks to partly is how many movies used to get made

[1:14:09] and how many different kinds of movies and the different kinds of people who could be movie stars.

[1:14:13] Not that Roy Scheider is not, he's a handsome white man who does adventure movies a lot of the time.

[1:14:17] Like, it's not like he's that breaking the mold that much.

[1:14:19] But that you had so many movies, like, can you imagine, um, like, I don't, I don't have someone in particular who comes to mind that answers the question exactly.

[1:14:30] You know, because there are a number of actors who had a great run.

[1:14:33] And I feel like as they get towards the end of their lives, they start to get a little more recognition.

[1:14:38] You know, like, I feel like, um, like, people didn't talk about Gene Hackman for a while and then he passed.

[1:14:43] And then suddenly it was, people were talking about what an amazing actor he was in his run of movies.

[1:14:47] Yeah.

[1:14:47] But, like, the, uh, something you hear a lot is, maybe not as much as he used to was, can you believe that Elliot Gould used to be a, like, a star who would carry movies?

[1:14:56] This guy?

[1:14:57] And you watch those movies and you're like, yeah, I can believe it.

[1:14:59] He's amazing.

[1:15:00] He's an amazing actor.

[1:15:01] He's got amazing charisma.

[1:15:02] Like, he has a great run of movies.

[1:15:03] So, I can believe it.

Stuart Wellington

[1:15:04] Yeah, but he's just, you know, he's just the dad of Ross and, uh, Monica.

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:07] I, I mean, like.

[1:15:08] I mean, that's his, that's surely his crowning achievement.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:12] Yeah.

[1:15:12] I mean, here's the thing.

[1:15:13] But that's specifically about, like, let's be clear.

[1:15:16] Elliot Gould is a, is a handsome man with, like, a lot of charisma.

[1:15:20] But.

[1:15:20] Yeah, yeah.

[1:15:20] He's handsome in a very, like, specific, like, kind of goofier way that I think people are talking about.

[1:15:24] Like, now, like, big movie stars have to be beautiful.

[1:15:29] Like, leading men movie stars have to be beautiful.

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:32] But there's a, um, I don't know.

[1:15:34] Not always.

[1:15:35] But, uh.

[1:15:35] Not always, no.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:36] But I think that that's what people are saying.

[1:15:38] They're not like, can you believe this guy?

[1:15:40] This, this.

[1:15:41] No, but it's never.

[1:15:42] This is a churness hunk of.

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:42] No, but it's never.

[1:15:43] Or, like, they'll say the same thing about, like, Donald Sutherland, who also, you know, passed relatively recently.

[1:15:47] Where it's like, instead of saying.

[1:15:49] It's, I feel like it often gets said.

[1:15:51] And it's a different point than the question he's making.

[1:15:53] Instead of saying, oh, man, things were so much.

[1:15:55] The variety of movies we had when these guys were big movie stars.

[1:15:59] Instead, it comes off as like, can you believe there was a time when people would settle for Donald Sutherland or Elliot Gould when they could have had a Harrison Ford?

[1:16:07] Like, come on, guys.

[1:16:08] When it's.

[1:16:09] Which is.

[1:16:09] I think is.

[1:16:10] Yeah.

[1:16:10] Not the right way to look at it.

[1:16:12] But it's.

[1:16:12] There's a.

[1:16:13] I mean, that's the nature of.

[1:16:14] You could say it's the nature of fame.

[1:16:15] You know.

[1:16:16] It's, you know, it's the bitch goddess.

[1:16:18] It's.

[1:16:18] It gives you.

[1:16:19] It gives.

[1:16:20] And then it takes away.

[1:16:21] And you can't guarantee you're going to be around forever.

Stuart Wellington

[1:16:23] Yeah.

[1:16:23] Well, it was like there was a.

[1:16:25] During the third season of The White Lotus, there is some discourse.

[1:16:28] Some weird discourse on the internet about dudes being like.

[1:16:32] Walton.

[1:16:32] You think Walton Goggins is a sex symbol?

[1:16:34] I'm like.

[1:16:35] Yeah, dude.

[1:16:37] Look at that guy.

Dan McCoy

[1:16:39] Yeah, I mean, well, I think that also just straight men being straight men, like, can't wrap their heads around the idea of, like, charisma and not just being like, oh, this is the handsomest man.

[1:16:50] This is the most clearly handsome man.

[1:16:52] I mean, like, he's a handsome guy.

[1:16:54] I'm not saying that he isn't.

[1:16:55] But, like, there's something interesting about him in the same way that, like, you know, I think it's obvious for us, like, you're not just attracted to, like, the most obviously beautiful person.

[1:17:08] There's someone who's interesting.

Stuart Wellington

[1:17:10] Yeah, it's like when I was watching the other day when I was watching Fatal Beauty directed by Tom Holland, a friend of the show, Tom Holland.

[1:17:19] And Sam Elliott gives.

[1:17:20] Spider-Man himself.

[1:17:21] Yeah.

[1:17:22] Whoopi Goldberg and Sam Elliott plays the, like, love interest.

[1:17:26] And Sam Elliott is so fucking hot in this movie.

[1:17:30] He really is.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:31] It's like.

[1:17:31] Well, but that's the thing.

[1:17:32] Sam Elliott is hot.

[1:17:33] I mean, that's the, like.

Stuart Wellington

[1:17:34] But, like, it's more than just him being attracted, like, being, like, good looking.

[1:17:38] He just, like, he sells this shit so well.

[1:17:41] Like, he's got so much fucking charm.

[1:17:42] There's just.

[1:17:43] Yeah, there's warmth.

[1:17:44] It's like oozing out of my fucking laptop screen.

Dan McCoy

[1:17:50] Okay, well, sorry again about the names.

[1:17:53] Please write in.

[1:17:54] But now we'll move on.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:56] Sorry about not really answering that last question.

[1:17:57] But it's okay.

Dan McCoy

[1:17:58] You know, we talked about something.

[1:17:59] Yeah.

[1:18:00] I got to talk about Sam Elliott being super hot.

[1:18:03] As our friends at Jordan and Jesse go say, what is a podcast if not saying words?

[1:18:08] And we certainly did that.

[1:18:09] Yeah.

[1:18:11] But let's recommend some movies.

[1:18:13] Movies that maybe would be a better use of your time.

[1:18:16] Hey, I have an animated movie to recommend.

[1:18:18] I actually highlighted this in.

Elliott Kalan

[1:18:21] Legend of the Overfiend.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:24] I mentioned this in Flop Secrets.

Elliott Kalan

[1:18:27] Sam's like, I saw something that I just found.

[1:18:30] It just felt like it was really saying something to me about the human condition.

[1:18:33] It's called Ninja Scroll.

[1:18:36] It's so good.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:37] I want to recommend a movie by legendary animator Richard Williams, The Thief of the Cobbler.

[1:18:46] I watched the recobbled cut.

[1:18:48] I had seen huge, huge chunks of this before, but I don't think I'd ever sat down and watched it, you know, all the way through.

[1:18:55] And part of that's because – so this was a project that he worked on for decades and decades.

[1:19:01] It originally was released in a chopped up version that he did not like at all by Miramax.

[1:19:09] It was like taken away from him.

[1:19:11] And then there was this recobbled cut, which is fan cut putting together, you know, the best elements that exist to get it closer to what Williams intended.

[1:19:24] And when I say best elements, like, you know, some of it is literally just like animatics or sketches.

[1:19:31] But what exists is astounding still.

[1:19:35] It is like he was a genius animator.

[1:19:40] And it doesn't really work that well as a narrative, but as a work of visual beauty and animation skill, it's amazing.

[1:19:48] So that's what I'm recommending.

Stuart Wellington

[1:19:50] I'm recommending a movie by one Rowdy Harrington, 1988's Jack's Back.

[1:19:59] This is the movie before Roadhouse.

[1:20:01] And I would say it is not as good as Roadhouse.

[1:20:03] I'm not going to go out there and make crazy claims.

[1:20:06] But this is a movie set in Los Angeles where there is a serial killer going around on the hundred year anniversary of the Jack the Ripper crimes committing mirror crimes.

[1:20:20] But in Los Angeles, which is weird.

[1:20:23] The movie kind of abandons that part of the premise about halfway through.

[1:20:28] James Spader is in it and he's, you know, James Spadering it up.

[1:20:32] There are – there's a surprise twins reveal.

[1:20:35] Not the movie twins, but characters that are twins.

Elliott Kalan

[1:20:38] Oh, they don't reveal that they're actually in the movie twins.

Stuart Wellington

[1:20:41] It is a – I mean maybe.

[1:20:43] It's a wild ride.

[1:20:45] Do the weasels show up?

[1:20:46] The weasels – I think they do.

[1:20:48] I'd have to go frame by frame.

[1:20:50] I will point out that Robert Picardo is in it playing like a psychologist.

[1:20:57] And man, there's somebody else that was in it that was really great.

Elliott Kalan

[1:21:00] Everyone's favorite Gremlin love object.

Stuart Wellington

[1:21:02] Oh, yeah.

[1:21:02] Chris Mulkey is in it.

[1:21:04] Oh, man.

[1:21:05] Yeah.

[1:21:05] Two thumbs up.

[1:21:06] Yeah, exactly.

[1:21:07] Mr. Greta Gremlin himself, Robert Picardo.

[1:21:10] So what I would say is it's not Roadhouse, but it's still a fun time at the movies.

[1:21:15] Go check out Jack's Back.

Elliott Kalan

[1:21:17] I'm going to recommend another fun time at the movies.

[1:21:19] This is a Japanese movie from 1963 called An Actor's Revenge directed by Kan Ichikawa.

[1:21:25] This is one I've been looking forward to seeing for a long time and had never gotten around to it.

[1:21:28] And I finally watched it, and it's super fun.

[1:21:31] It's set in 19th century Japan, or maybe it's early – no, I think it's late 19th century Japan.

[1:21:36] And the main character is an actor who specializes in female roles and always has kind of like a feminine kind of like a carriage to him, carries himself as a woman most of the time.

[1:21:48] But secretly, despite being an acclaimed actor, he is also on a mission of vengeance against the three men who ruined his father and drove his father and mother to insanity and death.

[1:22:01] And so he is now in the town where these three men are, and he's going to use all of his wiles and cunning in order to bring them to an end.

[1:22:08] And there's also a bunch of different – there's a bunch of different thieves running around who all have different gimmicks and are very fun.

[1:22:14] Elliot, you have sold this movie so hard for me.

[1:22:17] It's great, and it is – it looks beautiful.

[1:22:20] It's got – it's this 60s color.

[1:22:22] It's very non-naturalistic.

[1:22:23] It's very kind of expressive.

[1:22:26] And it's just – it's a super fun movie.

[1:22:28] But it also has a serious message about the emptiness of spending your life seeking vengeance against people.

[1:22:35] So that's An Actor's Revenge.

[1:22:36] I really enjoyed it.

[1:22:38] I highly recommend it.

Dan McCoy

[1:22:39] Well, that's been it.

[1:22:41] Another episode of the Flophouse, that is.

Stuart Wellington

[1:22:43] Time to unroll that anchovy can and climb into it and put on our little acorn caps.

Elliott Kalan

[1:22:51] We're also tiny.

[1:22:52] Yeah, we use a dust bunny as a stuffy.

[1:22:54] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:22:55] If you enjoy this podcast, why not check out MaximumFun.org where there's a ton of other great podcasts on our same network.

[1:23:05] Thanks to them for supporting us.

[1:23:08] Thanks to you for supporting us.

[1:23:09] Thanks to our producer, Alex, for supporting us by editing the thing and making it sound good.

[1:23:16] He goes by Howell Doughty on the internet.

[1:23:19] Yeah.

[1:23:19] But for the Flophouse, I've been Dan McCoy.

Stuart Wellington

[1:23:22] I'm Stuart Wellington.

[1:23:24] And I'm Elliot Kalin.

[1:23:25] And we are the Flophouse.

[1:23:28] And I'm Elliot Kalin.

[1:23:30] And I'm Stuart Wellington.

[1:23:31] I'm Dan McCoy.

[1:23:32] Produced by?

[1:23:34] Alex Smith.

[1:23:35] On Maximum Fun.

[1:23:37] Oodles of Casts for your noodle.

[1:23:39] Bye.

[1:23:47] Just fucking grip it and rip it, baby.

[1:23:49] Let's grip that.

[1:23:49] And then also let's rip that.

Dan McCoy

[1:23:51] Let's both grip and rip.

[1:23:52] But first, let me say to you, one.

[1:23:55] Two.

[1:23:56] Three.

[1:23:58] We gripped it.

[1:23:59] And it was ripped.

Stuart Wellington

[1:24:00] Yep.

[1:24:01] Those three numbers were gripped and ripped.

[1:24:03] Let's kick some tires, light some fires.

Dan McCoy

[1:24:06] Sure, I guess.

[1:24:09] And here we go.

[1:24:12] It starts like this.

[1:24:14] Maximum Fun.

[1:24:15] A worker-owned network.

S4

[1:24:17] Of artists-owned shows.

Dan McCoy

[1:24:18] Supported.

[1:24:19] Directly.

[1:24:20] By you.

Ep.#454 - The Garfield Movie

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