Ep.#454 - The Garfield Movie

[0:00] On this episode, we discuss the Garfield movie.

[0:03] The story of a farm boy who rose to become America's president

[0:06] before being felled by a madman's bullet.

[0:08] Love lasagna? Eights Mondays.

[0:30] Hey everyone, I'm Dan McCoy.

[0:36] Hey, I'm Stuart Wellington.

[0:38] My name's Elliot Kalin.

[0:40] Welcome to the Flop House.

[0:41] Sorry, I was just laughing at the way Stuart said his name,

[0:43] which seems like you put a little extra sauce on it.

[0:45] Yeah, put some stank on it.

[0:47] That's what Dan told me to do.

[0:48] Yeah, I said, make it extra stanky.

[0:51] Ask and shall receive.

[0:54] He was my favorite of the original Little Rascals.

[0:55] Extra stanky.

[0:57] Pull that bottle that says stanky off of the counter and squirt it all over that bad boy.

[1:02] Put a little extra on there.

[1:03] This is a podcast where we watch a bad movie and then we talk about it.

[1:07] And this time around, boys, so it's a well-known thing in Dan McCoy lore.

[1:14] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1:15] So much as anything is a well-known thing in Dan McCoy lore that my birthday is also the birthday of one Garfield tea cat.

[1:23] What's the tea stand for?

[1:26] And not just the day, but the first Garfield strip was on the day I was born.

[1:34] And he celebrates his birthday every year on my birthday.

[1:39] So it's an extra treat.

[1:41] I'll open the newspaper.

[1:43] I'll be like, what sort of half joke exists here?

[1:47] What a non-humorous, but, you know, sort of slightly smile-inducing thing that Garfield's done.

[1:57] Pleasant. Mostly pleasant.

[1:57] Yeah.

[1:58] Yeah, you're really celebrating Garfield already.

[2:01] Oh, I thought you were talking about your birthday.

[2:02] No, no, I like my birthday.

[2:05] That your birthday is mostly pleasant, kind of a half-joke, you know.

[2:08] I mean, other than, you know, the march to the grave that it represents, I'm a big fan.

[2:13] Yeah, but March to the Grave is a great title for your metal album, Dan.

[2:17] march to the grave yeah so uh this episode will be coming out a couple days after but it's close

[2:24] and i said hey guys a couple days after your birthday yeah yeah because the audience doesn't

[2:27] know unless the audience already knows the date of the first garfield strip or your birthday

[2:31] they don't know that this is topical is juneteenth uh a more significant holiday than either my or

[2:38] garfield's birthday i don't know dan you do have an naacp image award not a joke that is not a joke

[2:44] Now, Dan, you're saying that Juneteenth is not commemorating the day when the last enslaved people of the United States saw Garfield for the first time.

[2:54] No, no, no.

[2:54] They would have fucking flipped their lids.

[2:56] This cat's so lazy.

[2:59] Far more significant holiday.

[3:01] But, yeah, that's the day of my birth.

[3:05] I was not born on Juneteenth itself.

[3:07] That would make me very old.

[3:09] You'd be very old, yeah.

[3:10] Very, very old, yeah.

[3:11] But I said, hey, there was a new Garfield movie out.

[3:14] You know, just why don't you pander to me, guys, for once, for once in your lives.

[3:18] Let's do this Garfield thing.

[3:21] Yeah, you really had to twist our arms.

[3:23] You really had to bleed.

[3:24] Yeah.

[3:24] Yeah, the man who I think sent out his birthday RSVP three months ago.

[3:29] Hey, you know why that is, though?

[3:31] I know so many people who have birthdays within like 10 days of mine.

[3:38] So I really need to stake a claim.

[3:40] Really to stake a claim on people's Juneteenth plans.

[3:42] Yeah.

[3:43] Because he didn't want them to celebrate freedom

[3:45] when they could be celebrating Dan McCoy.

[3:46] We're not doing it on the date.

[3:48] That would be crazy.

[3:49] It's a Thursday.

[3:50] No, no.

[3:51] Yeah, he needs maximum attendance

[3:54] so that people can fawn all over him.

[3:57] Okay, all right.

[3:58] Yeah, yeah.

[3:58] You don't like attention, Stuart.

[4:00] I love it.

[4:01] This is when the cracks start to show.

[4:04] Yeah, who knew that this was going to be the thing

[4:07] that drove us apart was the existence of Dan's birthday.

[4:09] Guys, before we get into the summary of Garfield the movie.

[4:14] The Garfield movie.

[4:15] Can I give a little bit of setup here?

[4:19] Okay.

[4:19] It's been a really long week for me.

[4:21] I've been working a lot at my various bars.

[4:24] I'm physically exhausted.

[4:26] And I'm also emotionally exhausted from looking at my little rectangular glass thing in my pocket

[4:32] that shows me images of my phone.

[4:34] That's what you're talking about.

[4:35] I thought you meant your scrying glass that shows you the future of the people you meet.

[4:39] I call it a palantir.

[4:40] Yeah, you can call it a scrangler.

[4:42] You approached it in the most obvious way.

[4:44] I look at it and it, you know, it shows me images.

[4:46] I thought you meant one of Father and Eerie's mirrors that you carry with you.

[4:48] Yeah, it shows me constant.

[4:50] You haven't read those books, Dan.

[4:52] You haven't read those books.

[4:52] Okay, sorry.

[4:53] You know, it's showing me constant images of war crimes and civil unrest

[4:57] and just the worst people in the world stoking tensions on the world

[5:03] to enrich themselves, coupled with various other capitalism-type stuff.

[5:08] You know, things that bum me out.

[5:09] And for me, movies are an escape.

[5:12] Yeah.

[5:12] So, firing up the Garfield movie,

[5:17] I see filmmakers take the simplest idea,

[5:22] a cat that is very lazy, likes to eat, and is sarcastic,

[5:26] and somehow they deliver what might be

[5:30] one of the most soulless things I've seen.

[5:32] Just such a fundamental misunderstanding

[5:35] of a very simple character.

[5:37] Yeah.

[5:39] And you're saying, wait, you're so you're saying that when you imagined a Garfield movie, a character that the audience knows well, this character has been around for nearly 50 years at this point.

[5:49] You didn't think the best story for Garfield, the lazy orange cat, is to sneak into a dairy in order to reunite two cows that have fallen in love and been separated.

[5:58] I have the same problem.

[5:59] Despite having no particular love for Garfield other than a fondness, you know, for a birthday and growing up in the 80s reasons, just like a vague sort of warm feeling.

[6:08] Yeah.

[6:09] I don't think it's a funny strip.

[6:11] I don't particularly like it, but I have a fondness for him, so I still have the same problem.

[6:15] It's certainly no Mutt's.

[6:16] It's no Mutt's by Patrick McDonald, that's for sure.

[6:18] I definitely have the same problem that Stewart had.

[6:20] He's more of a shoe guy.

[6:22] Yeah, Dan loves shoe.

[6:23] This is a very simple premise that this movie seems to have no interest in.

[6:27] I will argue with you on one thing.

[6:29] I don't know that, like, people know, like, youngsters know Garfield these days, Elliot.

[6:34] Like, no young person is reading the comics page.

[6:38] not the same way they did when when i was a kid where every year that new garfield collection

[6:43] would come out and it was the top seller of the scholastic book fair at school everyone was buying

[6:48] it garfield was everywhere certainly garfield was sitting around the house you know certainly

[6:52] garfield mania is not what it once was but that being said if you're going to make a movie for

[6:58] kids about a lazy orange cat that loves to eat this is as original ip this is not the movie that

[7:04] you make yeah we should say like elliot you know for the young people in the audience elliot is not

[7:09] overstating the popularity of garfield there was a time in which you could not pass a car

[7:14] without seeing that furry orange cat uh suctioned to the back car garfield was very close to being

[7:22] elected president of the united states i feel like yeah like there was yeah i mean there was

[7:26] a president named garfield but i guess they can have two right the bushes did it we could do it

[7:31] yeah there's two adams two bushes and they would have been two adams yeah and they would have

[7:34] been father and son. Scott Adams was president?

[7:36] Yeah, Dilbert Scott Adams was

[7:38] president. Ugh, what a terrible president

[7:40] he would make. Not that different from the current one.

[7:42] Exactly. Ugh, anyway, but

[7:44] the, uh, the, uh, but he'd be like

[7:46] if our current president was a vegetarian,

[7:48] that's basically the only difference. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[7:50] But, uh, but, yeah, but, because Garfield the Cat was

[7:52] the son of James Garfield, the original president,

[7:54] so it would have been similar. But, you know, Garfield was

[7:56] the most popular comic strip

[7:58] other than Peanuts for

[8:00] years and years, right, guys? I feel

[8:02] like other than the Charlie Brown characters, there was

[8:04] no one more recognizable on the comics page than Garfield.

[8:06] You know, and

[8:07] television specials.

[8:10] We watched the TV show.

[8:12] Garfield and Friends, which is a great

[8:15] cartoon show. Yeah, with U.S.

[8:16] Acres. Yeah, hell yeah. Yeah, the U.S.

[8:18] Acres, the cartoons, which were like, it's like

[8:20] they're just saying to America, hey kids, use the bathroom for

[8:22] a little bit. Now's your chance. The Macy's

[8:24] Thanksgiving Day balloon

[8:26] with the meme that I love

[8:28] of whoever

[8:30] the announcer was saying, ah, here comes

[8:32] that son of a gun, that cat,

[8:34] That Garfield, that gigantic thing.

[8:36] Part of it is, I think for me,

[8:40] the Jim Davis is a really fucking talented draftsman.

[8:45] Like, he's delivering super crisp, clean art

[8:48] that I found very appealing.

[8:50] Well, his assistants are now delivering that.

[8:52] Whoever's working for Jim Davis is doing a great job.

[8:54] Yeah, okay, yeah.

[8:55] Like, you're not going to knock various manga artists

[8:58] because they have a league of uncredited assistants.

[9:00] No, I'm just like, I laugh at the idea

[9:03] Jim Davis has drawn a Garfield strip since I don't know.

[9:06] But I mean, like, he probably drew some of the ones in the 80s.

[9:10] Yes, for sure.

[9:11] For sure.

[9:12] But this is not a Charles Schultz level of devotion to making it a single man's artistic statement, you know?

[9:19] I mean, he wasn't in the fucking movie programming the digital models and stuff.

[9:23] That's a good point.

[9:24] That's a very good point.

[9:25] He was like, how can I make this look worse than my drawing?

[9:28] I mean, again, a fondness for Garfield, and Garfield has a second life now, I think, in, like, mean stuff like Garfield without Garfields and, like, early.

[9:37] Yeah, because he's such an enormous cultural artifact, you know.

[9:40] But he did start out, too, like, you know, Stuart has praised Jim Davis.

[9:45] Now I come to bury him.

[9:46] Like, he designed Garfield.

[9:48] The stated purpose of Garfield was what would be good for merchandising.

[9:52] He, like, looked around.

[9:53] He was like, okay, well, there's a dog.

[9:55] There's no big cat, you know.

[9:57] And he's like, let me give it a few traits that will be good for, you know, coffee mugs and whatnot.

[10:03] I may have read this wrong, but I read somewhere, I think, that it was either inspired by Charles Schultz or Charles Schultz giving him this advice that it was like, you should have Garfield stand on two legs.

[10:13] Because in those early Garfield strips, he stands like a cat.

[10:16] He's on four legs all the time.

[10:17] And then it was like a lightning bolt, you know, inspiration revelation that if he stands on two feet, he can be that much more kind of like smaller, rounder, expressive, cuter, you know, that's part of the secret.

[10:28] He's a bipedal cat, you know.

[10:30] Guys, let's get into the Garfield movie and find out why it has upset Stewart so much.

[10:35] Why this might have been the thing that broke Stewart Wellington.

[10:38] We're going to find out.

[10:39] And we should make it very clear we're not talking about Garfield the movie from 2004.

[10:42] That is a 21-year-old live action movie.

[10:45] That's where Bill Murray does the voice of Garfield.

[10:47] That was the movie which, while promoting it, Jennifer Love Hewitt went on The Daily Show and John made her feel bad by accident by talking about what a dumb movie it was.

[10:58] But this is the Garfield movie, not Garfield the movie.

[11:02] So we should all know that.

[11:03] And Stuart, to set the stage for Stuart's madness, and not my madness, I don't mean insanity, I mean his anger.

[11:10] It could be both.

[11:12] Yeah, it did drive it.

[11:14] He did call me up after watching it and say something about how he could see the fnords, and there was non-Euclidean geometry all around him.

[11:20] And I was like, this movie's driven you mad, Stuart.

[11:22] There's some very key things about Garfield.

[11:24] Garfield is lazy.

[11:26] Garfield is sarcastic.

[11:28] Garfield does not particularly seem to like his owner, John.

[11:31] These are all things that are not true of this movie's Garfield.

[11:34] So they touch on it briefly.

[11:35] Garfield is lazy.

[11:37] He's gluttonous.

[11:38] He loves lasagna.

[11:38] He hates Mondays.

[11:39] He hates spiders.

[11:40] He hates this cute cat named Nermal.

[11:43] And he is very condescending towards his ostensible owner.

[11:46] He is clearly the one who runs the house.

[11:48] And that's, yeah, that's Garfield.

[11:50] Like, that's it.

[11:51] That's all of what's Garfield.

[11:52] That's Garfield.

[11:52] That's what Garfield means to me.

[11:55] When a cat hits your eye with, like, a big lasagna pie, that's Garfield.

[11:58] So, and this movie kind of hits some of those bullet points early on

[12:01] and then is like, forget everything you knew about Garfield.

[12:03] Time to do something different.

[12:04] Yeah, so before we get a bunch of backstory,

[12:06] we see, like, Garfield lives with John.

[12:09] They live in a house.

[12:10] He lives, they also have a dog named Odie.

[12:13] Now, Odie is one of, I would say, the biggest mischaracterizations in the movie.

[12:18] They make Odie smart in this movie.

[12:19] Yes.

[12:20] Yes, and they make them, you know, compatriots rather than, you know, Garfield tolerates Odie at best.

[12:28] Yeah, I feel like the running gag is him kicking Odie.

[12:31] Yes, indeed.

[12:32] And also that Garfield uses a phone for quite a bit of the opening of this movie, which seems like a real fuck you to the audience.

[12:38] Like, hey, guess what?

[12:39] You're going to watch this character just using a screen for a little bit.

[12:43] Um, so we get, then we get a little bit of backstory.

[12:45] How did we get here?

[12:46] How did we get ourselves in this mess

[12:48] where this cat is running this man's life?

[12:50] Well, it begins with Garfield as a baby,

[12:53] which I'm like, already we have a baby,

[12:55] a cute baby Garfield.

[12:57] And I'm like, that was fucking Nermal, dude.

[12:59] And the whole existence of Nermal was Garfield hating him.

[13:02] Like, why do we have like a cute version,

[13:04] a cuter version of Garfield?

[13:05] Because we've got to make Garfield

[13:07] this incredibly popular character for 40 years.

[13:09] We got to make him likable, Stu.

[13:12] We've got to get the audience on his side.

[13:13] We've got to give Nicholas Holt more chances to do the voice of John Arbuckle with, I have to say, one of the stranger performances that I've seen from Nicholas Holt, who is an actor I love.

[13:24] I've seen him do so many great performances.

[13:25] I've seen him do so many different interesting voices.

[13:27] And this whole time I was like, this is not the best use of Nicholas Holt.

[13:30] Well, also, we have to see Garfield as a kid so we can give him daddy issues, which is the only thing that Hollywood understands.

[13:36] Yeah.

[13:36] Yeah, yeah.

[13:37] Daddy issues or – actually, that's true.

[13:40] It's two kinds of daddy issues.

[13:41] Either your dad left you or you're a dad

[13:44] and you don't have time for your kids

[13:46] because you're working all the time.

[13:47] Those are the two things that Hollywood understands.

[13:48] The only daddy issues I like

[13:50] are the People Magazine special issue

[13:52] focusing on Pedro Pascal.

[13:53] That was much more wholesome than I thought it was going to be.

[13:58] Yeah, I thought it was going to be much more overtly sexual.

[14:00] Don't ask Stuart about his bear issues.

[14:03] It keeps stealing my honey.

[14:07] So in Garfield's backstory,

[14:09] He has a father who is a large alley cat named Vic

[14:14] who abandons him in an alleyway.

[14:17] I don't want to stop you right away, but I will.

[14:19] And so the cat, Garfield's voice,

[14:24] as all voices are these days, is Chris Pratt.

[14:28] And the dad is Samuel L. Jackson.

[14:30] And I was torn between being like,

[14:33] well, I'm pro-colorblind click casting

[14:36] and being like, is it racist that we're giving him

[14:39] a black-sounding father who abandoned him?

[14:42] Like, the deadbeat dad is the black father of a white cat.

[14:46] Wow, Dan, you are noticing a problematic thing

[14:50] that I feel bad I did not pay attention to,

[14:52] maybe because I was already so not looking for meaning

[14:55] in a Garfield movie.

[14:56] I will say, Chris Pratt has got a hard row to hoe here

[15:01] because Garfield's voice,

[15:03] it's a couple different people have done the job,

[15:04] But for me, it will still always be Lorenzo Music, who did his voice in the early specials.

[15:07] He gets a little Easter egg in the back story.

[15:10] There's a music store in the back called Lorenzo's Music.

[15:12] Which I had to explain to Charlene, and her eyes glazed over immediately.

[15:16] She was like, wait, Lorenzo Music?

[15:18] You mean Carlton, your doorman?

[15:19] And you go, uh, he was more things than just Rhoda's doorman.

[15:21] She's like the voice of Peter Fankman in the real Ghostbusters.

[15:25] Exactly.

[15:26] But yeah, how do you guys feel about Chris Pratt's performance as Garfield?

[15:30] He's really putting on an interesting new voice, right?

[15:32] He is not.

[15:34] You know, I just do a regular voice like Chris Pratt has done good voice performances in the past.

[15:40] Yeah.

[15:40] Drop a couple on us.

[15:41] No, the Lego movie, I think, is good.

[15:43] And then, like, I was not, you know, I did not really care about, like, the whole, like, Mario controversy.

[15:50] I'm like, eh, whatever.

[15:52] It's like it's not great.

[15:53] But, like, Pratt is an Italian-American name, right?

[15:57] Well, I mean, I think the fact, to be honest, the Mario character as a New York Italian-American probably does sound more like Chris Pratt than it's-a-me, Mario, which is itself a cartoonishly Italian voice.

[16:10] I'm just saying that, like, I don't think it was, like, a great voice performance, but it was certainly, it certainly had energy, whereas this has, to my mind, very little energy or effort.

[16:20] Which, I mean, on some level fits the character Garfield.

[16:23] Yeah, but not, it doesn't seem intentionally lazy.

[16:26] When he is surfing on food being delivered by a drone

[16:29] because he's fighting evil dogs on top of a train,

[16:32] you do want a little bit of energy from the character.

[16:33] Okay, so...

[16:36] Oh, remind me.

[16:37] By the way, I watched this movie with my younger son.

[16:39] Remind me when we get to the later in the movie

[16:41] to tell you about when my younger son

[16:42] pitched a punch-up on one of the jokes in it

[16:45] that I thought was much better than what they had in the movie.

[16:46] I was very proud of him, yeah.

[16:47] So, we get some backstory.

[16:50] A baby Garfield goes looking for food.

[16:53] He finds, what, Mama Leone's pizzeria.

[16:56] he sees John Arbuckle about to tuck into some food

[17:01] and he is like licking the window.

[17:03] John Arbuckle is noticeably sad

[17:05] when he sees the families at Mama Leone's

[17:08] and he's all by himself.

[17:09] Yeah, he's a lone diner.

[17:11] And I mean, I feel like that's also like

[17:14] a kind of a weird restaurant to go eat by herself.

[17:16] Like go to the bar.

[17:17] A family, go to the place from Nighthawk,

[17:19] from Nighthawk's The Painting.

[17:20] Like that's where you go when you're lonely

[17:22] is an Edward Hopper restaurant, yeah.

[17:24] Yeah, but he, you know, he takes pity on this.

[17:26] You can talk the movie theater.

[17:27] Why not?

[17:28] It's a great theater.

[17:28] Yeah, why not?

[17:29] Edward Hopper never painted it,

[17:30] but that doesn't mean it's bad, you know?

[17:32] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[17:32] You can just order food in the movie

[17:35] and then leave when you're done eating.

[17:36] You don't have to-

[17:37] Yeah, no one sees you're alone

[17:38] because the movie's going on and it's dark in there.

[17:41] Especially like if you eat gross like Dan does sometimes.

[17:44] What?

[17:44] It means it's dark.

[17:45] No one can see you, yeah.

[17:46] I'm just joking.

[17:47] We all eat gross sometimes, right?

[17:49] I mean, when you're watching The Substance,

[17:50] you gotta eat gross, right?

[17:51] I don't know.

[17:52] Yeah, that's the special ad with The Substance, gross.

[17:55] Yeah, eat gross the way you want to at The Substance.

[17:58] Okay, so there's some, like, hijinks in the restaurant

[18:02] where Garfield's eating everybody's food.

[18:04] Doesn't matter.

[18:05] John takes him home.

[18:06] He's like, maybe I'll give this cat up.

[18:08] And Garfield's like, no, no, no, they love each other.

[18:10] Takes him home.

[18:11] The scene where Garfield is eating all the food

[18:13] and John is trying to stop people from noticing it,

[18:15] I turned to my son and I said, so is this funny to you?

[18:18] Like, do you find this, like, funny?

[18:20] Is this like a clown?

[18:21] Does it amuse you?

[18:22] And he just turned to me and shrugged and went, eh.

[18:24] I don't think he knew that it was supposed to be funny.

[18:27] Like that's how not successful it is as like a joke, you know.

[18:30] So it does highlight kind of the general like scene structure in a lot of this movie is just make it fast.

[18:38] Make a lot of stuff happening fast, which I feel like on some level it goes against a very lazy cat like Garfield.

[18:45] Now, can I mention that the director of this picture, so on the low end.

[18:49] Sidney Lumet?

[18:51] Yeah.

[18:51] Wow.

[18:52] Lumet.

[18:54] Oh, how continental of you.

[18:56] On the low end, directed Chicken Little.

[18:59] On sort of the neutral end, Cats Don't Dance.

[19:03] And on the high end, Emperor's New Groove.

[19:06] So he's a screenwriter too, right, for Emperor's New Groove?

[19:09] I don't know.

[19:10] I don't know about that.

[19:10] It's Mark Dindle.

[19:13] He's a longtime Disney animator.

[19:14] Yeah, and I think that this movie has some moments of, like, successful slapstick.

[19:23] And the problem is it's just tied into a movie that it should not be part of.

[19:28] Like, there's stuff in here that I'm like, well, I could see myself enjoying this if this was not a Garfield movie, which is part of the problem with, like, the obsession with IP.

[19:36] Because, like, this doesn't feel like a Garfield movie in the first place.

[19:38] So if it's just an unrelated kids movie, I'd be like, yeah, whatever.

[19:42] I mean, it's not really for me.

[19:43] But there's a couple of, like, laughs in there.

[19:45] Kids would like it.

[19:46] If it was called Cat's Son or something like that.

[19:48] Cat Junior.

[19:48] Cat Williams.

[19:49] Something like that.

[19:50] Yeah.

[19:51] But there's a part at the end where Garfield keeps stepping in the way of traffic

[19:55] and all the cars have to stop short and they're getting annoyed at him.

[19:58] That's the funny part.

[19:58] That was timed really well, you know?

[20:00] Yeah.

[20:00] But it doesn't feel like Garfield.

[20:01] It feels like something a different character would do.

[20:03] So we see the passage of time.

[20:05] John moves out of an apartment, moves into a house.

[20:08] They gain a dog named Odie.

[20:11] We see them getting into all kinds of goofy situations

[20:14] where Garfield basically is now running this house.

[20:17] He has a nice big lazy boy.

[20:18] All this stuff.

[20:20] This shows you – this is another thing I feel like people who make – obviously adults make these movies, not kids.

[20:26] But I think they sometimes don't really get what kids will be interested in because the transition from an apartment to a two-bedroom, two-bathroom house is something that I don't think kids need mentioned or to see necessarily.

[20:38] John Arbuckle could just be in a house the whole time.

[20:41] It's not something that a kid cares about.

[20:44] You're coming out in favor of child labor.

[20:46] You're saying that more children should have been involved in making this big thing.

[20:48] Yes, very much so, exactly.

[20:49] With their little hands, they can draw things better, you know.

[20:51] Dude, all we need to do, I think it's pretty straightforward.

[20:54] We take kids, we shove them in front of that Zoltar machine or whatever, make them big, okay?

[20:59] Then they can give us their fucking ideas and we can make money.

[21:02] Child labor laws, that way.

[21:03] Roger Loja.

[21:07] Robert Loja knew what was going on.

[21:09] Robert Loja knows.

[21:10] That's how you get good toys.

[21:11] It's like there was a, in the Dog Man movie, which we did not do for this podcast, I believe, but which I saw with my children.

[21:16] There's a.

[21:17] How was it?

[21:18] Yeah, yeah.

[21:19] Give us a – miss that movie.

[21:20] I kind of stopped paying attention partway through.

[21:22] But it's fine.

[21:23] I mean the Dogman books I came to really appreciate eventually.

[21:25] They get very emotionally rich at a certain point.

[21:29] But the movie –

[21:30] They're about the supporting character who eventually becomes king of the north from the First Law series by Joe Abercrombie.

[21:36] Exactly.

[21:37] Yeah, exactly.

[21:37] That's what it is.

[21:38] But there's a part in it where Dogman is like sad because his – before he became a Dogman, he had a girlfriend and now she has left him.

[21:46] And I was like, what kid cares about this?

[21:48] Like, what kid wants there to be a romantic subplot in their movie about a cop with a dog's head who fights a cat and makes robots?

[21:54] Like, come on.

[21:55] There is, like, as soon as they started giving us backstory about how Garfield was abandoned as a child, I'm like, what the fuck are you doing, movie?

[22:02] Like, we don't need this.

[22:04] And what we also don't need is a sequence where Garfield explains why he hates Mondays.

[22:09] Like, bitch, part of what makes Garfield so approachable is that he hates, he doesn't, this dude doesn't even have a job and he hates Mondays.

[22:16] And the thing is, everybody identifies with that.

[22:19] Everybody on the planet hates fucking Mondays.

[22:21] Yeah, this is not certainly a unique observation.

[22:25] I believe I've seen this out in the universe.

[22:28] But it is odd that Garfield hates Mondays, seeing that he does not have a job.

[22:33] And the reason most people hate Mondays is that they work a regular work week.

[22:40] You know, not everyone, but, you know, many people.

[22:42] And so Monday represents.

[22:43] That makes sense.

[22:45] That makes sense, Dan.

[22:46] But if I could ask you just one question, isn't there something inherently comical in a cat hating Mondays when it does not have a job?

[22:53] Isn't it almost a ridiculous juxtaposition leading to a humorous reaction or an ironic standpoint?

[23:00] So much of Garfield is to elicit a, like, a gentle nod and being like, yeah, Garfield, food is delicious or whatever.

[23:07] I don't feel like the comic ever makes that sort of connection, though.

[23:13] No, you're right.

[23:15] Because comics are better when they explain the jokes and they don't let the audience find them.

[23:18] Yeah, like it's Acme Novel.

[23:20] I mean, maybe I'm poisoned by knowing that Jim Davis wanted this to be, you know, a merchandising bonanza.

[23:27] But I feel like his hatred of Mondays feels like something that's just like, oh, this would be good for posters.

[23:32] You're right. You're right. Merchandising is always bad.

[23:34] Like, don't the peanuts shill for MetLife, Daniel? Don't you love them?

[23:39] But that's not part of the strip there.

[23:42] Snoopy isn't like going up to like

[23:44] Shermie you gotta get a

[23:46] you gotta get a policy

[23:48] yeah that's right that's right because Garfield does a lot of

[23:50] product placement in it's comic strip

[23:52] you make a good point

[23:53] the comic the Monday thing is from the comics

[23:57] but yeah

[23:58] do you think he's being paid by the no Mondays

[24:00] council like I understand

[24:01] I'm saying like this will be a good thing

[24:04] to put on a shirt

[24:06] because art that seeks to

[24:08] connect with humans based on their

[24:10] own personal frustrations. That's bad.

[24:13] I guess that's bad now. You know, Columbo, you're getting

[24:14] really irritated.

[24:15] Wow, it sounds like one of the

[24:18] most famous person in the cast.

[24:20] He was clearly the murderer.

[24:21] Columbo, you're getting really

[24:24] annoyed. You know, Lieutenant,

[24:26] this is getting a little

[24:28] annoying right now. It seems like you're picking apart

[24:31] everything. You're right, Dick Van Patten.

[24:32] You're right, and I shouldn't be asking you all these questions.

[24:34] Okay.

[24:37] Columbo, could you just

[24:38] go. I don't want to be in this conversation anymore.

[24:40] I literally can't. I'm investigating

[24:42] a crime and you're the suspect.

[24:44] Okay, well. Okay, so Garfield and Odie.

[24:46] That makes sense. I should stop investigating the crime

[24:48] and do something else as a police detective.

[24:51] Garfield and Odie.

[24:52] Maybe I should stop reviewing restaurants. You're right.

[24:54] You're right.

[24:55] I guess, Stuart, Garfield? Garfield and Odie

[24:58] go to get, I'm still on my first

[25:01] plot card here.

[25:02] Yeah, there's not a plot to this thing.

[25:03] There's too much. Someone say too much for a Garfield movie.

[25:07] I 100% would say that. I feel

[25:08] like this is a movie

[25:09] that should have just been

[25:10] a collection of incidents.

[25:11] Too much,

[25:12] but we can bullet point it.

[25:13] I think a collection of incidents

[25:14] would be harder to,

[25:15] anyway.

[25:16] Well,

[25:17] that's,

[25:18] I mean,

[25:18] that's basically

[25:19] what the Garfield collections were

[25:20] and those things

[25:21] rocked my shit.

[25:22] I'm just saying

[25:25] it's harder to summarize

[25:26] something when nothing's important.

[25:27] So Garfield and Odie

[25:28] are trying to get

[25:29] Garfield a late night snack

[25:30] and when they get kidnapped

[25:32] by Roland,

[25:34] Nolan,

[25:35] and Barry,

[25:36] a large Sharpay,

[25:38] a whippet, and a bird who are goons.

[25:42] It's always goons around the Flophouse.

[25:44] It should be called the Goon House.

[25:46] That's a different podcast.

[25:48] Okay.

[25:49] It's mostly about lube.

[25:50] Yep.

[25:51] They, I mean, there's a lot to talk about there.

[25:54] Yeah, that makes sense.

[25:56] It's a complicated subject.

[25:58] They kidnap Garfield and Odie for their master jinx.

[26:04] What kind of cat is that?

[26:07] It's a white Persian cat.

[26:09] White Persian cat voiced by Hannah Waddington.

[26:11] Now, these are all celebrity voices.

[26:13] Because Roland is Brett Goldstein.

[26:15] Nolan is Bowen Yang.

[26:16] Like, some would say that there are unnecessarily famous voices, as with many animated movies.

[26:23] Now, I thought you were going to point out these are all new characters.

[26:26] Instead of hanging around with Garfield and Odie and John and Liz, the veterinarian that John annoys.

[26:34] What about Arlene?

[26:35] Arlene, yeah.

[26:37] The waitress, right?

[26:38] Yeah.

[26:39] Oh, no, that's just his girlfriend, right?

[26:41] His cat girlfriend, yeah.

[26:42] His cat girlfriend.

[26:42] But yeah, there's also a waitress.

[26:44] Like any of these characters, it's just like, no, no, no, no.

[26:46] Here's a bunch of other characters from whatever unrelated script this started out as.

[26:52] Now, I would say—

[26:53] Well, we'll address each of these characters in turn, I'm sure.

[26:56] Yes.

[26:57] We'll give them a real ranking.

[26:58] And I would say as much as—

[27:00] A real hot or not ranking, yeah.

[27:01] As much as giving Garfield a sad backstory, I think, is a misstep.

[27:05] This is where the movie really, I was like, oh, okay, I don't know what this movie is going to be.

[27:09] Like, I don't know what's going on here.

[27:11] When Garfield and Odie are kidnapped by these genuinely, like, genuinely menacing, unpleasant characters.

[27:18] Garfield and Odie get kidnapped by Jinx using her, through her henchmen, as an attempt to draw out Garfield's absentee father, Vic, who is some kind of, like, ne'er-do-well type scoundrel cat.

[27:31] A real macavity.

[27:34] Yeah.

[27:35] Well, he's like a low-level Macavity,

[27:38] maybe even more of a Bustopher Jones.

[27:39] Now, Vic is the absentee father

[27:44] who abandoned baby Garf,

[27:47] and Garf found John.

[27:48] Jinx needs them to...

[27:50] We've done jokes about the world

[27:51] according to Garf at some point, right?

[27:52] Yeah, of course.

[27:53] Now, also, there's some additional backstory

[27:56] where we learn that Jinx

[27:58] wanted to be like a special cat,

[28:00] but wasn't successful,

[28:02] and then fell in with a bad crowd,

[28:03] stealing things.

[28:04] This is all dumb bullshit.

[28:05] Unnecessary.

[28:06] So much backstory.

[28:08] Just be a villainous cat.

[28:09] We don't need to know the tragic reasons that pushed this cat towards crime.

[28:14] I do like some of the character design on Jinx.

[28:17] I like the way that she has, I like her kind of like bell-shaped body.

[28:22] And I like that she has this like string of gems that glow different colors based on her mood.

[28:28] I think that's interesting.

[28:29] Everything else I don't like.

[28:30] Every time she switches from friendly to evil very quickly and back,

[28:35] the lighting changes, that all looks really cool.

[28:37] I think it's fun, yeah.

[28:37] It does feel like a character from a different movie, but it looks cool.

[28:40] And they occasionally play that up by showing her henchmen

[28:44] actually using a flashlight to cause lighting effects.

[28:46] I think that's fun.

[28:47] But Jinx needs...

[28:49] Do you ever wonder how they made their base in this abandoned mall

[28:54] and how they got Garfield Nody hanging, it seems, 200 feet in the air

[28:59] from the ceiling of this mall?

[29:00] I did not wonder that, despite the lies that you say about how I love backstory.

[29:06] Oh, yes, you must have been loving all this Jinx stuff.

[29:09] You must have been so excited about it.

[29:10] I was not wondering about any of it.

[29:12] I just accepted it because it was a cartoon.

[29:14] So in part of her backstory, Jinx was running around with Vic and committing crimes.

[29:22] And while she was betrayed by Vic when they were trying to steal some milk from, what, Lactose Farms is the name of the thing.

[29:30] And as a lactose intolerant person, I am not a fan of this.

[29:33] This makes me upset.

[29:34] Also, it makes me upset to see a cat drinking milk all the time because I know that gives cats diarrhea.

[29:39] Yeah, it's bad for cats.

[29:40] But, I mean, I would think that you're happy that this milk is being stolen and thus taken out of the ecosystem.

[29:44] That's true, yeah.

[29:45] It's less likely to go into my mouth.

[29:46] I mean, I know this is all cat milk.

[29:47] You know, this is—

[29:49] What?

[29:50] Okay, well—

[29:51] I think humans who can process lactose probably were going to get some of this milk, yeah.

[29:56] No, I'm saying it won't go to stew.

[29:57] Yeah, it won't go to meat.

[29:58] That's the important thing.

[29:59] Because if cats aren't stealing it out of the factory,

[30:01] Stu has to drink it.

[30:02] That's the law.

[30:02] Legally.

[30:03] So she, the deal.

[30:07] Whenever America and Russia signed the first salt treaty,

[30:11] Stu always lactose tasting.

[30:13] That stated that Stuart,

[30:14] to keep peace between the two nations,

[30:16] Stuart had to drink a lot of milk.

[30:18] Yeah, you know.

[30:19] It's always bad for you, yeah.

[30:21] So using some questionable leverage at this point,

[30:27] Banks convinces Vic, Garfield, and Odie to go back to Lactose Farms and steal a very large quantity of milk as kind of payment for the time she spent in the pound.

[30:39] This was something that my younger son also explained to me.

[30:42] He said, why does she want all that milk?

[30:44] It's going to go bad before she can drink it.

[30:46] I'm like, that's a good point.

[30:48] That's a very good point.

[30:49] One can't drink that much milk.

[30:51] No, it's not the most shelf-stable treasure.

[30:54] Well, also, the street value of milk is almost nothing because if someone tries to sell you some milk in the street, you're like, where did this milk come from?

[31:02] Well, it's like a cart.

[31:02] The minute you take it off the lot, the Blue Book value goes way down, just drops.

[31:07] So our heroes set off riding the rails.

[31:13] They sneak aboard a train cart.

[31:16] Yep, Dan.

[31:17] Now, this was like the moment in my life

[31:20] where I felt the most like the comic book guy,

[31:24] like the nerd.

[31:24] I guess it wasn't the comic book guy,

[31:27] but it was in the one Simpsons episode

[31:30] where it's like you hit the skeleton in the same place

[31:34] and it made two different sounds.

[31:37] It just healed someone who's fired over that.

[31:38] Yeah, yeah.

[31:39] Yeah, I was watching this.

[31:40] There's a part where Garfield is shot from like a tree limb

[31:45] through the train.

[31:48] He goes through the open train car,

[31:50] goes out the other side,

[31:51] and then bounces back

[31:52] and goes through the same train car.

[31:54] And I'm like, no,

[31:55] that train car would have gone forward.

[31:57] Yeah.

[31:57] Like, there's no way

[31:58] he could go through the same train car.

[32:00] And then I was like,

[32:01] what am I doing?

[32:02] Why do I care?

[32:03] Dan, I hate to say it,

[32:05] I had the exact same thought process.

[32:07] Where I was like,

[32:08] he wouldn't have been able

[32:09] to fly back to the same train.

[32:10] But then I was like,

[32:11] you know, it doesn't matter.

[32:11] It's the Garfield movie.

[32:12] Yeah.

[32:13] Yeah.

[32:13] So, yeah.

[32:14] As we've addressed, he flies through the same train car multiple times.

[32:18] It's totally hilarious.

[32:19] This is one of the times when I started to say it also,

[32:23] and my youngest son turned to me and he goes,

[32:24] he goes, don't just complain through the whole movie.

[32:27] Don't just tell me you don't like the movie.

[32:29] And he wasn't enjoying it.

[32:31] When it was over, I was like, how was it?

[32:32] And he goes, eh.

[32:33] But he was like, don't just tell me what's wrong with the movie.

[32:35] Oh, wow, yeah.

[32:37] So your son's a polite Midwesterner who doesn't want to speak up.

[32:40] Exactly.

[32:41] You got to break him in that habit.

[32:43] Okay, so we arrive at the farm, lactose farm.

[32:50] Unfortunately, security has increased quite a bit

[32:53] since the last time Vic was here.

[32:55] It's all high tech and intense.

[32:58] Luckily, they meet Otto, a purple bull,

[33:03] who I thought was a yak for a while,

[33:05] but I think he's a former Ving Rhames,

[33:07] who I can guarantee you recorded all his lines while seated.

[33:12] But I'll say this.

[33:13] And while wearing a cool hat.

[33:15] But I'll say this.

[33:16] I think my favorite performance in the whole movie.

[33:17] I think he does.

[33:18] I think you're right.

[33:19] It's the funniest voice performance for sure.

[33:21] He, so this character was the former mascot of Lactose Farms, Otto the Bull, who it was him and a cow, Ethel, and they were deeply in love, but something happened and he got kicked out.

[33:40] And she remains, I guess, under lock and key by the farm.

[33:45] Is that correct?

[33:45] So they want to heist the milk and he's going to help them if they can heist the cow as well, essentially.

[33:51] Why heist the cow if you can heist the milk for free, you know?

[33:55] While they're training and preparing.

[33:58] I doubted myself.

[33:59] While they train and prepare, Vic, I think we get Vic's backstory here.

[34:04] I think this was involved.

[34:05] They get tied up to a tree and Garfield and his dad get in an argument.

[34:10] And we get Vic's backstory where he didn't actually abandon Garfield.

[34:14] He went off trying to get food, but then he showed up too late.

[34:19] And then he saw Garfield with John and like, it's fucking stupid.

[34:23] And he was like, oh, I guess my son's better off with this human, which I'm like, yeah, he probably is.

[34:28] Yeah, the human can buy food rather than having to scavenge it.

[34:33] But I don't know.

[34:35] He'll probably get fixed.

[34:36] In so much as anything in the Garfield movie elicited any sort of pathos for me, there were some mild twinges when I saw, like, the dad being, like, looking at Garfield being adopted basically in front of his eyes and being like, huh, I guess it is for the best.

[34:51] Yeah, not since the story of Moses has someone had to see their son be taken for their own safety and it had such pathos to it, you know, and such importance.

[35:04] Yep, Garfield.

[35:06] Sort of the Moses of cats.

[35:09] So Otto, who has an understanding of the layout,

[35:14] but is much too large to sneak in, stays back.

[35:17] They all put acorns in their ears, which work as like radios.

[35:22] Yeah, they're like little walkie-talkies.

[35:23] Our cats and dog friend all sneak in, pretending to be backpacks.

[35:28] They go around inside this high-tech facility,

[35:33] which is very much like a bunch of modern animation bullshit.

[35:37] Like there's a scene where like Garfield is almost getting chopped up

[35:41] or shredded like cheese.

[35:43] And you're like, it's all the fucking mayhem conveyor belt sequence

[35:48] from episode two, Attack of the Clones, right?

[35:51] Where like stuff's about to smash him all the time.

[35:53] I got so mad.

[35:53] There's a part, he's on a big block of cheese

[35:55] and these big cleavers are chopping it up.

[35:58] And he keeps running back and forth along the block of cheese.

[36:00] And I was like, Garfield, you exist in three dimensions.

[36:02] go forward off the cheese.

[36:04] Get out so you're not within reach of the blades.

[36:06] Elliot Gargoyle can't hear you.

[36:09] I kept shouting and shouting,

[36:11] but he couldn't hear me, Dan.

[36:12] He couldn't hear me.

[36:13] I was worried about him.

[36:14] And I'm like,

[36:15] we have strayed so far from the sarcastic cat

[36:20] who sits around complaining about shit.

[36:23] The fact that he is running

[36:24] through a high-tech action sequence.

[36:25] I hate it.

[36:27] Meanwhile, Jinx makes a phone call

[36:29] to Marge Malone,

[36:31] the head of security at Lactose Farms,

[36:34] voiced by Cecily Strong,

[36:36] who, you know,

[36:38] gives a pretty fun performance, I guess.

[36:39] She's fun.

[36:40] She's fun.

[36:41] That's fine.

[36:41] And using a phone app

[36:45] that will be used repeatedly

[36:47] throughout the movie

[36:48] where the cats and dogs

[36:50] can change their voice

[36:51] to sound like a human voice.

[36:52] So here's the thing,

[36:53] and this really got to me

[36:54] because what this means is

[36:56] when Garfield is talking,

[36:57] he's talking.

[36:59] Like he's speaking out loud.

[37:00] And in the Garfield comics, again, I hate to be the comic book guy,

[37:03] Garfield, John cannot understand Garfield.

[37:06] Garfield doesn't, he can speak to other animals or spiders or whatever

[37:09] while he's thinking.

[37:10] But the idea that if the animals can use this app to change their voices,

[37:13] why doesn't he just talk to John?

[37:15] Why doesn't he talk to any human being?

[37:17] Part of the joy is that humans can use it to translate the animals.

[37:20] Yeah.

[37:20] And part of the joy is that John, like it's Garfield reacting to John being an idiot.

[37:27] Like, it's him, like, running a monologue and, like, talking shit.

[37:31] Well, also, like, I understand why the security person needs to be able

[37:36] to translate this for plot reasons, but it was, you know,

[37:40] it was a much funnier joke.

[37:42] I mean, not that I was like, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

[37:44] It was a much funnier joke when, you know,

[37:47] the jinx is, like, calling up and, like, trying to frame the cat,

[37:51] and, like, then you cut to the person on the other line,

[37:53] and they just hear meow, meow, meow, meow, meow.

[37:55] But if you – but like this app, it just – it fundamentally changes the nature of human-animal relations in a way that this movie – it's like in Zookeeper how we talked about how the lion is like, we could always talk.

[38:06] We just don't say it because it freaks people out.

[38:08] It's like, really?

[38:08] You don't want to tell people to stop killing you and putting you in zoos?

[38:11] Because it seems like that's a good use of language.

[38:13] Yeah.

[38:14] One of the top uses.

[38:15] Yeah.

[38:15] Being freaked out is worse.

[38:17] It's a little bit like watching a romantic comedy.

[38:20] They're too polite.

[38:20] If there's a romantic comedy where the guy's like, I really got to impress my date, and he goes, I guess I'll fly, and he just starts flying through the air, I'd be like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[38:29] This movie has just fundamentally changed what it's about.

[38:31] Like, I can no longer care whether these two get together now that I know that man has conquered gravity in this movie.

[38:38] So, yeah, they infiltrate the complex.

[38:40] They think they're about to close in on the keys, but it turns out that Marge Malone, head of security, is there.

[38:47] She talks some shit.

[38:48] And then Vic manages to snatch the keys and leave Garfield and Odie behind.

[38:55] He betrays them, and he drives away with the milk truck.

[38:59] Again, questions of how a cat is able to drive a car is not really addressed, but that's fine.

[39:04] It seems like he's big enough to fit in the seat and hit the pedals.

[39:07] And also the truck itself, this milk truck, it looks like one of the war rigs.

[39:10] So the size of the cat was the issue for you, Elliot, not the fact that the cat knows how to drive.

[39:16] I mean, at this point, I got to buy a certain amount.

[39:19] I know it bothered me that you have an animal translating app

[39:23] and it has not revolutionized human society.

[39:24] But at a certain point, it is a cartoon

[39:26] and I got some things I got to just go along with, you know.

[39:28] I mean, well, I'm sure we'll talk about each of these OCs in time.

[39:33] But I do want to point out that I think it's a mistake.

[39:36] Original characters.

[39:37] Oh.

[39:38] Yeah.

[39:39] I think it is a design flaw to make Garfield's dad

[39:45] just bigger than Garfield.

[39:48] Garfield should be the biggest of them.

[39:50] It certainly makes Garfield look less

[39:52] like a lazy, out-of-shape cat

[39:54] if he's one of the smaller characters in the movie.

[39:57] Yes.

[39:57] Yeah.

[39:57] Okay, so they're trying-

[40:01] I will say it is a little weird also

[40:03] that Garfield at the end of the movie

[40:05] cooks dinner for everybody

[40:06] and John is not like,

[40:07] holy shit, my cat is cooking?

[40:09] And then it turns into one froggy evening.

[40:14] he opens a restaurant

[40:16] you gotta see this cooking cat

[40:17] he won't do it for anybody else

[40:19] not on Mondays John

[40:21] we shouldn't have called the restaurant Mondays

[40:24] the restaurant that's only open Mondays

[40:26] so

[40:28] TGI Mondays

[40:30] for their crimes

[40:32] Garfield and Odie are stuck in the pound

[40:35] and they

[40:36] while they're in the pound

[40:38] they connect with a few of

[40:41] Vic's former crew

[40:42] who are all there, all voiced by more celebrity voices.

[40:46] Snoop Dogg is one of them.

[40:47] You got Snoop Dogg, you got Janelle James,

[40:49] and you got Angus Cloud, R.I.P., in a final performance,

[40:52] which is wild.

[40:53] And that basically just kind of fills out

[40:58] a little more of Vic's backstory,

[41:00] more time spent talking about a character

[41:03] that isn't Garfield.

[41:04] The John shows up,

[41:08] and he springs Garfield and Odie from a pound.

[41:12] They're about to tuck into a massive lasagna feast that John has prepared.

[41:17] He had been going out of his mind missing his pets, which I understand.

[41:19] If my pets were missing, I would be devastated.

[41:21] And that's when Garfield pauses.

[41:25] He stops eating lasagna for a moment because he remembers the words that Vic may have been watching him while he was growing up.

[41:36] So he goes out to the tree that he believes Vic was hanging out in, and he sees a plethora of hash marks that Vic had made every single time he came to visit his son, which is also a weird thing to do.

[41:49] That every time he came to watch Garfield, he put a slash, and then he would, you know, he would bundle his sticks.

[41:57] He would do full, like, fives as a bundle all over this tree.

[42:01] This is how long I've been in prison, Mark.

[42:03] Yeah, it's kind of wild.

[42:05] Well, he was always, he was, like, there's a cut scene where he talks about how much he was influenced by the Batman villain Zaz.

[42:10] Yes.

[42:10] So that's why he loves those hash marks, yeah.

[42:12] Yeah, if you were to, if you were to shave Vic, you would see that his body's covered in those hash marks.

[42:17] I mean, like, I get that he's, like, supposed to be ashamed of everything or whatever, and, like, he wants to keep his, he doesn't want to confuse Garfield, maybe, by, like, reentering his life.

[42:28] But this, like, revelation, like, feels pretty empty.

[42:32] Like, oh, oh, he was here watching me from a distance this whole time, never, you know, making contact.

[42:39] Great.

[42:39] Not since the story of Moses when Moses' own mother was, I guess, I believe, hired as his nursemaid and could not reveal her identity to him, you know.

[42:48] I would say the idea of a shameful cat father is fundamentally not cat-like.

[42:55] No.

[42:55] I feel like cats are, that's part of Garfield's appeal, is that cats are kind of jerks.

[43:01] I love him for it, just like I love Garfield.

[43:03] But cats are not like, that's more of a dog trait.

[43:08] What I think is really the bad thing is that they didn't take this opportunity to do a parody of the song Somebody's Watching Me by Rockwell called Some Daddy's Watching Me, which I think would have fit this scene perfectly.

[43:20] Or a Cats in the Cradle bit, because, you know, they're cats.

[43:23] Yeah, cats.

[43:24] Yeah, Dan, other songs that could have fit this?

[43:27] They could have changed it to Garfs in the Cradle.

[43:29] I was too busy internally arguing with the idea that cats are jerks.

[43:32] You know, they, you know.

[43:34] And the normal spoon.

[43:35] You have to meet them at their level.

[43:37] They're not going to give their love unconditionally.

[43:39] Feline eyes are watching you.

[43:41] That could be another one.

[43:42] Yeah, it took you a little while, but you got there.

[43:44] Yeah, I got there.

[43:44] It took me a little bit of time to think about it.

[43:46] So, with this revelation that Vic actually loves him and was a good dad.

[43:50] Well, not a good dad, but that he cared about him.

[43:53] So they rush over to the mall that was Jinx's hideout and using the evidence dungeon that Jinx had left, they discover that Jinx's plan is to get on a train and throw Vic off of a bridge.

[44:08] Off the Mile High Bridge.

[44:09] What a clever plan.

[44:11] Also, but it's playing off of the famous Garfield landmark, the Mile High Bridge.

[44:16] We remember all the amazing Garfield stories that are set around this famously high bridge, right?

[44:21] So they, using their acorn earpieces, they contact Otto the bull, and they get Otto to agree to help them save Vic by doing a train job.

[44:35] Otto's help seems not really necessary, and here's one of the things about this.

[44:39] Until the very end.

[44:40] But they wouldn't have known that was going to happen.

[44:42] But so he's like, you're going to get on that train, and then just as it hits the bridge, you'll jump out with your dad, and you'll land in a net that Odie is tying.

[44:50] And while they get on the train, it takes them a little bit of time to get to the bridge.

[44:53] So I was like, why don't they just jump off the train before they get to the bridge

[44:56] so they don't have to fall a mile into a net?

[44:58] That seems like a better plan in some ways, you know.

[45:02] So this leads to a bunch of action and silliness.

[45:07] Hijinks.

[45:07] And Garfield saves the day by calling in 6,000 food delivery drones.

[45:13] So he's like surfing around on pizza boxes and eating.

[45:16] I think he eats hot sauce and breeds fire on people.

[45:20] This is really just a holding action, though, because by the time he's done with this whole action sequence of using food as weapons, everything is exactly back where it started.

[45:27] He's still dealing with the same bad guys on the same train.

[45:30] So he's really he's accomplished very little with this.

[45:32] There's a lot of also product placement in this film.

[45:36] At the end, I believe he like or like like explicitly orders online from like like FedEx delivers it.

[45:44] And there's like a there's like Walmart.

[45:46] I forget what like Target or something like it's all branded.

[45:50] very obviously for an animated movie.

[45:54] And all that free advertising for Mama Leone's pizza.

[45:56] Sure.

[45:57] Is that a real pizzeria?

[45:59] No, I don't think so.

[46:01] You never know, man.

[46:02] I don't know all the flyover states.

[46:05] Yeah, you don't know where the cool cats eat.

[46:08] Okay, so by the end of this train adventure,

[46:14] Jinx's goons turn on her.

[46:18] They don't want to do her dirty work no more.

[46:20] In what some would call an arbitrary plot twist.

[46:23] I just want to highlight that I teased to you guys on text that there was one time when I actually laughed out loud.

[46:29] It was when they jump off the thing, the train, they go to the net, and they said, like, Garfield meets Vic.

[46:38] Like, Vic is bouncing back up, and they meet in the middle, and he goes, net's too tight, or something like that.

[46:42] And they both just, like, go right back onto the train after escaping the train.

[46:47] I thought that was a funny bit.

[46:48] Good joke.

[46:49] Yeah. One time I did not laugh was when Garfield goes, that's right.

[46:53] I do my own stunts and then pause and me and Tom Cruise.

[46:58] And it was like, yeah, like, it's not funny to say Tom Cruise does his own stunts.

[47:02] Like, that's not a joke. That's just a.

[47:04] Yeah. Did you just put that in there in case Tom Cruise is watching the movie?

[47:07] I also do my own stunts.

[47:10] Leonardo DiCaprio meme.

[47:11] Yeah. So he would then after the movie, go up to somebody, some employee at the movie, at the AMC and be like,

[47:18] hey, they mentioned me in the movie.

[47:19] Popcorn in his mouth like a madman.

[47:22] He's like, did you see Garfield?

[47:23] The Garfield movie talked about me.

[47:25] He'd have to go to David Miscavige and say,

[47:26] make all the Scientologists go see the Garfield movie.

[47:29] They mentioned my name in it.

[47:30] If you're going to do that joke,

[47:31] make a joke about an actor

[47:33] who you don't expect to do all their own stunts.

[47:35] That would be, that's a joke, you know.

[47:37] Yeah, who would that be, Dan?

[47:38] Oh, I don't know.

[47:41] Paul Giamatti.

[47:42] I mean, Paul Giamatti can do anything.

[47:44] I feel like he might do it, actually.

[47:46] But if he was like, I do all my own stunts.

[47:48] Me and Tyne Daly.

[47:49] I'd be like, okay, that's a joke.

[47:51] Okay, so in the process, not only do they survive.

[47:56] Oh, wait, I apologize.

[47:57] We missed where I want to tell you about my son's punch-up.

[48:00] Oh, yeah, please.

[48:00] I was fucking aching for this one.

[48:02] Yeah, sorry.

[48:03] Garfield is about to, Otto is about to launch Garfield onto the train.

[48:07] And Garfield says to him, if I don't make it back, tell my story.

[48:10] Which is kind of like, okay, it's kind of a boilerplate line.

[48:13] And my son turned to me and he goes, he should have said, if I don't make it back, serve lasagna at my funeral.

[48:17] I was like, that's a much better line.

[48:19] It's a better line.

[48:20] It's more Garfield, yeah.

[48:21] So they manage to, in the process,

[48:23] they survive and they capture Jinx.

[48:26] They trade Jinx to Marge Malone,

[48:30] again, using the voice changer app.

[48:33] This amazing animal translating voice changer app.

[48:36] They trade this criminal cat

[48:38] in exchange for the cow mascot Ethel.

[48:41] This is a wild idea that the head of security is like,

[48:46] okay, yeah, you can have this cow

[48:48] because I need to punish this cat.

[48:50] You can have the mascot to the company

[48:52] whose worth is, you know, must be in the millions.

[48:56] It's a big company.

[48:57] Millions, yeah.

[48:57] In exchange for this criminal cat

[48:59] who I'm going to do what with?

[49:00] Why is this of use to me?

[49:02] Yep, so of course they trade Ethel the cow

[49:07] who walks over there, sees Otto,

[49:09] and then let's get it on plays,

[49:12] and we're like, I guess they're fucking?

[49:14] Yeah, yep, that's what they're doing.

[49:16] for getting it on.

[49:17] I mean, I get it.

[49:18] Like, again,

[49:19] Ving Rhames gives

[49:20] a really good performance.

[49:21] And, I mean,

[49:22] I'd say that's a pretty hot cow.

[49:23] I mean, I guess.

[49:25] I don't have...

[49:26] I've seen hotter.

[49:27] I've seen less hot, you know.

[49:28] Thank you.

[49:29] Okay, and then,

[49:31] so they get back home with John,

[49:33] and after a moment's hesitation,

[49:35] Garfield invites Vic

[49:37] to live with them.

[49:37] So now we have this new character

[49:39] all the fucking time.

[49:40] Yep, yep.

[49:41] That really blew my mind.

[49:43] Again, I have, like,

[49:45] this base level of familiarity fondness with Garfield,

[49:49] but I don't really give, like, a shit about Garfield

[49:53] as, like, an artistic endeavor,

[49:55] because I don't believe it is,

[49:56] but it still blew my mind.

[49:58] What about the nine lives of Garfield?

[49:59] That's a pretty good one.

[49:59] That's a good one.

[50:00] That's actually good.

[50:01] They do some strange things with that book, yeah.

[50:03] But it blew my fucking mind that this movie ends with, like,

[50:06] and now this new character, Garfield's dad,

[50:09] lives with them.

[50:10] You're going to love this.

[50:12] It's canon.

[50:13] And there's, in the, like, montage,

[50:15] There's the briefest moment where you see Nermal,

[50:17] and I'm like, where the fuck was Nermal this whole movie?

[50:20] Yeah.

[50:20] What?

[50:21] Okay.

[50:22] There's a part where they're eating cereal.

[50:23] Abu Dhabi, probably.

[50:24] Yeah, that's a good point.

[50:26] Yeah, he's still coming back from Abu Dhabi.

[50:27] Yeah, there's a part where they're eating cereal,

[50:28] and Binky the Clown is on the cereal box,

[50:30] and I'm like, can't wait to see that clown in this.

[50:32] Oh, wait, no, not going to happen, not in the movie.

[50:34] Just an Easter egg for the fans.

[50:36] So, again, Nermal's barely in it.

[50:38] We get none of the U.S. Acre dudes,

[50:40] including that fucking shell with the leg sticking out.

[50:43] Oh, he's the best, yeah.

[50:44] So let's talk about the OCs, okay?

[50:47] I'm assuming these are all original characters.

[50:49] I think it's Orson.

[50:50] I know that.

[50:50] So we have Vic.

[50:51] Yeah, yeah.

[50:51] What are our thoughts on Vic?

[50:53] I've already said I don't like him.

[50:54] I think he shouldn't be bigger than Garfield.

[50:57] I don't care for Vic.

[50:58] I don't care about him.

[50:59] It's not Vic's fault so much as it's just like I don't like this like, oh, we got to have a dad problem.

[51:05] Who has like so much time?

[51:06] If it's a Garfield movie, why are you introducing a new character and making them – giving them kind of equal weight with the main character?

[51:12] Like why are you doing that?

[51:14] Not since Walter and the Muppets.

[51:16] It's a very Walter situation.

[51:19] Hey, people love the Muppets.

[51:21] You know who they want to see?

[51:22] A new character who's not even a fucking animal.

[51:25] You got Roland and Nolan, the two goons.

[51:30] The like Sharpay and the Whippet.

[51:32] I mean, I'll give them credit for having one big guy, one little guy.

[51:35] Like that's a classic comedy, physical dynamic.

[51:37] Otherwise, they seem to have very little personality.

[51:39] There's nothing particularly funny about them.

[51:42] Yeah.

[51:42] Yeah, I mean, like, it's kind of a first thought idea

[51:46] to have Brett Goldstein be, like, a growly character,

[51:49] but he did a good job at it.

[51:51] Yeah, Ray Winstone wasn't available.

[51:53] Yeah, Nolan, I feel like, is a sub-weasel

[51:57] from Roger Rabbit type of villain.

[51:59] Yeah, I mean, but those are, I mean,

[52:01] those are fucking S-class villains.

[52:03] Those guys are great, yeah.

[52:04] Those are, like, they're up there with Salacious Crumb

[52:06] when it comes to bad guys.

[52:07] If those guys showed up in almost any movie,

[52:09] I'd be like, hell yeah.

[52:11] You're watching Oppenheimer.

[52:13] Will, we got the scientists for the project.

[52:14] And it's those weasels from Roger Rabbit.

[52:16] I mean, those suits would fit, dude.

[52:17] It's the time period.

[52:19] They would fit right in there.

[52:20] It's the right time period.

[52:20] We need these suits and weasels.

[52:25] They would get along so well with fucking Robert Downey Jr.'s character.

[52:28] For sure.

[52:30] Yeah.

[52:30] Do we really need the one who's just brandishing a straight razor all the time?

[52:34] You know we do.

[52:35] You know we do.

[52:35] He's going to use that to split an atom.

[52:37] Yeah, of course.

[52:38] Yeah, exactly.

[52:38] God damn it.

[52:40] And you know when they show up in any movie, I'd be like,

[52:43] shur, shur, shur.

[52:43] I know we're watching Portrait of a Lady on Fire,

[52:45] but the weasels just showed up.

[52:47] Paul Giamatti, there's a couple students you have to chaperone

[52:53] over Christmas at the school.

[52:54] Oh, no, it's those weasels.

[52:56] Even the one that's just laughing and bonking himself on the head all the time?

[53:00] Oh, yeah.

[53:01] The one with the beanie?

[53:02] Sure, yeah.

[53:03] Yeah.

[53:03] They're all students at this private boarding school, yeah.

[53:07] Yeah.

[53:07] Oh, man.

[53:08] If you've got rich weasel parents, you can get in anywhere, no matter how goofy you are.

[53:13] And most of them end up leaving, so it's just Paul Giamatti and that one weasel.

[53:16] Yeah, yeah, sure.

[53:17] Just the one weasel.

[53:19] He has a name.

[53:20] Okay, so we've talked about them.

[53:23] What about—

[53:23] I feel like this is a whole mini we should do is just inserting those weasels into other movies.

[53:27] What about Otto and Ethel, our characters?

[53:31] I don't get to know Ethel that much, but I'm sure she's wonderful because I'm fond of Otto.

[53:37] You know, so, you know, Ving Rhames' performance is strong.

[53:41] I feel like they do not belong in this movie.

[53:44] Yeah.

[53:45] No, but his performance is strong.

[53:47] And also, I will say this, Otto's personality, which is kind of like bitter and resentful and sarcastic and condescending, that fits in a Garfield story.

[53:57] Like, that's the kind of personality that Garfield should have, as opposed to smiling all the time and being like, I love my life.

[54:05] I'm Garfield.

[54:06] But the – I think that Otto at least – it doesn't make sense for them to be helping – again, for them to be helping a bull rescue his girlfriend from a lactose – from a milk farm doesn't make sense for a dairy.

[54:17] But his personality at least, I could see a couple weeks –

[54:19] Yeah, in like a sub-Ardman animation style milk factory.

[54:23] Yes, very sub.

[54:24] Yeah, but I could see a couple weeks of the Garfield strip where they like go to a farm and Garfield is dealing with Otto the bull for whatever reason.

[54:32] Like they're on vacation or something like that.

[54:34] Yeah.

[54:34] You know.

[54:35] And I think, oh, I guess, and Jinx the cat.

[54:38] I've mentioned I like some of the design elements of Jinx,

[54:41] but also very unnecessary character.

[54:43] Very Secret Life of Pets rather than Garfield.

[54:45] Yeah.

[54:46] Yeah.

[54:47] This is like a, I don't know,

[54:50] this is like a Beverly Hills Chihuahua, but a cat and mean.

[54:52] Mm-hmm.

[54:53] Yeah.

[54:53] So I think it's time for, what's that, Dan?

[54:57] It's Final Judgments, whether this was a good, bad movie,

[55:00] a bad, bad movie, or a movie we kind of liked.

[55:04] I'm going to say bad, bad.

[55:06] It is not a Garfield movie, let alone the Garfield movie.

[55:12] Dan, check the poster.

[55:13] It's the Garfield movie.

[55:14] And again, I think if it wasn't billed as a Garfield movie,

[55:20] I'd be a little easier on it just because I have no preconceived notions

[55:24] about what something should be.

[55:25] And normally I don't really care, but it's like, why do it this way?

[55:29] Why approach it this way?

[55:30] It's so weird.

[55:32] There's some, like, there's stuff in here that I'm like, oh, you know, like, this would be perfectly fine for a small child.

[55:38] There's nothing offensive in here.

[55:39] Like, there's some, like, fun slapstick stuff.

[55:42] But, you know, for full-grown men such as us who should not be watching it anyway, I'd say it's a bad, bad movie.

[55:50] We're all big boys here.

[55:52] We're grown-ups.

[55:53] Beefy boys.

[55:54] Yeah, so I don't, you know, I don't work in animation.

[56:00] I don't have a lot of experience working in animated things

[56:03] that might involve talking animals.

[56:05] Of the three of us, I have the least experience with that.

[56:09] But there was just something that felt so like they took Garfield,

[56:14] a character that I really cared about a lot for some weird reason.

[56:18] And obviously, I know it's like, it's a brand.

[56:21] Garfield is this weird cultural icon.

[56:23] But it just feels so strange to see this,

[56:26] like, just to see this character misrepresented this way.

[56:30] And this character just kind of, like, stuck into a movie that he does not belong, and he is not – it's, like, it'd be one thing if it was, like, we're going to take Garfield, but we're going to put him in, like, Barry Lyndon or something.

[56:42] I'm, like, well, he doesn't fit in there, but it's still Garfield.

[56:44] But, like, he's not – he doesn't feel like Garfield.

[56:47] But if you put those weasels in Barry Lyndon, oh, man.

[56:49] Oh, my God.

[56:50] It would be so much fun.

[56:53] OK, so, yeah, this is a bad, bad movie.

[56:55] And I don't know, like, it just feels so emblematic of a of like an industry that is built around like cut and paste style stories and just like churning out garbage.

[57:09] That's what it felt like, not to be too cruel to the people making it.

[57:14] No, yeah, no churning out garbage.

[57:17] I think that sounded very, very constructive.

[57:19] I feel like the people who worked on it, I feel like there is most likely an executive department that is more to blame than the people who worked on it.

[57:27] Oh, almost certainly.

[57:28] So I will – I'm also going to call this a bad, bad movie.

[57:31] You know, like Dan's saying, it's not offensive.

[57:34] I don't love – like there's not that much of like here's a joke for the grownups, wink, wink, in it.

[57:41] Yeah, yeah.

[57:42] It just – it feels like a misreading of what the things that people like about Garfield the character are.

[57:48] Now, I could be wrong.

[57:48] Again, the movie made – according to Wikipedia, it made $250 million to the box office.

[57:54] What?

[57:54] $60 million budget.

[57:55] So it did okay.

[57:57] There were no other kids' movies that same weekend I would imagine.

[58:00] Probably.

[58:00] But judging also by my – so like my older son, he was with us when he was little when we did the Boss Baby family business movie.

[58:09] He really enjoyed that.

[58:11] My younger son really enjoys that movie.

[58:12] I don't love it, but they really enjoyed it.

[58:14] This one, watching with my younger son, he just was not that into it.

[58:17] It was not that entertaining to him.

[58:18] It was not that funny to him.

[58:19] So I could almost buy it on the level of it's not for me, but a kid would like it if I saw a kid liking it, that it feels like it didn't reach that bar either.

[58:28] And so, again, it's not so offensively bad that I'm like, ugh, ugh, ugh, but it just – it fails to justify its existence in a way other than that there's money to be had in Garfield.

[58:41] So next time, Hollywood, when you do a Garfield movie, maybe just try to make it more Garfield-y.

[58:46] Like, he doesn't need a big backstory.

[58:48] Don't need big action stakes.

[58:50] Paul Giamatti would be a great Garfield.

[58:52] Paul Giamatti would be a great Garfield.

[58:54] Don't animate him.

[58:56] Put him in a cat suit.

[58:57] Who would fucking do that shit?

[58:58] Live action Paul Giamatti Garfield.

[59:01] It's right on the shelf there with the Wallace Shawn Ziggy that they should have made.

[59:04] Like, Paul Giamatti would be a great Garfield.

[59:06] Yeah.

[59:07] Hi, everybody.

[59:14] It's Ellen Weatherford.

[59:15] And Christian Weatherford.

[59:17] People say not to judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree.

[59:20] But we can judge a snake by its ability to fly, or a spider by its ability to dive.

[59:25] Or a dung beetle by its ability to navigate with the starlight of the Milky Way galaxy.

[59:31] On Just the Zoo of Us, we rate our favorite animals out of 10 in the categories of physical effectiveness, behavioral ingenuity, and of course, aesthetics.

[59:39] Guest experts like biologists, ecologists, musicians, comedians, and more join us to share their unique insights into the animal kingdom.

[59:47] Listen with the whole family on MaximumFun.org or wherever you get your podcasts.

[59:52] The wizards answer eight by eight.

[59:58] The cornclaves call to demonstrate their arcane gift, their single spell.

[1:00:06] They number sixty-four until a conflagration.

[1:00:13] Sixty-three and sixty-two they soon shall be

[1:00:19] as one by one the wizards die

[1:00:23] till one remains to reign on high.

[1:00:29] Join us for Taz Royale,

[1:00:31] an Oops! All Wizards Battle Royale season of The Adventure Zone

[1:00:35] every other Thursday on MaximumFun.org

[1:00:38] or wherever you get your podcasts.

[1:00:40] Hey, this podcast is brought to you overwhelmingly

[1:00:45] by the support of listeners like you

[1:00:48] who are members at MaximumFun.org.

[1:00:51] But we do also have a sponsor this week,

[1:00:53] and it is Squarespace.

[1:00:55] You know, maybe you want a website.

[1:00:58] Maybe, like, Garfield without Garfield has already been done.

[1:01:01] But maybe Garfield with extra Garfield.

[1:01:03] Like just stick a ton of more Garfields in the strips.

[1:01:07] You could do that with Squarespace, which gives you everything you need to offer services and get paid all in one place.

[1:01:14] Now, I don't know how you're going to get paid from this extra Garfield situation, especially because that's IP.

[1:01:19] It's not owned by you.

[1:01:20] You'll get sued.

[1:01:20] Yeah, yeah.

[1:01:21] No, but you could find – you can think of an idea that's almost as good as that.

[1:01:25] Like a pizzeria restaurant that's Garfield-themed?

[1:01:27] Again, that was shut down for copyright reasons.

[1:01:32] But you can get paid on time with professional on-brand invoices and online payments.

[1:01:36] You can streamline your workflow with stuff like appointment scheduling built right in and email marketing tools.

[1:01:42] And also, you don't have to know how to design something.

[1:01:46] You can be as lazy as Garfield because Squarespace also offers a complete library of professionally designed, award-winning website templates with options for every category and use.

[1:02:00] Drag and drop editing, styling options, visual design effects, no experience required.

[1:02:05] So head to squarespace.com slash flop for a free trial.

[1:02:10] And when you're ready to launch, use offer code flop to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

[1:02:17] Elliot, you do a lot of stuff.

[1:02:19] I bet there's something you want to mention.

[1:02:20] Oh, on Squarespace?

[1:02:22] Well, just your own personal plug.

[1:02:24] Oh, just the stuff that I do.

[1:02:25] Yeah, I'll just plug the same stuff I've been plugging, you know.

[1:02:28] There's a picture book I have out now called Sadie Mouse Wrecks the House.

[1:02:31] It's a fun romp for kids of all ages.

[1:02:33] And if you like that one, maybe you'll like to try one of my other picture books that have been out for a little bit, Horse Meets Dog or Sharko and Hippo.

[1:02:40] But Sadie Mouse Wrecks the House is a new one.

[1:02:42] Also, I still have Harley Quinn coming out from DC Comics every month.

[1:02:46] I've been enjoying writing that.

[1:02:47] I just handed in a script for what's going to be the 200th issue of all – if you combined all of Harley Quinn's series together.

[1:02:56] And it made me realize that this is already the longest run I've got to do on a series.

[1:03:01] And if you keep buying them, I'll just be able to keep doing them.

[1:03:04] So I'm excited to be on a book for a fair amount of time.

[1:03:07] And I also have another book coming out in November, but I'll talk more about that later in the year.

[1:03:11] Stuart, what about you?

[1:03:13] What do you have to say?

[1:03:14] Well, I'll always promote my three bars here in Brooklyn, New York.

[1:03:18] That's Hinterlands Bar, Minnie's Bar, and now Commonwealth Bar.

[1:03:21] And also, if you are interested in kind of like hanging out chill zone style,

[1:03:27] I do a regular weekly painting stream on Twitch, usually at 1 o'clock p.m. New York time,

[1:03:34] where I just hang out on Twitch and I paint little Warhammer guys and I yap for a while

[1:03:40] and I answer questions in the chat and it's a nice, fun, chill afternoon.

[1:03:44] And my Twitch name is Stuart Wellington.

[1:03:49] Easy to remember.

[1:03:50] Sometimes I'll throw that on just so I can hear Stuart's – my friend Stuart's voice.

[1:03:54] Yeah, it's nice.

[1:03:55] Being like, and Dan did this.

[1:03:56] And I was like, what?

[1:03:57] And I'm sure, Dan, you also throw on my other podcast, Smartless Presents Clueless, to hear my voice, right?

[1:04:03] Yeah, sure.

[1:04:05] Yeah, Smartless Presents Clueless, my puzzle podcast that I host and Sean Hayes is the star of.

[1:04:08] That's right, Sean Hayes from Will & Grace and Smartless.

[1:04:11] And the episodes are only about 12 to 15 minutes long and it comes out twice a week, although I think we're going to a once-a-week schedule.

[1:04:17] Check out that one too.

[1:04:19] If you like puzzle podcasts.

[1:04:20] Guys, I need to have something else going on.

[1:04:23] You do.

[1:04:24] We've told you that.

[1:04:24] I mean, it's not like I'm not trying, but maybe we can figure something out.

[1:04:28] Maybe we can brainstorm.

[1:04:29] I mean, maybe use Squarespace to make a website where you just insert those weasels into all the different movies.

[1:04:33] Oh, extra weasel stuff.

[1:04:35] I think you should do a series of cooking videos on TikTok.

[1:04:38] Yeah, I think you should do those.

[1:04:40] That's the route to success for me, I'm sure.

[1:04:44] I mean, it's either that or videos where you eat ice cream out of a toilet and people don't realize it's a joke and they get really mad about it online.

[1:04:50] There's gold to be had in that toilet.

[1:04:53] I mean, it's a very popular genre of video.

[1:04:57] How did I cut off the names of these people who sent us letters?

[1:05:06] I mean, usually we just say the first name.

[1:05:08] No, I know, but I...

[1:05:12] Did Cher send in a letter so you don't know how to say last name with help because there's no last name?

[1:05:16] No, I just, when I cut and pasted this, this time around, I somehow did not get the names in here.

[1:05:24] What's going on, guys?

[1:05:25] What's going on with my brain?

[1:05:26] What happened to it?

[1:05:27] Oh, boy.

[1:05:28] That's the side text that Elliot and I have.

[1:05:31] Okay, well, maybe you can let me in on what conclusions you've come to.

[1:05:37] So far, it's just been a lot of question marks, yeah.

[1:05:39] Oh, I apologize.

[1:05:41] And shrug emojis.

[1:05:42] I apologize very much to people who are not going to get their proper credit.

[1:05:48] So this first letter is from question mark.

[1:05:52] Question mark, question mark.

[1:05:53] If this is you, feel free to give us a zero star review.

[1:05:57] Question mark.

[1:05:58] Hi, floppers.

[1:06:00] I'm a faithful flop listener since 2014.

[1:06:03] And as a Parisian resident, I was so excited when I saw your Under Paris episode drop into my feed.

[1:06:12] At one point, you're all wondering...

[1:06:15] What did we get wrong about Paris?

[1:06:17] No, no, no.

[1:06:18] At one point, you're all wondering if Jaws ever got released in France.

[1:06:21] And Stuart posited that it was called Le Jaws.

[1:06:24] It's actually known as Dantes de la Mer, which you could translate literally as the teeth of the sea.

[1:06:31] Pretty cool.

[1:06:32] Anyway, the real mayor of Paris, Anne Hidalgo, took a swim in the Seine to prove to everyone

[1:06:40] that the river is swimmable

[1:06:42] as it would be the site

[1:06:43] of the triathlon

[1:06:43] for the upcoming

[1:06:44] Olympic and Paralympic Games.

[1:06:46] Afterward,

[1:06:47] a newspaper ran a picture

[1:06:49] with her coming out of the water

[1:06:50] with a particularly toothy smile

[1:06:52] on her face.

[1:06:52] The headline read,

[1:06:54] Les Dents de la Mer,

[1:06:56] spelled M-A-I-R-E,

[1:06:59] meaning mayor.

[1:07:00] So...

[1:07:02] Damn.

[1:07:02] Question.

[1:07:03] Got it.

[1:07:04] What's the best or worst pun

[1:07:07] you've ever seen

[1:07:07] from a movie critic

[1:07:08] about a movie they've seen

[1:07:10] or do you have any punny headlines

[1:07:12] for any of your Flophouse movies?

[1:07:14] Let me pull my saved Gene Shalit headlines.

[1:07:15] Thanks for a decade of great content here.

[1:07:20] Well, there's more too at this point.

[1:07:21] Here's to 10 more come to Paris.

[1:07:25] We should do a show in Paris.

[1:07:27] Yeah.

[1:07:27] Yeah, what's stopping us?

[1:07:29] I have to start finding venues in Paris

[1:07:33] to reach out to you.

[1:07:34] If any venue in Paris would like to pay our travel fees

[1:07:37] and have us come over,

[1:07:38] we'll be happy to do it.

[1:07:39] Do a show in the catacombs.

[1:07:40] Yeah, that'd be super cool.

[1:07:42] I don't know that I have actually an answer to this,

[1:07:46] but this was pretty...

[1:07:47] I'm a sucker for all pun-related news or reviews.

[1:07:53] So, do you remember any?

[1:07:57] No.

[1:07:57] I'm an idiot.

[1:07:58] Of course not.

[1:07:59] I also...

[1:08:00] Yeah, I'm also having trouble remembering ones.

[1:08:01] I kind of assumed you guys would be all over this shit

[1:08:03] because you're like pun maniacs.

[1:08:05] I think the one that sticks with me the most...

[1:08:08] I feel like your eulogies are going to be filled with puns.

[1:08:11] Probably, yeah.

[1:08:12] I mean, we're not giving our own eulogies,

[1:08:14] but I'm giving Dan's and Dan's giving mine.

[1:08:17] Yeah, yeah.

[1:08:18] Yeah, we'll swap eulogies.

[1:08:19] Criss-cross.

[1:08:20] Criss-cross.

[1:08:22] No motives.

[1:08:23] They can't catch whose eulogy is whose.

[1:08:25] I remember when I was a kid,

[1:08:28] and I was a huge fan of those Ninja Turtles.

[1:08:29] I really loved them.

[1:08:30] The Ninja Turtles movie came out,

[1:08:32] and I cut out one of the newspaper ads

[1:08:35] because back in the old days, kids,

[1:08:36] if you wanted to know when a movie was playing,

[1:08:38] You had to look in the listings in the newspaper and there'd be little ads.

[1:08:40] Next to Garfield.

[1:08:40] Yeah, next to Garfield.

[1:08:42] And there'd be little ads for each of the movies that would have quotes on them.

[1:08:46] And one of the quotes was from, I think, Joel Siegel for the Ninja Turtles movie.

[1:08:49] And I cut it out and it said, like, a shell of a good time.

[1:08:53] And as a kid, I, like, didn't quite get it.

[1:08:56] So was he saying it was negatively?

[1:08:59] No, no, he's saying it's a hell of a good time.

[1:09:01] Okay, because, like, you know, the pun, like, it seems like a shell of a good time

[1:09:06] would mean like it's a husk of a good time yeah yeah but that's not what he was i don't think

[1:09:10] anyone was thinking that deeply about it yeah that was the one that that's the one that sticks

[1:09:13] in my mind the most just because i think i had it on my room and my on the wall of my room when i

[1:09:16] was a kid you know well that works did you learn the whole ninja rap when you were a kid or no

[1:09:21] no i did not learn the whole ninja rap by that by that point i think i was no longer

[1:09:25] such i mean i did go see it in the theaters multiple times with your grandma yeah i made

[1:09:29] her go to see it when i wanted to see it a third time i think but uh i did not memorize i even

[1:09:34] even by the time the ninja rap came on i was like uh this is not what i come to the ninja turtles

[1:09:38] for sure is vanilla ice rapping this song now i love it though yeah come to this place for ninja

[1:09:44] turtles uh-huh yeah yeah somehow raps about ninjas feel good in a place like this um okay well again

[1:09:52] apologies this is from question mark and i just want to mention again this is not a matter of

[1:09:58] editorial control this is not because we don't want to say your names this is merely that dan

[1:10:02] made a mistake.

[1:10:03] Yeah, and I could not find...

[1:10:05] I did make an effort

[1:10:07] to try and find

[1:10:07] the unedited emails.

[1:10:09] Afterwards, he's going to have to...

[1:10:11] Well, we're taping right now.

[1:10:13] He sort of wanted

[1:10:14] to keep us moving.

[1:10:15] Does that last one

[1:10:16] seem like there was

[1:10:17] very specific French words

[1:10:18] you could have searched for

[1:10:19] and not a lot of emails

[1:10:20] would have come up?

[1:10:21] Yeah, after this,

[1:10:22] he's going to have to put on

[1:10:23] the Flophouse official hair shirt.

[1:10:25] Yeah, right in, guys.

[1:10:29] What's that thing

[1:10:30] where you have to sit on the...

[1:10:31] on a pole in the desert yeah or like and they put weights on your ankles oh that's a different thing

[1:10:37] if these emails are from you um please uh write in and this is a good time for someone to buy it

[1:10:42] later someone could get some stolen valor write in and say it was their email and really it wasn't

[1:10:47] yeah i've wanted to write in forever as your podcast was one of my saving graces when i was

[1:10:51] getting chemo for hodgkin's disease in my late 20s and again when i required mental health services

[1:10:56] It truly helped me through some trying times, and I wanted to thank you for years.

[1:11:00] I really appreciate that we could be there for you.

[1:11:03] I hope you're feeling better now, and I just wish you had a name that we could know about.

[1:11:08] It's just too bad your identity is lost to history.

[1:11:11] Unfortunately.

[1:11:13] Obviously, we played a very meaningful part in your life, and that means a lot to me.

[1:11:18] It really makes my heart swell, and I just wish that Dan felt the same amount of importance towards you

[1:11:23] and could even remember to put your name in.

[1:11:25] uh-huh uh i'm really uh now he's now he's he's spiraling dude no i can't find it i mean here's

[1:11:36] here's the real reason i like i we have so much mail in the inbox that i need to clear it out and

[1:11:42] once i do a letter it gets deleted so that's i thought maybe it'd be safe whoever you are i can't

[1:11:49] wait to hear the rest of your letter and i and thank you very much for listening to us during

[1:11:53] those times i'm glad that we could help you through them yeah uh i guess it was i just wish

[1:11:59] i just wish that we really would ever find who this person was i appreciated hearing this so

[1:12:04] much and i i feel so bad anyway unfortunately i felt that i needed to tie that into these thanks

[1:12:11] into a real question which i could never come up with i finally got it roy scheider or more

[1:12:18] precisely, Scheider had an epic

[1:12:20] run in the 90s. More precisely,

[1:12:21] Shoy Rider, his mirror name.

[1:12:23] Scheider

[1:12:26] had an epic run

[1:12:28] in the 70s with Clute, The Seven

[1:12:30] Ups, The French Connection,

[1:12:32] The Marathon Man,

[1:12:33] or just Marathon Man, Jaws,

[1:12:36] Sorcerer, and all that jazz.

[1:12:38] Perhaps my favorite film.

[1:12:39] I don't feel that he's ever really gotten his

[1:12:42] due for that. Do you, folks?

[1:12:44] Can you think of any other actors or

[1:12:46] actresses with so much greatness and so little recognition i actually uh just recently watched

[1:12:52] the seven ups for the first time and uh saw the uh amazing car chase sequence yeah in that thing

[1:13:00] like i i think i liked it more than like the famous like bullet and french connection ones

[1:13:06] actually uh and i had the same thought i was like oh roy scheider was on fire for like a very like

[1:13:12] this like span of time

[1:13:14] and I don't think

[1:13:15] he's like talked about.

[1:13:16] I can see

[1:13:17] in your eyes,

[1:13:18] Elliot,

[1:13:18] you're imagining

[1:13:19] Roy Scheider

[1:13:20] literally being on fire.

[1:13:21] Well,

[1:13:21] just if I said it right.

[1:13:22] I just remember

[1:13:23] when they put him

[1:13:24] in NBA Jam.

[1:13:24] Yeah,

[1:13:28] Roy Scheider

[1:13:28] in turbo mode

[1:13:29] was on fire,

[1:13:30] yeah.

[1:13:30] Yeah,

[1:13:31] he's crazy.

[1:13:31] But I had the same thought.

[1:13:33] Like,

[1:13:34] he isn't really talked

[1:13:35] about the same way.

[1:13:36] I was literally

[1:13:38] just talking to

[1:13:38] one of my bar regulars

[1:13:39] today.

[1:13:40] He was,

[1:13:41] I think he was

[1:13:42] either a camera operator or a PA on something with Roy Scheider. And he was, he was talking

[1:13:48] about how Roy Scheider was very professional and like, he was very calm. Like he was a very still

[1:13:54] guy on set until the, you know, action rolled. He was, uh, my, my regular was really impressed

[1:14:00] working with him. I mean, I think it's a, there's a, I think what it speaks to partly is how many

[1:14:08] movies used to get made and how many different kinds of movies and the different kinds of people

[1:14:11] who could be movie stars.

[1:14:13] Not that Roy Scheider is not,

[1:14:14] he's a handsome white man

[1:14:16] who does adventure movies a lot of the time.

[1:14:17] Like, it's not like he's that,

[1:14:18] breaking the mold that much,

[1:14:19] but that you had so many movies,

[1:14:21] like, can you imagine,

[1:14:22] like, I don't have someone in particular

[1:14:27] who comes to mind

[1:14:28] that answers the question exactly,

[1:14:30] you know, because there are a number of actors

[1:14:32] who had a great run

[1:14:32] and I feel like as they get

[1:14:34] towards the end of their lives,

[1:14:35] they start to get a little more recognition.

[1:14:37] You know, like, I feel like,

[1:14:39] like people didn't talk about

[1:14:41] gene hackman for a while and then he passed and then suddenly it was people were talking about

[1:14:45] what an amazing actor he was in his run of movies but like the uh something you hear a lot is maybe

[1:14:51] not as much as he used to was can you believe that elliot gould used to be a like a star who

[1:14:55] would carry movies this guy and you watch those movies and you're like yeah i can believe it he's

[1:14:59] amazing he's an amazing actor he's got amazing charisma like he has a great run of movies so i

[1:15:03] can't believe it he's just you know he's just the dad of ross and uh monica i mean that's his that's

[1:15:10] surely his crowning achievement yeah i mean here's the thing but that's specifically about like

[1:15:14] let's be clear elliot gould is a is a handsome man with like a lot of charisma but yeah he's

[1:15:20] handsome in a very like specific like kind of goofier way that i think people are talking about

[1:15:25] like now like big movie stars have to be beautiful like leading men music movie stars no but beautiful

[1:15:32] but there's a um i don't know not always but uh not always no but i think that that's what people

[1:15:37] are saying they're not like can you believe this guy this this no but it's never a hunk of no but

[1:15:43] it's never or like they'll say the same thing about like donald sutherland who also you know

[1:15:46] passed relatively recently where it's like instead of saying it's i feel like it often gets said and

[1:15:51] it's a different point than the question is making instead of saying oh man things were so much the

[1:15:55] variety of movies we had when these guys were were big movie stars instead it comes off as like can

[1:16:01] you believe there was a time when people would settle for donald sutherland or elliot gould when

[1:16:05] they could have had a harrison ford like come on guys when it's which is i think is not the right

[1:16:11] way to look at it but it's there's a i mean that's the nature of you could say it's the nature of

[1:16:15] fame you know it's you know it's the it's the bitch goddess it's it uh it gives you it gives

[1:16:20] and then it takes away and you can't guarantee you're gonna be around forever well it was like

[1:16:24] there was a uh during the third season of the white lotus there is some discourse some weird

[1:16:29] discourse on the internet about dudes being like walton you think walton goggins is a sex symbol

[1:16:34] i'm like yeah dude look at that guy yeah i mean well i think that also just straight men being

[1:16:43] straight men like can't wrap their heads around the idea of like charisma not just being like oh

[1:16:49] this is the handsomest man this is the most clearly handsome man i mean like he's a handsome

[1:16:53] guy i'm not saying that he isn't but like there's something interesting about him in the same way

[1:16:59] that like you know i don't i think it's obvious for us like you're not just attracted to like the

[1:17:06] most obviously beautiful person you're there's someone who's interesting yeah it's like when i

[1:17:11] was watching the other day when i was watching fatal beauty directed by uh tom holland uh friend

[1:17:17] of the show tom holland and sam elliott gives uh spider-man himself yeah uh whoopi goldberg and uh

[1:17:24] Sam Elliott plays the, like, love interest,

[1:17:26] and Sam Elliott is so fucking hot in this movie.

[1:17:30] He really is.

[1:17:31] It's like...

[1:17:31] Well, but that's the thing.

[1:17:32] Sam Elliott is hot.

[1:17:33] I mean, that's the, like...

[1:17:34] But, like, it's more than just him being a track,

[1:17:36] like, being, like, good-looking.

[1:17:38] He just, like, he sells this shit so well.

[1:17:41] Like, he's got so much fucking charm.

[1:17:42] There's just, yeah, this warmth that oozes.

[1:17:44] It's like oozing out of my fucking laptop screen.

[1:17:47] Okay, well, sorry again about the names.

[1:17:53] Please write in.

[1:17:54] but now we'll move on.

[1:17:56] Sorry about not really answering that last question,

[1:17:57] but it's okay.

[1:17:58] You know, we talked about something.

[1:17:59] Yeah.

[1:17:59] I got to talk about Sam Elliott being super hot.

[1:18:03] As our friends at Jordan and Jesse go say,

[1:18:05] what is a podcast if not saying words?

[1:18:08] And we certainly did that.

[1:18:09] Yeah.

[1:18:10] But let's recommend some movies,

[1:18:13] movies that maybe would be a better use of your time.

[1:18:16] Hey, I have an animated movie to recommend.

[1:18:18] I actually highlighted this in...

[1:18:22] Legend of the Overfiend.

[1:18:24] I mentioned this in Flop Secrets.

[1:18:26] Dan's like, I saw something that I just found.

[1:18:30] It just felt like it was really saying something to me about the human condition.

[1:18:33] It's called Ninja Scroll.

[1:18:34] I want to recommend a movie by legendary animator Richard Williams, The Thief and the Cobbler.

[1:18:46] I watched the recobbled cut.

[1:18:48] I had seen huge, huge chunks of this before, but I don't think I'd ever sat down and watched it.

[1:18:54] you know, all the way through.

[1:18:55] And part of that's because,

[1:18:56] so this was a project that he worked on

[1:19:00] for decades and decades.

[1:19:01] And it originally was released in a chopped up version

[1:19:05] that he did not like at all by Miramax.

[1:19:09] It was like taken away from him.

[1:19:10] And then there was this recobbled cut,

[1:19:13] which is fan cut, putting together, you know,

[1:19:18] the best elements that exist to get it closer

[1:19:22] to what williams intended and when i say best elements like you know some of it is literally

[1:19:27] just like animatics or sketches um but what exists is uh astounding still it is like he was

[1:19:37] a genius animator and um it doesn't really work that well as a narrative but as a work of

[1:19:44] visual beauty and animation skill it's amazing so that's what i'm recommending i'm recommending

[1:19:51] a movie by one rowdy harrington 1988's jack's back this is the movie before roadhouse and i

[1:20:01] would say it is not as good as roadhouse i'm not going to go out there and make crazy claims

[1:20:06] but this is a movie uh set in los angeles uh where there is a serial killer going around

[1:20:13] on the hundred year anniversary of the jack the ripper crimes committing mirror crimes but in

[1:20:20] los angeles which is weird they the movie kind of abandons that part of the premise about halfway

[1:20:27] through uh james spader is in it and he's you know james spadering it up there are uh there's

[1:20:33] a surprise twins reveal not the movie twins but characters that are twins it is they don't

[1:20:38] surprise they don't reveal that they're actually in the movie twins it is a wet i mean maybe it's

[1:20:43] it's a wild ride uh the weasels show up the weasels i think they do i'd have to go frame by frame

[1:20:50] I will point out that Robert Picardo is in it, playing like a psychologist.

[1:20:56] And, man, there's somebody else that was in it that was really great.

[1:21:00] Everyone's favorite Gremlin love object.

[1:21:02] Oh, yeah, Chris Mulkey's in it.

[1:21:04] Oh, man.

[1:21:04] Yeah, two thumbs up.

[1:21:06] Yeah, exactly.

[1:21:07] Mr. Greta Gremlin himself, Robert Picardo.

[1:21:09] So what I would say is it's not Roadhouse, but it's still a fun time at the movies.

[1:21:15] Go check out Jack's Back.

[1:21:16] I'm going to recommend another fun time at the movies.

[1:21:19] This is a Japanese movie from 1963 called An Actor's Revenge directed by Kan Ichikawa.

[1:21:25] This is one I've been looking forward to seeing for a long time and had never gotten around to it.

[1:21:28] And I finally watched it, and it's super fun.

[1:21:31] It's set in 19th century Japan or maybe it's early – no, I think it's late 19th century Japan.

[1:21:36] And the main character is an actor who specializes in female roles and always has kind of like a feminine kind of like carriage to him, carries himself as a woman most of the time.

[1:21:48] But secretly, despite being an acclaimed actor, he is also on a mission of vengeance against the three men who ruined his father and drove his father and mother to insanity and death.

[1:22:00] And so he is now in the town where these three men are, and he's going to use all of his wiles and cunning in order to bring them to an end.

[1:22:08] And there's also a bunch of different – there's a bunch of different thieves running around who all have different gimmicks and are very fun.

[1:22:14] Elliot, you have sold this movie so hard.

[1:22:17] It's great, and it looks beautiful.

[1:22:20] It's this 60s color.

[1:22:21] It's very non-naturalistic.

[1:22:23] It's very kind of expressive, and it's a super fun movie,

[1:22:28] but it also has a serious message about the emptiness of spending your life

[1:22:33] seeking vengeance against people.

[1:22:35] So that's An Actor's Revenge.

[1:22:36] I really enjoyed it.

[1:22:37] I highly recommend it.

[1:22:38] Well, that's been it.

[1:22:41] Another episode of The Flophouse, that is.

[1:22:43] It's time to unroll that anchovy can and climb into it

[1:22:47] and put on our little acorn caps.

[1:22:49] We're also tiny.

[1:22:52] Yeah, we use a dust bunny as a stuffy, yeah.

[1:22:55] If you enjoy this podcast, why not check out MaximumFun.org

[1:23:00] where there's a ton of other great podcasts on our same network.

[1:23:04] Thanks to them for supporting us.

[1:23:08] Thanks to you for supporting us.

[1:23:09] Thanks to our producer, Alex, for supporting us by editing the thing and making it sound good.

[1:23:16] He goes by HowlDotty on the internet.

[1:23:18] Yeah.

[1:23:19] But for The Flophouse, I've been Dan McCoy.

[1:23:21] I'm Stuart Wellington.

[1:23:23] And I'm Elliot Kalin.

[1:23:25] And we are The Flophouse.

[1:23:28] And I'm Elliot Kalin.

[1:23:29] And I'm Stuart Wellington.

[1:23:31] And I'm Dan McCoy.

[1:23:32] Produced by Alex Smith.

[1:23:35] On Maximum Fun, oodles of casts for your noodle.

[1:23:38] Bye.

[1:23:39] let's fucking grip it and rip it baby

[1:23:49] let's grip that and then also let's rip that

[1:23:51] let's both grip and rip but first let me

[1:23:53] say to you

[1:23:54] one, two, three

[1:23:57] we gripped it

[1:23:59] and it was ripped

[1:24:00] those three numbers were gripped and ripped

[1:24:03] let's kick some tires, light some fires

[1:24:05] um

[1:24:06] sure I guess

[1:24:07] uh and here we go it starts like this maximum fun a worker-owned network of artists owned shows

[1:24:18] supported directly by you

Ep.#454 - The Garfield Movie

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