Ep. #253 - The Snowman

Dan McCoy

[0:00] On this episode, we discuss The Snowman.

Elliott Kalan

[0:03] The worst Marvel movie yet.

Stuart Wellington

[0:30] Hey, everyone, and welcome to The Flophouse. I'm Dan McCoy.

[0:35] Hey, great energy, Dan. I'm Stuart Wellington.

Elliott Kalan

[0:38] Stuart, I like those compliments you're giving to Dan. I'm Elliot Kalin.

Dan McCoy

[0:42] Oh, thanks. I mean, thanks to Stuart, I guess.

[0:45] And thanks to Elliot for the compliment.

[0:47] Yeah, and you're welcome to everyone.

Elliott Kalan

[0:48] This is a positivity podcast where we try to be supportive of each other and just kind of generally, you know, complimentary.

[0:56] So, guys, you're doing great. Everything's wonderful.

Dan McCoy

[0:59] I got to say, this podcast has been a total failure on my end.

Stuart Wellington

[1:04] Hey, Elliot, you're doing pretty good at manipulating the Skype on your phone slash computer today.

Elliott Kalan

[1:12] Thank you.

[1:13] Is that another compliment?

[1:15] And I don't know if that's sarcastic or not.

[1:18] And Dan, you have a beard.

Dan McCoy

[1:21] Thanks.

[1:22] I mean, it's more of an observation than a compliment, but I appreciate it nonetheless.

Elliott Kalan

[1:26] Guys, I think today's...

[1:27] I wanted to let you put your own spin on it.

Stuart Wellington

[1:29] Today's a good time for me to talk about a problem I have, which is me, like millions of Americans, suffers from always sounding sarcastic syndrome.

[1:39] Oh, okay.

[1:41] David Taylor syndrome, it's called.

[1:43] Yeah.

[1:43] I can't say something nice without sounding like I'm being an asshole.

[1:49] And I don't know what to do about it.

[1:51] Probably not host a podcast dragging bad movies.

[1:58] Here's what I like to do.

Elliott Kalan

[2:00] What I like to do is I put my fingers up and I do kind of quote marks around what I'm saying because it's like nothing's more sincere than when you quote someone to show them that you respect what they say.

[2:12] So when I give someone a compliment, I put quote marks around it with my fingers so that they know I'm being sincere.

Dan McCoy

[2:18] Oh, okay.

[2:19] Who are you quoting when you're complimenting them?

[2:22] Myself.

[2:23] Okay.

[2:24] All right.

[2:24] Well, that checks out, I guess.

[2:27] So I guess this is a bad movie podcast.

[2:30] Yep.

[2:31] That's what people tell me.

[2:32] What does that mean?

Elliott Kalan

[2:33] How does that work?

[2:34] How does a bad movie podcast?

[2:34] Do we make a bad movie every episode?

Dan McCoy

[2:38] Yes, and we are way in the hole.

[2:40] We have spent so much money.

[2:43] I've had to mortgage my house that I don't have.

[2:45] It's weird.

[2:46] Oh, boy.

[2:48] No, but we watch a bad movie and then we talk about it.

[2:52] That's the way it works.

Elliott Kalan

[2:52] So let me get this straight.

[2:53] So it's a two-step process.

[2:55] Uh-huh.

[2:56] Yeah.

[2:57] Okay.

[2:57] So the first step, watching.

[2:59] We watch the bad movie.

[3:01] What's the second step?

[3:03] I like to watch, Elliot.

Stuart Wellington

[3:06] Now Dan's doing a weird bit in the middle of the other dumb bit.

Elliott Kalan

[3:10] Yeah.

[3:11] So, Dan, I started a dumb bit that was just about wasting time.

[3:14] And then you started a creepy bit that was about creeping me out.

[3:16] And you succeeded.

[3:18] That's gross and weird.

Stuart Wellington

[3:19] Yeah.

[3:20] All right.

[3:21] Well.

[3:21] See, that's the great thing about recording a show remotely is that when Dan does a creepy

[3:25] bit, Elliot has a moment where he's like, is there something to be lost in translation

[3:29] by not being in the room?

[3:30] Yeah.

[3:31] Is that not actually creepy?

Dan McCoy

[3:33] No, I tried to make a creepy face at Elliot.

[3:36] Case at Elliot.

[3:36] But it's hard to do it over the little Skype camera.

[3:39] Mm-hmm.

Elliott Kalan

[3:40] Yeah.

[3:40] And also, I had a moment where I was like, oh, thank goodness I'm not in that room with

[3:43] Creepo Dan McCoy being a creepy creep.

Stuart Wellington

[3:46] Mm-hmm.

[3:47] So this is a compliment podcast.

Elliott Kalan

[3:50] Yeah, where we try to keep the positivity up.

[3:52] So, Dan, keep creeping.

[3:54] You're the number one creep.

[3:55] You're doing great.

[3:55] Mm-hmm.

Dan McCoy

[3:56] Thanks.

[3:57] So this episode, we watched a little movie called The Snowman.

Stuart Wellington

[4:02] Talk about creepy, right, guys?

[4:04] Mm-hmm.

[4:04] The Greatest Snowman starring Hugh Jackman.

Elliott Kalan

[4:09] It was Jack Frost starring Michael Keaton as a dead jazz musician who comes back as a snowman,

[4:15] terrifying his child, right?

[4:17] And then that snowman attacks a woman in a shower.

Stuart Wellington

[4:20] Yeah.

[4:21] That's the other one.

[4:22] His name was Shannon Elizabeth.

[4:24] And now you know the rest of the story.

[4:26] Which, wait, which one had a lentricular cover where when you change it, the snowman's face

[4:31] gets scary?

Elliott Kalan

[4:32] That was the horror one.

[4:33] The frost.

[4:33] Yeah.

[4:34] Had the lentricular cover because it tricked you into watching the movie.

[4:38] What is it?

[4:39] Lenticular?

[4:40] I don't give a fuck.

[4:41] It should be tricular.

[4:42] Lenticular because it tickles you with enjoyment.

[4:46] That's a good-

[4:47] You turn it and you see the image change.

[4:48] You're like, that tickles me.

Stuart Wellington

[4:50] That's a good mnemonic device.

[4:51] Jesus' eyes follow you around the room.

Elliott Kalan

[4:55] Stuart, did you say that's a good umami device?

Stuart Wellington

[4:59] Maybe.

[5:00] Now, the snowman.

[5:03] Guys, he gave us all the clues.

[5:05] We knew it was going to be a bad movie.

[5:07] Why'd we watch it?

[5:08] Mr. Police.

[5:09] Yeah, why'd we watch it, Dan?

Elliott Kalan

[5:10] So, this is-

[5:13] Dan, what drew you to this?

[5:14] Because I know you really wanted to watch it, right?

Dan McCoy

[5:17] I did really want to watch it.

[5:18] I mean, part of it was curiosity because I've read the book.

[5:24] I've read a number of the books starring Harry Hole, or is it pronounced?

[5:29] In the original language, Harry Hula.

[5:32] So, it's not a gross pun.

[5:33] That's even sillier.

Elliott Kalan

[5:35] I thought the name Harry Hole couldn't get sillier, but Harry Hula is even sillier.

Stuart Wellington

[5:39] The Great Harry Hole.

Dan McCoy

[5:45] Yeah, well, yeah.

[5:48] So, Mr. Genitals, or Mr. Asshole, or whatever he is.

Elliott Kalan

[5:53] So, Dan, Dan-

[5:55] We're going to have to look into this Harry Hole.

Stuart Wellington

[5:58] Dan, did you-

[6:00] So, when you got into those books, would you say you fell down a Harry Rabbit Hole?

[6:06] Yes.

[6:06] I would say that.

Elliott Kalan

[6:08] Because I'm a fool.

[6:11] Now, these books are written by Joe Nesbo, which sounds like-

[6:15] It's like a Frank Zappa kid type name.

[6:18] But it's really just a Scandinavian guy, right?

[6:21] Dan?

[6:21] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[6:22] It's part of the wave of Scandinavian crime fiction that started with Girl with a Dragon Tattoo.

[6:29] Is that where it started?

[6:31] Well, I mean, that's where it got a foothold in America.

[6:33] I don't know about in Scandinavia itself.

Elliott Kalan

[6:37] And it continued on until Amy Schumer's Girl with the Back Tattoo.

Dan McCoy

[6:41] Yes.

[6:42] Lower back tattoo, Elliot.

[6:43] Lower back tattoo.

[6:44] I'm so sorry.

[6:46] And I was curious about this movie, because there's nothing in the rule book that says that this had to be a bad movie.

[6:52] I mean, it's based on a trashy book.

[6:57] Wait, wait, let me check.

Stuart Wellington

[6:59] Okay, yeah, you're right, Dan.

Dan McCoy

[7:00] The book was trashy, but it was entertaining and diverting.

[7:04] And, you know, it was a page turner.

[7:06] You got Thomas Alpherson directing it, who did Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy and Let the Right One In.

[7:13] Good movies.

[7:16] Thelma Schoonmaker was the editor, and she's Martin Scorsese's longtime editor.

[7:22] You got Michael Fassbender and Rebecca Ferguson in the main roles.

[7:26] And Charlotte Gainsbourg.

[7:28] Yeah, Charlotte Gainsbourg.

[7:29] You got J.K. Simmons.

[7:30] And Val Kilmer.

[7:31] And J.K. Simmons.

Elliott Kalan

[7:34] Yeah.

[7:34] Because everything about this movie was set up to be a number one hit success.

[7:38] Was it, Dan?

[7:38] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[7:39] No, it was widely panned.

[7:43] It was avoided by the public.

[7:46] And it launched a thousand memes because the Mr. Police, I gave you all the clues advertisement was very popular on the internet.

Elliott Kalan

[7:56] Very popular and inaccurate.

[7:59] It implies a game of cat and mouse between a policeman and a killer, which the movie does not bear out.

[8:04] Now keep in mind, and this is something I didn't realize until I started reading about it afterwards, that apparently their shooting schedule was too short and 10 to 15 percent of the screenplay was not shot.

[8:15] So I guess apparently they went into the editing room and they were like, wait a minute, we missed some stuff.

[8:21] So like, that's one of the reasons the movie makes no sense.

[8:24] And character, there's a, like, J.K. Simmons character, we'll get into it.

[8:29] I don't even know why he's in the movie.

[8:30] Like, there's a whole subplot that goes nowhere.

[8:33] And you know what?

[8:34] I don't need my subplots to go somewhere.

[8:36] I'm fine with that casino world in The Last Jedi.

[8:38] I enjoyed that.

[8:39] I don't need my subplots to be elegantly tied into the ending.

[8:42] But at least give me some reason for why this character is skulking around in an opera house looking at topless women.

[8:48] Dan?

Dan McCoy

[8:49] But I mean, he, I think the movie wanted to be a little sleazier, so it had to put a topless woman in there.

[8:56] I don't know.

Stuart Wellington

[8:57] I mean, but we can all agree that J.K. Simmons looks great in this movie.

[9:02] Oh, he's jacked.

[9:03] Like, he's jacked.

[9:04] You put him in that suit and you're like, J.K. looking like a snack.

[9:08] Am I right?

[9:09] Dan.

[9:11] Am I right?

[9:11] J.K.

Elliott Kalan

[9:12] His name means just keep doing what you're doing, J.K. Simmons.

[9:18] You're faster with an initials joke than me.

[9:21] Sorry.

[9:22] Well, that's why it's a tough life I leave because everyone's always trying to best me in quickness with initials jokes.

[9:28] And I just want to rest.

[9:30] I don't want to have to constantly defend my title.

[9:32] But every punk kid who wants to make a name for himself wanders into my one horse town, decides that he wants to show he's faster with an initials joke.

[9:40] And I've killed so many kids that way.

[9:42] Oh, terrible.

Stuart Wellington

[9:42] L.A. always has to sit with his back to the wall so that a kid doesn't run up and try and out-reference him.

[9:48] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[9:49] Yeah.

[9:50] Exactly.

[9:51] So should we get into the plot of this movie and eventually lead us to the one great thing in it, which is Val Kilmer's weirdly dubbed voice?

Dan McCoy

[9:59] Because I'd like to get to that point.

[10:00] Sure.

[10:01] Let's get into the plot that is so fucking twisty.

[10:04] I can't make heads or tails of it, and I read the book again.

Elliott Kalan

[10:08] It's like a mountain pass in a dark night.

[10:11] So did you read this book, The Snowman, starring this guy?

Dan McCoy

[10:14] Yes.

[10:15] It was the first book in the series that I read, and it hooked me on the series.

[10:19] So I obviously enjoyed it enough that I thought this might have the slight chance of being good.

[10:24] But we'll see what we all thought.

Stuart Wellington

[10:26] So the movie opens up like in fucking Norway, and it's all snowy and shit.

[10:33] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[10:34] What country is this actually in?

[10:34] That's exactly the case.

[10:35] Norway.

Stuart Wellington

[10:36] Is it Norway?

[10:36] Yeah.

[10:37] Norway.

[10:37] It's in Oslo.

[10:38] It's in Norway.

Elliott Kalan

[10:38] So we see this kid lives in an isolated house in the middle of the winter with his mom.

[10:45] And a guy who calls himself the kid's uncle comes by and tests him on facts of Norwegian history.

[10:52] And whenever the teen gets an answer wrong, the uncle hits the mom.

Stuart Wellington

[10:56] And she drops coffee beans all over the floor.

Elliott Kalan

[10:59] Yeah.

[11:00] That's what those are, right?

[11:01] No.

[11:02] Yeah.

[11:03] Okay.

[11:03] Yeah.

[11:03] No, I think either that or they're mouse pellets.

[11:06] Something.

[11:07] But the kid goes outside to make a snowman while the uncle, in quotes, not quoting anybody,

[11:14] this is to say that he's not really the uncle, and the mom have an illicit rendezvous.

[11:19] It turns out that guy is the mom's mistress and must be the kid's son.

[11:23] In fact, she says as much.

[11:24] But he wants nothing to do with that family.

[11:26] And he leaves.

[11:27] The mom takes the teen, drives him onto an ice lake, and then he gets out of the car, but

[11:32] she won't.

[11:32] And he watches as she just drowns herself inside of a car.

[11:36] And I'm sure like any teen, what he's thinking is, hey, I wanted to use that car.

[11:40] I want to go down to the mall to see my friends.

[11:42] Mom, mom, let me use the car.

[11:44] Oh, I can't use it forever?

[11:45] Thanks, mom.

[11:46] Anyway, that's the end of that prologue.

Stuart Wellington

[11:49] So much of that opening feels like digitally enhanced to the point that I'm like, I don't

[11:59] know what's going on here.

Elliott Kalan

[12:01] Are they robots?

[12:01] It felt to me like I was watching a scene from, even not having seen any of this movie,

[12:07] it felt like I was watching a scene from a different movie that suddenly got spliced onto the tape.

[12:12] Like, oh, I don't know what's going on and I don't care.

Stuart Wellington

[12:17] This feels like the scene that would show up normally, like right after the reveal of the

[12:23] killer.

[12:23] And you're like, oh, that's why he's a killer, because he was abused.

[12:27] And victims of trauma and abuse are always murderers.

[12:31] They're dangerous.

[12:32] Can't have them in society.

Dan McCoy

[12:34] Well, it's not too much of a spoiler at this point to like, and you know, you know that

[12:38] this prelude has something to do with the killer and it's probably the origin story of

[12:42] the killer.

[12:42] So it's not a spoiler.

Elliott Kalan

[12:43] Yeah, because that's how movies work, Dan.

Dan McCoy

[12:44] This is the origin story of the killer.

Elliott Kalan

[12:46] They just decided to give you a little extra tail at the beginning to wet your whistle

[12:49] for Norwegian depression.

[12:52] Here's a little booze-bush of misery for you before we get into the real story.

Dan McCoy

[12:56] A serious man kind of does that with the whole Dybbuk story.

[13:00] That's true.

[13:00] A serious man does do that.

[13:02] Doesn't really relate back to the rest of everything.

Stuart Wellington

[13:06] So in Dan's words, the snowman as good as a serious man.

Dan McCoy

[13:10] But I love the fact that he goes outside to build a snowman and like,

[13:16] I guess that's the origin story of the fact that he weaves snowman into his killings later

[13:22] on.

[13:23] I mean, yeah, they talk about that.

[13:24] But like the idea that this kid remembers like, well, on the day that my mom died, I

[13:28] built a snowman.

[13:30] So I guess that's my thing now.

Stuart Wellington

[13:32] Isn't he always making the snowman like as a, to sit there like looking at the women he's

[13:37] about to murder accusingly?

[13:38] Yeah.

[13:39] Like, I don't know.

[13:41] That's his like judgmental alter ego is this little snow guy.

Elliott Kalan

[13:45] I mean, all of that might have been explained more clearly if they had shot the, I have to

[13:49] assume 20 pages of script that were, that were left out.

[13:53] Why, why snowman in particular?

[13:55] But okay.

[13:56] We don't have time for that because now it's the present day or some other time.

[14:00] Michael Fassbender is a drunk guy who's asleep in an ice fishing shack, wakes up and goes

[14:06] off to his home.

[14:07] He's Harry Hole.

[14:08] He's a homicide detective who doesn't have a lot of work to do because there's a lot of

[14:12] homicides in Norway.

Stuart Wellington

[14:13] Speaking of his home, it is offensive to me that at nowhere do we see a bit of set dressing

[14:20] of like a little, like a little like woodwork thing that calls his apartment Harry's Hole.

[14:29] I mean, that's just fucking bullshit, dude.

Elliott Kalan

[14:31] I mean, he is in Norway where the language is different, so that might be part of it.

Stuart Wellington

[14:35] But no, other than the fact that they tell you it's in Norway, you see no Norwegian written

[14:41] anywhere in this film.

[14:42] No one has a Norwegian accent.

[14:45] Like.

Elliott Kalan

[14:46] Yeah.

[14:47] The fact that it's Norway is just represented by the kind of cold sexless architecture and

[14:53] interior design where everything is kind of functional and uninteresting for the most

[14:58] part.

[14:59] Like that symbolizes Norway.

Stuart Wellington

[15:01] I think I read somewhere where they even like change the signs on the police cars so it

[15:06] doesn't have the Norwegian word for police.

Elliott Kalan

[15:10] Well, that kind of like.

[15:12] Yeah, Dan.

Dan McCoy

[15:13] I kind of like that.

[15:14] I mean, like that's a choice that you can make.

[15:15] Like you can set a thing in a place and just be like, well, we see everything in English,

[15:22] so we assume it's in Norwegian.

[15:24] Like I find it weird when you set.

Stuart Wellington

[15:26] Like we have some kind of like Babelfish in our eyeballs.

Dan McCoy

[15:28] Exactly.

[15:28] Like I find it weirder in movies where you set it in a different country and everyone feels

[15:34] like they have to speak in that accent as if what they do in that country is just walk

[15:38] around speaking English with a different accent all the time.

[15:41] But that is what they do, right?

[15:42] I've never been anywhere.

Elliott Kalan

[15:43] Isn't that how other countries work?

[15:45] Yes.

[15:46] Yeah.

[15:46] Like if you go to France, everyone's like, hello, how are you?

[15:49] Oh, welcome to France.

Dan McCoy

[15:52] If you get plimps or language tapes, they're actually just dialect coaches.

Elliott Kalan

[15:57] Well, I think it's weird to set a movie in a place and then make the choice to denude that

[16:03] place of much of its identifying marks.

[16:06] Because at that point, why didn't they just set this in like a small Midwestern town in

[16:11] America that doesn't have a lot of killings or set it in.

[16:15] And a big subplot is whether Oslo is going to get the World Cup.

[16:19] So it's like what everyone's talking about how great Oslo is and how we're also proud

[16:23] of being Norwegian.

[16:25] I mean, that was the emotional climax of the movie, right?

Stuart Wellington

[16:28] Is when we're all like, yeah, and the music swells.

Elliott Kalan

[16:32] And there's just a freeze frame of J.K.

[16:34] Simmons pumping his fist in the air and then credits roll.

[16:37] And then the movie continues.

[16:40] So anyway, Michael Fassbender is this depressed cop.

[16:43] It doesn't help that his apartment is full of dry rot and mold and he can't live in it

[16:48] because they're cleaning it out all the time.

Stuart Wellington

[16:50] It's symbolic of the like, just like the shit he's dealing with, you know, man.

[16:56] Yeah.

[16:56] He's got a corrupted soul.

[16:58] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[16:59] But he's like John Constantine.

[17:01] He seems to be.

[17:02] Yeah.

[17:03] There you go.

[17:03] Yeah.

[17:03] He sold his soul to three different demons and they can't go to.

[17:07] They can't.

[17:07] He can't die or else hell will go to war.

[17:09] So here's the thing that I kind of don't remember about Constantine.

[17:14] Why were they so eager to have his soul, those three demons?

[17:17] You'd think like he's just kind of this like wastrel British drunk who smokes too much.

[17:23] You'd think that one of the demons would be like, you know what?

[17:25] It's not worth it.

[17:26] Like you guys just take him.

Stuart Wellington

[17:28] I mean, I think part of the argument is that you're trying to say that like demons are actually pretty understanding chill things.

Elliott Kalan

[17:36] As opposed to like the embodiment of evil.

[17:39] And like avarice.

[17:40] And greed.

[17:40] Yeah.

[17:41] That's a good point.

Dan McCoy

[17:43] Touche, Stuart.

[17:44] Like these surfer demons who are like, yeah, it could take your soul, but there's some pretty sweet breaks today.

[17:50] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[17:50] Just accept it and move on, dude.

Elliott Kalan

[17:54] Demon with a puka shell necklace is just kind of like a beach bum.

[17:58] Yeah.

[17:59] You know, I could collect souls and be like a prince of hell or whatever, but I don't know, man.

[18:04] Like what does that mean in the end?

[18:06] I'm just here for now, you know?

[18:08] Anyway, look at that.

[18:09] Check out that curl.

[18:10] I got to hit those waves.

Stuart Wellington

[18:11] I'm just a lion's head surrounded by goat legs, dude.

[18:15] Why don't I put sandals on those five goat legs?

Elliott Kalan

[18:20] Okay, so he's falling apart anyway, but his tough boss has been covering for him as he disappears from work on kind of like benders.

[18:33] But he gets a cryptic note in the mail on beautiful robin's egg blue stationery with a drawing of a snowman at the bottom.

[18:39] And the note is like a poem about snowmen.

[18:43] Yeah.

[18:44] It says, do you want to build a snowman?

[18:47] Yeah.

[18:48] Come on and let's go and play.

[18:50] I never see you anymore.

[18:52] Da da da da da da.

[18:53] I don't remember the rest of the words.

[18:54] I know I could count on you to take it since you have a kid.

[18:57] I know.

[18:58] Well, we used to listen to those songs all the time and we haven't listened in song that I've forgotten all of them.

[19:03] Oh, no.

[19:03] I never see you anymore.

[19:04] Come out the door.

[19:05] It's like you've gone away.

[19:07] We used to be best buddies, but now we're not.

[19:11] I wish you would tell me why.

[19:14] Do you want to build a snowman?

[19:17] It doesn't have to be a snowman.

[19:19] Anna, go.

[19:21] Okay, bye.

[19:23] And then it goes, knock, knock, knock, knock, knock.

[19:25] This is our new podcast.

[19:26] Do you want to build a snowman?

[19:27] It's a frozen.

[19:29] Or ride our bikes around the hall?

[19:31] Oh, God.

[19:32] Why did I kill this up?

[19:32] Are your company is overdue?

[19:35] I started talking to the pictures on the wall.

[19:38] Hang in there, Joan.

[19:39] The book is going down.

[19:40] It gets a little.

[19:44] It's a hit song from the biggest animated film of all time, Stuart.

[19:47] Anyway.

[19:48] We also learned that.

[19:50] Yeah.

[19:50] Should we say Shrek?

[19:52] Yeah.

[19:53] I was recently told a story about apparently for Shrek, they hired a bunch of people to write

[19:58] like a big opening musical number that would explain all the characters and that they like put weeks of work into it and put this song together and presented it to Jeffrey Katzenberg.

[20:09] And he was like, that was great, guys.

[20:10] That was great.

[20:11] But we just got the rights to Smash Mouth song All-Star, so we're just going to use that.

Stuart Wellington

[20:16] Oh, God.

[20:17] Speaking of putting work into a score that's not being used, apparently this movie had a Johnny Greenwood score and they didn't use it.

[20:24] Oh, wow.

Elliott Kalan

[20:25] And they replaced him with Marco Beltrami.

Stuart Wellington

[20:27] Yeah, which, I mean, Marco Beltrami, don't get me wrong, has dropped some sick-ass scores.

Elliott Kalan

[20:34] I wonder what was wrong with Johnny Greenwood.

[20:35] Well, maybe they accidentally hired Lee Greenwood.

[20:38] Oh, yeah.

[20:39] It was all really jingolistic.

[20:40] You can't have all this patriotic America music in this Norway movie.

Dan McCoy

[20:44] Yeah, it doesn't make any sense.

Elliott Kalan

[20:46] So we also learned that Harry Hall has an estranged son named Oleg and an ex-wife whose name I did not catch.

[20:52] There's a couple characters in the movie whose names I just...

Stuart Wellington

[20:55] Wait a minute.

[20:56] She's an ex-girlfriend and that's not his actual son, right?

Dan McCoy

[20:59] No, it is his actual son, but Oleg doesn't know that.

Stuart Wellington

[21:02] Oh, shit.

[21:03] That's what's going on.

Elliott Kalan

[21:04] I'm like, Oleg.

[21:05] That is not clear in the movie.

[21:07] In the movie, I was never sure if it was his real son or not.

[21:10] And I was never sure if she was his ex-wife or his ex-girlfriend.

[21:13] People kept saying to Harry Hall, he's not your real son.

[21:16] You don't have to worry about it.

[21:17] But it was like...

[21:19] It was that clear in the books?

[21:21] Is that what it is, Dan?

[21:23] Yes.

Dan McCoy

[21:24] Now...

[21:25] I believe I'm right about this.

[21:26] I feel...

[21:27] Now I feel weird about my certainty about it, but...

Stuart Wellington

[21:29] So you mentioned a moment where Harry gets a note in the mail.

[21:34] And that's actually, I think, the one scene I really liked in the movie, or the little touch,

[21:38] where he's in the cafeteria and he puts his food down and then he actively goes and takes

[21:43] the second chair from the table and moves it away.

Elliott Kalan

[21:47] Yeah, that's a good touch.

[21:51] Yeah.

[21:51] And so...

[21:53] And Harry Hall's ex-girlfriend, mother of his possible son, has a new boyfriend, Matthias,

[22:00] who is a...

[22:01] He's some kind of hormone doctor.

[22:04] He's like a doctor, basically.

[22:05] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[22:06] He, uh...

[22:07] Harry thinks he's a plastic surgeon at first, but, yeah, I think his...

[22:12] He explains that it's...

[22:13] That much of that stuff is dealt with hormones now.

[22:16] And he seems very jovial and eager to give Harry some medication.

[22:21] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[22:22] Everything about him, like...

[22:24] And this character, everything about him screams, there's something off with this character,

[22:29] because if there wasn't, why would he have such a large part in every scene that he's

[22:33] in?

[22:34] Yeah.

[22:34] Like, he gets...

[22:36] Yes, Dan?

Dan McCoy

[22:37] Yeah.

[22:38] I mean, Roger Ebert used to have something called the Law of Conservation of Characters,

[22:42] where he stated that any character that seems extraneous to the plot is probably, like, ends

[22:48] up being the killer.

Elliott Kalan

[22:51] And, uh...

[22:52] Spoiler alert.

[22:53] Spoiler alert.

[22:54] Yeah.

[22:55] Maybe.

[22:56] Uh, meanwhile, there's a woman with a red scarf.

[22:59] She's a mom.

[22:59] She gets home.

[23:00] She's just hanging out on her own after she puts her daughter to bed.

[23:03] Her husband was mad and left.

[23:04] And, because she was, like, getting home from work and he had to go somewhere.

[23:07] A snowball gets thrown at her window and she looks out and sees a snowman in her yard

[23:11] peeping at her.

[23:13] Uh-oh.

[23:14] And by snowman, I mean literally, like, just a childish snowman.

[23:17] Three lumps of snow with some coal in his face.

[23:20] Uh, Harry goes to his office.

[23:22] There's a new cop there.

[23:24] She's a lady.

[23:24] Her name's Katrine, which I only knew because I looked it up on Wikipedia afterwards because

[23:28] I missed, I think, the one time they mentioned her name.

[23:31] And the rest of the movie, no one addresses her or anything like that.

Stuart Wellington

[23:35] Well, there's the moment where he has the big reveal where he, like, finds a child's raincoat

[23:40] that says Katrine.

[23:41] And I'm like, is that supposed to mean something?

[23:44] So I went to IMDb and I'm like, oh my god, movie?

Elliott Kalan

[23:48] Because you hear the word, you hear the word Cloudberry more often than you hear Katrine.

Stuart Wellington

[23:53] I would love the idea that a movie relies on you going to IMDb to, like, gasp.

[24:00] Well, it makes you a more active participant in the mystery, Stuart.

Elliott Kalan

[24:03] Yeah, it's like when people would watch Lost and they're like, I gotta go online and figure

[24:07] out the clues in this one.

[24:08] And the creators of Lost were like, eh, people are doing their part.

[24:11] We don't have to figure out anything.

[24:15] Or it's like, what was the movie you watched where it ended with, it was the exorcism movie

[24:19] that ended with a website that said, for the rest, go to this URL.

Stuart Wellington

[24:24] That's the last exorcism, I think.

[24:25] I think that's right.

[24:26] The last exorcism?

Elliott Kalan

[24:27] Yeah.

[24:28] Like, boy, that was very disappointing.

Stuart Wellington

[24:32] Yeah, where it's like, find out more at your local library.

Dan McCoy

[24:35] I would have loved it if they went even further and it's like, write to this address and you

[24:41] got like a snail mail thing describing an extra scene at the end of the movie.

Elliott Kalan

[24:47] No, it became a very long scavenger hut.

[24:50] You write away and they send you an audio tape that gives you the instructions to where

[24:54] to find a key that opens like a safe that has a reel of film.

[24:59] And when you watch the film, the film is like, hey, find this guy.

[25:03] He's the one who knows what happens in the movie.

[25:05] You got to track him down.

[25:06] People are spending years wandering the globe trying to figure out the end of this movie.

Stuart Wellington

[25:10] So do you guys, do you think that in like school libraries, they now have posters that say

[25:16] like, you know how they have those posters that are basically like, hey, you should read

[25:20] more.

[25:21] And maybe the poster just says read.

[25:23] And then it shows like a detective surrounded by bloody snowman.

[25:26] And it says hole up with a good book.

Dan McCoy

[25:32] Yes.

[25:33] I think that that definitely is happening.

Elliott Kalan

[25:35] Yeah.

[25:35] I have to assume so.

[25:37] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[25:38] Okay.

[25:38] That's just like, that's all I got.

Elliott Kalan

[25:40] All those, all those ads, all those ads in Norway that say Nesbo knows murder.

[25:46] And it's all Joe Nesbo theme stuff and Nesbo knows baseball and Nesbo knows football.

[25:51] Mm hmm.

[25:52] Yeah.

[25:53] Yep.

[25:54] Anyway, that's all I know about sports.

[25:56] Bo Jackson's old slogans.

[25:58] Yeah.

[25:58] But, uh, okay.

[26:00] So, uh, Katrine is this new cop.

[26:03] She studied Harry Hole's cases in school.

[26:05] Now she wants to work with them and they're going to investigate the disappearance of the

[26:09] woman we saw before her red scarf.

[26:11] It's on the snowman in her yard.

[26:13] Uh oh.

[26:14] And did she wait?

Stuart Wellington

[26:15] Did she turn into a snowman?

Elliott Kalan

[26:17] That's the implication at first.

[26:20] No, we're quickly, quickly disabused of that notion.

[26:23] Turns out she's disappeared and someone has placed her scarf on a snowman.

[26:27] Because I think what, they do a DNA test on the snowman just to make sure it doesn't have

[26:30] any of her genetic code or something like that.

[26:33] Yeah.

[26:33] Uh, and Katrine has this futuristic video recording device for collecting evidence.

[26:39] That's like, it's one of those things that looks like.

Stuart Wellington

[26:41] To do the fucking Voight-Kampff test.

Elliott Kalan

[26:43] Yeah.

[26:44] Yeah, exactly.

[26:45] Or just like a really oversized iPad.

[26:47] Yeah.

[26:48] Well, that's what it's like.

[26:49] It's something where the first moment I saw it, I was like, whoa, does this take place

[26:52] in the future?

[26:52] And then it was like, no, wait a minute.

[26:53] I have a better machine for that in my pocket than this person has.

[26:58] Like, she should just use her phone to record all this.

[26:59] Yeah.

[27:00] And then the police department can defray the cost of her phone service and her data plan.

[27:06] Because she'd need a lot of data.

[27:06] Because she'd need a ton of data, right?

[27:08] To store that stuff in the cloud.

[27:09] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[27:10] I mean, from my understanding in Scandinavian countries, they've had a better advanced cell

[27:17] phone network and system than we've had.

[27:19] So, yeah.

[27:20] I mean, it's probably peanuts to them.

Elliott Kalan

[27:23] I guess that's true.

[27:25] And they do love peanuts there.

[27:26] Norway is the home of the peanut industry.

[27:29] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[27:30] All their famous boiled peanuts.

[27:32] Norwegian boiled peanuts.

Elliott Kalan

[27:34] Oh, you can't go into a grocery store without seeing a big display for Norwegian boiled peanuts.

Stuart Wellington

[27:38] Yeah, yeah.

[27:39] Have a delicious plate of peanut crusted puffin or whatever they eat there.

Dan McCoy

[27:43] Yeah, that's right.

[27:44] Some sort of fermented fish covered in peanuts.

Elliott Kalan

[27:49] What is this?

[27:50] No reservations or something?

[27:51] What are we doing here?

[27:52] Come on.

[27:52] Anyway.

[27:54] Then we get to – and Harry Hole looks in the newspaper and sees a picture of J.K. Simmons,

[27:59] who's a big, rich guy, who is both – I pick up – I'm never quite sure what he does.

[28:05] He seems to be a rich industrialist who is also famous for his profession of family values

[28:11] and being a family man, and his one goal in life is to get the World Cup in Oslo.

[28:16] And as we eventually find out, he loves to take pictures of women with his phone, thus proving

[28:21] that they have this phone technology that they could just use to record everything they needed to.

[28:26] But anyway, we cut to a flashback that is prompted by – I don't know who.

[28:31] I don't know who in the room is remembering this of nine years earlier, old Val Kilmer, who has been dubbed with the craziest voice, unless that's him doing it.

[28:41] But every scene with Val Kilmer feels like the scene at the end of Pee-wee's Big Adventure where Pee-wee Herman has that one part in the movie as the bellhop,

[28:50] and they dubbed in his voice so that he goes, Mr. Herman, paging Mr. Herman.

[28:55] Like, that's what Val Kilmer sounds like the whole movie.

[28:58] I think he's sick.

[28:58] What was the deal with that?

[28:59] I think he's sick.

Stuart Wellington

[29:00] Before we make too much fun of him.

[29:01] Well, no.

[29:02] I mean, he was recovering from, like, throat cancer.

[29:05] All right.

Elliott Kalan

[29:06] Oh, I didn't know that.

[29:07] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[29:07] But they could have found – I didn't know that, but they could have found somebody who sounded more like him to do it.

Stuart Wellington

[29:12] I mean, partly I'm like – I mean, I guess he's got to make money, but I'm like, man, just take the time off.

[29:20] Like, you're more important than a movie.

[29:22] Yeah, or more important than the snowman in particular.

Elliott Kalan

[29:26] He's got to remember that Val stands for valuable and that we value him and that Val Kilmer – like, we want you to see in yourself the worth that we see in you,

[29:34] and you've got to take that time to take care of yourself.

[29:36] Okay, I didn't realize that because the whole – it really threw me off to hear him just have a completely different voice coming out of his face.

Stuart Wellington

[29:44] Yeah.

[29:44] It seemed like an insane choice.

[29:46] It seemed like they were just going to replace him with – who's that actor in All the Money in the World, Dan?

[29:53] Christopher Plummer.

[29:53] Yeah, they're – oh, man.

Elliott Kalan

[29:55] Christopher Plummer is a virus that is slowly infecting every movie, and here it's just the voice.

[30:01] But in every movie, you're going to see, like, in the background, a building is going to be Christopher Plummer.

[30:06] Or, like, some characters are getting – like, in – I went to see that Logan Lucky movie, and they get into a race car, and the race car was Christopher Plummer.

[30:12] Like, he's just slowly – like, the way that a bone turns into a fossil by little bits of matter becoming minerals, every movie is becoming Christopher Plummer that way.

[30:21] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[30:21] The – I heard they're releasing a new edition of the special editions where all the characters are replaced with Christopher Plummer.

Elliott Kalan

[30:29] Oh, yeah.

[30:29] Although, Watto is an improvement when it's Christopher Plummer.

[30:32] He's very elegant, very cultured.

Dan McCoy

[30:35] Yeah.

[30:36] So what happens next?

Elliott Kalan

[30:38] So anyway, what happens next is Val Kilmer has been hired to investigate the disappearance of a woman who is friends with J.K. Simmons.

[30:47] Is the – she's the wife of a rich guy, and they know J.K. Simmons.

[30:52] And that's the end of that flashback.

[30:55] But I – so I'm trying – now I'm looking at my notes, and I'm trying to reconstruct from my notes what any of it means.

[31:02] Yeah.

[31:02] Because even my notes are not clear.

[31:04] Now I just have – Hole talks to a missing woman's daughter, and we see that Harry Hole's good with kids.

[31:08] He really is good at talking to kids.

[31:10] Yeah.

[31:12] And then we cut back to the past, and we learn a lot of exposition via walkie-talkie that Val Kilmer's character, Rafto, has been suspended from the force.

Dan McCoy

[31:23] I know that that's a Norwegian name, but Rafto sounds so ridiculous.

[31:29] It sounds like a Muppet, yeah.

[31:31] Yeah, you've got a Muppet in the middle of this movie, which would have been amazing.

[31:35] Oh, if they had replaced Val Kilmer with a Muppet?

Elliott Kalan

[31:37] Yeah.

[31:38] Yeah, a Muppet of Christopher Plummer even?

[31:40] Like, that would have been fine.

[31:41] I would have loved that.

[31:42] Like, and when you say walked on, you mean did that kind of, like, bopping walk that Muppets do?

[31:46] Where they just – they hop up and down?

[31:49] That would have been – now I really want to see an otherwise serious

[31:52] Norwegian serial killer movie where the aging cop on the force is played by – is played by Fozzie.

[31:59] I would love that.

[32:01] And when he sees a dead body, he just shakes his head sadly and goes,

[32:05] Waka.

[32:06] Waka, Waka.

[32:09] Yeah.

[32:10] Anyway, so we go back to the past.

[32:11] We learn via walkie-talkie dubbed-in audio that Val Kilmer's been suspended.

[32:16] Toby Jones is now the cop in charge of the case, but he's considered an idiot.

[32:20] And there's a snowman there.

[32:22] And all the – there's a dead body that's at the top of a – like a ski mountain that's being eaten by ravens or crows.

[32:29] And – or seagulls?

[32:32] And Val Kilmer scares them away so that we can see the body.

[32:36] Now, Katrina, the woman cop in the present, thinks there's a snow-inspired killer on the loose.

[32:40] She thinks he kills when it snows.

[32:43] Does he?

[32:44] When is it not snowing in Norway?

[32:45] I don't know, man.

[32:46] That's a little bit like – there's this serial killer in America.

[32:49] He only strikes when people are eating hamburgers.

[32:51] Okay.

[32:52] Thanks, dude.

[32:53] So I guess it's just a year-round kill spree.

[32:56] They call him the wimpy killer.

[32:59] He would gladly kill you Tuesday for a hamburger today.

[33:03] Or is it Wednesday?

[33:04] I don't remember.

[33:05] And then we've got this killer in Barbados.

[33:07] He only murders when he hears steel drums playing on the beach.

[33:10] Oh, okay.

[33:10] So all the time then?

[33:12] Great.

[33:13] Okay.

[33:16] Harry Hull spends some time hanging out with Oleg.

[33:18] Oleg is clearly troubled.

[33:19] He needs a strong male role model in his life, and he wants it to be Harry.

[33:23] But Harry has his own problems.

[33:24] But then another woman is reported missing.

[33:27] Uh-oh.

[33:27] But when they go to her home, she's apparently there just killing chickens in her chicken coop.

[33:32] It's just Chloe Savini.

[33:34] Yeah.

[33:34] Just hanging out with her chickens.

[33:35] It's just Chloe Savini being like, what do you want?

[33:37] I'm just here killing chickens.

[33:38] Yeah.

[33:39] Nobody here but us chickens, she says.

[33:42] And me.

[33:43] Chloe Savini, of course.

[33:45] Chicken number one.

[33:46] Queen of the chickens.

Dan McCoy

[33:47] Just call me Camilla.

[33:50] Speaking of Muppets.

[33:52] Anyway.

[33:53] As you always are.

[33:54] She's there killing chickens.

Elliott Kalan

[33:55] She's there killing chickens, and she's like, oh, no, I'm not missing.

[33:58] I'm me.

[33:58] And they leave.

[33:59] And then she calls her ex and is like, stop sending people to me.

[34:04] She's like, what the fuck, dude?

Stuart Wellington

[34:05] I'm not missing.

Elliott Kalan

[34:06] Yeah.

[34:07] Yeah.

[34:07] She finds a creepy baby doll in the room, and she does what everyone does stupidly in horror movies,

[34:12] which is when you see a weird, creepy thing, you move towards it really slowly and look at it really slowly instead of looking around you to find who put this creepy thing in there

[34:22] and get away from them.

[34:24] Yeah.

[34:24] Like, if you put a room.

Stuart Wellington

[34:26] I mean, normally when I find, like, a weird totem in a room that I previously had no weird totems,

[34:32] I would go up and pick it up, hoping that some of the magic would infuse my body.

[34:38] You go, Charlene, did you put this totem here?

[34:41] Yeah.

[34:42] This weird child made of mud and hair?

Elliott Kalan

[34:47] Charlene, did you leave this calling card here?

[34:50] Such as one would at the scene of a crime?

[34:52] No?

[34:53] No.

[34:53] Okay.

[34:54] Well, I better investigate it more closely.

[34:56] Never using my peripheral vision to see if the room is occupied by anyone other than me.

Stuart Wellington

[35:01] Maybe if I turn it over, there's, like, a clue to the next stage of the mystery.

[35:06] Yeah.

[35:07] Yeah, or your transformation.

Elliott Kalan

[35:09] I put it in my pack in case I need it later on.

[35:11] Sure.

[35:12] Along with my 20 pieces of gold and my healing potion that I picked up on my way to get the Triforce back together.

Stuart Wellington

[35:20] Wow, Elliot.

[35:21] So she looks at it.

[35:22] That's some contemporary video game references.

Elliott Kalan

[35:25] It's a classic, okay?

[35:27] It's a classic.

[35:28] What am I supposed to talk about?

[35:29] Mass Effect or something?

[35:30] I don't know that game.

Stuart Wellington

[35:32] Q-Bert?

[35:32] Is that what kids like?

[35:33] Q-Bert?

Elliott Kalan

[35:35] What are the kids playing these days?

[35:36] What's Bonk up to?

[35:40] Banjo-Kazooie doing it.

[35:42] Banjo-Kazooie.

[35:43] That was a great game, though.

[35:45] Anyway, here's the problem with Banjo-Kazooie, and I'll just give it to you in a nutshell.

[35:50] Too much stuff to do.

[35:51] Every level, there were, like, 20 different things you had to find, and I was like, Banjo-Kazooie,

[35:56] can you guys sit down for a moment?

[35:57] Anyway, you're a great team.

[35:58] I love spending time with you.

[36:00] Banjo, you're a fantastic bear.

[36:01] Kazooie, I love the way you shoot eggs out of your butt at bad guys.

[36:05] But here's the thing.

[36:06] I don't want to collect all this stuff that you have me collecting on every level.

[36:10] I just want to beat the game.

Stuart Wellington

[36:11] That's a weird way to deal with, you know, unfertilized eggs, you know?

[36:17] Is to just hurt them at enemies?

[36:19] Yeah.

[36:20] I mean, when I do that shit, people get angry.

Dan McCoy

[36:23] Otherwise, you just eat her young, so.

Elliott Kalan

[36:25] Yeah, I guess that makes sense.

[36:26] But we could eat her young.

[36:28] Yeah.

[36:29] Mmm, yummy.

[36:29] Eggs.

[36:30] Eggs from chickens.

[36:31] Chickens being killed by Chloe Savini, who herself is killed right now.

[36:35] Because, as she's investigating that baby doll, she is attacked by a mysterious figure with some kind of, like, garroting wire gun.

[36:43] That, I don't know why that would exist, but maybe that's a real thing that exists.

[36:47] Dan, is that in the book?

Dan McCoy

[36:47] Uh, I think so.

[36:50] I think it, I mean, it must be some sort of, like, farm equipment.

Stuart Wellington

[36:56] I would assume.

[36:57] Yeah.

[36:57] Like, uh, like the, the thing in, uh, in, uh, No Country for Old Men.

[37:02] Yeah.

[37:03] That's what it felt like.

Dan McCoy

[37:05] Yeah.

[37:05] Otherwise, I don't know why it would exist.

[37:08] Like, a thing that just, like, uses a wire to cut through stuff.

[37:12] I mean.

Elliott Kalan

[37:12] Well, why do we have a gun that shoots fire at human beings?

[37:15] That exists.

[37:16] That's true.

Stuart Wellington

[37:16] Yeah.

[37:17] Yeah, but this seems like this wouldn't be used in, like, a war situation.

[37:21] It's not like you're running around trying to get that.

[37:22] It's not like it's a fucking flying guillotine or something.

Elliott Kalan

[37:27] You're not running around a battlefield trying to lasso Nazis with twine so you can cut their heads off?

[37:32] Yeah, I guess so.

[37:33] Yeah.

[37:33] Uh, here's the, but every killer in the movies and TV has to have, like, their special way of doing stuff.

[37:39] But when you read about serial killers, they tend to just kind of kill people the same way everybody else kills people.

[37:44] Just by stabbing them or strangling them or whatever.

[37:47] What is it about the movies, guys, that demands our serial killers do things in crazy James Bond villain type ways?

[37:53] Stuart, I open the floor to you.

Stuart Wellington

[37:56] Well, uh, I guess it's, uh, to sell more toys, right, guys?

[38:03] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[38:04] I mean, I'm, I was going to say I'm more baffled.

[38:07] Okay, Stuart is holding, holding for applause, I guess.

[38:12] Uh, yeah, I'm usually more baffled by, like, the killers that always need to, like, taunt the police.

[38:19] Although I guess the Zodiac killer did that, so it's really true to life.

[38:22] Yeah, they do.

Elliott Kalan

[38:22] A lot of those, a lot of killers, I think, they get, they get off three times.

[38:26] One's from imagining the kill, one's from, uh, performing it, and one's from reliving it.

[38:32] And part of talking to the police is reliving the encounter.

[38:35] Like, you need a witness that you can show off to, in a way, because that makes it feel more real.

[38:39] Anyway, that's why I do it.

[38:40] Oops.

Dan McCoy

[38:40] Oh, yeah.

[38:43] Guys, long-term sting operation has finally borne fruit.

Stuart Wellington

[38:47] Guys, can we officially, can we officially classify this shit as a, uh, true crime podcast?

[38:52] Because those are really popular.

Elliott Kalan

[38:53] Yeah, right?

[38:53] Yeah, yeah.

[38:55] Yeah, they called me the, uh, Park Slope pedant.

[38:58] I would kill people around Park Slope and then leave corrections on their bodies.

[39:01] Sometimes they used grammar wrong or got a basic fact wrong.

[39:05] People in Park Slope, Brooklyn were so frightened and afraid of getting anything wrong that they would, before anyone said anything, they would look it up in the almanacs they started carrying around with them.

[39:14] Just so they wouldn't make themselves vulnerable to the Park Slope pedant.

[39:20] Yeah.

[39:20] But, uh, anyway, let's get back to the movie.

[39:21] I'm glad your reign of terror is over.

[39:23] Yes.

[39:24] Here's crazy twist number one that makes no sense.

[39:27] Uh, the police go back to find Chloe Savini's there.

[39:30] She's fine.

[39:31] And she's like, oh, I'm the twin sister of the woman you were talking to before.

Stuart Wellington

[39:35] Oh, thank God.

[39:36] And here's my, what?

[39:37] Thank God I was worried that Chloe Savini was going to exit this movie too soon.

Elliott Kalan

[39:41] Yeah.

[39:42] And they find first Chloe Savini's body being eaten by chickens and her head's been cut off.

[39:47] And where's her head been placed?

[39:48] On a snowman.

[39:50] Yeah.

[39:51] This is, uh, yeah.

[39:52] The ultimate insult.

Dan McCoy

[39:54] The addition of a twin to this movie does not bear fruit at all.

Elliott Kalan

[39:59] No, never.

[39:59] What are you talking about?

[40:00] There's no reason.

Stuart Wellington

[40:03] It allows me to live out my ultimate fantasy of one living Chloe Savini and one snowman Chloe Savini.

Elliott Kalan

[40:12] What a better movie would have been if, if she finds her sister's head and it's still kind of alive and to keep it alive, she sticks it on a snowman and does a magic spell.

[40:20] And now regular Chloe Savini and half snowman Chloe Savini have to team up to find the killer before she melts.

Stuart Wellington

[40:27] And you know how, you know that she's a twin and not the original because one of them wears makeup and the other does not.

[40:33] Mm-hmm.

Elliott Kalan

[40:34] It's a real Patty Duke story.

[40:37] I guess those were cousins.

[40:39] It's a real parent trap.

[40:41] Identical cousins.

[40:43] Which happens, I guess.

[40:44] Apparently.

[40:46] So then they go to, they go to like a winter sports gala that is celebrating, uh, it's, oh no, it's just promoting Oslo as a place for the World Cup.

[40:56] And it's like something out of a Batman movie.

[40:58] There's like actors in hockey outfits who are like skating around, around the gala attendees.

[41:04] Like all the, and, uh, JK Simmons is there.

[41:07] And Harry Hole there, it goes there because his boss from the police force are there.

[41:11] And he asked him for an investigative team to get on this case because he thinks these cases are connected.

[41:16] Katrine, the lady cop, follows JK Simmons into a meeting with a creepy guy who is very much like what I imagine the MC from Cabaret is like in his off time.

[41:25] Just like a creepy, weird, like giggly, corrupt, decadent man, uh, who presents a young woman to JK Simmons.

[41:31] And then the woman lowers her top and then JK Simmons takes a picture of it with his phone and then it's like, get out of here, get out of here, stop bothering me here.

[41:38] Uh, that woman will later, her face will appear in a window mysteriously and then we will never see her again.

[41:45] So, I guess enjoy that moment, guys.

[41:49] Uh, Harry Hole goes home.

[41:51] He finds that the mold remover, who is still working because only one person has been assigned to, I guess, clear the mold out of this whole building.

[41:58] And Harry Hole's apartment is the worst of them.

[42:00] Uh, he's dancing to, uh, this, to this song that was playing at the first murder scene.

[42:06] And it's that song that goes,

[42:07] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[42:09] Hot, hot, hot butter, I think it's called.

[42:12] What's it called?

[42:13] I think it's called popcorn by hot butter.

Stuart Wellington

[42:15] No, because when Ellie was doing it, it sounded like fucking jizz music from Star Wars.

[42:19] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[42:21] Do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do.

[42:23] Yeah.

[42:24] They're jizz whalers.

[42:25] It's not jizz music, Stuart.

[42:27] That's a different thing.

Dan McCoy

[42:29] Yeah.

[42:29] But it was a famous early electronic, uh, song.

Elliott Kalan

[42:33] Yeah.

[42:34] I have, I started assuming that it's just the national anthem of Norway.

[42:37] Cause I know that type of music is real popular there.

Stuart Wellington

[42:40] Yeah.

[42:41] That's their, their biggest musical export.

[42:43] I will say.

Elliott Kalan

[42:44] Novelty songs.

[42:45] The one moment of, the one moment of real joy I had in the movie was hearing that song and

[42:49] being like, oh yeah, I remember that song.

[42:51] Yeah.

[42:51] It's like the trigger of, oh, I hadn't thought about that song in a long time.

[42:54] It's like in the movie, uh, reprise, there's a song in it where I was like, oh, I

[42:59] hadn't heard, I hadn't heard that song in a long time.

[43:01] Anyway.

[43:02] Uh, it's we at the, at the murder scene, Harry goes like, get out of here, get out of here

[43:07] to the mold remover.

[43:08] And then take some of the medicine that he has been given from his, uh, ex girlfriend's

[43:13] new boyfriend.

[43:14] And it's kind of, I guess, have we seen the mold remover tampering with the medication?

[43:19] I can't remember or not.

[43:20] He, I think he does.

[43:21] Uh, Harry's team goes to work and they find out that the dead woman close Vini saw the

[43:27] same creepy doctor who showed JK Simmons, the topless girl.

[43:31] And they go to his house and he is very creepy and evasive and doesn't want to tell them too

[43:37] much about anything.

[43:38] Uh, and the doctor eventually says, you're going to need a warrant to search my house.

[43:42] Get out of here.

[43:42] You have been too rude to me.

[43:44] And this is, it's a cultural thing, dude.

[43:47] Yeah.

[43:47] And it feels like this is the beginning of either a web of intrigue or a red herring.

[43:51] And what it's actually is, is the beginning of a plot that never gets resolved.

[43:57] They just kind of forget it after a while.

[43:59] Uh, meanwhile, Harry Hole hacks into the lady cop's crime computer case, her Vogue camp

[44:05] test machine.

[44:06] And she finds out that she's been filming JK Simmons.

[44:09] Uh oh.

[44:10] And Harry Hole's so taken with the case and who wouldn't?

[44:13] It's so incredibly.

Stuart Wellington

[44:14] I mean, if filming JK Simmons is a crime, then lock up most of Hollywood, you know?

Elliott Kalan

[44:19] Because who wouldn't want to?

[44:20] The man leaps off the screen and you've got to, you've really got to hand it to any actor

[44:25] who manages to, I call them Giamatis.

[44:28] Any actor who manages to carve a big place for him in Hollywood, not being a traditionally

[44:33] beautiful man, if you get what I mean.

[44:35] Not being, uh, the handsomest knife in the drawer.

[44:38] What are you talking about?

[44:39] I'm just, JK Simmons is not, uh, usually your idea of what a, like, Hollywood hunk is.

[44:44] So he's, he's of that genus that I call actress Giamatti, which is just like, you're

[44:49] such a good actor that it doesn't matter that you are not a handsome man.

[44:52] We're still going to make you a movie star.

Stuart Wellington

[44:53] I mean, that's obvious, that's obviously more available to say like men.

[44:59] That's what my wife gets mad every time she sees John Goodman in a movie because she's

[45:05] like, there's no way a woman could look like that and beat play a character where their

[45:10] weight is never brought up or an issue.

[45:12] It seems.

Elliott Kalan

[45:13] I've got two words for you, Margot Martindale, but that's the only word, two words I have

[45:18] because otherwise it doesn't matter.

[45:19] And I guess Kathy Bates, I got four words for you.

[45:22] Kathy Margot Martindale Bates, because that's Kathy Bates nickname, Margot Martindale.

Stuart Wellington

[45:28] Yeah.

[45:29] You're right.

[45:29] Those are the ones though.

[45:30] But on the subject of J.K.

[45:32] Simmons, I don't know if you guys were upset about the Academy Award nominations this year

[45:37] when I saw the Best Supporting Actor category.

[45:40] And yet again, J.K.

[45:42] Simmons was not nominated for his role as J. Jonah Jameson in the Spider-Man movies.

Elliott Kalan

[45:47] I mean, those are no longer eligible.

Stuart Wellington

[45:50] That role was from years ago.

[45:52] I don't get it.

[45:54] I mean, I keep waiting.

[45:56] I agree to disagree, Elliot.

Elliott Kalan

[45:59] Okay.

[45:59] On the rules of the Academy?

[46:01] Okay.

[46:01] That's fair.

[46:03] We're actually recording this on the day of the Academy Awards and it hasn't happened yet.

[46:07] So should we pretend that we know the winners and we're angry and upset about them or should

[46:10] we not bother?

[46:12] I mean, yeah, of course we can pretend.

Stuart Wellington

[46:13] I mean, it's our fucking right as the podcasters.

[46:17] Yeah.

[46:17] I call it Prima Nocta, the right of the podcaster.

[46:21] Prima Nocta.

Elliott Kalan

[46:23] Or should we wait two weeks and give our lukewarm takes on the winners and losers?

Stuart Wellington

[46:29] I mean, we should probably wait at the very least until we're done talking about this turd.

Elliott Kalan

[46:34] That's a good point.

[46:36] Okay.

[46:36] So Harry Hole is so engrossed in the case he forgets to go on a camping trip with Oleg.

[46:42] Instead, he's taken a train to see the man.

Stuart Wellington

[46:44] I mean, can you blame him though?

[46:46] Like, it's so snowy out there.

[46:48] Why would you want to go out camping in that shit?

[46:51] That's a good, you make a very good point.

Elliott Kalan

[46:55] You got to poop in an ice hole or something?

[46:57] Nobody wants to do that.

[46:58] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[46:59] A hairy ice hole.

[47:00] So.

Elliott Kalan

[47:01] How many times do you think ice fishermen get super drunk and then as a joke just poop through

[47:08] the holes that they're ice fishing in?

[47:09] Like I said.

[47:10] Like, take this fish.

[47:12] You don't want my.

[47:13] 100% of the time.

[47:16] Only 110%.

[47:18] Yeah.

[47:18] So he's going to see the man who hired Val Kilmer low those years ago.

[47:23] We learned that Val Kilmer, rafto, is dead.

[47:26] Seemingly of a self-inflicted gunshot.

[47:29] And Harry Hole runs into Matthias, his ex-girlfriend's new boyfriend, on the train.

[47:35] And Matthias seems like he's really got it together.

[47:38] And he covers for Harry Hole saying, oh, Harry called me and said he wasn't able to do a.

[47:43] He called me yesterday and said he couldn't take Oleg.

[47:44] I forgot.

[47:45] That's on me.

Stuart Wellington

[47:46] He seems like a pretty good dude.

[47:49] Oh, he seems like a great guy.

[47:51] He's like really sweet and really nice.

[47:52] I feel like the movie introduced Matthias mainly to show that like not all new boyfriends

[47:58] are the bad guy.

[48:00] Yeah.

[48:01] And maybe if Harry got his shit together, he could be like.

[48:04] Yeah.

[48:05] Is that the one with Mel Gibson in it?

[48:07] Well, that's the second one.

Elliott Kalan

[48:09] That's the second one.

[48:09] More daddies, more stuff.

[48:10] So you're saying, Stuart, he's supposed to be like.

[48:12] Two daddies, two curious.

[48:13] He's supposed to be like a figure that Harry Hole should look at for inspiration.

[48:17] To be a better man.

Stuart Wellington

[48:18] Why couldn't he be more like Matthias?

[48:20] Well, we'll see how the movie plays out.

Elliott Kalan

[48:23] Because right now, up till now, we think that about Matthias, you can't find a better man

[48:28] than Matthias.

[48:29] So.

[48:30] Yeah.

[48:31] Yeah.

[48:31] I did that just to irritate Stuart.

[48:34] But he also, the fact that Matthias has the kind of like cold dead stare of a Jared Kushner

[48:39] shouldn't worry us right now.

[48:41] We should just think he's just like a good dude.

[48:43] Who could totally handle the Mideast peace process and is not using his office to make

[48:46] money for his failing family real estate company.

[48:49] Yeah.

[48:50] Anyway, Val Kilmer is looking more and more like Donald Trump.

[48:53] I just want to say that.

[48:55] Especially in these flashbacks.

[48:56] And I kept thinking.

[48:57] Take it easy on him, dude.

[48:58] He's going through a fucking sickness.

[49:02] I'm sorry.

[49:03] I'm sorry.

[49:04] We flashback to Val Kilmer getting a note from the Snow Killer during Toby Jones' birthday

[49:09] party at the office.

[49:10] And Val Kilmer storms out.

[49:14] Now, go back to the present.

[49:16] And Harry Hole shows Toby Jones, who's now has aged barely at all in the intervening years,

[49:22] shows him a picture of Val Kilmer with his own head blown off that he just carries around

[49:26] with him.

[49:27] And we learn that Val Kilmer's character, Rafto, had a daughter.

[49:33] Who's that daughter?

[49:35] I think you can figure it out.

[49:36] It's Harry Hole's lady cop.

[49:37] And Harry Hole figures that out by going to Rafto's fishing shack where he was killed

[49:42] and where nothing has been touched since then.

[49:45] And all of his mementos of his daughter are still around.

[49:48] And we learn that her password on her computer was Cloudberry, right?

[49:52] And that's what her father called her for some reason that I don't remember what it is.

[49:57] And...

[49:58] And we...

Stuart Wellington

[49:58] Yeah.

[49:59] Is this when there's like a flashback of his dead body and then somebody puts a snowman

[50:07] head on it?

[50:08] Yeah.

[50:09] That happened, right?

[50:10] Yeah.

[50:10] And it looked like...

[50:11] Flashback.

[50:12] It looked super CGI'd, right?

[50:16] Oh, yeah.

[50:16] There was a very...

[50:17] It wasn't the only one.

[50:18] No, very fakey CGI shot.

[50:20] It's not that hard to make a snowman head, right?

[50:22] Yeah, but it does...

[50:23] I do think it's...

[50:25] This is the part where like...

[50:26] Of all the things...

[50:27] I mean, come on.

[50:28] It's just snow and stuff stuck in it.

[50:30] I mean, everything...

[50:31] Everything in this movie...

Elliott Kalan

[50:32] Maybe they couldn't get a real carrot in time, so they had to CGI it in.

Dan McCoy

[50:37] Everything in this movie is ridiculous and everything doesn't make any sense.

[50:40] And the idea of a guy who spends the time as a killer to make a snowman every time is ridiculous.

[50:46] But what was most ridiculous to me was the idea that he could actually balance the snowman

[50:51] head on top of blown off Val Kilmer's neck.

Elliott Kalan

[50:55] They treat his neck as if it's like a tree stump.

[50:58] Like it's just a super strong thing.

[51:00] Even a regular person's neck would kind of move around and wiggle a little bit, let alone

[51:03] a blown off head person's neck.

[51:05] Yeah, there's a very fakey CGI shot of Val Kilmer's head being blown off and then a snowman

[51:10] head being placed on it.

[51:12] Like it's like...

Stuart Wellington

[51:13] Like it's like gingerly on top.

[51:14] Like it's...

[51:14] It looks...

[51:15] It looks when you're like stacking barrels or crates in a video game and you're like...

[51:20] For some...

[51:20] The laws of physics would indicate that that would normally fall over, but you know, whatever.

Elliott Kalan

[51:25] For a moment I was like, is this now the origin story of the old Jack in the Box mascot?

[51:31] That like snowman headed clown?

[51:33] Is that what I'm watching right now?

[51:34] Sorry guys.

[51:35] I've been in the West Coast too long.

[51:36] I'm making Jack in the Box jokes.

[51:37] Sorry guys.

Stuart Wellington

[51:38] Is that a...

[51:39] Is that like a...

[51:40] Is that a hamburger place?

[51:42] Is that a hamburger restaurant?

Elliott Kalan

[51:43] It's a local fast food restaurant chain.

[51:45] You may remember it from when we were kids.

[51:47] There was an E. coli problem there.

[51:49] And some people got sick eating there.

[51:51] And for years, that's all I knew about Jack in the Box was that they had a sickness problem

[51:57] so bad that jokes about it were made on Saturday Night Live.

[52:00] And now I'm here and they're everywhere.

[52:01] There's Jack in the Boxes all over the place.

[52:03] And it was funny for us because it was happening in someone else's backyard.

Stuart Wellington

[52:07] So we were able to be like...

[52:08] Oh, exactly.

[52:09] We're not suffering, so we don't care.

[52:12] It's like it's not happening.

[52:13] Were you about to ask me to wish them into the cornfield, Elliot?

Elliott Kalan

[52:15] That's exactly what I was going to do, Dan.

[52:17] I was going to wish that Jack in the Box into the cornfield.

Dan McCoy

[52:20] If I had that power, Elliot, boy, things would be different.

[52:25] Oh, wow.

[52:26] Seems kind of threatening when you say it like that.

Elliott Kalan

[52:29] It'd be a good life for me.

[52:31] Yeah.

[52:32] And growing up in Illinois, I guess you just had to manually place things in the cornfield.

[52:36] That's right.

Dan McCoy

[52:38] Yeah, when I wanted to extend my evil power, I would just go out and I would drive and I

[52:43] would put her in the cornfield.

[52:45] Like, what are you doing?

[52:46] I'm like, I'm putting you in the cornfield.

[52:48] Yep.

[52:49] Like, okay, I'll just follow one of these rows of corn until I get out, but I guess thanks.

Stuart Wellington

[52:54] Why are you putting me in this cornfield with sports equipment, mirrors, books you don't like?

Elliott Kalan

[53:02] All this half-finished poetry that's addressed to someone named Donna in a chemistry class?

[53:08] What is all this?

Stuart Wellington

[53:09] A collection of different brass instruments?

Elliott Kalan

[53:12] All this used-up pornography about butts?

[53:18] It's used up.

Dan McCoy

[53:19] There's no more use left in it.

[53:21] No.

[53:21] Okay.

[53:23] You only get...

[53:23] Us.

[53:24] Everyone knows that's the way masturbation works.

[53:27] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[53:27] If you were to touch it, it would just disintegrate.

Elliott Kalan

[53:30] Yeah.

[53:30] It's like a toothpaste tube.

[53:32] You just...

[53:32] You can't put it back in.

[53:34] Yeah.

[53:34] It can't happen.

[53:35] Yeah.

[53:36] So anyway, I guess masturbation is like a toothpaste tube.

[53:38] You cannot put it back in.

[53:39] You cannot put it back in.

Stuart Wellington

[53:40] I mean, Lord knows I've tried.

[53:45] Like, mother, give me the bellows.

Elliott Kalan

[53:51] So, okay.

[53:52] We're about to get to the...

[53:53] Pretty much to the climaxes of the movie.

[53:56] There's some complicated nonsense with tracking phone signals and a phone set up somewhere as a trap that I could not follow and did not care to.

[54:03] But it leads Katrine, the lady cop, to a setup like her dad's.

[54:07] Someone who's had their head blown off.

[54:08] It's the creepy doctor from earlier.

[54:11] He's been set up to look like he killed those two missing women and then blew his own head off.

[54:15] Lady cop is suspended for, I guess, not following orders and just running off on a run.

[54:20] Procedent exam.

[54:21] For what?

Stuart Wellington

[54:22] Yeah, she's not following procedures.

Elliott Kalan

[54:24] Yeah, yeah.

[54:24] Not following procedure.

[54:26] And Oleg runs away but gets found incredibly quickly.

[54:31] Harry Hull confronts the lady cop by lying on top of her, which is not okay.

[54:36] No.

[54:36] That's not like...

[54:37] It made me very uncomfortable.

[54:38] I forgot about that.

[54:39] I didn't like it at all.

[54:40] It was like, this is the only way I can incapacitate you long enough so we can have a conversation.

[54:44] I'm going to lay my enormous body on top of you because I'm Michael Fassbender, a huge man.

[54:49] Yeah.

[54:49] And you're just going to have to deal with it.

[54:51] I did not like that.

[54:53] They argue.

[54:54] She tries to give him a drink and he refuses because he's an alcoholic.

[54:57] She's tempting him.

[54:58] And he takes her off the case.

[55:00] She's gotten too close.

[55:02] Meanwhile, hey, they announced Oslo's going to get the World Cup.

[55:05] Yay!

[55:06] Everyone's celebrating at J.K.

[55:08] Simmons' nonstop rich man party.

Dan McCoy

[55:11] Another side plot that is baffling as to why it's included in this movie.

Stuart Wellington

[55:17] Yeah.

[55:18] I mean, you got to get people to feel good before you make them feel so bad.

Dan McCoy

[55:21] I guess the same people who funded United Passions funded this or something.

[55:25] Yeah.

[55:25] FIFA, they're called?

[55:27] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[55:28] So yeah, Katrin infiltrates the party so she can go undercover and find out if J.K.

[55:33] Simmons is actually a bad guy.

[55:35] Yeah.

[55:35] Which of course he is.

[55:37] Of course he is.

[55:37] That's when he snaps a pic.

[55:39] Yeah, he snaps a pic with flash, right?

[55:42] Like, what the fuck?

Elliott Kalan

[55:43] Yeah, with flash.

[55:44] Because he's an old man.

[55:44] He doesn't know how to use his camera.

[55:46] What's great is he walks away from her and then his flunky comes over with a room key

[55:51] and is like, if you'd like to talk to Mr. J.K.

[55:53] Simmons after the show.

Stuart Wellington

[55:55] And he's standing five feet away just like.

Elliott Kalan

[55:58] Just like waving at her like, yoohoo.

[56:01] It's like, very subtle, J.K.

[56:04] At least get out of the room before you send your guy over at the hotel key.

[56:09] But she goes up there.

[56:11] She goes to the hotel.

[56:12] Oh, and then we cut to Harry Hole's ex-girlfriend shows up at his place.

[56:16] She wants him badly.

[56:17] Dry humps him for a while and then just leaves him there like a pile of dead wood.

Stuart Wellington

[56:21] And the thing about Harry Hole is that like, this guy's like a fall down drunk.

[56:25] Even if he's off for a little bit.

[56:27] Yeah.

[56:28] The movie never shows him showering.

[56:29] So I can only assume that he stinks like piss and fucking alcohol sweat.

[56:34] Like, he's gross.

[56:36] Yeah.

[56:36] But he is Michael Fassbender, which is pretty dreamy.

[56:39] So, you know, it's maybe if maybe Charlotte Gainsbourg's character doesn't have a sense

[56:44] of smell.

Elliott Kalan

[56:45] Oh, yeah.

[56:45] I think that's in the stuff that got cut out of the movie.

[56:47] She doesn't have a sense of smell.

[56:48] Or maybe that she loves how he smells like lutefisk or something.

[56:53] Like she loves that he smells like fermented shark or whatever it is they eat in Norway.

[56:57] And so she's like, oh, this is delicious.

Stuart Wellington

[56:59] Or maybe she's like the bad guy in that James Bond movie where she has a bullet lodged in

[57:03] her brain and it kind of rewired how her brain thinks.

[57:06] And things that smell gross actually smell delicious.

Elliott Kalan

[57:10] Oh, yeah.

[57:11] Is that the James Bond movie with my favorite bad James Bond line, welcome to my nuclear family?

[57:17] Because he's got a nuclear weapon.

[57:19] I don't remember that.

[57:20] And it's like, dude, we're not your family.

[57:23] Like, what are you talking about?

[57:24] That doesn't make any sense.

Stuart Wellington

[57:26] That's the one where Sophie Merceau is where is the bad guy.

[57:29] And she has those like giant earrings.

[57:31] And it's revealed that she wears giant earrings because she's like missing most of her ear.

[57:35] And you're like, I get why you're a bad guy now.

Elliott Kalan

[57:39] You had no other choices left to you in life.

[57:42] No one would hire someone with weird ears.

[57:45] That's why you don't see Ferengi just working at jobs all over the place.

[57:48] That's the only reason.

Dan McCoy

[57:50] I thought you were saying it was like Lex Luthor.

[57:52] Like when he lost his hair, he had to become a bad guy.

[57:55] It's just like when you lose part of your body.

Stuart Wellington

[57:57] It's like just natural.

[57:59] I thought Lex Luthor lost all his hair because he spent three years training to be the greatest

[58:03] superhero ever for fun.

[58:05] And it just fell out because he trained so hard.

[58:08] Sorry, that's a One Punch Man reference.

[58:10] Okay.

Elliott Kalan

[58:12] Okay.

[58:13] Anyway, Lady Cop goes up to J.K. Simmons' room and sets up her video evidence box to

[58:20] catch video of, I assume, herself having sex with J.K. Simmons so she can post it online

[58:25] and invade his privacy with revenge porn or something.

[58:28] And then she's attacked, oh no, by the guy with that killer string gun.

[58:32] Ah!

[58:33] And Oslo gets the cup.

[58:35] Okay, everybody, we did it.

[58:36] The bad guy kills the Lady Cop.

[58:39] Uh-oh, she's dead.

[58:40] Cuts off some of her fingers and uses the fingerprints to delete her files.

[58:44] Now, clearly there's some connection between this killer and J.K. Simmons.

[58:48] It's hopefully going to...

[58:49] The word knows I don't know what it is.

[58:51] It'll play out over the course of the movie.

[58:53] Yeah.

[58:54] Like it's...

[58:54] That's a question I still have.

[58:56] But Harry looks out his window and sees not a full snowman, but kind of like a two-dimensional

[59:02] Trompe-Loy effect snowman on the top of the Lady Cop's car.

[59:06] Goes and looks inside.

[59:07] She's dead.

Stuart Wellington

[59:08] Missing her fingers in the car.

[59:10] So at the same time as she is being killed...

[59:14] Or no, she already found the dead body, right?

[59:16] He was doing something while she was dying, right?

[59:19] Harry Hole?

[59:20] Yeah.

[59:21] I guess not.

Elliott Kalan

[59:21] He was with Charlotte Gainsborough.

[59:23] Oh, right.

[59:25] And then her...

[59:25] But then she gets called by her ex-boy...

[59:28] By her...

[59:28] By Matthias.

[59:29] And she finds the pills that Matthias gave Harry.

[59:32] So Matthias calls her and it's like he's calling her to, what, check where Harry is?

[59:38] Like, I don't...

[59:39] Anyway.

[59:41] They find some evidence that someone...

[59:43] Some dead woman's husband was lying about the doctor that he saw, that he knew something

[59:48] that he didn't know.

[59:49] Who knows?

[59:50] It turns out they saw a hormone specialist.

[59:52] They didn't see the creepy doctor whose head got blown off.

[59:56] It turns out, of course, Matthias is the killer.

[59:59] And he was the teen from earlier.

[1:00:00] But he seems so nice.

[1:00:02] Yeah.

[1:00:03] He seems so nice and he's so eager to help.

[1:00:05] And there's no reason up till now that we've had to believe that he has some kind of string

[1:00:09] gun that he uses to cut people's heads off.

[1:00:11] He hasn't even shown any interest in snowmen.

[1:00:14] What's that all about?

Dan McCoy

[1:00:15] So I guess, like, what we're supposed to believe, this convoluted motive that he has, is that

[1:00:24] he's mad at women who's like, who have illegitimate children.

Elliott Kalan

[1:00:30] Or who have abortions.

[1:00:34] Is that it?

[1:00:35] Well, because it's women.

[1:00:36] It's women who don't want their children.

[1:00:38] Women who don't want their children.

[1:00:39] At one point they talk about that a bunch of previous women who disappeared similarly were

[1:00:43] women who had all gone to the same abortion clinic.

[1:00:46] Okay.

[1:00:47] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:00:47] So, and the reason why he's also targeting Harry is that, like, Harry has this illegitimate

[1:00:55] child in Oleg.

[1:00:58] And I, but I guess it doesn't, but it doesn't really fit the MO otherwise because, like,

[1:01:02] she does want that child.

[1:01:04] So I'm not really sure.

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:05] Well, but also, but, like, Harry reminds him of his dad.

Stuart Wellington

[1:01:08] I mean, does she really want, does she really want Oleg?

[1:01:11] Okay.

[1:01:11] I mean, as Elliot said before, Oleg is a drip.

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:15] Yeah, it's like, no one shows that much care about Oleg.

[1:01:18] Like, Oleg disappears and they're like, oh, he's at a friend's house.

[1:01:21] And then later in the movie they're like, he's at a different friend's house now.

[1:01:24] Like, they just, they don't really care.

[1:01:26] But Matthias kidnaps Oleg, kidnaps Oleg's mom, and takes them to his little grass shack

[1:01:32] out in, in Norway where he was raised as a kid.

[1:01:36] And we find out he was the teen from earlier.

[1:01:39] And the guy who was his father but wouldn't own up to him was the head of the police or something

[1:01:44] who was investigating some stuff.

[1:01:47] I don't know.

[1:01:48] Like, the, uh...

Dan McCoy

[1:01:49] Here's one problem I have with this ending, by the way, is I feel like it has...

[1:01:54] Single problem.

[1:01:55] It has...

[1:01:56] It has a bit of Raiders of the Lost Ark syndrome, wherein, like, if the hero hadn't done anything,

[1:02:04] basically everything would happen the same way.

[1:02:06] Because Harry doesn't really solve the crimes.

[1:02:09] I mean, he sort of does.

[1:02:10] It's like, it's like seven that way.

[1:02:13] Yeah, mostly it's just like, at the end, Matthias kidnaps the people he loves, which he would

[1:02:17] have done anyway.

[1:02:18] And then Harry would have found out who the killer was through that.

[1:02:23] And, uh...

[1:02:24] And we would have been in the same place.

Stuart Wellington

[1:02:25] And maybe he wouldn't have gotten his fingers sawed off by, uh...

[1:02:29] A wire gun.

[1:02:30] Oh, yeah.

[1:02:30] That happens later.

Elliott Kalan

[1:02:32] But it's also like, there's...

[1:02:33] He has this game of cat and mouse with Harry.

[1:02:35] And it's...

[1:02:36] Yeah, it's never...

[1:02:36] It's not really clear why he gives...

[1:02:38] He wants Harry to admit that Harry is selfish and not a good dad.

[1:02:42] And why he cares about that or gives a shit is not clear.

[1:02:45] Why he went after Val Kilmer, who, it seems, loved his daughter, you know, when he was alive.

[1:02:51] Like, that's not super clear.

[1:02:53] Like, it's really messy and mushy.

[1:02:56] But, yeah, it feels like in 7 where they're like, well, we ran out of leads and the killer just shows up at the police department and is like, let's hurry up with the endgame, shall we?

[1:03:05] Because I cannot wait around killing people anymore.

[1:03:07] I'm out of sins.

[1:03:09] I need you to pick up the pace, guys, and catch me so I can trick you into being the last one.

[1:03:14] Can we do this, guys?

[1:03:15] Can we do this?

[1:03:16] Like...

Stuart Wellington

[1:03:16] There's 10 minutes left in this episode.

[1:03:19] You're gonna have...

[1:03:19] We have to wrap this up because next episode is a different mystery.

[1:03:23] Yeah.

[1:03:24] Yeah, exactly.

[1:03:25] Let's just assume Tate Donovan is the one who did it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:03:30] It's like if there's an episode of The X-Files where they're investigating and then 10 minutes from the ending an alien shows up and is like, you got me, guys.

[1:03:38] Take me to the interrogation room.

[1:03:39] I'll explain the conspiracy to you.

[1:03:41] Meet Morp.

[1:03:42] This is how it works out.

[1:03:44] He said meet Morp because he's an alien because that's alien-ese.

[1:03:46] Meet Morp, yeah.

[1:03:48] Anyway, there's a big fight.

[1:03:49] Matthias is threatening...

Stuart Wellington

[1:03:51] I think big fight is being generous.

Elliott Kalan

[1:03:54] Okay, well, there's a little bit of slapping around.

[1:03:57] He asks Hole why he left his family and Hole admits that he's selfish.

[1:04:00] They fight.

[1:04:00] Hole gets his finger hurt and gets stabbed in the leg with a fork.

[1:04:03] And then Matthias, having gained the upper hand, runs away.

[1:04:07] Uh-huh.

[1:04:09] Hole runs after him.

[1:04:11] And he runs away because the final denouement has to take place on the thin ice.

[1:04:16] He shoots Harry Hole.

[1:04:18] And then I guess God takes pity on everyone in the world, including the viewer.

[1:04:22] And the ice breaks and Matthias falls through and dies.

Stuart Wellington

[1:04:26] I'm offended that the killer, when he has Harry dead to rights, he doesn't say, now you're in a Harry situation.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:35] Or like, hey, Harry, here's another hole, and then shoots him.

Stuart Wellington

[1:04:39] Yeah.

[1:04:39] See?

[1:04:41] And then when he falls in a hole in the ice, Harry doesn't say, that was Harry's hole.

[1:04:48] Or what, ice to see you or something like that?

[1:04:51] Yeah, yeah.

[1:04:51] But I like the idea that...

[1:04:53] See you later, ice hole.

[1:04:55] In a better story, Harry would have had a moment where he's like, that was your mistake all along.

[1:05:01] See, holes are part of me.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:05] I have a connection to holes, and I can call on them when I need them.

[1:05:10] Like a Looney Tunes character.

[1:05:13] And so a literal deus ice machina ends the movie and saves the day.

[1:05:19] Because it's like, Harry Hole just got shot and fell on the ice.

[1:05:22] Why didn't he crack through?

[1:05:24] And it's not like Harry outweighed Matthias.

[1:05:25] Once again, we just covered that he doesn't...

Stuart Wellington

[1:05:27] He has a kinship with holes.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:30] He's like, hey, guess what my favorite movie is?

[1:05:33] Holes.

[1:05:34] Guess what my favorite book is?

[1:05:36] Holes.

[1:05:36] The basis of the movie Holes.

[1:05:38] His favorite band?

[1:05:40] Smashing Pumpkins.

[1:05:41] God damn it, dude.

[1:05:45] So it's...

[1:05:46] Because smashing something is making the ultimate hole.

[1:05:49] It's a hole the size of the object.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:51] Yeah, it's like a hole in the universe.

[1:05:53] Yeah, he does like the band hole, though.

[1:05:54] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:57] So he...

[1:05:58] Yeah, and Harry goes back to work.

[1:05:59] End of the movie.

[1:06:01] That's it.

[1:06:01] The movie ends on him taking a new case.

[1:06:04] Not with a bang, but with a whimper.

[1:06:06] And that whimper is me being like, but what?

[1:06:08] Wait a minute.

[1:06:09] So he just falls through the ice?

[1:06:10] Harry didn't...

[1:06:11] Like...

[1:06:12] Harry didn't even have to chase after him.

[1:06:14] Like, I don't know.

[1:06:15] Case closed.

[1:06:17] Yeah.

[1:06:18] Diplomatic immunity revoked.

[1:06:20] Yeah.

[1:06:20] Thus ends the case of the string gun killing hormone specialist.

[1:06:26] AKA the snowman.

Stuart Wellington

[1:06:28] Only Harry could have solved it, man.

[1:06:30] He's the best.

[1:06:31] That's quite a body count, man.

[1:06:32] It's a pretty big body count.

[1:06:34] I feel like, obviously, these...

[1:06:37] The Scandinavian thrillers have a tendency to overestimate the amount of people being ritualistically murdered in these countries.

[1:06:46] Yeah.

[1:06:46] Or any country.

[1:06:47] Like, we've been watching a lot of elementary, and I'm always like, I don't remember New York's murder rate being high enough to justify, like, six people being killed by mushroom poison.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:00] Well, it's a little bit like the whole...

[1:07:02] It feels like one of the purposes of Scandinavian crime fiction is to be like, oh, this place that doesn't seem to have a lot of crime.

[1:07:10] Here's some kind of dark underbelly thing, and it seems weird because it's in this place where there's not a lot of crime.

[1:07:15] But there's so much of it now that it's like, oh, okay, so that's the murder capital of the world, I guess.

[1:07:19] Oh, yeah.

[1:07:20] It's Norway and Scandinavia.

[1:07:21] The same way that the whole point of the movie Fargo is, here's this bloody crime in a place not known for crime.

[1:07:27] But because of the TV show Fargo, you're like, oh, this is crime's capital.

[1:07:31] This is crime city.

Dan McCoy

[1:07:32] And, I mean, from the books, at least half of the time in the books, Harry Hole is tracking down a serial killer.

[1:07:38] And they, like, bring him in because he's, like, at this point, Norway's expert on serial killers.

[1:07:43] But it really feels like they're just, it's like fucking Miami and Dexter, the number of killers there are in these books.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:51] There's that scene in episode Dexter where they find all the garbage bags he's thrown in the ocean with the bodies of his victims.

[1:07:59] And you're like, wait a minute.

[1:08:00] So he's killed, like, a thousand serial killers.

[1:08:02] What is the serial killer per capita number in Miami?

[1:08:05] Like, this is nuts.

[1:08:06] You would think that the mayor would be like, we're losing one of our greatest homegrown industries, serial killing.

[1:08:11] We've got to figure out how to prop it up.

[1:08:13] We need subsidies for serial killers.

[1:08:15] Like, this is a folk thing here.

Stuart Wellington

[1:08:17] If he wasn't killing all those people, think about, like, I feel like Miami would have a, like, a starvation issue with just overpopulation of people.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:26] Yeah, you can't have that many alpha predators.

[1:08:28] There's not enough prey.

Stuart Wellington

[1:08:29] But at least, like, at least something like Hannibal kind of understands the, like, ridiculousness of the volume of serial killers and, like, ritual murders.

[1:08:40] Yeah.

[1:08:40] And portrays it in a, like, crazy Grand Guignol opera type thing.

[1:08:45] Yeah, well, Hannibal might as well be like John Wick 2, like, where everyone's a killer.

Dan McCoy

[1:08:50] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[1:08:51] It's more fun.

Dan McCoy

[1:08:53] But let's do final judgments, whether this was a good, bad movie, a bad, bad movie, or a movie we kind of liked.

[1:08:59] Elliot, what's your opinion on this?

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:01] Well, obviously, there's one frontrunner for Best Picture later today at the Oscars, and it's The Snowman.

[1:09:08] This was a bad, bad movie.

[1:09:09] I found it so boring.

Stuart Wellington

[1:09:10] If you had to nominate this movie for one category.

[1:09:16] What, for the Oscars?

[1:09:17] Yeah, yeah.

[1:09:18] If this movie, one nomination had to come out of this movie, what would you give it?

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:23] I guess I'd nominate the score just as more of a lifetime achievement thing for Beltrami.

Stuart Wellington

[1:09:28] Yeah, I mean, a fucking score for three billboards can get nominated.

[1:09:32] I mean, this deserves it, too.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:35] But it was, it felt like a movie that, it reminded me a lot of all those James Patterson movies that came out a number of years ago with, like, Morgan Freeman.

[1:09:44] Where it was like, okay, this is so by the numbers and bland.

[1:09:48] Why did they bother making a movie out of it?

[1:09:50] Except it's like one of those movies where they just randomly started removing scenes at the last minute.

[1:09:54] So it's like, wait, why was this character in it?

[1:09:57] What was that about?

[1:09:58] Like, the way that, you know what?

[1:10:01] It would have been a better movie if they removed more scenes.

[1:10:03] And then it would become more of like a David Lynch type thing where you're like, I don't know what's happening.

[1:10:08] It's so surreal and dreamlike.

[1:10:09] But instead it was like, it felt a little bit like when you're trying to fall asleep and someone keeps poking you and waking you up.

[1:10:17] Like that kind of dream.

[1:10:18] Where you're like, my dream can't get started.

[1:10:20] Like, I'm not, I'm not, there's no, I can't figure it out.

[1:10:22] Stop it.

[1:10:23] Stop doing that.

[1:10:23] I'm just irritated now.

Stuart Wellington

[1:10:25] Yeah.

[1:10:25] I was watching this movie last night and I was a couple of beers deep and, uh, yeah, it was a, it was a, it was a rough watch.

[1:10:35] Uh, yeah, I would say this is a bad, bad movie.

[1:10:37] I, you know, I'm a big, uh, I don't, I don't know if I'm in the minority of this, but like, I'm a big defender of the David Fincher girl with the dragon tattoo.

[1:10:46] Yeah, me too.

[1:10:47] Uh, and the part of what I loved about it is how it felt like it, it felt like it made effort to like create a feeling and a place.

[1:10:56] And it, I don't know, like, I don't know how accurate it is to actual Sweden.

[1:11:01] That's Sweden, right?

[1:11:02] But like, this felt so neutered and strange and it didn't, I don't know, like it didn't, it didn't feel like it fit the setting.

[1:11:13] Yeah.

[1:11:13] And of course nothing made sense.

[1:11:15] And I didn't really have any understanding of any of the characters.

Dan McCoy

[1:11:19] Guys, I had a weird reaction to this movie because like.

Elliott Kalan

[1:11:23] You broke, you broke out in a rash.

[1:11:25] Like what?

Dan McCoy

[1:11:25] Well, I don't think it's a good, bad movie.

[1:11:28] I don't think it's a good movie by any means, but I kind of enjoyed it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:11:33] And I.

[1:11:33] All right.

[1:11:34] Explain.

[1:11:34] You've been very quiet about that up to this point.

[1:11:36] You've let us slag it like crazy.

Dan McCoy

[1:11:38] It's ridiculous.

[1:11:39] It's a ridiculous movie.

[1:11:40] It does not make any sense.

[1:11:42] Like the, the logic of it doesn't make any sense.

[1:11:44] The mystery doesn't make any sense.

[1:11:46] But I think I liked it for the same reason that you were talking about Elliot, that it brought

[1:11:50] to mind, uh, like, like semi shitty thrillers of the nineties.

[1:11:56] And I think it might be pure nostalgia that I enjoyed the atmospherics of it.

[1:12:01] I enjoyed the feel of it.

[1:12:03] And even though like nothing in it made sense, I kind of brought back memories of mindless

[1:12:10] entertainment of yesteryear that I have a weird fondness for.

Stuart Wellington

[1:12:14] Is that because Val Kilmer was in it?

[1:12:16] Could be.

Dan McCoy

[1:12:17] I mean, it doesn't hurt.

[1:12:18] It's always nice to see Val Kilmer show up in the thing, even though he's, like his performances

[1:12:24] have gotten weirder and weirder over the years.

Elliott Kalan

[1:12:26] Well, that's what I like about it.

[1:12:28] Like that's, I wish that there'd been more Val Kilmer in it.

[1:12:30] It felt like, and if Val Kilmer was recovering from a major illness, that makes sense.

[1:12:34] But he felt very like, like many things in the movie, it was like subdued to the point

[1:12:39] of why is this here?

[1:12:41] Like, why is this in the movie?

[1:12:44] Well, to each their own, right?

[1:12:47] That's the lesson we learned from the Flophouse.

Stuart Wellington

[1:12:49] That's the tagline of the podcast.

[1:12:51] To each their own.

Elliott Kalan

[1:12:51] Yeah, that's our motto, translated into Latin, on the Flophouse coat of arms.

S5

[1:13:01] My name is Rachel, and I love the Flophouse.

Stuart Wellington

[1:13:04] I'm Jeff, and I love Pop Rock.

S5

[1:13:06] I would recommend the Flophouse as a great way to spend some time with three funny guys.

[1:13:13] I would say it's intelligent and diverse pop culture commentary.

[1:13:17] I realized at some point that I get so many hours of enjoyment out of MaxFun shows that

[1:13:24] it was criminal that I wasn't paying anyone, anybody for it.

[1:13:28] I see Jesse on social media talking about how he just wants to be better friends with Guy

[1:13:32] Branham, and I relate to it so hard.

S4

[1:13:35] These are listeners just like you, and they support the Flophouse and Pop Rocket with a

[1:13:40] MaxFun membership.

[1:13:42] The 2018 MaxFun drive is April 2nd through 13th, and if you want to support your favorite

[1:13:47] shows too, it's the best time to sign up or upgrade your membership.

[1:13:52] Just tune in starting April 2nd, and we'll give you all the details.

[1:13:55] Now back to the show.

S5

[1:14:00] Hey guys, this is Adam Conover.

[1:14:01] You may know me from my true TV show, Adam Ruins Everything.

[1:14:04] Well, guess what?

[1:14:05] Now we're doing a podcast version right here on Maximum Fun.

[1:14:08] What we do is we take all the interesting, fascinating experts that we talk to for just a couple

[1:14:12] minutes on the show, and we sit with them for an entire podcast, really going deep and getting

[1:14:16] into the fascinating details of their work.

[1:14:19] Find Adam Ruins Everything wherever you get your podcasts or at MaximumFun.org.

Dan McCoy

[1:14:25] We've got only one sponsor this week.

[1:14:27] Okay.

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Elliott Kalan

[1:14:46] Rediscover how fun cooking can be.

[1:14:47] Wait a minute, wait a minute.

[1:14:48] The kind of box you might put a snowman in?

[1:14:52] That's right.

Dan McCoy

[1:14:53] Mr. Blue Apron gave you all the clues.

[1:14:56] I gave you all the ingredients, Mr. Police.

[1:15:01] That should be...

[1:15:02] Yeah, they should put that meme out.

[1:15:04] I mean, it's a little late now.

[1:15:05] It's a little...

[1:15:06] People would be like, all right, Blue Apron, you're a little dated, but...

Stuart Wellington

[1:15:10] Yeah, I mean, they should do that, and then next week they'll do like a Mordecai meme.

[1:15:14] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:17] You can rediscover how fun cooking can be while enjoying specialty ingredients and exploring

[1:15:21] new flavors and cuisines.

[1:15:23] Get $30 off your first order by visiting blueapron.com slash flophouse.

Stuart Wellington

[1:15:30] Blueapron.com slash flophouse?

Dan McCoy

[1:15:33] Blueapron.com slash flophouse.

Stuart Wellington

[1:15:35] So when they do that snowman joke on their box, maybe they can sneak in like a fermented

[1:15:41] shark with peanut crust on it or some shit.

[1:15:43] Oh, yeah, delicious.

[1:15:45] The classic meal of Norway.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:50] We do not have any...

[1:15:52] What?

[1:15:53] We do not have any Jumbotrons this year.

[1:15:56] This year?

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:57] This year?

[1:15:58] Wow.

[1:15:58] Okay, already we ran out.

[1:16:00] Okay.

[1:16:00] We're less popular than we thought.

Stuart Wellington

[1:16:02] Do we want to do a birthday wish for me?

[1:16:05] I mean, it was a couple days ago.

[1:16:07] Yeah, sure.

Elliott Kalan

[1:16:07] Happy birthday, Stuart.

[1:16:08] Oh, yeah.

[1:16:08] So this Jumbotron is for Stuart from Dan and Elliot.

[1:16:12] Oh, both of you.

[1:16:14] Okay.

Stuart Wellington

[1:16:14] Hey, Stu.

[1:16:15] Couldn't we each have done your own, but that's fine.

Elliott Kalan

[1:16:17] Well, we wanted to split the cost.

[1:16:20] We didn't want to cost so much.

[1:16:20] Yeah, that's what I was implying.

[1:16:22] Hey, Stu.

[1:16:23] Happy birthday from your favorite podcast co-hosts.

[1:16:26] We thought what better present than to have the co-hosts of your favorite podcast wish you

[1:16:31] a happy birthday.

[1:16:32] Anyway, I hope you enjoyed lots of ding-dong ripping off and also messing with the head and

[1:16:37] then being dead and also perhaps video games.

[1:16:42] Love your friends at the podcast.

[1:16:44] Rorau.

Stuart Wellington

[1:16:45] Oh, wow.

[1:16:46] You know, I never thought it would happen to me.

[1:16:49] Long time, long time listener.

[1:16:51] First time writer.

Dan McCoy

[1:16:55] Yeah, that was great.

[1:16:56] Thanks, guys.

[1:16:57] What a gift.

[1:16:59] No, but we don't have any Jumbotrons, but we should promote ourselves.

[1:17:04] We've got some live shows coming up.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:07] What?

[1:17:07] We're getting the band back together to appear before human beings on stages into places that

[1:17:12] are not your apartment?

Dan McCoy

[1:17:15] On the 26th of May, we're doing a show.

[1:17:19] That's a Saturday.

[1:17:20] That's a Saturday.

[1:17:21] We're doing a show in D.C. at the 6th and I Historic Synagogue.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:27] That's right, everybody.

[1:17:28] I'm going to be schooling Dan and Stuart on stage about the faith of my father's Judaism

[1:17:33] in a synagogue.

[1:17:35] And it's going to be pretty amazing.

[1:17:36] I think a couple of Dybbuk's might show up.

[1:17:39] Maybe King Solomon himself.

Stuart Wellington

[1:17:41] And a golem will show up and I'll have to, you know, give him the one ring.

[1:17:46] But it'll also just be a normal.

[1:17:47] It's not the same kind of golem.

Dan McCoy

[1:17:49] But it'll also be a normal Flophouse show.

[1:17:52] It won't all be Judaism.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:54] It's our triumphant return to Washington, D.C.

[1:17:57] Last time we performed in kind of a bar club.

[1:17:59] This time we're performing in a synagogue.

[1:18:01] We're going to perform in every type of communal meeting place in Washington, D.C. eventually.

[1:18:05] And eventually we'll perform on the floor of the House of Representatives.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:10] Okay.

[1:18:11] And also in June, on June the 30th, that's also a Saturday, we're performing in Seattle

[1:18:17] at the Neptune Theater.

[1:18:19] Now, I've never been to Seattle.

[1:18:20] I'm really excited about it.

[1:18:21] I've never been there before.

[1:18:22] Yeah.

[1:18:23] This is our first Pacific Northwest show.

Stuart Wellington

[1:18:26] Guys, I think I hear the blues calling something about tossed salads, cranberry eggs.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:34] Could only be Seattle.

[1:18:37] If you want to get tickets to these shows, you can go to flophousepodcast.com and click on the events tag.

[1:18:44] Although there'll be links to these tickets.

Elliott Kalan

[1:18:46] Or just go to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:51] Yeah.

[1:18:51] Or you could just go to the, you could probably go to the venue pages too.

Stuart Wellington

[1:18:55] Web browser, type in flophouse Seattle question mark.

Dan McCoy

[1:19:02] So those events are on sale right now.

[1:19:04] I do want to mention too, on sale soon, but not as of right this moment.

[1:19:09] There's a June 7th live show here in Brooklyn at the Bell House.

[1:19:14] Wow.

[1:19:15] First announcement.

[1:19:16] Yeah.

[1:19:17] Our old stomping grounds.

Elliott Kalan

[1:19:20] And that's the live show's announcement.

[1:19:23] So let's just go through them real quick laundry list style.

[1:19:25] May 26th in Washington, D.C.

[1:19:28] Your chance to see the Flophouse in our nation's capital.

[1:19:31] Maybe we'll even get a little bit political.

[1:19:33] Who knows what senators might show up.

[1:19:35] Then, June 7th, we'll be in Brooklyn at the Bell House.

[1:19:38] And June 30th, we'll be in Seattle.

[1:19:41] Our first Pacific Northwest show.

[1:19:43] Maybe we'll catch a Sasquatch.

[1:19:44] Who knows.

[1:19:45] Anyway, that's the Flophouse.

[1:19:47] Check them out.

[1:19:48] May 26th, it'll be D.C., June 7th, Brooklyn, June 30th, Seattle.

[1:19:53] And I would just say this.

[1:19:54] If you live near any of those places and you haven't seen us live and you want to see us live,

[1:19:58] take advantage of it because starting in early August,

[1:20:01] I will be out of commission for live shows for a while

[1:20:04] because my family's going to have a little new addition.

[1:20:07] We're taking in a homeless person and we're going to have to teach him how to get a job

[1:20:11] down and out in Beverly Hills style.

Stuart Wellington

[1:20:14] You're going to shave off his caveman beard

[1:20:16] because you thawed him out of the ice.

Elliott Kalan

[1:20:19] Yeah, we've got an Encino man who's going to be staying with us.

[1:20:21] Yeah, you guys live in Encino, right?

[1:20:23] We don't.

[1:20:24] But closer to it.

[1:20:26] But anyway, so I'm going to be, for family reasons,

[1:20:29] we're not going to do as many live shows later in the year.

[1:20:32] So if you're near D.C., go to it.

[1:20:34] May 26th.

[1:20:35] If you're near Brooklyn, go to it.

[1:20:36] June 7th.

[1:20:36] If you're near Seattle, go to it.

[1:20:38] June 30th.

[1:20:39] Flophouse Live.

[1:20:40] 2018.

[1:20:43] Dan, you did a thing last episode where you were announcing some of these shows

[1:20:47] and you said we're going to be at, the Flophouse is going to be at the 6th and I Synagogue

[1:20:50] and then I think you didn't mention Washington, D.C. for a while.

[1:20:53] And I just imagined all these listeners being like, is that in my town?

[1:20:57] Where is, hold on a second.

[1:20:59] Oh, I'm sorry.

Dan McCoy

[1:21:00] You know.

[1:21:01] It's okay.

[1:21:02] You said it eventually.

[1:21:03] I did that ad read right after I woke up.

[1:21:08] Because I put the podcast online as early as I can on Saturdays.

[1:21:14] And that's right.

[1:21:14] I put the sponsors first.

[1:21:17] And so I came out.

[1:21:19] Well, if it matters.

[1:21:19] Shuffled in with my pajama pants on.

Stuart Wellington

[1:21:22] If it matters, it doesn't show.

[1:21:23] You sound fresh-faced.

Elliott Kalan

[1:21:26] Thank you.

[1:21:26] Dan, as with everybody, I'm a big fan of your solo ad read segments.

Dan McCoy

[1:21:32] Yeah, well, I feel like I need to make up for the two of you not being there

[1:21:36] by jumping on my own every misspeaking.

Elliott Kalan

[1:21:41] Speaking of misspeaking, I think it's time for us to speak out directly to our fans, right?

[1:21:49] Yeah, we should.

[1:21:50] Okay, what does that mean?

[1:21:51] It's a little segment I like to call Blophouse Movie Mailbag.

[1:21:57] Ba-da-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba.

[1:22:00] Tinseltown.

[1:22:01] Hollywood.

[1:22:02] Oh my god, I'm here for good.

[1:22:05] And I'm seeing movies all the time.

[1:22:07] And there's only one way to talk about movies.

[1:22:10] And that's in a mailbag.

[1:22:12] A movie mailbag for the Flophouse.

[1:22:14] It's a bag full of mail.

[1:22:16] It's a bag full of movies.

[1:22:19] There's so much stuff you can put in a bag.

[1:22:21] Truly, America's greatest invention.

[1:22:24] Bags.

[1:22:25] They're from America.

[1:22:26] Bags.

[1:22:27] No one ever had them before.

[1:22:28] Bags.

[1:22:29] They're the greatest thing since sliced bread, which you can also put in bags.

[1:22:33] Hey, here's some words that rhyme with bag.

[1:22:35] Nag, rag, hag, jag.

[1:22:36] Those are words that rhyme with bag.

[1:22:38] What are some words that rhyme with mail?

[1:22:41] Dale.

[1:22:41] Nail.

[1:22:42] Bail.

[1:22:42] Hail.

[1:22:43] What are some words that rhyme with movie?

[1:22:45] Groovy.

[1:22:46] That's it.

[1:22:46] There aren't any others.

[1:22:48] Fit all those words in a bag.

[1:22:49] Some kind of word bag full of mail.

[1:22:51] It's a mailbag for you and me.

[1:22:53] And Dan.

[1:22:54] It's a bag full of mail.

[1:22:56] About movies.

[1:22:57] For the Flophouse.

[1:22:57] Hans and Crosby stills.

[1:22:59] Hey, Stuart.

Dan McCoy

[1:23:05] So the first letter is from Irvin, last name withheld.

[1:23:11] And Irvin writes, not sure if I've asked this question before.

[1:23:16] I often write while Juku, that's a word that was invented on the Facebook group.

[1:23:23] But I will ask anyway.

[1:23:24] And it just means drunk.

[1:23:25] Just means drunk.

[1:23:26] I think originally it meant drunk and stoned together.

[1:23:30] But now I think it's just all purpose intoxication is Juku in Flophouse lore.

[1:23:35] Anyway.

Elliott Kalan

[1:23:36] Oh, the correct fucking strikes again.

[1:23:40] Jeremiah Juku's all purpose intoxication.

[1:23:43] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:23:44] But anyway, he continues to write, do any of you get stressed out by the circumstances of

[1:23:48] a story while a filmmaker explores the theme?

[1:23:50] For example, while watching Hiroshima Monomore, I got nervous for Emmanuel Rivas,

[1:23:56] as she wanders in a semi-dreamscape Hiroshima, baited by and playing with, I'm going to misspeak

[1:24:04] here, Eiji Okada's character during the second act.

[1:24:08] She is supposed to be going to the airport to fly home and she ends up dicking around.

[1:24:12] I couldn't help but get nervous for her, fearing she might miss her flight.

[1:24:16] This, of course, is totally stupid.

[1:24:18] But the feeling was still there.

[1:24:19] Do you ever get caught up like that?

[1:24:21] Her missing her flight was not the filmmaker's intent.

[1:24:24] But there I was, clutching my popcorn, desperate to find a reassuring weenus buried in the kernels.

[1:24:31] As always, you're a lovely bunch and whenever I feel lonely, I pull up an old episode.

[1:24:34] Thanks.

Stuart Wellington

[1:24:35] A reassuring weenus is a rare description of a weenus.

[1:24:41] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:24:43] So, getting stressed out by something that is not maybe a main thing in a film.

Elliott Kalan

[1:24:50] Well, movies are kind of like Rorschach tests in that way.

[1:24:53] That like, the thing that makes you anxious in real life when you see it in a movie, it happens.

[1:24:57] So like, any time in a movie that I see someone turn on water and just leave it running,

[1:25:02] and don't turn it off because they don't need any more,

[1:25:04] I'm like, turn that off.

[1:25:06] You're wasting water.

[1:25:07] Like, stop it.

[1:25:07] I found it very distracting.

Stuart Wellington

[1:25:09] There's this amazing moment in Call Me By Your Name where a character leaves a freezer door partially closed

[1:25:17] and it pauses for a second before somebody comes and closes it,

[1:25:21] and I'm like, oh, thank God.

Dan McCoy

[1:25:24] I mentioned this on the aforementioned Facebook group,

[1:25:28] but I always get very disturbed by whenever someone comes home to find their place has been ransacked,

[1:25:35] but I'm not really like, upset about the fact that someone is against them so much that they're going to ransack their house

[1:25:43] or that they're embroiled in this whole thing,

[1:25:45] but more I get upset like, thinking, oh, they're going to have to clean all that up.

Stuart Wellington

[1:25:50] Yeah, this is coming from a guy who has not made plans because he was expecting to organize his CDs one time.

[1:25:59] Did that happen?

[1:26:00] Yeah, it totally happened.

[1:26:03] I mean, this is kind of a horror movie, so I don't know if it counts because I think in horror movies,

[1:26:09] like, basically anything can be conceived as scary,

[1:26:12] but there's a scene in Raw where a character is getting her first bikini waxing,

[1:26:18] and the whole time I was, like, on the verge of throwing up because it's just stressing me out so much.

Dan McCoy

[1:26:25] I also get stressed by whenever there's, like, a manufactured conflict in an act two where, like,

[1:26:31] it's a movie about friends, like a comedy about friends or a comedy, like a romantic comedy,

[1:26:36] where the main characters just, for no reason, split up for a little while, you know?

[1:26:43] Yeah.

[1:26:43] And it's always completely contrived.

Stuart Wellington

[1:26:45] Yeah, like when Spider-Man and his powers split up.

Dan McCoy

[1:26:48] Yeah, so I get madder at it because it's contrived, because it still works on me.

[1:26:54] I'm still just, like, stressed out by, like, ugh.

[1:26:56] This totally, like, avoidable thing has caused these friends or lovers to separate,

[1:27:02] and I'm, like, mad at the movie for, like, doing it the way they're doing it.

Stuart Wellington

[1:27:07] So-and-so's zipper was just stuck.

[1:27:09] They weren't giving each other blowjobs.

[1:27:11] Exactly.

[1:27:11] Come on, get over it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:27:13] That's the, that in movies, people, like, stumble on something and either assume the worst immediately,

[1:27:20] and the person who's, that they're assuming it of is never able to just say, like,

[1:27:24] no, no, it's this thing.

[1:27:26] They just go, ba-da-ba-ba-da-ba-da-ba-ba-da-ba.

[1:27:28] Like, that's, that, in so many movies, if a man and a woman are caught in a room together,

[1:27:33] even if they're just talking, it's assumed that they're, like, having an affair.

[1:27:36] That kind of stuff, I guess it's the contrivance of it that bugs me.

[1:27:39] That's also why-

Stuart Wellington

[1:27:40] I get why Mike Pence can't be alone with a lady then.

Elliott Kalan

[1:27:44] Yeah.

[1:27:44] Because he's been watching too many movies, you know.

[1:27:47] That's also why, though, I couldn't watch too much Curb Your Enthusiasm after a while,

[1:27:52] because it was like, if these characters just said one thing that explains the whole situation,

[1:27:57] which would be very easy to do, we wouldn't have this problem.

[1:28:01] Like, there's so many farces that fall apart because it's like, a character just needs to go,

[1:28:06] hey, did you think this?

[1:28:08] Actually, it's this other thing.

[1:28:09] And then the other character would be like, oh, I see now.

[1:28:11] I made a mistake.

[1:28:13] Nobody ever does that.

Stuart Wellington

[1:28:14] You think, like, Basil Fawlty's wife would just be like, oh, he's just got some kind of weird scam going again,

[1:28:20] and that's why he's acting weird.

[1:28:26] I'm sorry I don't remember Basil's wife's name.

Elliott Kalan

[1:28:30] Brunella Scales was the actress.

[1:28:32] It's, uh, why can't I remember you?

[1:28:35] She's so great.

[1:28:36] Yeah, she is.

[1:28:37] Anyway.

Dan McCoy

[1:28:38] Uh, moving on.

[1:28:39] I'm going to look it up.

[1:28:41] Okay, you do that, and I'll move on to this letter.

[1:28:43] You move on, and I'll look it up.

[1:28:45] Okay, thanks.

[1:28:45] Okay?

[1:28:46] Open up.

[1:28:46] Open up my browser.

[1:28:48] Type in.

[1:28:49] Fawlty.

[1:28:49] Seems like talking during it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:28:51] Fawlty Towers.

[1:28:53] Okay.

[1:28:53] That was his problem, so I can't move along.

[1:28:54] Now let's see.

[1:28:55] Wikipedia.

[1:28:55] Let's take a look.

[1:28:57] Click on Cast List.

[1:28:59] Okay, let me go down to Cast List.

[1:29:02] Oh, Sybil.

[1:29:02] That's what the name was.

[1:29:03] Right.

[1:29:04] Sybil.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:05] Okay.

[1:29:06] Sybil Shepard.

[1:29:07] Okay.

[1:29:08] By the way, there were just, like, listeners screaming at us for the past half minute.

[1:29:14] Just, like, out there being like, Sybil.

Elliott Kalan

[1:29:17] No, they were screaming at us going, this is a great bit.

[1:29:20] Yeah, keep it up.

[1:29:21] I love it.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:23] Anyway, this next letter is from James' last name withheld.

[1:29:28] Patterson.

[1:29:29] Right.

[1:29:30] Dearest floppers, Dan is the best.

[1:29:32] Now that I've assured my letter will be read.

Stuart Wellington

[1:29:35] Sounds more like James Woods, am I right?

[1:29:37] I wanted to ask you.

[1:29:38] I don't know what that meant, but.

Elliott Kalan

[1:29:41] What, because Dan is a 16-year-old girl?

[1:29:43] I don't understand.

[1:29:43] I don't know.

[1:29:45] Or because does Dan represent like.

Stuart Wellington

[1:29:46] James Woods is kind of like an asshole, and I was making fun of Dan.

Elliott Kalan

[1:29:49] I don't know.

[1:29:49] Does Dan represent extreme conservative values, and that's why James Woods loves it so much?

[1:29:54] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:55] I'm just being a jerk.

[1:29:57] Continuing onward.

[1:29:58] I wanted to ask you guys.

[1:30:00] I'm forging ahead.

Elliott Kalan

[1:30:01] I wanted to ask you.

[1:30:02] Like Shackley in the Antarctic.

Dan McCoy

[1:30:05] Or Shackleton.

[1:30:05] Not Shackley.

[1:30:06] Shackleton.

[1:30:07] I wanted to ask you guys.

[1:30:12] Yeah.

[1:30:12] Is that written?

Elliott Kalan

[1:30:13] Sorry.

[1:30:13] He wrote down, I want to ask you guys.

Dan McCoy

[1:30:15] There's a word missing here, so I wanted to parse what he was trying to say.

[1:30:19] I wanted to ask you guys why you think that people, or if you think, or why did.

Elliott Kalan

[1:30:26] So did someone throw this letter through your window seconds ago?

Dan McCoy

[1:30:31] No, I read it, but then I forgot that the sentence didn't really make any sense.

[1:30:36] There was a typo.

[1:30:37] I'm going to rephrase to make it clear what he's saying.

[1:30:41] I wanted to ask you guys why it's often true that people who do comedy are, one, musically talented, and two, struggle with depression, mental health issues.

Elliott Kalan

[1:30:56] As a musically talented comedian, I guess I could talk about that.

[1:31:00] You see, it's just a song in my heart, and I've just got to sing it like this.

[1:31:07] Dan, you hate life.

[1:31:09] What would you think?

[1:31:10] What do you say?

Dan McCoy

[1:31:11] Well, I don't know that the musically talented thing is correct.

[1:31:15] There are some very high-profile comedians who are also musically talented, but I think that that's just the thing of performance.

[1:31:22] If people are interested in one type of performing, they're often interested in other types of performing as well.

Elliott Kalan

[1:31:27] I think there's more musically talented people among the general population than is realized by people most of the time.

[1:31:35] Not all people who are musically talented are professional musicians, and you hear so often of just regular people who play guitar or drums or clarinet or piano.

[1:31:48] A lot of people treat music as a hobby, even if they're good at it.

[1:31:51] Yeah.

[1:31:51] You know?

[1:31:51] And it's just that I think there's probably that same ratio of comedians are good with music as the general population is my guess.

Stuart Wellington

[1:31:59] I don't know.

[1:32:00] I mean, I feel like a lot of comedians are –

[1:32:04] For instance, I feel like a lot of people that are funny can also be good at other art forms, whether it's, I don't know, acting.

[1:32:16] Like, you see more comedy actors who are also good at dramatic roles than dramatic actors that are also good at comedy roles.

[1:32:24] And Dan's good at drawing.

[1:32:25] Yeah, Dan's got another talent.

[1:32:28] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:32:29] And I'm a mediocre guitarist.

[1:32:31] I'm not talented at music, but I like doing it as a hobby, like Elliot says.

Elliott Kalan

[1:32:35] There is this weird thing where a lot of stand-ups really want to be rock musicians, it seems, or rappers.

[1:32:40] And a lot of – over time, more and more musicians have wanted to become comedians, which is weird to me.

[1:32:46] That, like, someone like Justin Timberlake seems to want to have a second career as, like, a comedy performer.

[1:32:51] And it's like, why would you give up the thing you have, which people love, which is enormous, to, like, do digital bits for SNL?

[1:32:58] Like, I don't understand you, Justin Timberlake.

Dan McCoy

[1:33:02] And to speak to the depression thing, I'm not sure that that's true, that there's a higher incidence of depressed people among comedians.

[1:33:09] Like, I think that people don't talk about depression a lot, and so people who talk about themselves a lot are – like, comedians do, it comes out more often, maybe.

Stuart Wellington

[1:33:21] Wait, are you saying that not everybody's just depressed all the time?

[1:33:24] Well, that's the other thing.

Dan McCoy

[1:33:25] No, that's the opposite of what I'm saying.

[1:33:27] It's like, I feel like a lot of people are depressed all the time.

[1:33:29] But also, if it is true that it happens more often in comedians, and again, I'm not sure it is, it might be because people who do comedy are more observant, maybe, than the average.

[1:33:40] Like, they're literally making observations a lot of the time that lead to comedy.

[1:33:45] And not to be too nihilistic or negative about the world, like, noticing things about the world often means you notice bad things.

Elliott Kalan

[1:33:55] Yeah, like airline food.

Dan McCoy

[1:33:57] And homework.

Elliott Kalan

[1:33:59] What's the deal with that?

[1:34:00] Have you ever noticed these things?

[1:34:01] Mm-hmm.

[1:34:02] I don't know.

[1:34:03] What do you think, Elliot?

[1:34:04] I think you're right that I don't – I think it's more a matter of comedians, so many of them, that's what their act is, is talking about their depression.

[1:34:11] But that's more that part of being a stand-up, at least, is talking about yourself.

[1:34:17] And there are many, many people struggling with depression who do not talk about it, either because they're not comfortable with it or it's not professionally appropriate.

[1:34:25] Like, at most jobs, you can't just start complaining about your depression and not have your supervisor say, like, hey, can you not do that?

[1:34:32] Like, this is not the place for that.

[1:34:34] Like, you need a therapist.

[1:34:35] But there's also – there's the old stereotype of, like, the sad clown.

[1:34:40] And, like, Pagliacci goes to the doctor and he's super sad and he can't laugh because he's the one making other people laughing.

[1:34:47] And I think it's a – it's a – both just the visibility is higher and also it's a very easy stereotype also for comedians to fall into.

[1:34:55] I think there's a number of people who are like, oh, I could get my life together, but I'm not supposed to because I'm in comedy.

[1:35:01] Yeah, so when, like –

[1:35:02] And comedy people are supposed to be, like, fucked up.

Stuart Wellington

[1:35:03] When you hear a comedian talk about being depressed, you're like, hacky bit, dude.

Elliott Kalan

[1:35:09] Well, not that, but there are some people who genuinely struggle with depression in a way that they cannot get out of.

[1:35:15] And oftentimes there's comedy that comes from that.

[1:35:17] But then I feel like there's also people who are like, hey, I'm going to play into this.

[1:35:22] Like, I'm not going to do the work on myself that I can do even if it's only going to help me a little bit because I feel like this is the person I'm supposed to be.

[1:35:30] Like, I'm supposed to be unhappy because that's what being a comedian is all about.

[1:35:33] And it's – I don't want to – by doing that, I don't want to delegitimize anyone's genuine depression that they – that is a real trouble for them.

[1:35:40] I just know that I've known some people in my life who it's like, dude, like, you're playing a part and you're not – you know, you could be a person who is – no, not Dan.

[1:35:50] Stuart, like, reached out to rub Dan's shoulder.

[1:35:53] But the same way that you meet people who are like, hey, I'm an artist.

[1:35:56] I'm not supposed to have it together.

[1:35:58] I'm supposed to be, like, always in trouble and, like, making other people fix my messes for me.

[1:36:04] Yeah.

[1:36:04] But that's a different issue.

[1:36:05] Now I'm complaining about specific people that I know that I don't want to name.

Dan McCoy

[1:36:09] Okay.

[1:36:09] It's called Elliot Subtweet.

[1:36:10] I also – I also just think that, like, the cheap irony of it appeals to people.

[1:36:16] Like, this person is supposed to be, like, funny and, like, that must be being happy all the time.

[1:36:22] But they're sad all the time.

[1:36:24] Like –

[1:36:24] Yeah.

[1:36:25] There's something in that.

Elliott Kalan

[1:36:28] So anyway, I guess what I'm saying is comedians are not special.

[1:36:30] Moving on.

Dan McCoy

[1:36:31] Moving on to this last letter, which is not a question.

[1:36:34] It's just something kind of nice.

[1:36:36] So I thought I'd –

[1:36:37] I'm going to answer it anyway.

[1:36:38] Share something kind of nice.

[1:36:40] Let me guess.

[1:36:41] It's about how great Dan is.

[1:36:42] This is from Lydia Ivy, last name withheld, who writes –

[1:36:45] Lydia the tattoo lady.

[1:36:47] Today I am a woman.

Dan McCoy

[1:36:49] I was born Louis Jonathan, last name withheld.

[1:36:52] At 13 I was a man.

[1:36:53] A bar mitzvah complete with an ill-fitting suit and a cripplingly embarrassing party with no girls.

[1:36:58] Today at 29, my final moments as a legal man.

[1:37:02] Being glared at for laughing out loud outside a courtroom.

[1:37:06] I was listening to Elliot impersonate Sly Stallone talking about Estelle Getty and his heart being tender like soft cheese.

[1:37:13] My first act as a legal woman, finishing that episode while walking home in a lovely well-fitting dress on a beautiful sunny afternoon in Oakland.

[1:37:23] Tonight I am throwing a party to celebrate, which will probably be better than my bar mitzvah.

[1:37:27] There will be friends of various gender identities, alcohol, and hyphy dance music.

[1:37:31] Fewer clip-on ties, no cold french fries, but still probably some kugel if I can swing it.

[1:37:39] Today I am a woman, at least for tax purposes and insurance and shit.

[1:37:43] So congratulations to Lydia Ivey.

[1:37:45] I thought that was a nice letter.

[1:37:46] That is very sweet.

[1:37:47] That's great.

[1:37:48] Congrats.

Stuart Wellington

[1:37:49] Although I have been to some raging bar mitzvahs, let me tell you.

[1:37:54] I've been to bar mitzvahs that cost more than my wedding.

[1:37:57] Yeah?

[1:37:57] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1:37:58] With like a, have you been to a bar mitzvah where there's like an MC hype man who like follows the birthday boy around?

[1:38:06] And then like all the dancers are-

[1:38:08] A birthday boy is the wrong way to put it.

[1:38:10] And, you know, whatever.

[1:38:12] I don't even know, the bar mitzvah boy.

[1:38:13] Bar mitzvah boy, sure.

[1:38:16] I didn't say I understand it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:38:18] I'm an outsider in that situation.

[1:38:20] There's a bar mitzvah hype man who follows the happy couple around.

[1:38:24] No, but yeah, I've been to many bar mitzvahs where there's a hype man and a dance team.

[1:38:28] That's there to like get people moving.

Stuart Wellington

[1:38:30] And the dance team, I mean, in my untrained eye, always appear to be like deceptively young looking.

[1:38:38] Where I'm like, they're probably not 13, but they're meant to be able to pass for 16, which is kind of weird to me.

[1:38:46] Yeah.

[1:38:48] Well, I've been to those kinds of bar mitzvahs too.

[1:38:49] And then they tricked me into a fucking Zumba routine.

[1:38:51] Like I'm standing there on the dance floor and my wife turns to me and she's like, is this Zumba?

[1:38:57] And then all of a sudden the music is like Zumba, Zumba, Zumba, Zumba.

Elliott Kalan

[1:39:02] And then it becomes a Taibo workout.

[1:39:04] Yeah.

[1:39:05] Yep.

[1:39:06] Next thing you know, you're just cross fitting around.

Dan McCoy

[1:39:08] Yeah.

[1:39:08] This has been Stuart Wellington remembers bar mitzvahs.

Elliott Kalan

[1:39:12] Stuart Wellington's bar mitzvah horror stories.

[1:39:16] I was not being in it.

[1:39:18] I said I would never perform a Zumba routine.

[1:39:21] And yet there I was Zumbaing around.

[1:39:25] Anyway, bar mitzvah horror stories aside, that is a very sweet letter.

[1:39:29] And congratulations.

[1:39:30] And I can speak for maybe all of us, I think, when I say we're happy that you are, you know, being the person you want to be and you feel comfortable as and that you should be.

[1:39:41] That's really nice.

Dan McCoy

[1:39:42] Yeah.

[1:39:43] So moving on to the final segment of the show.

Elliott Kalan

[1:39:45] I feel like, wait, let me just say one thing.

[1:39:47] One thing.

[1:39:48] I talked earlier about.

[1:39:49] Comedians suck.

[1:39:50] What?

[1:39:51] Comedians suck.

[1:39:53] Yeah, now it's on to roasting again.

[1:39:55] No, but what I was saying in that in that to the previous letter about like people not doing the work to be to be the people that they should be or the people that they you know, the versions of themselves.

[1:40:05] I feel like that then the second letter was exactly that sort of thing being like, okay, this is the person that I want to be.

[1:40:12] I'm going to do the work that it takes to be that person.

[1:40:14] It takes a lot of work against, I'm guessing, a lot of a lot of unnecessary obstacles.

[1:40:19] It always makes me very happy when someone has achieved that sort of that self-realization, you know?

Stuart Wellington

[1:40:25] Yeah.

[1:40:25] I mean, I admire it so much considering that like, I feel like for most things I put the bare minimum amount of work into life.

[1:40:34] And like, I know that's got to be so hard.

[1:40:37] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:40:41] Again, moving on to the last segment of the podcast.

Elliott Kalan

[1:40:46] Hey, everybody.

[1:40:47] It's letter time.

[1:40:49] Last segment of the show.

[1:40:51] Letters.

[1:40:51] Dan, read another letter.

Dan McCoy

[1:40:52] No, we're doing our recommendations of movies that you should watch instead of The Snowman.

[1:40:58] Oh, okay.

Elliott Kalan

[1:40:59] Because we could have some more letters.

[1:41:02] Hey, everybody.

[1:41:03] Write us some letters.

Dan McCoy

[1:41:05] Wait, what?

[1:41:06] I didn't pick any extra ones out, so I don't think we could have any extra letters.

Elliott Kalan

[1:41:09] Oh, so where do I start my change.org petition to force you to pick more letters?

Stuart Wellington

[1:41:14] I think, I mean, I think you said it when you just said that.

[1:41:17] Go to change.org.

Elliott Kalan

[1:41:19] Oh, right, right.

[1:41:21] Right.

[1:41:21] Good point.

[1:41:23] I'll recommend a movie.

Dan McCoy

[1:41:23] So, Dan, what's this segment?

[1:41:25] It's recommendations of movies.

Stuart Wellington

[1:41:27] And we recommend movies, right?

[1:41:29] Yeah.

[1:41:29] Not the one.

[1:41:30] What about books?

[1:41:31] Yeah, can we recommend books?

Dan McCoy

[1:41:33] I've done it before, and you guys were really down on me for it, so probably not.

Elliott Kalan

[1:41:38] Okay, so I want to recommend a movie called The Snowman.

[1:41:41] It stars a snowman.

[1:41:44] It's a twist.

[1:41:44] Dan, you recommend your movie.

Dan McCoy

[1:41:47] I watched the movie Southern Comfort.

[1:41:50] They were showing it at the.

Stuart Wellington

[1:41:51] Now, Dan, it sounds like you're recommending an alcoholic beverage and not a movie.

[1:41:56] Are you tricking us again?

Dan McCoy

[1:41:57] I would never recommend Southern Comfort.

[1:41:59] It's gross.

[1:42:01] Wow.

[1:42:02] Hot take alarm.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42:04] What a flip-flop.

[1:42:05] You were just about to recommend it.

[1:42:06] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:42:07] No, not the drink.

[1:42:09] I'm recommending the movie directed by Walter Hill, who directed The Warriors, among other

[1:42:14] things.

[1:42:15] And Bullet to the Head.

[1:42:17] Yeah.

[1:42:17] A movie that I think we kind of liked eventually.

[1:42:20] I think that's where it came from.

[1:42:21] Yeah, yeah, sure.

Dan McCoy

[1:42:22] Yeah, yeah.

[1:42:23] So, Southern Comfort is about a group of National Guardsmen in, I believe, Louisiana?

[1:42:32] I'm not sure.

[1:42:32] I can't remember.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42:34] It checks out.

[1:42:34] That's the South.

Dan McCoy

[1:42:35] They go into.

[1:42:36] And quite comfortable.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42:38] Dan, is there anything else I can do to make you stay a little more pleasant?

Dan McCoy

[1:42:41] I will have another slice of that delicious pie, ma'am.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42:45] Okay, that'll be $13, please.

Dan McCoy

[1:42:47] Oh, wow.

[1:42:48] Okay.

[1:42:49] Real tourist trap you're in.

[1:42:50] Southern hospitality that I heard about.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42:52] Would you like a picture of you eating that pie?

[1:42:54] That'll be another $25, but I'm happy to do it.

[1:42:57] Hey, how about I freshen up your sweet tea?

[1:42:59] That'll be $45, please.

[1:43:01] Wow, you're already doing it.

Dan McCoy

[1:43:03] This trip's house is bankrupting me.

Stuart Wellington

[1:43:05] I'm not a fan of taking the picture first and then showing it to me and trying to get

[1:43:09] me to pay for it.

[1:43:10] Like, I'm paying for the work.

[1:43:11] That sucks.

[1:43:13] It's like putting a bracelet on my wrist and then being like, that's five bucks.

[1:43:16] And I'm like, I didn't even ask for this bracelet.

Elliott Kalan

[1:43:18] Yeah, but I'm guilting you into paying for it because there'll be more work to not to.

[1:43:22] Anyway, Dan, I'm glad to have you here at my Airbnb.

[1:43:26] It's called, that'll be, again, another $300 a night just for the soap.

Dan McCoy

[1:43:32] Okay, well, thanks.

[1:43:33] Anyway, this bit was great, but Southern Comfort, the movie, is about these National Guardsmen

[1:43:40] who go on these training exercises in the swamp and they've mostly just got blanks in their

[1:43:47] guns and they go and they run into some Cajuns.

[1:43:51] They make a few mistakes.

[1:43:55] They borrow a boat from the Cajuns and then one of the people shoots off a couple of rounds

[1:44:01] of blanks to scare them.

[1:44:04] And they don't take it as a joke, these Cajuns, as you might expect.

[1:44:09] They're not happy about interlopers in their backwoods Cajun hideaway.

[1:44:16] Now, would you call these Cajuns raging at this point?

[1:44:19] Cajuns are at that point raging.

[1:44:21] And they start picking off the soldiers one by one and it's very tense.

[1:44:28] I actually, I have to admit, I fell asleep a little bit during the second act because I

[1:44:34] was tired.

[1:44:35] It's a tense pot boiler that also functions as a sedative.

[1:44:39] I slept because I was tired.

[1:44:41] The movie started at 930.

[1:44:43] I was a little tired.

[1:44:44] But it's not the kind of movie where if you drift off for a little bit, you're lost.

[1:44:48] It's a very simple premise.

Stuart Wellington

[1:44:51] Wow.

[1:44:52] Clever way to turn lemons into lemonade.

Dan McCoy

[1:44:55] I did watch the third act, which has, the third act has just an amazing.

[1:44:59] I did watch the third act, raves Dan.

[1:45:02] The third act has an amazing sequence set to this Cajun music where these guys have to escape

[1:45:10] a conclave of these people.

[1:45:13] And it's just really tense and exciting and fun.

[1:45:18] And so I recommend Southern Comfort.

Elliott Kalan

[1:45:19] I love that Walter Hill, I'm sure, was listening to that and was like, oh, an underseen movie

[1:45:24] of mine.

[1:45:24] I can't wait to hear it.

[1:45:25] What?

Stuart Wellington

[1:45:27] I think Dan turned it around at the end, you know?

[1:45:29] Yeah.

[1:45:30] Yeah.

[1:45:31] It was a full arc of a story.

[1:45:35] That was that second act breakup that Dan hates.

[1:45:38] Mm-hmm.

[1:45:40] Oh, man.

[1:45:41] I have two movies that I really strongly want to recommend, and I don't want to wait until

[1:45:45] next episode to split them up.

[1:45:46] So I'm going to do them both.

[1:45:49] I, yesterday I watched, uh, Call Me By Your Name right before, uh, cause the Oscars are

[1:45:55] tonight and it's one of the last ones that I hadn't seen.

[1:45:58] And oh man, I couldn't stop crying after that.

[1:46:02] It's just fucking great, man.

[1:46:04] Uh, all the performances are great.

[1:46:06] Uh, it really captures the feel of being, uh, like young and in love and on vacation.

[1:46:14] And, uh, and also the way that when you're as a, like when you're a teenager, the way you

[1:46:21] look up to people that are a few years older or a lot of years older and, uh, and the way

[1:46:26] you kind of both idolize and want to emulate them.

[1:46:30] Um, but also that gets mixed in with like desire and the way that even, even if you were to take

[1:46:39] like sexual attraction out of there, the way you might resent when the, the, your idol shares any

[1:46:46] kind of attention with someone that isn't you.

[1:46:49] Uh, it's just, man, it's just so great.

[1:46:51] I totally recommend it.

[1:46:53] And, uh, I also want to recommend Annihilation.

[1:46:56] Um, a, uh, a science fiction movie based on a series of books that I really liked.

[1:47:03] And the movie is a lot different, very much its own thing.

[1:47:06] Uh, it is obvious at this point, very much underseen.

[1:47:11] I think it, by the time this comes out, it'll probably already have left theaters.

[1:47:16] Um, and it's a weird one, like it's beautiful and scary and, uh, it's, it's, I don't know.

[1:47:25] It's not, it's certainly not for everyone.

[1:47:26] I've already had one argument over text message with my mother-in-law about it.

[1:47:33] And, uh, the, yeah, it's just great.

[1:47:37] Like I, the, the other day I was, I was making breakfast and my wife came into the kitchen and

[1:47:44] she was like, what, what music, what's that music you're playing?

[1:47:47] And I'm like, Crosby stills a Nash and Charlene's like, is that because of that movie?

[1:47:54] So I guess it's, it's a lot like seeing Annihilation is a lot like going into the shimmer.

[1:47:59] You, you don't come back unchanged.

[1:48:01] You know what I mean?

[1:48:03] Uh, it's just a hard, I don't know.

[1:48:05] Go see it.

[1:48:06] Annihilation.

[1:48:07] It's great.

Elliott Kalan

[1:48:07] Yeah.

[1:48:08] I'll co-sign that.

[1:48:08] I saw it and I loved it.

[1:48:09] So, uh, I haven't seen it, but I'll co-sign the lease cause I trust you guys.

[1:48:15] You're not going to leave me with the bill for Annihilation?

Stuart Wellington

[1:48:18] Uh, I mean, I don't think so.

[1:48:19] I, I, I enjoyed it.

[1:48:21] I'll gladly pay, pay my price or the price of a ticket, you know?

Elliott Kalan

[1:48:25] Good.

[1:48:25] Cause I, cause I trust you guys, you know, this, I don't want to be left holding the bag

[1:48:28] on this.

[1:48:29] I don't know if it's, I don't know if it's for you.

Stuart Wellington

[1:48:32] Elliot, do you like, do you like intelligent science fiction movies?

Elliott Kalan

[1:48:37] Hmm.

[1:48:37] How would you classify Johnny Mnemonic?

[1:48:40] Is that intelligent?

Stuart Wellington

[1:48:42] Uh, I would say it's pretty intelligent.

[1:48:45] That's the one where Takeshi Kitano has a monofilament whip for a thumb, right?

Elliott Kalan

[1:48:50] Yep.

[1:48:50] And where Dolph Lundrigan is some kind of cyborg priest.

Stuart Wellington

[1:48:54] That was, that was great because after I saw that movie, every single game of Shadowrun

[1:48:58] I was in featured at least one, one heavy that had a monofilament whip thumb.

Elliott Kalan

[1:49:04] They could have come up with that idea on their own, but you never know.

[1:49:07] That's a common idea.

[1:49:08] Yeah.

[1:49:08] I mean, monofilament whip thumb, just a coincidence.

[1:49:12] Okay, guys, time for me to recommend a movie.

[1:49:15] And you know what?

[1:49:16] This movie has a connection with the movie we watched today and that it was also edited

[1:49:20] by Thelma Schoonmacher, the, uh, the longtime editor of Martin Scorsese movies.

[1:49:25] Hey, it's a Martin Scorsese movie.

[1:49:27] Maybe that's why.

[1:49:29] And I wanted to recommend the movie Silence, uh, that came out a couple years ago.

[1:49:33] That's, uh, it's a movie about two, uh, Portuguese missionaries who've been sent to Japan in

[1:49:38] the 17th century when Japan has outlawed Catholicism and is actively, uh, just killing

[1:49:46] Catholics left and right.

[1:49:47] And they've been sent to find a Catholic priest who was, went missing before them and who it's

[1:49:52] rumored has given up on the faith and given in and become a, uh, complicit with the Japanese

[1:49:57] government.

[1:49:57] And it's a kind of a lumpy movie.

[1:50:01] Not everything in it works perfectly.

[1:50:03] And by a certain point, when you've seen the sixth or seventh person tortured in it, you're

[1:50:09] like, all right, okay, this is a lot of, okay, Eli Roth.

[1:50:13] But there's a, but I thought, but the, it's another one of these instances of like, you're

[1:50:18] watching certain scenes and you're like, oh yeah, this is because Martin Scorsese is one

[1:50:21] of the best kind of like just technical filmmakers around.

[1:50:24] And I found it very moving in the sense of a movie that like takes faith seriously, but it's not

[1:50:31] blinded to the problems of faith and to the, it doesn't try to answer the questions that

[1:50:36] it raises about whether kind of faith is worth it and what you owe to somebody else because

[1:50:42] of their faith or because of your faith and what the best way to express your, your religion

[1:50:47] or your love for God is.

[1:50:49] And I found, yeah, the performance is really good in it.

[1:50:52] And it's a movie that never quite reaches the heights that it's reaching for, but it makes

[1:50:58] you think a lot about those heights.

[1:51:00] And I really enjoyed that aspect of it.

[1:51:02] It's a, it's a long end, right?

[1:51:04] It's long.

[1:51:05] It's a, well, it's like, yeah, it's about two hours and 40 minutes long.

Stuart Wellington

[1:51:08] And that's got a, it's got Garfield and Kylo Ren in it, right?

Elliott Kalan

[1:51:11] Yes.

[1:51:12] It's got Spider-Man and Kylo Ren as the, as the main characters.

[1:51:15] And they're looking for Liam Neeson, who ironically has been taken himself this time by a Japanese

[1:51:20] political system.

[1:51:21] How many ninjas are in the movie?

[1:51:23] Too many?

[1:51:24] There are too many ninjas.

[1:51:25] I would say, yeah, the other alternate title for the movie was too many ninjas.

[1:51:30] There's no ninjas in it.

[1:51:32] And it's, it's also one of these movies where it was set in feudal Japan, Elliot.

[1:51:37] Uh, yeah, true.

[1:51:38] Well, there are some samurai.

[1:51:39] Okay.

[1:51:40] But it is one of these movies too, where it's like, you have your big American stars, uh,

[1:51:44] and Liam Neeson, who's what?

[1:51:45] Irish.

[1:51:46] But, uh, and Andrew Garfield's not American either, I guess.

[1:51:49] But, uh, then you have the Japanese actors in it and the Japanese actors just blow the

[1:51:54] American Western actors away.

[1:51:55] Like the Japanese actors are so good in it.

[1:51:58] And in a way that like mixes, there's like two styles of Japanese acting.

[1:52:04] And I'm generalizing greatly.

[1:52:05] There's a very big over the top style that's usually done by the like crazy or outcast character.

[1:52:10] It's a very subdued small style of acting.

[1:52:13] And both of those are on display here really fantastically.

[1:52:16] So the acting is fantastic in it.

Stuart Wellington

[1:52:18] It's the full, uh, Mifune spectrum.

Elliott Kalan

[1:52:21] Yeah, basically.

[1:52:22] Yeah.

[1:52:22] You get both sides.

[1:52:23] They use all parts of the Mifune in this one.

[1:52:26] Uh, so silence.

[1:52:27] Underseen Martin Scorsese.

[1:52:29] It's long.

[1:52:29] It's an undertaking, but I would recommend it.

Stuart Wellington

[1:52:32] Okay, Dan.

[1:52:33] Any, uh, any scrolling pics on your phone?

[1:52:35] Anything cool in there?

Dan McCoy

[1:52:36] Uh, I got a text from a mutual friend and I was just saying what that was about.

[1:52:40] Oh, cool.

[1:52:41] You got to the bottom of it?

[1:52:42] Yeah.

[1:52:43] Yeah.

[1:52:43] Dan McCoy text detective solved another case.

[1:52:47] Oh, finally.

Elliott Kalan

[1:52:48] Text dog detective.

Dan McCoy

[1:52:50] Uh, so we should sign off.

[1:52:53] That being the last segment of the show, the next thing that happens is usually going home.

Elliott Kalan

[1:52:57] Yeah.

[1:52:58] I like, or except for you who are in your home already and me who's in my home.

[1:53:01] Dan, I'd like to salute the way that we were just kind of rolling the show to a regular close.

[1:53:07] Uh-huh.

[1:53:08] We had like kind of a low-key momentum going.

[1:53:11] Mm-hmm.

[1:53:11] And then, uh, you decided to check it out.

[1:53:13] Of Thor.

[1:53:14] Of Thor.

[1:53:14] You decided to check the text on your phone and throw off even what little energy we had

[1:53:19] going into the conclusion.

Dan McCoy

[1:53:21] Guys, for, I want to.

[1:53:22] To be fair, no one needed to comment on the fact that I was looking at my phone.

[1:53:25] It could have passed unremarked upon.

Stuart Wellington

[1:53:27] Mm, I don't know if that's in my character, Dan.

[1:53:31] That's not, that's not me living my truth.

[1:53:33] Now, uh, before we sign off, I say we do like a, we do a prediction because, I mean,

[1:53:40] our predictions are going to seem ridiculous.

[1:53:42] Like when I said that no way would we hire a president with hair as ridiculous as Jonathan

[1:53:46] Price in our G.I.

[1:53:47] Joe retaliation episode.

[1:53:49] Yeah, and that's exactly what happened.

[1:53:49] And I have not been able to live it down.

Elliott Kalan

[1:53:51] You were like, no way will we elect a president who's an openly evil man working for a power

[1:53:56] that wants to destroy America.

[1:53:58] No way.

[1:53:58] But then we did it.

[1:53:59] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[1:54:01] That was, that was all I could think about on that, uh, that election night was my stupid

[1:54:06] words coming to haunt me.

[1:54:07] Um, but, uh, yeah.

[1:54:09] Do you have a, do you have any prediction, Oscar predictions, best picture?

[1:54:12] Do you have something you would like to win?

Elliott Kalan

[1:54:14] I think, I mean, there's a, uh, it's weird because so many people focus on the Academy

[1:54:19] Awards, either snubs or the losers.

[1:54:22] But there are so many things nominated this year where I'm like, yeah, I could see that

[1:54:26] winning and I, and it would deserve it.

[1:54:27] Like there were a lot of really good movies that came out this past year.

[1:54:30] And like, you have all these, I'm sure the one movie I really haven't seen much of is

[1:54:35] Darkest Hour.

[1:54:36] And I'm sure that'll win a bunch because it's kind of easy going, you know, but, uh, like

[1:54:40] in a year when you have like movies as diverse as, and I don't mean diverse in terms of racial

[1:54:46] and gender, but just in type of movie as get out, call me by your name, lady bird, shape

[1:54:52] of water, like nominated.

[1:54:54] What?

[1:54:55] Phantom thread.

[1:54:56] Phantom thread.

[1:54:57] Yeah.

[1:54:57] Like being nominated for things, it's like, there is a, there's a, I like to look at the

[1:55:02] Oscars less as about the winners and more about what type of stuff, the variety of stuff that

[1:55:07] gets nominated.

[1:55:07] And it's like, movies are in a pretty good place if they can have that, they, that wide

[1:55:13] and that high quality of stuff.

[1:55:14] Does it mean the best thing will win?

[1:55:16] No, probably not.

[1:55:17] But I kind of love that we live in a place right now where not that, not the place where

[1:55:21] the Oscars have gotten very politically polarized, which is, I understand why it is.

[1:55:25] And I agree with much of it and I don't agree with all of it, but that in a world where shape

[1:55:30] of water is becoming like the middle of the road consensus mainstream choice, which is a

[1:55:36] movie about, oh, it's a Guillermo del Toro movie about a woman who has sex with a fish

[1:55:41] man where like, it's a crazy movie.

[1:55:44] And the act that we live in a world that has become so comfortable with that type of movie

[1:55:49] that it's like, oh yeah, a lot of the older people are picking shape of water because they

[1:55:53] just feel more comfortable with it.

[1:55:54] Like, I like that.

[1:55:55] I like that aspect of this world that we live in.

Stuart Wellington

[1:55:58] This movie does feature a fish man eating masturbation eggs, but it does celebrate classic

[1:56:04] Hollywood.

[1:56:05] So.

Elliott Kalan

[1:56:05] But it's like, this is the movie that really reflects where we are.

[1:56:08] It's a movie where a fish man bites the head off a cat.

[1:56:12] And it's kind of an adorable moment in a way because it's like, oh, he doesn't know.

[1:56:16] He's just a fish man.

[1:56:17] Like as much as there are a lot of great movies that are nominated this year.

[1:56:20] And like, I don't know, if you look at it as a field of nominees being honored by getting

[1:56:26] greater attention that way, I think it's, I think we're in good shape, but who's going

[1:56:29] to win?

[1:56:29] I don't know.

[1:56:30] Dan Stewart.

[1:56:30] What do you guys think?

[1:56:31] I've rambled on.

Stuart Wellington

[1:56:32] I mean, but do you have something you would like to win?

[1:56:35] Do you have a favorite of the best picture nominees?

[1:56:37] Do you have a snub?

[1:56:38] Like I wish Florida, I wish Florida project had been nominated for best picture.

[1:56:42] Cause it's really beautiful and great.

Elliott Kalan

[1:56:44] But yeah, I mean, it's, it's, I'd rather look at the, I'd rather look at the positive

[1:56:48] side of it and what did get nominated than be like, oh, but not this one because you

[1:56:53] don't have to dunk on me, dude.

[1:56:54] I was just trying to talk up Florida project.

[1:56:57] No, no.

[1:56:58] I'm like Florida project.

[1:56:59] Sorry.

[1:56:59] You didn't bring it all.

[1:57:00] You didn't want it badly enough, but, but I don't know.

[1:57:04] It's like, if I think I'll only be disappointed if the post wins, I guess, if it's like, because

[1:57:12] that is a movie that feels like, okay, this is a movie that did not try particularly hard

[1:57:17] to do anything.

[1:57:18] And it feels so bland and it feels like, I mean, and the people who made it are amazing.

[1:57:24] Everyone is, is amazing.

[1:57:25] Steven Spielberg's amazing.

[1:57:26] Like that's, that's the disappointment for me is you have some of the most talented high

[1:57:30] profile people in, in the movies and this is what they made.

[1:57:34] And it feels like you can make, you can make a movie like spotlight, which is very similar

[1:57:39] and is so good and so tense and immediate.

[1:57:42] Or you can make a movie like the post where it's like, all right, like it feels like I'm

[1:57:47] watching like, like history illustrated comics or something like that.

[1:57:51] You know, and it's just about eating my vegetables or something.

Stuart Wellington

[1:57:53] And talking about like the freedom of press is important, but try not to make it seem so boring.

Elliott Kalan

[1:57:59] Well, like here's a movie that's like, Hey, freedom of the press is important.

[1:58:03] And never during the movie did I feel like, Oh, I had, they have to get this story out.

[1:58:07] I'm like, I'm going to, this is like, it never made me feel anything.

[1:58:10] And it doesn't help that the first half of the movie is a bunch of people being like,

[1:58:13] look at all the great work the New York times is doing.

[1:58:15] It's like, yeah, they are like, why am I paying attention to you?

[1:58:18] Assholes?

[1:58:18] Like, let's go look at the times they're doing it.

[1:58:21] You know?

[1:58:21] Yeah.

[1:58:22] It's like if, uh, if the bad news bears, if the bad news bears were spent the whole movie

[1:58:26] being like, look at that team of misfits.

[1:58:28] That's winning all the games.

[1:58:29] Oh man, I wish we could be like them.

[1:58:31] Like, yeah, let me see them.

[1:58:34] Or if Teen Wolf was about one of the other teams and they're like, Oh, we wish we had

[1:58:38] a Teen Wolf on our team.

[1:58:39] Man, wouldn't that be great if we had our own werewolf?

[1:58:42] Yeah.

[1:58:42] Show me the werewolf, dude.

[1:58:43] That's my big, my big.

[1:58:45] Show me the werewolf.

Dan McCoy

[1:58:47] Show me the werewolf.

[1:58:50] Uh, I mean, I don't really have much to say.

[1:58:52] I, I want, I, if, if my favorite movie of the year that I saw won, it would be Phantom Thread.

[1:59:01] But I looked at the odds makers and that has, they currently have that as 100 to one.

Elliott Kalan

[1:59:07] And you're that one.

[1:59:09] Oh wait, I can think of one.

[1:59:10] There's one movie I wish was nominated for more stuff and that's Mother.

[1:59:13] Because I thought that was a really amazing movie.

[1:59:15] But I, it's like, it's a weird movie.

[1:59:18] I get what.

[1:59:19] But it's, I like, in a world where Mother is too weird but Shape of Water is not, we're

[1:59:23] getting closer to a world where Mother is not too weird.

[1:59:26] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:59:27] Uh, no, I mean, like, they changed the makeup of the voting academy and I think, I think

[1:59:32] you really see it.

[1:59:32] I think that there are a lot of younger, in quotes, movies being honored.

[1:59:38] Um, and that's nice to see.

Stuart Wellington

[1:59:42] Yeah.

[1:59:43] I don't know, I hope Get Out wins because it's awesome.

[1:59:45] Okay.

Elliott Kalan

[1:59:46] It is awesome.

[1:59:47] And what, that's, it's like, what's wonderful about where we are now in terms of movies is

[1:59:52] that I feel like the Oscars have gotten decoupled from the idea of these are the best movies.

[1:59:57] Yeah.

[1:59:57] Like, of the past 10 years, how many times was the, and I'm sure this is true for all of

[2:00:03] cinema history, but it's so much easier to see movies now and to see them if you missed

[2:00:09] them before, that like, you don't have to rely on them winning Best Picture to be remembered

[2:00:13] for a hundred years.

[2:00:13] Like, Get Out's going to be remembered for a hundred years.

[2:00:15] Yeah.

[2:00:16] And it doesn't need to win Best Picture to do that.

[2:00:17] But if it did win Best Picture, I'd be really happy because it's a great movie.

[2:00:21] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[2:00:22] That'd be interesting too.

[2:00:23] I mean, you know, Silence of the Lambs is the last horror movie that won Best Picture.

[2:00:27] You know, I like a little genre in my, uh, in my film.

[2:00:30] Mm-hmm.

Elliott Kalan

[2:00:32] I would consider The King's Speech a horror movie.

[2:00:35] Whoa.

[2:00:36] Whoa.

[2:00:36] The horror of whether he's going to be able to give that speech.

Stuart Wellington

[2:00:40] Did he, did that win Best Picture?

Elliott Kalan

[2:00:42] It did, I believe.

[2:00:43] Yeah.

[2:00:44] Oh, wow.

[2:00:45] Yeah.

[2:00:46] I mean, it's fine.

[2:00:46] I guess.

[2:00:47] I was looking back at the last few, the last few movies that won.

[2:00:49] I mean, Birdman is kind of a horror movie in some ways, but the last, but they're like

[2:00:53] a bunch of movies that won Best Picture where you're like, oh yeah, that's right.

[2:00:57] Cause the movie that wins Best Picture gets forgotten much of the time.

[2:01:01] Like who's, who's out there watching the artist right now or like watching The King's Speech

[2:01:07] or Chicago or any, you know, any of that stuff.

[2:01:10] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[2:01:11] It's like a, like a curse.

[2:01:13] So basically what we're saying is this segment, which was already not, uh, relevant

[2:01:18] because it'll come out long after the Oscars is extra not relevant because the Oscars aren't

[2:01:23] relevant.

[2:01:25] Yeah.

[2:01:26] I guess that's fine.

Stuart Wellington

[2:01:28] I just want to talk about movies with my friends for a second, Dan.

Dan McCoy

[2:01:32] We've literally been doing it for two hours at this point, but sure.

Stuart Wellington

[2:01:35] Okay, cool.

[2:01:36] Fine.

[2:01:36] Signing off.

[2:01:37] You're Dan.

[2:01:38] I'm Stuart and that's Elliot.

[2:01:39] Peace.

[2:01:40] Wow.

Dan McCoy

[2:01:43] And I guess we're leaving on that note.

Elliott Kalan

[2:01:47] Yeah.

[2:01:47] Well, who, who caused that?

[2:01:49] Who played that note?

[2:01:50] Dan, you did.

Dan McCoy

[2:01:52] I said peace, dude.

Elliott Kalan

[2:01:55] He said peace, but it sounded more like war.

Dan McCoy

[2:01:57] Yeah.

[2:01:58] Uh, I guess namaste to everybody.

[2:02:04] I'm going to, let's do it.

[2:02:06] Let's do it.

[2:02:06] Nice.

[2:02:07] This time.

[2:02:07] I've been Dan McCoy.

[2:02:08] Hey, I'm Stuart Wellington.

Elliott Kalan

[2:02:10] Hey, I'm Elliot Kalin.

[2:02:12] The nice guy saying, have a nice day from us.

[2:02:16] The flop house, the positivity podcast.

[2:02:18] That's all about making everybody feel better and compliments.

Dan McCoy

[2:02:22] Uh, good night, everyone.

Stuart Wellington

[2:02:29] And our waiter is an old friend of Alex Smith's who, uh, this guy, Brendan, who plays the guy

[2:02:36] who goes crazy in the beginning of the new, uh, not new, but, uh, recent, more recent, uh,

[2:02:43] Amityville horror remake with Ryan Reynolds.

[2:02:45] Oh, really?

[2:02:47] Yeah.

[2:02:48] Big stars.

[2:02:49] That's pretty impressive.

Elliott Kalan

[2:02:50] Yeah.

[2:02:50] It was a glamor night.

Stuart Wellington

[2:02:52] Yeah.

[2:02:53] He was saying, uh, that when they shot a scene where, uh, they were both in a bathroom, like

[2:02:58] Ryan Reynolds is in a bathroom looking in the mirror and he sees Brendan's face instead of

[2:03:02] his own face.

[2:03:03] Uh, uh, Brendan was like, yeah, he was like wet in every scene and man, he's just got an

[2:03:09] amazing body.

[2:03:14] So that's, that's my review for Amityville horror.

[2:03:17] Maximum fun.org comedy and culture artist owned listener supported.

Ep. #253 - The Snowman

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