Ep. #310 - Bloodshot

[0:00] on this episode we discuss bloodshot a phrase that is never mentioned during

[0:06] the movie that's is that true I can't tell no they never say I don't think

[0:10] they ever call him bloodshot yeah they call him bloodshot I think I peer says

[0:14] you are bloodshot now when he wakes up he says you're the bloodshot now dog

[0:30] hey everyone welcome to the flop house I'm Dan McCoy hey I'm Stuart Wellington

[0:52] I'm Elliot Kalin owner of a brand new hot water heater because mine was

[0:56] leaking okay how's everybody doing today save that juicy talk for after we

[1:00] introduce our guest you know see leaky you know our guests from the tick where

[1:07] he played Arthur you know him from the blank check podcast you know him for

[1:11] being a tie for my girlfriend Audrey's second favorite podcaster after Hallie

[1:17] Haglund tied with la kalin for second favorite podcaster I assume I'm in the

[1:22] top 25 at least don't make an assumption Dan you know what happens when you

[1:26] assume it's Griffin everyone hello hi if you can please add to my credits

[1:33] Griffin Newman world's number one bloodshot fan yeah yeah you're a real

[1:38] Vin addict when I'm a Vin addict I'm a big vino but I also I feel like truly I

[1:46] may be the only person who has voluntarily watched this movie two times

[1:49] now yes Stewart said you were watching and I'm like I follow him on Instagram

[1:54] I'm pretty sure Griffin has already seen bloodshot I'm telling you I got

[1:59] only sounds a little creepy there right I got a lot of new stuff on the second

[2:04] viewing and I am not joking at all I am so happy I spent the extra hour and 50

[2:10] giving it another run so before we get into bloodshot because on this podcast

[2:14] we watch a bad movie then we talk about it Griffin I want to know what what is

[2:17] it about the D's and I'm talking about of course Eddie Deason that really

[2:22] that you're such a big fan of him what is it about Vin Diesel that like you

[2:25] really relate to someone because you are a big Vin head yeah yeah yeah I mean you

[2:30] know it's taken me a while to fully analyze what it is that you know

[2:35] attracts me to him so much because it's you know it's what is love how do you

[2:39] define it you know well let's say let's try to let's try to kind of graph it out

[2:43] some kind of Vin diagram if you will this this is what I will say I think an

[2:48] ex-girlfriend of mine summed up the best because any ex-girlfriend of mine

[2:52] essentially has to take an undergraduate course on Vin Diesel whether or not they

[2:57] want not like as a prerequisite but it comes with the territory of spending my

[3:00] post requisite yes it's a post requisite once they've signed up to spend time

[3:04] with me there's a heavily curated playlist of things that we have to watch

[3:10] some short form some long form but I was explaining my love of Vin Diesel and my

[3:17] love of Guns and Roses who are my favorite band of all time and and she

[3:22] said I get it I think I finally get it you like things that are like a parody

[3:27] of masculinity okay yeah I can see that I mean I get the appeal to some extent

[3:34] you know you guys all know I'm pretty into D&D and by that I mean diesel and

[3:40] D's nuts jokes that's my whole joke now I that's good that's a certain amount of

[3:50] confusion about this because like I like Vin Diesel but I'm not quite sure why

[3:56] not in like with him because I feel like in his non voice acting roles he does

[4:02] not exude much in the way of personality well I disagree with you there yeah I

[4:08] want to hear your defense Elliot oh no I think I think kind of a caricature or

[4:14] an exaggeration of masculinity makes sense to me Vin Diesel even when he's

[4:18] playing the serious part it's always pretty is always winking when he's

[4:24] playing a serious part like Xander Cage or pitch black or fast because but he's

[4:28] in fast and the furious his character is Johnny fast and then the late Paul

[4:33] is of course is of course Roger furious but it's that there's something about him

[4:41] that's always kind of like about to look at the audience and be like can you

[4:45] believe I get to do this shit and I really find that endearing about him

[4:48] that he he doesn't of all if you compare it to someone like ironically Jason

[4:53] Statham who is a much winkier performer I get the feeling that he's like no no

[4:57] no I could do all these things if you asked me to do him in real life I could

[5:00] do them whereas Vin Diesel is like this is all made-up craziness like let's just

[5:04] blow it out let's have fun with it like if Griffin is that how you feel or a

[5:07] hundred percent you you nailed that perfectly and I think if you want to

[5:10] like establish you know three points on a masculinity scale right and it's

[5:15] cinematic masculinity like our modern action star right and it's Statham the

[5:20] Rock and Vin Diesel and I'm not ranking them in terms of quality although Vin is

[5:25] obviously the top but I'm saying like if you look on the louder I'm sure I mean

[5:29] Statham is it is a pretender I just I feel like we're running down Statham a

[5:38] lot more than I'm comfortable with because I feel like I love I love

[5:41] Statham I love Statham but I do think there's a distinction which as Elliot

[5:45] said Statham is more openly winking to the audience right whereas Vin has a

[5:51] greater level of sincerity than Statham but is also more self-aware than the

[5:57] Rock who is so fully buying his own bullshit you know yes and Vin's like

[6:02] right between the two Statham for me though I love him is a little bit too

[6:09] winky to be able to fully emotionally invest in him as a protagonist the whole

[6:14] movie is always in quotes and then the Rock is buying his own bullshit a little

[6:18] bit too much and I think Vin is this perfect balance in terms of the like

[6:22] machismo baldies of the 2000s and on where he like means everything he says

[6:29] in like a John Wayne kind of way where it's like it does not resemble normal

[6:34] human behavior but it is imbued with as much emotional integrity as possible but

[6:39] he is also so aware that he is himself like a special effect like his voice the

[6:45] fact that his name is goddamn Vin Diesel which was by choice like everything about

[6:50] it yeah someone once told me that the name Vin Diesel he came up with because

[6:54] when he was young he spent time around around in the drag community I guess and

[7:00] there's something about him that is like drag racing right drag racing yeah that's

[7:05] it no there's something is there's something in him that is kind of like a

[7:08] a I assume I don't know anything about his personal life I have always assumed

[7:12] he's straight but I don't know like a straight man who is like I'm going to

[7:15] totally absorb into me that kind of like comment on masculinity that is part of

[7:23] drag you know and I'm gonna make that part of my persona in a way that is both

[7:26] straightforward and both commenting but he it's weird that like when you turn

[7:30] about bald masculinity the person I would compare Vin Diesel the most with

[7:33] strangely enough strangely enough is Telly Savalas yes yes it was where I had

[7:38] a similar sense of like this guy means what he says but he also knows that what

[7:42] he's saying is kind of crazy and like but he's going all out with it you know

[7:45] Elliot I hate to tell you this but I but I might fuck you by the end of this

[7:49] episode things I have said about Vin to other people and be things I have never

[7:58] even figured out how to verbalize before you know do you know that Kojak is one

[8:03] of Vin Diesel's favorite characters of all time for the last five years he's

[8:06] been trying to set up a Kojak movie that's crazy that he hasn't been able to

[8:10] set up it is his dream job he has it set up at Universal where he makes the

[8:14] Fast and Furious movies and presumably he should be able to make whatever the

[8:17] fuck he wants and he has been announcing it for five years that he's doing a

[8:20] project as a tribute to his mother who apparently he used to watch it with her

[8:25] all the time and it was his favorite when he was a child sweet he would be a

[8:29] great Kojak I wish that he was not they'd have to find some way to make him

[8:32] not look like a superhero yeah at least a little bit maybe a mustache like well

[8:38] seen paparazzi photos of Vin on vacation in between movies I will say I think he

[8:44] has the capacity to look like not a superhero and he is also and I say this

[8:50] with all due respect 52 years old a fact that I were like to circulate as

[8:56] much as possible is Vin Diesel and Paul Giamatti were born one month apart so he

[9:02] puts a lot of effort in so you're saying that the modern version of twins

[9:11] is the Vin Diesel and Paul Giamatti playing the Arnold Schwarzenegger and

[9:16] Danny Vito Rose this is like a Salman Rushdie magical realist novel and I'm

[9:22] also saying with all due respect because it is it is a testament to his work ethic

[9:27] but pretty much I'd say give him one lease lazy weekend and Vin Diesel can no

[9:32] longer look like a superhero Stuart this is very stupid but I need to get this out

[9:37] please Vin Knight's children yeah yeah no it's perfect um and to go back to

[9:46] comparing Vin Diesel and The Rock one of the things that I feel like I prefer one

[9:50] of the things that gives Vin the edge for me is I don't feel like at any point

[9:54] in the future am I going to have to worry about having to vote for or against

[9:58] him in a political

[10:00] I feel like there is something to him for as much as he is like

[10:05] Was one of these guys who was tip of the spear on social media is constantly posting like

[10:10] Fan art of himself with like live love create Happy Friday and shit like that

[10:16] Yeah, feels like he has cultivated less of a cult of personality around him

[10:22] Then someone like the rock who is also selling us like his fucking workout equipment and his like tequila and his constant

[10:29] Towing that line of like I don't know

[10:31] Do you want me to be president and I also think as you said like the rock wants to be and I'm sorry

[10:38] I'm gonna go hard after the rock here

[10:39] But you have to if you're ever talking about Vin Diesel if you really want to defend Vin Diesel's honor

[10:44] Compare him to the rock because the rock is the one who who most people

[10:49] Accept as the best at what he's trying to do, right?

[10:52] Which I reject because I think the rock a is

[10:57] Lesson on the joke and what we're talking about

[10:59] I do think the key of Vin Diesel for me is Elliot as you said that he kind of is giving a

[11:04] Drag performance of an action star, you know, it is like, you know

[11:09] He is doing to Arnold Schwarzenegger what like a drag queen is doing to Judy Garland in a certain way

[11:15] It feels like the only thing that makes the triple X movies bearable is that Vin Diesel is like, whoa

[11:21] This isn't real. Can you imagine this stuff like any any moment with him?

[11:25] He is playing it like if they're if to have and I don't mind knocking Jason Statham

[11:31] I don't I don't have the same affection for him

[11:32] but like if Jason Statham was in triple X return of Xander Cage the moment when

[11:36] That room full of women makes him have sex with them to get his coat back

[11:39] It's like the things I do for my country Jason Statham would say that in this kind of leering like yeah

[11:44] I get to have sex with these women now, whereas Vin Diesel was like, can you believe how silly this scene is?

[11:49] And I also think you look at the first triple X and the third triple X and the third one is the one where it feels

[11:55] Like he has claimed some level of authorship over the movie

[11:59] And it is so much better and so much less toxic than the first one

[12:04] Which is Vin being self-aware in a movie that is kind of horrifying

[12:10] Feels like it's totally on his level

[12:12] We were all tired of our daddy's James Bond and it was time for not our daddy's James Bond

[12:17] Like I was like, oh how many times is my daddy's James Bond gonna be inflicted on me?

[12:21] And by the time the third triple X came out we were ready for not our daddy's triple X

[12:26] Right. I just I remember that when the first triple X came out and this is a this is a quote

[12:31] I had to read I researched because I remembered it

[12:33] I want to make sure I got it right and I used it in a

[12:35] presentation when we talked about triple X before a live audience where the producer or the producer the director was like

[12:40] We basically took the best parts of Dirty Dozen and Kelly's hero and help Kelly's heroes and smashed them together into one movie and I

[12:46] Was like whoa

[12:49] Ubristic thing to say like that's such a crappy thing to say but also if that's what you thought you did

[12:53] Do you hate Kelly's heroes and the Dirty Dozen?

[12:59] No, I mean like I have affection for the first triple X but then like only on Vin levels and for it being such a

[13:06] painful time capsule of the year

[13:08] 2003 but I think like triple X 3 I was like, well, I've like, you know

[13:13] I have to do my my duty as like a civilian and and go see the new Vin movie in theaters

[13:19] And then was surprised by how much I actually liked it and to go back to the rock thing

[13:24] It's like you go to Hobbes and Shaw where every character has to exist in a scene

[13:30] Next to the rock to prove how masculine the rock is and it doesn't feel like it's a joke

[13:36] Even though it is supposed to be a joke only in the sense that it makes the rock look funny

[13:41] So that you know, he's funny on top of being kind and the toughest guy, but also something like that

[13:48] Vanessa Kirby has to be sexually attracted and to the rock in Hobbes and Shaw despite being 20 years

[13:56] younger than him and

[13:59] literally

[14:00] He is a not a human in that film

[14:03] It is scientifically impossible that the two of them are together

[14:07] We're as in like triple X State the Union or not save you I'm sorry returns the undercage the third entry in the triple X trilogy

[14:15] The to put the last of the X's. Yes, triple X. This is the final X. Yeah X X

[14:22] Who knows? Yeah, maybe they'll be triple X 3 one more X X 9

[14:29] But but in that film the the two quote-unquote hot girls are attracted to each other

[14:34] Which it just feels like it's something that the rock would never do

[14:38] Like have two hot women in a movie who are like we don't want to fuck you

[14:42] We're gonna fuck each other and it is not treated as a joke. And also there isn't a sex scene

[14:47] Yeah

[14:48] All right, you turn around y'all turn me around right? There's a certain generosity to Vin Diesel

[14:53] Yeah, I mean when we were watching triple X 3 return as Andrew Cage

[14:59] Mm-hmm. I got such a moment of genuine joy when Ice Cube showed up and like the audience

[15:06] I was watching it with just screamed even though none of them had seen the second movie

[15:11] But isn't that like the entire power of what he pulled off with the Fast and Furious franchise is like fast five

[15:19] Has the energy of this is the Avengers were finally uniting all of the greatest cinematic characters

[15:25] And it's characters that you ostensibly did not care about before

[15:30] Three and the guy from two

[15:33] Franchise and he made it seem like somehow it was like a world shattering crossover event

[15:40] Yeah, so speaking of world shattering crossover events. So bloodshot the movie

[15:46] We're ostensibly supposed to be talking about today. Yeah, this has turned into a podcast about triple X

[15:51] I

[15:54] Shot is the first entry in the valiant cinematic universe

[15:57] Mm-hmm, and I don't know how familiar you guys are with valiant comics and if you wanted me to say early or not

[16:03] Oh, I mean, please talk about I mean

[16:05] I'm only familiar with them in so much as I know that they were kind of a product of the 90s comics boom

[16:13] And I know that my friend Alejandro is currently writing. Dr. Tomorrow, which is great and being published by Valley comics

[16:19] Oh, I mean the valiant comics of today is a very different publisher

[16:22] Like I've written stuff for valiant comics like the current one

[16:24] They actually have put out a number of good books now

[16:26] But valiant in the 90s was very much like image had come out

[16:30] image comics and it toppled marveled and Marvel and DC from the number one spots for a little bit and

[16:35] Valiant was a bunch of people who?

[16:37] very talented people who had

[16:39] New comics who had long careers at Marvel and DC and we're like we're gonna create a new universe and they just couldn't quite

[16:45] Capture the magic and

[16:46] Eventually, it was sold to a claim the video game maker and was a claim comics and now it's valiant comics again

[16:51] and it's kind of new versions those characters but bloodshot is kind of the punisher of the valiant universe as opposed to a

[16:57] XO Manowar's Iron Man or solar man of the atoms

[17:03] Superman or ninjax

[17:05] Harbinger was like Harbinger was like the x-men right harbinger was yes

[17:09] And now if if this if bloodshot does well enough they have plans for a harbinger movie and there's also like

[17:15] But valiant was this others rye in the future force valiant was this this world that like they also had they had some of the

[17:21] Old gold key characters. I think Magnus robot fighter and solar in there now

[17:24] Wait, just let me pause you for just a second. You said that

[17:28] he was the

[17:30] Punisher of that universe did he use like guns and such a lot more in the comics because I watched this movie and I'm like

[17:35] Okay, he is now technology Wolverine is well

[17:39] He always he always had that the nanotech in his system bloodshot, but he basically used it in

[17:46] Punisher type missions to shoot people, you know

[17:48] It was like if if Punisher and Wolverine were the same character which might have been what they were thinking when they created him

[17:52] Like people love the Punisher. They love Wolverine

[17:55] What if they were one character and you know what slap a chromium on that cover give that chromium cover?

[18:00] Any charge

[18:02] 295 on the not die cast if you think die cast chromium, I think that was the Turok Dinosaur Hunter cover

[18:08] But uh, but it was but I see what and I cut I think is what you meant die cast would be like

[18:13] You're making like matchbox cars, but uh someone write in and correct me. I might be wrong

[18:17] I don't know that much about production techniques for these things. Okay. Sorry you had gotten up to gold key before I interrupted you

[18:23] No, no, but anyway, so that was so valiant was one of these companies that

[18:26] Was never was kind of the number for a company for a while just because

[18:30] There was room for a number for a company

[18:32] There was no one at the you know after DC Marvel and image

[18:35] But they were never quite as big and they've been through ups and downs now

[18:39] It's and now they put it they put out a lot of great books

[18:41] But like yeah, I mean it was back in the day when the only other option was reading what the self-published Elfquest comics

[18:47] I mean, that's a great option or bone from Jeff's cartoon books

[18:51] the

[18:52] But it's like a it's a weird

[18:54] Universe to use to try to make a film universe out of it

[18:57] And when they announced this it does feel a little bit like oh, okay

[19:01] This is the film universe that you could get because Marvel and DC were taken an image does not exist as one

[19:06] It's all creator owned by their individual creators and at that and you're not gonna go get get a Malibu Press universe together

[19:13] Because Marvel bought and buried all those characters. So well also I will say watching this movie

[19:18] It was about halfway through that. I'm like, oh, yeah

[19:21] I think this is based on a valiant comic because it doesn't necessarily feel like a superhero story so much as just you know

[19:27] Like a throwback sci-fi action movie totally. Yeah

[19:32] I mean this same movie I could see watching it on HBO as a teenager

[19:36] Like in the middle of a Saturday and I guess yeah. Okay. This makes sense. I'm neither

[19:41] I'm neither surprised nor am I disappointed? I I was my my sort of closest

[19:48] Vin

[19:49] Cohort in terms of the guy. I constantly check in with for Vint update updates

[19:53] well, one of a couple people I check in with after there have been Vin updates in the world is

[19:59] John

[20:00] Gabrus of the High and Mighty in Action Boys podcast and I was like after I

[20:06] watched it for the first time telling him like my takes on it I was like it

[20:10] feels like Schwarzenegger in a racer zone like it feels like it is pulled off

[20:17] of the timeline from 1997 if I can offer a quick I feel like Guy Pearce is a

[20:23] slightly more intimidating villain than James Caan maybe maybe I mean this is

[20:28] this this movie rather than fitting into like a valiant cinematic universe

[20:32] it kind of fits into a don't trust Guy Pearce as the head of a technology

[20:36] company I was like how many movies am I gonna see where Guy Pearce is like an

[20:41] evil scientist businessman like has he ever just paid a straight-up like a good

[20:46] guy I'm like well I mean like confidential but he was kind of a dick

[20:51] and lockout but he was also kind of a dick yeah I'm not sure if I can offer a

[20:58] quick addendum to your valiant breakdown Elliot this movie was announced as Sony

[21:05] gets the valiant comics right rights for movie universe planned and what they

[21:10] announced was it'll be like harbinger bloodshot then I think harbinger too and

[21:16] then they were gonna do a crossover that's what I think was sort of thrown

[21:22] out and then when Vin got attached bloodshot became the first thing and

[21:25] we're like we will use this to launch everything else and to your point like

[21:30] the weirdness of trying to launch a bloodshot cinematic universe a thing I

[21:34] experienced from working on the tick is very often these large companies that

[21:40] buy the rights to obscure creator on comic book companies and properties

[21:45] don't understand that everything isn't as popular as the Avengers assumption

[21:52] whether like will they like comic books right so every character has as big of a

[21:56] built-in fan base but that was announced bloodshot was announced as the first

[22:02] step of this thing you're saying when they put out the American splendor book

[22:05] they were like this is just chapter one hundred percent blender cinematic

[22:08] universe it's comics right then we're mr. natural then Harvey P car and mr.

[22:12] natural crossover in the sequels I'm like a comics fan who was alive through

[22:19] that period and if you ask me for a valiant comics character I after Turok I

[22:25] would tap out dance time for the crazy cat movie well I'm amazed that there is

[22:32] not already a movie out there that's like the Sunday comics cinematic

[22:37] universe public domain one so it's like crazy cat cats and jammer kids like what

[22:42] there's that like young kid I guess incomprehensible looking new CGI

[22:47] scooby-doo movie which is that with Hanna-barbera where it's a new CGI

[22:52] scooby-doo movie there's also simultaneously six other Hanna-barbera

[22:55] properties well I mean but Hanna-barbera has been doing that for decades

[23:00] Olympics and yeah erasers and but oh actually the weirdest one is that Tom

[23:05] and Jerry movie that's also a Willy Wonka movie yes great great series of

[23:10] like the other ones are like public domain because there's Tom and Jerry

[23:13] Sherlock Holmes Tom and Jerry Wizard of Oz and then Wonka is so specifically

[23:18] Gene Wilder Wonka with all the same designs and characters but this is I

[23:22] don't mean to drop a big bombshell here but I was doing my research before we

[23:27] record it and it turns out as seemingly the move of like dumping things

[23:32] overboard right before the ship hits an iceberg Sony like five months ago sold

[23:40] off all the remaining valiant rights before this came out and so they were

[23:44] like yeah no Paramount you can make Harbinger that's fine so it seems like

[23:49] if any other valiant movies get made they will not be connected to this in

[23:52] any way even though that was the explicit design of this movie I mean I'm

[23:56] gonna tell you I don't think Harbinger is gonna get made because even as a kid

[23:59] when that came out I was like what kind of a name for a comic is Harbinger like

[24:03] it's such a weird word to like make your name a thing like I don't it doesn't

[24:08] make sense to me so I certainly had trouble pronouncing it as a kid yeah

[24:12] only Christopher Nolan could get away with a blockbuster called Harbinger he's

[24:16] the only guy who can just put Harbinger on a title and people go like that

[24:19] sounds smart like that actually yeah yeah I bet this is a movie about ideas

[24:24] yeah speaking about a movie that's not about ideas bloodshot you want to tell

[24:28] us what happens in this movie yeah let me uh so we're about 30 minutes into the

[24:32] podcast let's start talking about the movie to be fair we've been on point

[24:37] let me look at my seven pages of notes somehow somehow this is both the most

[24:44] time we've taken before talking about the movie and the most on topic we've

[24:47] ever been so Griffin I appreciate you being here for that okay bloodshot we the

[24:53] movie opens in Mombasa we're introduced to Vin Diesel playing a character we

[24:58] know as Bravo 6 later find out his name is Ray Garrison he's talking to his

[25:03] buddy Marines over his headpiece they're doing a lot of sit-reps he disobeys a

[25:07] direct order and he breaches the what the the terrorist cell by himself and

[25:14] kills a bunch of terrorists and saves the the hostage yeah it's full of

[25:18] hostages and terrorists and he just walks right in my my note I wrote here

[25:22] is a Vin Diesel casually 52 year old soldier yeah yeah there's like it's it's

[25:31] similar to any time when Tom Cruise plays a soldier and you're like uh he's

[25:35] not a frontline soldier like a grunt yeah I mean maybe he was I wouldn't be

[25:43] maybe if this was if this was a different time if this was yeah like the

[25:46] Civil War well no babe this is like 10 years ago you could say that he was like

[25:50] he was called back in they were doing that a lot with people in the National

[25:53] Guard or people yeah I've had their their hitch and they were being brought

[25:55] in for a new like but I guess in the Navy they call it they should have had

[25:58] like a tour I should say like a aren't you a little short for a stormtrooper

[26:03] scene explains it what he does I mean the real question is at 52 he really

[26:12] should have been promoted much higher I was gonna say this guy hasn't put in for

[26:15] a desk job yet there are ways to stay in the military and I do think I think

[26:20] you're right there was a ten-year grace period where you could take any over a

[26:25] certain hill action star and say look after 9-11 they wanted to go back he's

[26:32] fighting in Mombasa so this is a this is like one of these operations that the

[26:36] public doesn't even learn too much about and like where we're assisting local

[26:40] forces so it's not like he is fighting the Taliban and makes me wonder I don't

[26:44] know what Mombasa looks like but where they were looked so generic to me that I

[26:48] want it kind of felt like they it was just supposed to be anywhere and they

[26:51] just kind of named it later you know no this movie was shot entirely in Cape

[26:56] Town South Africa I think partially because the director was there and I

[27:00] assume they were able to get some sort of government grant or tax rebate but

[27:04] also because it feels like a place that looks like eight different places so

[27:08] they could just shoot different areas and later decide which chi runs they

[27:11] would put over identifying like no this is Australia this is Madrid like

[27:18] everything is Mombasa this is Italy but a different part than the other part of

[27:24] Italy that also explains why what the first time we he sees the skyline where

[27:29] his like the guy Pierce's building is I was like I don't know what city this is

[27:33] supposed to be like I don't recognize this skyline at all I don't know the

[27:37] Cape Town skyline so I feel pretty certain they did not pick the specific

[27:40] cities until 10 months after production wrapped the movie is supposed to release

[27:46] tomorrow can we name where it's taking place you throw some car runs up if

[27:50] they're in Budapest now okay so despite having a an opening similar to the

[27:57] marine starring John Cena wait is it John Cena I don't remember who's in the

[28:01] marine yeah oh perfect nailed it one um so he there's no repercussions he and

[28:08] his buddies go back and by buddies I mean other Marines they talk about why

[28:12] the reason they do this is because of Vin Diesel's wife that's why we fight

[28:19] boys I'm like wait are they all married yeah it's just like the end of

[28:24] horsefeathers Dan they all married her in the same ceremony at the very least

[28:27] they all covet her and I mean yeah they've been on a vow of celibacy for 20

[28:32] years waiting for their chance they call him boss which I was like boss I thought

[28:37] somebody else was giving him the orders but don't worry about that so they go

[28:40] for a walk along a pier and then they have a candlelight love scene and they

[28:44] talk about his stars it's like a very simple post special ops mission

[28:48] vacation he's going on his covert moon that's the little trip with his wife

[28:56] after each covert mission where he just you know gets to forget about his

[29:00] troubles they just go to the Italian coast they lull around in bed in their

[29:03] underpants because like all married couples in pg-13 movies they wear their

[29:07] underpants when they're in bed together and then they and what else do they do

[29:11] they just kind of hang around they go to a fish market laughing loving like they're

[29:15] not they don't have the underwear on the whole time there's a like a pg-13 sex

[29:20] scene that happens and they like some side yeah yeah I don't know whether this

[29:24] is actually the way it was shot in the movie or how I just remember in the movie

[29:29] but I remember them having sex in like one of those movie rooms that's like

[29:33] filled with a lot of tools just sort of hanging from the ceiling like like

[29:38] fabrics just sort of like like the fabric yeah yeah I thought you meant

[29:43] tools like you know yeah like the centibites are gonna show up keeps

[29:50] hitting his head on the chains that are hanging above them yeah I don't know if

[29:54] you guys know this too but the the actress who plays his wife is Tallulah

[29:59] Riley

[30:00] who is also on Westworld, but was married two separate times to Elon Musk, and I find

[30:07] that fascinating because she seems to only appear in projects that feel like they could

[30:11] have been written by Elon Musk.

[30:15] She's drawn to a certain type, and Dan, you're remembering it right.

[30:22] They're basically having sex in like the video from I Will Do Anything for Love.

[30:27] Like a penthouse centerfold or something?

[30:29] Yeah.

[30:30] Yeah.

[30:31] But Stuart, what happens?

[30:33] It sounds like the movie's over.

[30:35] Everyone's having a great time.

[30:36] They love it.

[30:37] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[30:38] Perfect happy ending.

[30:39] Mission accomplished.

[30:40] Unfortunately, the next morning, a team of two guys attack Bravo 6, aka Ray Garrison,

[30:45] aka Vin Diesel.

[30:47] He beats the shit out of them, and then as he's leaving, he bumps into a guy, and then

[30:51] he falls asleep, and you're like, I guess he got drugged.

[30:54] Smash cut.

[30:55] He wakes up tied with hempen rope to a chair in a meat locker filled with meat.

[31:01] The guy who knocked him out shows up and then dances to Dan's favorite song.

[31:06] At this point, I'm sure Dan was pretty into the movie, Talking Heads Psycho Killer.

[31:10] I had the same thought when Psycho Killer started.

[31:13] I was like, oh, they're pandering to Dan right now.

[31:16] You're also a big Talking Heads fan.

[31:19] I am.

[31:20] I am.

[31:21] But when I think Talking Heads, I think Dan.

[31:24] This was the moment where I fully fell in love with the movie.

[31:26] I mean, I was like, I was pretty in just from the name above the title.

[31:32] But the second we got to the second best ever use of Psycho Killer in a film, I knew I was

[31:39] in love.

[31:40] Now, the first one, I assume, would be in my college screenplay, Psycho Killer.

[31:44] Correct.

[31:45] And then Stop Making Sense is third.

[31:46] OK.

[31:47] Yeah.

[31:48] Stop Making Sense is number third.

[31:49] Yeah.

[31:50] So what was your Psycho Killer screenplay about?

[31:53] This is a screenplay I wrote in one of my screenwriting classes at NYU, and it was about

[31:56] there's a serial killer who is stalking New York and a big time director who's had a couple

[32:04] bombs under his belt has decided he's going to go back to his indie roots and he's going

[32:08] to make a movie about this serial killer on the real locations that the serial killer

[32:11] is killing people.

[32:12] And the serial killer gets really interested in this movie because he's like, oh, this

[32:15] is how I'm going to like this is how people are going to remember me and basically is

[32:19] stalking this director and like killing people around him to get him to do the things he

[32:22] wants in the movie.

[32:23] And anyway, it's like it was written by me at a time when I really didn't know how movies

[32:27] were made.

[32:28] So there's a lot of stuff where I'm like using terminology that where I'm like, if I look

[32:31] back at it now, I'm sure be like, that's not how that works.

[32:33] That's not a thing you can do.

[32:35] That's not what craft services is.

[32:39] Weird that you put those into the screen directions.

[32:43] A lot of like smash cut rack focus to ultra close up, that kind of stuff.

[32:49] It's weird that you put in screen directions for what was going to be on the craft services

[32:53] table.

[32:54] I got it.

[32:55] Look, I was really building a world.

[32:58] OK, so we we have forgotten about our pal Vin.

[33:01] Vin is tied once again with hemp and rope to an office chair.

[33:06] Thank you for specifying the kind of rope.

[33:07] I appreciate.

[33:08] I just think it's kind of funny because up until this point, you're like, I bet this

[33:11] like they would use like high tech handcuffs, but no.

[33:15] So you think they're just going to be intimidating Vin Diesel.

[33:18] But nope.

[33:19] They bring his wife in.

[33:20] Oh, man.

[33:21] They just cross the fucking line.

[33:23] The guy then uses one of those pneumatic, pneumatic pistol things and asks Vin some

[33:31] questions that, of course, he doesn't know because they're above his pay grade.

[33:34] And then he kills his wife anyway, and then he shoots him in the face.

[33:37] Yeah.

[33:38] End of the movie.

[33:39] Right now.

[33:40] Now, hold on.

[33:41] Now, I want to say now I'm not going to spoil the twist of the movie at this point, even

[33:46] though the trailer does it.

[33:49] We will spoil the twist, you know, in another 20 minutes or probably an hour.

[33:54] The way we're talking, it'll be tomorrow.

[33:57] But, you know, Audrey was watching this with me.

[34:00] She's much more vocal when we watch movies at home than than I normally would be.

[34:04] But like she's like, you know, like chatting about the movie and she's like like at this

[34:09] point she is not angry, let's say, but pointing out that this woman is like the laziest version

[34:16] of a wife in one of these situations where she's just waiting around at home to like

[34:20] leap on him and have sex in this drapery factory afterwards.

[34:26] And then like she's all those candles, drapery showroom, Dan.

[34:29] Yeah.

[34:30] And then she is immediately fridged to give him a motivation.

[34:35] And there is a reason why this is also like lazy that will will come up later in the movie.

[34:41] But at this point, you're like, OK, well, I've seen this movie a million times before.

[34:45] A hundred percent watching this for the first time without without getting to the spoilers

[34:49] yet watching for the first time, I was accepting the sloppiness and the shortcuts and areas

[34:54] like that as like, I guess this is what I fucking have to tolerate to get a Vin Diesel

[34:58] bloodshot movie.

[35:00] Like as long as they get to the, you know, the good stuff, I'm fine if like the setup

[35:04] is is sloppy.

[35:06] Watching it the second time, I am actually kind of astonished by the artistry of how

[35:13] transparently clockwork all of that stuff is.

[35:16] Yeah.

[35:17] I also want to bring up the rope.

[35:20] Yes.

[35:21] I also all every single detail for me feels so perfectly chosen.

[35:25] Once you understand what the twist of this movie is.

[35:28] I also just want to point out the way you know that this is a film made by a director

[35:31] who understands Vin Diesel as a star because I stopwatched it.

[35:35] I believe it is four minutes and fifty two seconds in once they've landed the plane at

[35:40] the base and Vin turns to all his grunts and says like, that's who we're doing it for.

[35:45] He wastes no time to immediately take off his uniform and reveal the wife beater underneath,

[35:51] which is for Vin Diesel pulling off an outer layered revealing a wife beater is like Captain

[35:56] America picking up his shield.

[35:58] It is the moment you know you are cooking with gas.

[36:01] Well, you know, Vin Diesel, if he's had a lot of foes on film, but his greatest enemy

[36:07] is sleeves.

[36:08] Famously overheated arms, Vin Diesel.

[36:13] Yeah.

[36:14] Yeah.

[36:15] And I'm glad that he's never he has yet to come across a necktie or a bow tie because

[36:19] I feel like that is a battle he cannot win.

[36:21] No.

[36:22] Yes.

[36:23] I mean, so just to jump in, it was originally reported that Jared Leto was going to star

[36:28] in this film as Bloodshot.

[36:29] How different up to this point do you think this movie would be if it was Jared Leto instead

[36:33] of Vin Diesel?

[36:34] Well, I'll tell you a big difference.

[36:37] I would not have seen it.

[36:38] That's an immediate difference.

[36:40] I would have no opinions on it other than my absolute revulsion at the very premise.

[36:47] I also think I think like the thing we're sort of talking around here is that like the

[36:52] movie doesn't work unless you have someone who is an action star is proven in this genre

[36:58] because of what this movie is ultimately doing narratively.

[37:01] And B is someone who is so self-aware about how their action persona plays.

[37:06] If you cast it against type and pick a guy like Jared Leto and go like, it's Morbius.

[37:11] The thing is, we've never seen a hero who looks like this before.

[37:14] Then the whole thing is fucking nonsense.

[37:17] Yeah.

[37:18] Yeah.

[37:19] Well, so so we get our opening credit sequence.

[37:22] We can only assume that Vin Diesel is dead.

[37:24] And then, of course, nope.

[37:25] He wakes up.

[37:26] He's in a secret lab.

[37:29] He's in a secret lab and he is introduced to Katie, a young cyborg woman.

[37:35] And who is this guy, Dr. Emile Harding, who is played by Space Jail himself.

[37:44] Guy Pearce.

[37:45] Now, Guy Pearce himself.

[37:46] His casting is a clue to the twist of the movie.

[37:50] Can you figure it out?

[37:53] He is one of those.

[37:54] And I love him as an actor.

[37:55] He's so good in Memento.

[37:56] He's so good in The Proposition, the Western that he's in.

[38:02] But he's like Max von Sydow at this point, where the minute he shows up, you're like,

[38:05] oh, the bad guy.

[38:06] But at the same time, I think he brings something extra to it that like, yeah, it might spoil

[38:13] the twist, but at least it's going to be fun the whole time.

[38:16] Oh, no.

[38:17] Yeah.

[38:18] He does this stuff.

[38:19] Great.

[38:20] It's in his sleep.

[38:21] He can do this stuff.

[38:22] But at this point, it's like, I want to see him do something where I don't automatically

[38:24] know the minute, literally the minute I see his name in the credits.

[38:29] It's like in Geostorm.

[38:30] Geostorm.

[38:31] Yeah.

[38:32] When Ed Harris shows up and you're like, oh, the villain.

[38:35] I love that.

[38:36] I knew exactly where you were going.

[38:38] Yeah.

[38:39] That was that was pretty amazing.

[38:40] It's like we were talking with our nanobots.

[38:42] Yeah.

[38:43] To this point, I think like if you see Ed Harris's name in the opening credits of a

[38:47] film like Geostorm, you go, oh, he's the villain and he's going to sort of be phoning it in

[38:51] like this.

[38:52] I'm not going to get full Ed Harris here.

[38:54] He's not going to leave it all on the dance floor for fucking Geostorm.

[38:56] This is not a Pollock.

[38:57] He's not going to do that.

[38:58] This is not Milk Money.

[38:59] Right.

[39:00] Right.

[39:01] But whereas like if you see Guy Pearce in the opening credits, you're like, well, they've

[39:05] they've already spoiled for me that he's the villain, but I know he's going to have fun

[39:07] with it.

[39:08] Like this guy is actually going to try to entertain himself playing this.

[39:13] Stuart, just quickly, because I feel like you glossed over this.

[39:16] You said that Katie is a cyborg.

[39:18] Now I assume the parts of her body that have been augmented or something really cool that

[39:22] would help her fight big robot arms or laser eyes, like guns.

[39:28] Well, we later find out that Katie was a Navy swimmer and she can swim really fast.

[39:36] Tell me that she got a motor, a fan.

[39:38] What does she got?

[39:39] So she was horribly injured.

[39:41] And the only thing they could do was replace her.

[39:44] She couldn't breathe.

[39:45] So they put in like a robot breathing tube in her neck or chest.

[39:51] But that's great, because that means that she what can like filter out like poisonous

[39:56] gas.

[39:57] Yeah, she can.

[39:58] She can breathe.

[39:59] She can breathe through it.

[40:00] anything. Water, gas. She's like a human grida filter. Yeah. Now, I want to say that she

[40:06] is played by Isa Gonzalez, who has been in, you know, some fun movies like Hobbs and Shaw

[40:13] and Baby Driver, but she's also, this is her fourth Flophouse movie. She was in Jim and

[40:18] the Holograms. She was in Welcome to Marwen, and she was in Elisa Battle Angel, which I

[40:24] don't believe we've released yet. Yeah, but we did do it. That's the movie where, and

[40:28] spoiler alert for that one, where we talk about Dan's love of backstory and elaborate

[40:32] world-building histories. I do not have that love. That's something that's been placed

[40:37] on me because I asked for one line of explanation for a key plot point. But anyway, I don't

[40:44] want to spoil the rest of the movie, but for a character with, let's just say, a limited

[40:48] power suite, they find many opportunities to use her powers for her benefit. I mean,

[40:55] that's imagination. That's what Jack Kirby would do. He'd say, okay, the Hulk is super

[40:59] strong. Okay, I can have him just punch and lift things, but what if he slapped his hands

[41:03] together and created a shockwave? What if he jumped so far that he could basically fly?

[41:07] Like, what if he could blow with his enormous lungs and knock people over? You got to find

[41:11] different ways to use those powers. What if he went undercover as a robot clown working

[41:15] at the circus? Okay, he wasn't necessarily undercover. He was hypnotized, and they disguised

[41:21] him as a robot clown working at the circus. It wasn't like he did that as a plan. He just

[41:25] found himself in that situation. Now, that is a reference I can enjoy without actually

[41:29] knowing what it's referencing. Well, it's a major part of Marvel history. Imagining

[41:37] the Hulk as a robot clown delights and amuses, no matter what your experience. For a very

[41:42] brief time, he was hypnotized into thinking he was a robot clown in the Ringmaster of

[41:46] Crime Circus. Great. I love it. So at this point, Dr. Harding explains that Bloodshot

[41:53] has been killed. He's been killed in action, and they brought him back, that his body had

[41:59] been anonymously donated by the military, and nobody had picked up his body. He had

[42:04] no loved ones. They just left him in a drop box that side. Yep. They put him in a drop

[42:09] box. They said, please replace blood with nanites, which is what they did. Nanites are

[42:14] nanobots that will heal any damage that is caused to his body. What's that? It's called

[42:19] Project Bloodshot. Project Bloodshot. And they demonstrate by cutting his hand, and

[42:25] he goes, owie! And then we get a close-up of his hand healing. Now, it will surprise

[42:33] no one that the science of all this is questionable, but when they say, like, oh, you put nanites

[42:38] in my blood, and she's like, no, your blood is nanites. I'm like, what? Important distinction!

[42:44] There's no blood left. He has no blood. He just has, I mean, to be honest, you don't, as long as

[42:49] you've got something that's gonna bring oxygen and things like that around your body, you don't

[42:53] need blood. Sure, great, but spoiler alert, there are a couple times in this movie where he basically

[42:57] gets blown apart, and then he comes back together, and I'm like, uh, okay, I don't know if at this

[43:02] point nanorobots explains this. I do like that when Dr. Harding cuts his hand to demonstrate

[43:10] his bloodshot powers, he does like, he's like, ow! And that is literally the only time in the

[43:15] rest of the movie when he's getting shot and blown apart that he seems to register the, uh, injury.

[43:20] That's the thing, when he, he has nanites that heal him, but, like, literally he's being blown up,

[43:24] half his head gets blown away in the reforms, it should hurt so much, but instead he's just like,

[43:29] whatever, I don't care. Like, he feels no pain now. It's mind over matter, okay? Physical pain

[43:35] is a mental prison, because the whole point is, Guy Pearce cuts his hand, he thinks it hurts,

[43:41] because he doesn't know that he's fucking bloodshot yet. Yeah, I see, so every time,

[43:47] so now when he gets hurt, he's like, ow, and then he looks at his tattoo that says,

[43:50] you are bloodshot, he's like, oh yeah, right. Because that, no, that is a big, this is important

[43:55] detail, this is where this movie starts to start to, you know, riff on Robocop and Memento, the

[44:01] Guy Pearce of it all becomes a little clearer. He also doesn't remember who he fucking is.

[44:06] He doesn't remember shit. Yeah, he doesn't remember anything, he's introduced to a couple

[44:11] other enhanced soldiers, Tibbs, who lost his eyes, but now has robot eyes and can see everything,

[44:18] and then, uh, Jolton. His enhancement is actually kind of crappy, in that he has cameras on his

[44:22] chest, and they're hooked up to his eyes, so if he wears a shirt or is not, and is not wearing

[44:26] that harness, he's still blind again. He's V-neck only. Yeah, and then, and there's Dalton,

[44:31] who has a pair of robot legs, and Dalton is played by the guy, he's that hunky outlander fellow,

[44:36] right? Yeah, yeah, and now, and this again is a tip-off that if someone has artificial legs,

[44:41] they're going to be the murderer, just like the real-life artificial leg murderer.

[44:45] Wow. Oh, wow. Yeah, Dan doesn't want to get sued by the Oscar Pistorius.

[44:52] This, this movie, above all else, is anti-Pistorius agaprop. That's, that's the number

[44:57] one goal of this film. The scene, the scene where, the scene where Dalton fires through a bathroom

[45:02] door at his wife, and then tells everyone he thought it was a burglar, that seems pretty

[45:06] on the nose. I just want to say, South African director, filmed in Cape Town. That's, yeah,

[45:11] that's, uh, connecting the dots. So, now, Stuart, now, wait, but they're not the only cyborgs,

[45:16] because what about Guy Pearce? Oh, yeah, I forgot. Dr. Neil Harding has a cyborg arm that he lost

[45:21] in a tennis cancer accident, I think. I can't remember. Yes, I don't know. I think it's called,

[45:26] just called a disease, when cancer's involved. I don't think it's an accident, necessarily. But

[45:31] they make it very clear that tennis was involved in some way. Tennis was very important to him,

[45:35] but it also made him strong. Actually, that would have been a pretty good joke if he was,

[45:39] if he just had, lift up his robot arm, he's like, yeah, tennis elbow, what are you gonna do?

[45:44] That's a very Jonah Hex reaction. Yeah, that's true. So, uh, Vin Diesel has a nightmare about

[45:50] something or other, he punches the wall, and then he's like, wait, I can punch a wall? So,

[45:53] he goes down to the basement, he starts punching the shit out of stuff, and doing curls with the

[45:57] biggest weights. Yeah, exactly what we would all do if we got super strength. He's punching the

[46:02] shit out of a load-bearing, uh, pillar. He's punching a support pillar until it's cracking,

[46:08] and the ceiling is dropping, and then he's like, oh, maybe I shouldn't do that. But you guys are

[46:12] missing a very important detail, which is, he is also laughing while doing this. It is an amazing

[46:18] touch that he thinks this is so much goddamn fun already. Yeah. Yeah. So, he then, he then watches,

[46:26] uh, KT do some, uh, underwater tai chi. He's very impressed. Uh, she gives him this spiel,

[46:33] and hands him a coin, then she starts doing, uh, drinking with him. She hands him a challenge coin,

[46:38] which usually you're given, you know what, I guess she's giving it to him to, like, accept him as

[46:41] part of the group. Usually you get it for some sort of accomplishment, but she just kind of hands

[46:45] it to him, and that's a big thing, especially for these former military people. You don't just go

[46:49] handing out challenge coins willy-nilly. So, already you're like, oh, this is pretty, this is

[46:54] pretty hardcore for people who just met that day, and who, she doesn't seem to like him very much

[46:57] until this moment. Yeah, they've gone through some shit. It's the ultimate peer-to-peer currency,

[47:01] and I also want to point out that, uh, they start drinking together, but it's not just, oh, let me

[47:07] take a bottle down from the shelf, and we'll have some drinks. She steps over to a table near the

[47:13] gym, where she's been swimming, and there is a full display of multiple different liquors and

[47:20] spirits. Because they work hard, and they play hard, and sometimes, sometimes it's like the

[47:24] prisoner. You go for a workout, someone tries to kill you, you go to a bar, you realize you've

[47:29] been poisoned, you have to drink a little bit of every single drink there, so you throw up the

[47:33] poison. It's just like Patrick McGowan. If there was a full bar at most gyms, I would be going to

[47:38] the gym on a regular basis. And this was a very important point in the movie, too, because this

[47:43] was the point in the movie when I googled, can Wolverine get drunk? Because it raised a lot of

[47:51] questions for me. I mean, Wolverine, he has been drunk in the comics. Yeah, well, the answer I got

[47:56] is that he needs to drink a lot more, of course, because of his healing powers. This is the one

[48:01] part of the movie that I gotta, I gotta give it some shit, Griffin. I gotta call it out, because

[48:06] the reason they're drinking is because she's like, you lost your memory, you don't remember what you

[48:10] like to drink, and I'm like, that man knows. He drinks fucking Corona, baby. Yep, no, I agree,

[48:17] I agree. It is actually a major logic flaw in the movie. I don't like to point out plot holes,

[48:22] but that just does not track for one second. He's got Corona in his blood as much as he has

[48:28] nanites in his blood. You can't pull that out of the man. But we don't have time to focus too much

[48:33] on what he likes to drink, because speakers that have not been set to any radio, as far as we could

[48:37] tell, start playing Psycho Killer, the song that was playing when he kills his wife, or when his

[48:42] wife was killed. And when he kills, well, I mean, you'll see. It triggers him almost as if it is

[48:49] some kind of trigger. He's literally a figurative trigger. And at no point is he like, wait a minute,

[48:56] why did that speaker start playing a song? But this is, once again, like watching it the first

[49:02] time, I was like, okay, this movie just wants to get through the beats as quickly as possible

[49:06] with zero elegance. I'm watching it the second time. I'm like, the transparency of, and now she's

[49:11] finished her final line of dialogue. So the music is going to start playing randomly. It's the same

[49:16] song that was playing. It's Chef's Kiss for me. Yeah, so at this point, it triggers him. He has

[49:22] a flashback to his wife being murdered. He realizes that his wife's been murdered by this guy.

[49:27] What is his name? Maximillian Axe or something? Martin Axe. Martin Axe, I'm sorry. I mean,

[49:32] Maximillian Axe is an amazing name that they should have gone with. The guy they have playing

[49:38] him is not cool enough to carry the name Maximillian Axe. He then walks with no security

[49:45] to the parking garage, takes, of course, a pickup truck, drives away, doesn't have to see security

[49:50] at all. He starts talking with Guy Pearce, who's like, hey, you can't leave. He's talking to him

[49:56] through the nanites in his blood. You have speakerphone in your head.

[50:00] Yeah, basically. And this is this is one of my favorite bits in the movie where, you know,

[50:04] they're doing a little bit of back and forth and Vin's like, I just got to kill the guy who killed

[50:08] my wife. And Guy Pearce is like, no, you have to come back. He's like, I always come home,

[50:13] which was a little bit of banter he did with his wife. But for Guy Pearce, he's like, wait, what?

[50:20] Like, he's banter they does with his wife and Guy Pearce is like, I'm not part of this isn't

[50:24] an inside joke for me, dude. I don't listen to your podcast.

[50:27] It's almost like he's reciting hacky action movie dialogue. A wink, a wink, a wink.

[50:34] I wish Guy Pearce had been like, wait, this is just like a temporary residence.

[50:38] It's not your home. Like, we're gonna set you up with an apartment, I guess. Like, this is

[50:42] do you really think you live here now? Because we got it. We've got fast turnarounds. And he's

[50:46] always like, no, man, this is my home. Now I made it my own. I peed on everything. And Guy

[50:50] Pearce is like, why did you do that? But I also love, I mean, sort of the

[50:54] self aware brilliance Guy Pearce plays this scene, you're like, he's not putting up enough

[50:59] of a fight. He's not getting freaked out enough about the fact that this guy's going rogue.

[51:04] Because he's playing this scene like he has a hard out and they only have two takes to get it done.

[51:10] And he's just trying to do the bare minimum.

[51:14] And they they're, in retrospect, you know, that they are, they are putting on a little

[51:19] bit of an act because then the tech guy is like, oh, my God, he's downloading a million

[51:22] things a minute into his computer brain, right? And the way that people in worse movies are always

[51:27] stating out loud the thing they're amazed at, that someone else is even more apathetic,

[51:32] like he can't even find a take on his character. He is so passionate when he says like, Sir,

[51:37] there are five vans following him. But but also it there's a great touch where Guy Pearce says,

[51:43] like, Garrison, what are you doing? And then he turns around, there's no response. And he

[51:48] goes to the tech guy. And he's like, is the mic on? And the guy's like, no. And he's like,

[51:51] Jesus, turn the mic on. And then he just does the line reading again.

[51:56] They should to the channel. That's what it is. Yeah. Yeah, I would say that this this tech guy

[52:02] is one of the things that rubbed me more so the wrong way in this movie, you know, once the

[52:07] twist everything because he is such it because for all the things in the movie that seem to be

[52:11] cliche for a purpose, he is just cliche. And there's a bit about how he has a small

[52:16] penis that seems totally unnecessary. Not only that he has a small penis, but he wants it

[52:21] enhanced. He wants a robot. Yeah, he wants a man. He's about to ask to have it enhanced.

[52:26] And it was like, did we really like, is this really worth the movie? The runtime?

[52:33] I didn't like it. But when they pay it off, I kind of like it because Guy Pearce

[52:36] is so dismissive while still like, you know, like sort of like transmitting to the audience,

[52:42] like he knows what this guy is secretly asking about, but he like just has no time for it.

[52:47] So I laughed at that. Well, it's like when when you know your staff has some kind of

[52:51] bullshit requests and you're like, well, I want to make them say it out loud.

[52:57] But also, I would argue there is a reading of this film in which that character, the tech guy,

[53:03] is the ultimate villain because he is the world's most despicable person,

[53:07] a shitty writer who is just cashing in his checks. Oh, yeah. Well, he's he's the one who

[53:13] he's just doing a job and he doesn't care who gets hurt. Right. Just it just there's

[53:16] just this moment of like, OK, yeah, the nerdy character has a small penis. I get it. Like

[53:21] nobody else in the movie is held up to that kind of casual ridicule. Yeah. You know,

[53:25] and considering there's a super cool tech guy later on who helps the hero,

[53:30] it like just made it even more so. So you're offended on behalf of nerds is what you're

[53:34] saying. Yeah, basically, yeah. Nerds, the people and the candy. But one guy's an artist and the

[53:39] other guy is just like a hack fucking spec screenwriter, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So at this

[53:45] point, a spec screenwriter is doing it out of passion. No, this guy's writing specs just to

[53:50] be sold. You know what I'm saying? He doesn't even like them. So at this point, as we've already

[53:57] addressed, it seems like, oh, so you say he's Max Landis. OK, never mind. No, they're totally

[54:01] I get it. OK, I didn't realize he was Max Landis. Now I hate him. Guys, guys, guys,

[54:05] we're infuriating Stuart to unsustainable levels. We're interrupting. So so he steals a plane,

[54:14] right? Well, yeah, he steals a plane. He it seems like he has the ability to download

[54:19] information and skills directly to his brain. He teaches himself how to fly on the fly.

[54:25] Oh, shit. He tracks down Martin X and he stages an ambush in a tunnel using a semi truck filled

[54:36] with flour. I have to admit, this sequence I found really confusing. What part about it? I mean,

[54:44] just not not the purpose of it or anything, but just the actual geography. I like it was very

[54:49] hard for me to figure out who where he was and who was shooting what. And it was it was it was a

[54:54] tough scene for me to to and to figure out like moment by moment. Yes. I would like to talk a

[54:59] little bit about this in so much as like I think that the film looks good, like, yeah, like like

[55:05] the vibe of it, like it looks good. But in terms of the action sequences, other than the final

[55:10] action sequence, which I actually liked quite a bit, the final one I thought was really good.

[55:13] Yeah, it is. It does fall prey a lot to the problem of a lot of modern action sequences

[55:20] where the fight choreography is not thought out particularly well. The they're trying to cut a lot

[55:25] to make it seem exciting, which makes it sort of confusing just about the spatial like like this.

[55:31] The scene looks great because you're in this like tunnel with all this like flour around like snow.

[55:37] And it's lit only by like road flares. It's red lights and emergency lights. Yeah. Yeah. It's

[55:43] like it's like a like a samurai movie with like blood falling on the snow. Yeah. Well,

[55:48] this director, by the way, I just want to say, like his job before this, like he he is he has

[55:53] one TV credit, one episode of television. But otherwise, he is the video game director of

[55:58] cut scenes. So do with that as you may. He comes from the same company as Dan. What what what can

[56:06] I do with that? You know, as I may, I don't even know where to begin with. He said tell to the

[56:11] Marines a little way. And then on some some holiday, you know, like deep into the future,

[56:17] perhaps a birthday, you know, like you can sort of like pull it out, you know, ponder it for a

[56:23] moment. Think about the time that's passed since we had this conversation and then put it back

[56:27] into the old memory. That's sweet. OK, what are we going to say? I will do that, Dan. Thank you.

[56:32] This guy comes from the same. He might even been a co-founder of the same video game cut scene slash

[56:38] special effects house that the Deadpool guy came from and the Sonic the Hedgehog movie came from.

[56:43] So they are like the new film brats taking over the industry, except instead of all having the

[56:50] same alma mater that they went to for film school, they all worked on the same video cut scenes

[56:53] together. I do like, though, even though I think I agree that the choreography is not great and

[56:59] it's a little incomprehensible. I like that Bloodshot has to function as like his own art

[57:05] director and his own like gaffer, like he's setting up good lighting. Yeah. And like most

[57:10] for his fight scenes. And I like that. I like that all the fight scenes in this movie look

[57:16] different. Yeah. Like they're distinct, different things. Like there is some thought being put into

[57:21] that. I think this movie has visual thought. Yeah. So he wipes, he kills all these mercs,

[57:28] he blows up a bunch of stuff, he manages. Every time you think he's defeated the mercs,

[57:31] there's like three more that pop out of a car. That's that was like, how many guys are there?

[57:36] And Martin, Martin Axe, not only is terrified of being attacked, but he realizes that there's

[57:41] something up. And we we learned that Martin Axe knows more about Bloodshot than he should. Right.

[57:47] But also Martin Axe chin stroke in no way resembles the guy from the opening of the film.

[57:53] Does not seem like the same man who would wear like Bermuda shorts and flip flops

[57:57] and a big winter coat while dancing to Psycho Killer. He seems very timid and terrified.

[58:02] Now, we should we should make it clear this is Martin Axe and not the character Martin Axe

[58:06] from the Guardians of the Galaxy. The Marvel character, not a valiant character.

[58:13] So, of course, Vin Diesel kills him anyway. He heads home. He meets up with the rest of

[58:18] the team at an airfield where they seem annoyed, but they bring him back anyway.

[58:24] They mentioned something about his nanites almost being out of juice or something.

[58:29] Uh, and this is when we get the twist, guys. Who wants to talk about the twist?

[58:35] Uh, I think I guess I guess I will. OK, you do.

[58:39] OK, so this is when we find out that this is this is just one of many missions that Bloodshot's been

[58:44] on, that he has had his memory erased and reset, given a new implanted memory with a new target

[58:52] each time. It's the same script that he's working off of. And that explains all of the cliches,

[58:57] guys. It was intentional. Oh, it's like wild things. It's supposed to be dumb.

[59:03] Now, I want to I want to take a moment here to address the this twist. Now,

[59:10] I think you can make a case for, like, maybe why it makes sense. And I will after this.

[59:18] But for the most part, the problem with this twist is it makes a lot more sense as a critique of

[59:23] action movies than it does as like a thing that would happen in life because. Well, wait, Dan.

[59:29] So wait, what can interrupt your interrupt your criticism? You're right. In real life,

[59:33] if you were using a reanimated Marine Corps filled with nanobots,

[59:38] you would probably not go to these elaborate lengths. You might even give it no personality.

[59:42] Although, as we later learn on, Guy Pearce says he's the perfect assassin for these moments

[59:46] because he's so passionate, because he has a reason to do it. But I think you're right,

[59:49] if only. And I'll help you with this one thing. It means every time they reboot him,

[59:52] Guy Pearce has to give him the same tour of the facilities. I think that would get old pretty

[59:57] fast. Well, they had to fix they had to fix that load bearing.

[1:00:00] pillar each time yeah yeah here's the thing i bet that's not even really a load-bearing pillar

[1:00:05] that's probably an elaborate like universal studios backlot tour thing where they're like okay

[1:00:09] and he's punching it and hit the button so that the ceiling drops just enough so it looks like

[1:00:14] okay well you've interrupted me far enough uh uh as jesse would say shut your pie hole i just want

[1:00:20] to say like it makes sense in the sense like you're if you're subverting the idea of a revenge movie

[1:00:27] like this is great but in reality it's kind of like okay well why not just like reanimate a

[1:00:32] dude who doesn't care if he's killing a bunch of people and just have that dude kill a bunch

[1:00:38] of people without going through this elaborate charade every time so this is my counterpoint

[1:00:43] it makes no sense in a technical real world level but yes you kind of have to accept the movie on

[1:00:50] like a paul verhoeven level which is because it's even underlined in the dialogue about like

[1:00:55] explaining to outlander guy that he's better because he's more passionate because he has a

[1:01:00] backstory like essentially saying this guy gets to be the lead of the movie and you don't because

[1:01:06] he has some weird charisma he is emotionally accessible and also the audience is given a

[1:01:11] reason to root for him like he cares um i think the movie works as like a meta commentary on

[1:01:17] movie stardom and like what you need to do to make an audience care about an action movie

[1:01:23] there is a throwaway line too and we have no reason to necessarily believe it because it's

[1:01:28] from guy pierce our unreliable narrator but there's a throwaway line about how like he's the

[1:01:33] one guy they were able to make this work with and so if that's true then you can make an argument okay

[1:01:40] like they have to go through this charade because real life vin diesel uh whatever his fucking name

[1:01:48] has ray garrison has like a moral sense so they need to like give him a motivation

[1:01:53] much like movie stars have some it factor that you can't manufacture you can't build it in a lab

[1:01:59] you can you can harness it you can develop it further but you either got it or you don't kid

[1:02:04] well as as we know as we learned guy pierce is eliminating people he used to work with yes who

[1:02:09] are now business competitors of his and so if it was someone like dalton he was sending out

[1:02:13] then martin axe could be like hey dalton i'll pay you twice what guy pierce is paying you and

[1:02:17] then he just switched but if this if the killer if the assassin thinks that martin axe killed his

[1:02:23] wife nothing's gonna stop him so you need to that's why they want those fake memories

[1:02:28] you can use a soldier so i feel like you could give him a simpler lie where you're just like oh

[1:02:32] this is a bad guy he needs to be taken out are you are you implying that our soldiers are not

[1:02:36] intelligent enough to see through lies because i would say i know that are very intelligent the

[1:02:41] military are uh actively uh uh encouraged to follow the chain of command without asking questions

[1:02:50] but here's the thing then guy pierce has to pretend he's in the military which he could do

[1:02:54] which would be a different type of choice it's a simpler lie is all i'm saying but i'll say that

[1:02:58] vin diesel then he's got to buy insignia and uniforms oh boy and then he's up against that

[1:03:05] stolen valor but vin diesel because usually military people only take orders from

[1:03:10] higher-ups in the military it's not like if you went up to a soldier and were like hey do this

[1:03:13] for me they'd be like i gotta follow orders okay i know it's not like the game surely the man

[1:03:19] who has engineered all this could not pretend to be part of the military that is a bridge too

[1:03:24] far sir i mean that's then you get a thing like in the game where the guy is that guy is talking

[1:03:30] to him and then he sees the guy later on a commercial for medicine and it's like maybe

[1:03:35] they maybe they shouldn't have hired an actor who does commercials i also hired a guy who really

[1:03:41] works on the stage i mean ultimately isn't that part of the game though elliot oh yeah i did i

[1:03:46] mean i guess it's an intricate game it's also like it has to be emotional and personal for him

[1:03:52] because he has to think that he is betraying orders to do quote unquote the right thing like

[1:03:59] he has to be motivated by a self-righteousness i also love that guy pierce's big evil plan is

[1:04:05] essentially i want to fire everyone else who helped develop this script so i can be the only

[1:04:12] one who gets residuals you know like that's his big plan is like we're gonna sell it and i'm gonna

[1:04:16] make a ton of money and the ends will justify the mean i i can be the only one with credit on this

[1:04:21] thing so in a in a weird way if we're mapping the valiant universe onto it it's almost like

[1:04:27] jim shooter one of the founders of the former marvel editor-in-chief is like okay i gotta kill

[1:04:32] bob layton and david mitchell and all these other guys who worked with me on valiant properties

[1:04:36] so that i can be the only create which is not really a phil shooter thing to do it's kind of

[1:04:39] more of a stan lee thing to do in a way guy pierce is kind of playing stan lee in this way but it's

[1:04:45] a lot of those like comic book universes not the universes but the actual like stories of the

[1:04:50] publishers themselves where it's like all the grunt work goes up to the top and then everyone

[1:04:54] gets thrown out and they're like yeah i just one day thought of spider-man single-handedly

[1:04:59] oh wow you there's this movie is so deep so we cut back to we cut back to vin diesel lying on

[1:05:05] a table a man apart vin diesel lying there uh dalton explains everything that's going on because

[1:05:11] he resents vin diesel because he's not a movie star he doesn't have it yeah harding is planning

[1:05:17] on selling the technology he just has one final uh guy they need to kill uh barris barris was his

[1:05:25] his final uh partner who now needs to be eliminated so at this point they go through the whole routine

[1:05:33] again we see bits of the routine and we can see how uh it's fraying at the edges a little bit

[1:05:39] and it's like a mundane day at the office for everyone like now that it's been exposed

[1:05:43] it's like his whole emotional backstory can be covered in a really really rote montage

[1:05:50] he uh at this point we are introduced to barris who has an army of goons because everybody seems

[1:05:56] to be able to hire an army of goons uh and he has his own tech guy played by new girls lamorne

[1:06:03] morris with a english accent is that his real accent no absolutely no no absolutely i think

[1:06:09] he's a chicago guy i think no it's that's a pretty heavy chicago accent

[1:06:15] here we are in the windy city and we're gonna have some of that deep dish pizza

[1:06:20] put a lot on my hot dogs mate i would say he's playing this role with a lot of verve i don't

[1:06:26] think that the jokes that are given to him are particularly good but he's doing his his level

[1:06:30] best to like give everything he can to this oh no he's he's very admirable in the in the amount

[1:06:36] of enthusiasm he's giving especially but you know he gets to play himself a local chicago in with

[1:06:41] that famous chicago accent it's the second city love but you know we're the first city in the

[1:06:46] hearts of our neighbors uh i will also say i i auditioned for and actively pursued this role

[1:06:53] uh and none of that stuff was in the script it was very lacking in any sort of characterization

[1:07:00] so it really feels like he threw on a lot of choices that i think largely worked to try to

[1:07:06] define this as personality in some way so was that true you're trying to get that role oh so

[1:07:12] badly you have no idea yes yes a full court effort multiple tapes i made a direct plea like i i sent

[1:07:21] like a video testimonial in addition to you offered to have your memory wiped and go on

[1:07:27] i said do what you want with my body i will anonymously donate it to you

[1:07:31] i'll imagine that i must give the best performance of my life in order to avenge my wife if you put

[1:07:37] me did you do an english accent for the tape i didn't know because that wasn't in the script

[1:07:43] it was just like there was none of that it was uh i i think he pretty much like the dialogue

[1:07:49] is pretty much the same but it feels like none of that none of his character choices were in the

[1:07:55] breakdown um so i think he did a pretty creative job with this role yeah and uh stewart did you

[1:08:02] mention that that uh the swimmer has started getting upset yeah so she's she obviously is

[1:08:07] not comfortable with what they are putting uh bloodshot through and she is getting upset with

[1:08:13] uh the whole situation but uh harding is like this just one last time then we can sell it and

[1:08:18] we're done she's stuck on like season six of a shitty tv show and she's like i'm tired of playing

[1:08:24] this same part over and over again yeah she's uh what's her name from uh fresh off the boat

[1:08:29] oh she's constance woo yes exactly which is a show i like but she's the one where they're like

[1:08:34] good news we got another bloodshot mission she's like oh fuck i gotta i gotta do the bloodshot

[1:08:38] thing again oh i have like offers so we now uh so bloodshot shows up to barris's compound and we

[1:08:47] have an action sequence that is mainly through like what like uh heat based security cameras

[1:08:54] of him uh like killing his way through goons because the nanites make him really hot in in

[1:09:02] every sense of that word uh but also enough that he glows his red chest glows much like the grinch

[1:09:08] learning to love christmas or i would say much like iron man the first character in a different

[1:09:15] much more successful cinematic universe of convo characters almost as if they're

[1:09:18] trying to fool us at times into thinking we're watching an iron man movie

[1:09:24] uh so he fights his way through there uh we find out that bears his tech guy uh what's his name

[1:09:31] wally wendell something wiggins wiggins actually has a portable emp device that they have to charge

[1:09:37] up so they can take out bloodshot and wiggins is a is a legendary techie guy the techie guy that

[1:09:43] works for guy pierce is like wiggins he's the king i use some of his code for bloodshot and

[1:09:47] wiggins he is dithering around in a way that initially you think is just because he's like

[1:09:52] an uh going to be an annoying comic relief character but he has his reasons for taking

[1:09:57] his time with this he has his raisins he has

[1:10:00] he has his reasons really said recently and they're golden

[1:10:03] they're golden i wrote here my notes i wrote uh... guide pierce is the hack

[1:10:07] filmmaker who has in the posters on his wall

[1:10:10] uh... weekends is the indy filmmaker trying to sneak through the studio

[1:10:14] system but he's too esoteric to make something successful uh... and i in my

[1:10:19] notes it just as wiggins

[1:10:20] iro wisecracker

[1:10:21] the

[1:10:24] so bloodshot fights his way through there he kills barris and you think that he

[1:10:28] is meant to avoid the mp but somebody

[1:10:32] who we later learn is wiggins triggers it anyway taking out all the power

[1:10:36] and disrupting uh... disrupting harding's plan and his surveillance and

[1:10:40] control over bloodshot

[1:10:42] this is the end of the movie and uh... this is a moment here where

[1:10:46] it feels like the movie is trying a little too hard

[1:10:48] to to call it's call out cliche things for the tech guys like

[1:10:51] he's got the mp electromagnetic pulse that'll shut off all the electricity

[1:10:55] and skeptics like i know what any mp is uh...

[1:10:59] so of course uh... wiggins wakes bloodshot up using some uh... like a car

[1:11:04] battery

[1:11:05] uh... and they basically explain at this point like they talk a little bit about

[1:11:08] his powers and they're like oh well now you're free their control we can do

[1:11:11] whatever we want these like what what i want is to find my wife and kill this

[1:11:14] guy

[1:11:15] and we're not going to make sense

[1:11:17] but he's not completely free of their control in some sort of like

[1:11:20] vague way i mean like

[1:11:22] like they can come back in and like hijack him

[1:11:25] and this is one of the moments

[1:11:27] where i was a little confused plotting wise it felt like maybe something got

[1:11:32] cut out maybe the script got changed

[1:11:33] because we leave wiggins

[1:11:35] in such a way where you think like okay well he's going to continue to work

[1:11:40] uh... for vin diesel

[1:11:42] on this problem of like totally liberating vin diesel from their

[1:11:46] control

[1:11:47] but then the next time we see him spoiler like

[1:11:50] the swimmer is like

[1:11:52] like kind of hijacking him

[1:11:54] and taking him off so the two of them can work together to help vin diesel

[1:11:58] wait hold on like

[1:11:59] in between times like what was wiggins doing like was he

[1:12:02] trying to help was he just like

[1:12:04] ignoring him like i don't get

[1:12:07] he said he was like trying to hack

[1:12:09] the the nanite sample that

[1:12:12] that he gave him yeah well he said that at the end of the scene but then we don't see any of that

[1:12:15] like he just kind of disappears from the movie

[1:12:17] the next time we see wiggins he also has like his own personal bodyguards

[1:12:21] which convinced me

[1:12:22] yeah i was so confused because i was like wait a minute so is he rich like i

[1:12:26] don't understand i don't know what wiggins was working for barris and he

[1:12:29] diverged himself as an indentured servant

[1:12:31] but then like

[1:12:33] but he also he writes open source code

[1:12:36] so like is he

[1:12:37] a wealthy tech guy or is he like an anarchist tech guy

[1:12:40] who doesn't make money but is like a crazy master

[1:12:43] there are a lot of layers to wiggins it's a multifaceted character

[1:12:48] i can see why you wanted to play the character so badly

[1:12:51] first of all they explain that he is a sort of uh... gone to seed former child

[1:12:55] prodigy which is the number one thing i auditioned for

[1:12:59] whenever i see that in a logline i think that would have a chance

[1:13:01] yeah like a billy quiz boy type of

[1:13:03] yeah just broken child genius

[1:13:06] uh... ten years later is is kind of my wheelhouse

[1:13:10] but so yes he was sort of this child prodigy i think they show in newspaper

[1:13:13] clipping that he won some sort of

[1:13:15] coding award

[1:13:17] in like elementary school

[1:13:19] but i think yes he does open source

[1:13:21] because he's a fucking artist elliot okay

[1:13:24] he's not about working for the man

[1:13:26] he's got stuck he's stuck in this fucking shitty contract he got sold a

[1:13:30] false bill of goods he's stuck

[1:13:33] on a first look deal

[1:13:35] with this shitty fucking guy and to continue the analogy

[1:13:39] he lets vin diesel go because he's still in the seduction period of like

[1:13:43] he has gotten access to

[1:13:46] a coffee meeting with a major movie star

[1:13:48] who he's trying to convince

[1:13:50] to sign on so that he could get financing for his project

[1:13:53] like he's got a vague idea of like this is how i could use you

[1:13:57] and it would be for good

[1:13:58] but i don't totally have my shit together enough

[1:14:01] to get you to sign on for this yet

[1:14:03] i think the metaphor works perfectly if it's in terms of filmmaking

[1:14:07] it does not make sense in terms of

[1:14:09] the immediate story that absolutely not absolutely not i will concede that

[1:14:14] is like bloodshot i'm gonna work on this problem for you i'll see i guess

[1:14:18] when i get around to it

[1:14:20] do you want status updates vin diesel no that's okay i got some stuff to do

[1:14:23] alright do you want my phone number now that's i'll find you and vin diesel

[1:14:27] and vin diesel does have stuff to do because he goes to london he

[1:14:31] tracks down his wife gina's flat

[1:14:35] and uh... he knocks on the door and they you know they have a reunion but

[1:14:39] then we find out

[1:14:40] she's actually remarried they're not together anymore she has a child and

[1:14:44] it's been five years since she last saw him not only that like they broke up

[1:14:49] long before

[1:14:51] he then was taken by guy pierce yeah like not only has she moved on

[1:14:57] but his memory of them being together up until the end is like far far in the

[1:15:01] past it's um... i mean it that memory i would go as far say what they're

[1:15:05] telling us is all of that memory is false yes yeah this is literally they

[1:15:08] took his last regular serious girlfriend

[1:15:11] and slapped her face and name onto the idea of a wife

[1:15:16] who knows how and she makes it very clear like

[1:15:18] this week it wasn't like

[1:15:20] of this you know uh...

[1:15:21] there was something happened to cut our way like she did not want to be in a

[1:15:24] relationship with not anymore

[1:15:25] maybe they saw well she suggested she wanted to stay and not leave i mean that

[1:15:29] indicates that she did like it

[1:15:31] and i don't know that i have heard of it

[1:15:33] yes but she also reacts with a little

[1:15:36] fear of him when he comes on yeah he's scary

[1:15:39] if vin diesel showed up on your doorstep even if you're a fan of his it would be a little bit like i do think that it implies

[1:15:43] because she realized she could just lose her leave her current life behind to

[1:15:47] leave with vin diesel her own reaction implies to me

[1:15:52] they not only broke up

[1:15:54] but it was a bad breakup

[1:15:56] and she's like she is not unhappy to see him in the same way that you might not

[1:16:00] be unhappy to see someone

[1:16:01] that enough time has passed that you're cool with them again and like it's like

[1:16:05] nice for old times sake

[1:16:07] but she seems

[1:16:08] a little nervous in a way that suggests that things ended very badly

[1:16:12] yes and here there's something very realistic in this scene which is that her

[1:16:15] young daughter

[1:16:15] will not stop trying to get her attention and make her come into the

[1:16:18] house while this

[1:16:19] hulking man is standing there upsetting her

[1:16:21] and so it's like look i'm living that life right now people it's very hard to

[1:16:25] you could tell a kid

[1:16:27] i'm talking to my ex and he's a super marine assassin and so i'm a little afraid of why he's here

[1:16:31] the kid does not care they just want to come and show you their new paw patrol thing

[1:16:35] i fully love this scene because i feel like this the real gina that we're

[1:16:40] seeing for the first time is

[1:16:42] the only character who is not

[1:16:45] in the movie bloodshot

[1:16:46] it's just like i just have a day to do

[1:16:50] and and uh... yeah the arc of the scene is like

[1:16:52] that was a bad breakup but i moved on i don't hold it against him anymore my

[1:16:56] life turned out okay

[1:16:57] he shows up on her doorstep she's like oh this is like funny and weird

[1:17:00] i guess you're in the neighborhood we'll catch up for a couple minutes

[1:17:03] then she starts to become scared that he's a psycho

[1:17:06] and then she goes all the way around to feeling actually bad for him

[1:17:10] where you can tell by the end of the scene she's like is he having like a

[1:17:14] psychotic break

[1:17:15] like he's not making any sense and my note i wrote here is

[1:17:18] love that the gina scene is fully embarrassing

[1:17:22] just a completely earnest face plant

[1:17:24] like there is a level of vulnerability

[1:17:27] to how much vin is failing in this scene

[1:17:30] and and to the point also where vindy is a famously deep-voiced man

[1:17:34] his voice cracks a couple times in this scene

[1:17:37] where he goes like when was the last time you saw me

[1:17:40] and she goes five years and he goes

[1:17:42] five years

[1:17:43] and he sounds like a cookie monster like he's doing both like a falsetto vibrato

[1:17:50] but it is this thing where he just like cannot fathom

[1:17:54] that even though everyone was lying to him

[1:17:57] he assumed that she must have been waiting out there for him in his life

[1:18:01] and he's just being told like he was forced to method act like he was using a

[1:18:06] backstory of a woman

[1:18:07] to map onto the scenes that he was playing on a day-to-day basis

[1:18:12] there's something about like you're saying that

[1:18:14] every other situation it's like i can tough guy my way through this

[1:18:17] but there is no way aside from becoming a monster and doing something monstrous

[1:18:22] there's no way to tough your way out of like

[1:18:24] going to visit someone you think you're in a relationship with and then being

[1:18:27] like no

[1:18:28] uh... this is not happening

[1:18:29] and so he's not just yet but he's not just dealing with the fact that all of

[1:18:32] my memories are different i don't have a life

[1:18:34] it's also like yet embarrassment like uh... this is awkward i don't even know

[1:18:37] now i feel like an at like a jerk and yet she feels bad for me and i don't

[1:18:41] want to like i want to think i'm cool yeah i'm a black dot

[1:18:45] i'm assuming he sees thinking all that stuff he's thinking like

[1:18:48] why did that's the why did this specific conditioning works so well on me what

[1:18:51] does that say about my personality so while he's having these thoughts he then

[1:18:55] gets attacked by tibbs and alton

[1:18:57] who are on the hunt

[1:18:58] this must be such a relief for him to be like off thank goodness i don't know i

[1:19:01] can just

[1:19:02] i can just battle

[1:19:03] and for my story i could just battle these guys this is what i can do it like

[1:19:06] uh... that's and i wish they'd show a little more of him being like all thank

[1:19:09] god i can get to a fight now yeah i have to deal with these emotions i don't find

[1:19:13] an out for this conversation anymore i don't have to pretend like i have to be

[1:19:16] somewhere

[1:19:17] he doesn't have to go

[1:19:18] for for all that was my father and i think that the new girlfriend and i

[1:19:23] don't have to deal i gotta go

[1:19:26] uh... so

[1:19:28] this is basically a chase sequence where bloodshot is running away dalton is

[1:19:32] firing these like the mp bullets adam that like

[1:19:35] sterilizes nanites or something

[1:19:38] uh... wall tibbs is like

[1:19:40] doing all kinds of hot dog stunts on his fucking motorbike

[1:19:44] and uh... there's some really great comic relief policeman in a car

[1:19:49] that is great where he like kicks the car and there's like three slow motion

[1:19:53] shots of these two cops who despite being in london are eating american

[1:19:57] style donuts and coffee

[1:20:00] Our fucking, like, keystone cops, yeah.

[1:20:03] But, no, you, like, yeah, the car is, like, sort of, like, at half speed spinning around

[1:20:09] and Vin is backing away, using the car as a, like, shield as it rotates.

[1:20:15] It's pretty great.

[1:20:16] Yeah, and it keeps cutting to them, going, what, no!

[1:20:19] I just watched the first half of Onward last night, and, like, these cops could have been

[1:20:23] in Onward.

[1:20:24] Oh, yeah.

[1:20:25] That's how suddenly cartoonish they are.

[1:20:27] Yeah, I kind of wanted a scene with these two cops telling their, like, friends and

[1:20:31] family, like, the night after this situation, what they saw and what just happened.

[1:20:38] So, you know, the fight continues, Dalton's robot legs get knocked off, it looks like

[1:20:43] Vin's got him, and then Tibbs drives up and stabs him in the back with a jackknife, which

[1:20:50] I guess logs him onto the internet, and then they shut him down remotely.

[1:20:53] Yeah, and he has, like, three seconds to pull this knife out, and I'm, like, in my- I'm

[1:20:58] just, like, yelling, like, Vin!

[1:21:00] Vin!

[1:21:01] When they, like, jab you with a thing, you pull it out, because you gotta know that they're

[1:21:04] trying to hijack him into the Matrix, but, like-

[1:21:06] But if there's one thing I know about Vin Diesel, it's that he never pulls out.

[1:21:11] No one has ever believed in the pull-out method less than Vin Diesel.

[1:21:16] No, he's- he's- he never enters unless he's invited, but he never pulls out.

[1:21:22] I want to make this very clear.

[1:21:24] Okay.

[1:21:25] Okay.

[1:21:26] The- I mean, also, like, just logistically, I don't think he can get his arms all the

[1:21:30] way around to his back.

[1:21:31] He's just too muscly.

[1:21:32] He doesn't.

[1:21:33] That is also true.

[1:21:34] Well, he could just flex.

[1:21:35] Just use those nanites to extend his arms a little bit.

[1:21:36] Yeah.

[1:21:37] Like, come on.

[1:21:38] That would've been awesome.

[1:21:39] Or tell the nanites to push that thing out.

[1:21:40] Okay, so now KT goes on her own mission, she, uh, she waits outside for Wiggins to leave

[1:21:45] his hotel with his security detail, she uses her, uh, her special breathing abilities to

[1:21:51] blow poison smoke into people's faces, but she herself is unaffected by that smoke, because

[1:21:56] as we've addressed, she has special breathing abilities because of her cyborg lungs.

[1:22:00] She then beats up some dudes with one of those rods, and then, uh, captures Wiggins, although

[1:22:07] when she returns to Harding, she says, Wiggins got away.

[1:22:10] What?

[1:22:11] Hold on.

[1:22:12] Now, what if- now, here's- guys.

[1:22:14] What if she got mistaken, and she went- while she was capturing this Wiggins, she thought

[1:22:19] the mission was to go kill Wile E. Wiggins, the star of Dazed and Confused, and- but he

[1:22:24] got away.

[1:22:25] I mean, you're- so it's-

[1:22:26] What you're describing now, Elliot, isn't an action film, it's a tragedy.

[1:22:30] I- I cannot even, even for laughs on a podcast, imagine what would happen if we were to lose

[1:22:35] Wile E. Wiggins.

[1:22:36] Austin-

[1:22:37] I'm sorry.

[1:22:38] Competing staple.

[1:22:39] Well, I mean, luckily, he's far too Wile-y to be captured by the lightsabers.

[1:22:43] Yes.

[1:22:44] The Wile-iest of all Wiggins.

[1:22:46] Wile E. Wiggins.

[1:22:47] He was able to use his acne devices to get away.

[1:22:52] So while- while KT is deceiving them, Harding has a chat with Bloodshot in the, what, neural

[1:22:58] realm?

[1:22:59] Which is basically one of those, like, inevitable, like, uh, you know, is it worth fighting,

[1:23:03] yadda yadda, you should just do this, because what- what is life anyway, et cetera, et cetera.

[1:23:07] Well, he essentially gives Bloodshot a series of notes.

[1:23:10] He gives him a round of notes.

[1:23:11] He's like, can I just give you just a quick pass on some of the stuff you've been doing?

[1:23:15] I love this analogy.

[1:23:16] Keeping the analogy going.

[1:23:17] I love it.

[1:23:18] I love the determination.

[1:23:19] But then it even gets down to, he goes, like, I made you the best version of yourself.

[1:23:23] And Bloodshot says, you're the best version of me.

[1:23:25] And he's like, look, I made you sad, I killed a fake girlfriend, like, but I got you there.

[1:23:31] And he's essentially the abusive director saying, like, look, if I got the performance

[1:23:35] out of you, isn't that, like, what you wanted at the end of the day?

[1:23:39] Yes, Shelley Duvall.

[1:23:40] Right.

[1:23:41] It was hard for me to pay attention to this since I was still blown away from the five

[1:23:46] or six minutes they spent building the fake Italy that they're in.

[1:23:49] Yeah, they did a real serenity where the graphics just sort of came out.

[1:23:55] You don't need this much Italy for this conversation they're having.

[1:23:58] We don't need the mountains.

[1:24:00] So now that KT has lied and said that Wiggins is on the run, he's in the wind, they decide

[1:24:05] to stop draining the nanites out of him.

[1:24:08] And instead, they got a reboot Bloodshot and they have to map Wiggins' face back on

[1:24:13] the murderer of his wife.

[1:24:15] KT interrupts the sim while we find out that Wiggins, who is in the wind, is actually in

[1:24:22] a van underneath the building.

[1:24:25] And he hacks into the Bloodshot system, waking up Bloodshot.

[1:24:30] Bloodshot wakes up, KT uses her breathing ability again to sneak around Guy Pearce.

[1:24:38] She then uses her breathing ability to blow up the server system.

[1:24:41] I mean, I don't know that she used her breathing ability for that, she just walked in and blew

[1:24:45] it up.

[1:24:46] I don't think you could have done it with your human life.

[1:24:48] But also, she blows it up with similarly Bloodshot-esque, very moody, red lighting explosives because

[1:24:57] she now needs to prove that she also can be an action star.

[1:25:02] She also blows it up with great trust that the windows behind her are not going to burst

[1:25:08] spraying glass into her.

[1:25:10] She can breathe in those explosion-proof glass, yeah.

[1:25:13] And the belief that those servers aren't 100% necessary to the functioning of these nanites.

[1:25:19] Yeah, that's a good point.

[1:25:21] Now, this is around the point when I started realizing that this movie is basically Tootsie

[1:25:25] as an action movie, when both are about somebody who's forced to really transform themselves

[1:25:30] and become a new person, not because it's best really for them, but because the system

[1:25:35] around them has decreed that that's the only way they're going to survive in the mode that

[1:25:39] is most comfortable with them, the only way they can survive.

[1:25:42] And that, again, there's a woman assisting who doesn't really get her own full life or

[1:25:47] story, but is still necessary to making Bloodshot, or as I call him, Tootsie, successful until

[1:25:55] he can turn the tables and reveal himself again.

[1:25:59] Look, she's trying to take control of her narrative again.

[1:26:02] She's trying to restart her career on her own terms, and she's the one who proactively

[1:26:06] reaches out to Wiggins and is like, we should be united in this, figuring out how to bypass

[1:26:12] the studio system.

[1:26:13] So you're saying she is Elizabeth Banks creating her own projects so that she's more than just

[1:26:19] an actress who at some point will have to play moms, even though she's only 10 years

[1:26:23] older than the kid playing her child.

[1:26:26] And so she's going to make her own stuff.

[1:26:27] I see.

[1:26:28] I get that.

[1:26:29] That makes sense.

[1:26:30] Yeah.

[1:26:31] So now Dalton puts on an exosuit because those robot legs alone aren't going to kill Bloodshot.

[1:26:37] So he puts on this exosuit that has two extra arms, and then he gets in a fight with Bloodshot.

[1:26:42] This is a pretty cool fight.

[1:26:43] Like, I like that the exosuit arms basically are just a little bit longer, so it gives

[1:26:47] him some reach.

[1:26:48] No, it looks like he's wearing, like, the arms from that scene in Nightmare on Elm Street

[1:26:53] where Freddy just extends his arms really silly.

[1:26:56] Yeah.

[1:26:57] Scrapes the fences.

[1:26:58] Yeah, it's psychological warfare right there.

[1:27:01] Yeah, I'm going to say, like, I'm not going to pretend I didn't like the movie up until

[1:27:05] this point, but I also, when he put on these extra long robot arms, I'm like, OK, well

[1:27:11] this is the movie I really wanted to see.

[1:27:14] 100%.

[1:27:15] So I believe, I would assume, the only person here who has watched all these special features

[1:27:21] on the digital release of Bloodshot.

[1:27:23] That's a fair assumption.

[1:27:25] And this goes back to the point of the earlier action sequences not being terribly exciting,

[1:27:30] even if the movie itself is kind of stylish overall.

[1:27:33] This movie had a budget of, like, $40 million, which is very, very budget for something that

[1:27:38] is trying to kickstart a cinematic universe based on comic books.

[1:27:43] But there is an alternate ending with a director's intro that is this final battle, except it

[1:27:50] just happens without any CGI in the swimming pool that Iza Gonzalez does her dances in.

[1:27:59] And then he just drowns him to death.

[1:28:01] Oh, OK.

[1:28:02] And they said that that was the ending in the script with the budget they had, and they

[1:28:07] screened it for the studio, and they were like, this is the most anticlimactic thing

[1:28:11] of all time.

[1:28:12] Oh, shit.

[1:28:13] So this entire final action sequence is, like, the one reshoot in the movie that is them

[1:28:18] saying, like, we'll give you a couple extra million dollars, make your video game cutscene.

[1:28:22] Like, we know you can do that.

[1:28:24] Do your insane comic book fight scene.

[1:28:26] And it's why it's the only fight scene in this that is actually pretty exciting.

[1:28:30] I mean, that explains why they spent a good amount of time setting up that swimming pool.

[1:28:35] Yes.

[1:28:36] Because otherwise there's no reason for her to be a swimmer, no reason for her power to

[1:28:39] be special breathing, no reason for them to have a pool.

[1:28:42] Swimming pool is supposed to be the Chekhov's gun that then Vin Diesel transfers so many

[1:28:47] nanites to this guy that he becomes heavy and drowns in the pool.

[1:28:51] Ha!

[1:28:52] Oh, wow.

[1:28:53] Terrible.

[1:28:54] Terrible alternate fight.

[1:28:55] Yeah.

[1:28:56] Yeah, and he's like, I wish I had the lung breathing power instead.

[1:29:01] It's the, because this scene is a really fun, like, creative action scene.

[1:29:08] Yeah.

[1:29:09] And the only issue I had with it was that they seem to keep forgetting that Vin Diesel

[1:29:13] has nanites in his body and can come back from anything because they're just dropping

[1:29:16] him down elevator shafts and then they're surprised when he comes back and it's like,

[1:29:19] yeah, dudes, he's full of nanites.

[1:29:20] I don't know, just tell you.

[1:29:21] But then also, this is when he, like, goes turbo and finally transforms into something

[1:29:26] that vaguely resembles the comic book character.

[1:29:28] Like, he gets his sort of kabuki bloodshot getup where he's pale white and his eyes are

[1:29:34] red.

[1:29:35] The thing about this exosuit is it reminded me of the movie Elysium, if the movie Elysium

[1:29:39] was cool and had longer arms for the exosuit.

[1:29:44] So, yeah, so they get in this big fight.

[1:29:47] It's crazy.

[1:29:48] They end up on these, like, giant elevators.

[1:29:51] Tibbs joins in in the fight and you're like, whoa, dude, you don't even have an exosuit.

[1:29:55] And, of course, Dalton ends up letting Tibbs die.

[1:30:00] He's got bloodshot, but of course bloodshot kills Dalton,

[1:30:03] and he falls all the way to the bottom,

[1:30:05] and you're like, oh man, he's almost dead.

[1:30:07] And then, nope, he's not dead,

[1:30:09] and he interrupts Harding, who, yeah,

[1:30:12] what's his name, Harding, Hartness, whatever,

[1:30:14] who is trying to escape.

[1:30:16] He throws a robot arm through his car,

[1:30:19] and Harding shoots bloodshot with a grenade,

[1:30:24] which maxes out his, depletes his nanites, I guess,

[1:30:28] because using the nanites a lot,

[1:30:30] his nanite percentage goes down like 2% or something,

[1:30:33] and you're like, what the fuck?

[1:30:34] He sees this, Guy Pearce has a readout on his robot arm,

[1:30:37] and it says nanite levels depleted at a certain point,

[1:30:41] and that is one of those lines,

[1:30:43] even if it's not spoken out loud,

[1:30:45] if your movie can somehow get to nanite levels depleted

[1:30:48] as three words in a row, you have me.

[1:30:51] It's so great because Lamorne Morris Wiggins

[1:30:57] is watching the nanites reducing on his computer screen,

[1:31:00] and as soon as they hit zero, all of his monitors turn off.

[1:31:04] That was one of the stranger things earlier, too,

[1:31:07] when he sets off the EMP, Wiggins' monitors don't turn off,

[1:31:11] they just say no feed, so I guess maybe his stuff

[1:31:14] was shielded, I don't know, but it just seems very funny

[1:31:16] that it shuts off everything, but his stuff is fine.

[1:31:19] He's got some hand-cranked computers, yeah.

[1:31:21] But I also-

[1:31:22] He has a horse walking in a giant wheel,

[1:31:25] and that's how it works.

[1:31:26] I mean, he is the one guy who knew that this was coming,

[1:31:29] I don't know.

[1:31:30] That's fair, that's very fair.

[1:31:31] But Harding is also making the argument of,

[1:31:35] well, you can't kill me, I'm the only person

[1:31:37] who understands how to use you, I made you,

[1:31:40] you're inherently tied to me, and what I wrote down here

[1:31:44] was it's literally about the three POC characters

[1:31:48] fighting for autonomy and control of their narrative,

[1:31:51] and the conventional white man's fight against irrelevance,

[1:31:54] and then my next note is, I love this movie,

[1:31:57] I can't wait to watch it a third time.

[1:32:00] So yeah, so at this point, his nanites are depleted,

[1:32:08] Guy Pearce shoots another grenade at him,

[1:32:11] the last bit of nanites are used to strip the casing

[1:32:14] off the grenade, Guy Pearce walks up and he's like,

[1:32:17] the nanites are gone, it's just you,

[1:32:20] and then, of course, Vin Diesel reveals,

[1:32:23] I mean, at that point, you're like, yeah,

[1:32:24] he's just Vin Diesel, you're totally dead, dude.

[1:32:27] So he holds out in his hand that he's got the grenade,

[1:32:31] which he drops on the ground and it explodes,

[1:32:32] killing Guy Pearce, and theoretically killing Vin Diesel,

[1:32:36] finally he can rest, his hard work is over.

[1:32:41] He knows for the first time, much like Murphy realizing

[1:32:44] he is Murphy and not Robocop, he realizes for the first time

[1:32:48] just who he is inside, his true heart is enough

[1:32:51] to be a hero.

[1:32:53] It is something that I feel like it's weakened slightly

[1:32:54] by the fact that the audience has no idea who he is.

[1:32:56] Oh, no, we haven't met Ray Garrison,

[1:32:58] we don't know him at all.

[1:32:59] No, all we know is that he has an ex-girlfriend

[1:33:02] that he still has feelings for, and otherwise,

[1:33:04] I don't know if he was really in the military, I guess so,

[1:33:07] when he says, I said I'd always come home,

[1:33:08] and she was like, but I wanted you to stay at home,

[1:33:10] he could have been a traveling salesman, I don't know.

[1:33:13] Yeah, as opposed to the colorful character Murphy was

[1:33:17] before he became Robocop.

[1:33:19] No, but you see Murphy's, you know what Murphy's

[1:33:21] actual family is.

[1:33:22] Yeah, you know, he can do the gun trick.

[1:33:24] Pistols around.

[1:33:25] Exactly.

[1:33:26] And I think that's one of Verhoeven's jokes

[1:33:27] is that Murphy has more personality as a robot

[1:33:30] than he did as a human being.

[1:33:32] But like, when he's like, I know who I am now,

[1:33:34] the audience is like, great, are we gonna,

[1:33:36] can I find out, is that, because I know your name,

[1:33:38] is your name really Ray, I think it is,

[1:33:40] is that a nickname, like, I don't know.

[1:33:42] So we, of course, next thing we know,

[1:33:45] Bloodshot is waking up from a new fresh injection

[1:33:48] of nanites, they're hanging out in a trailer

[1:33:50] somewhere along Pacific Coast Highway 1, I bet,

[1:33:53] which is along the South African coast.

[1:33:56] Wiggins is dressed so stylish.

[1:33:58] He's gone to Hollywood, he sold his first script.

[1:34:01] He's now on the other side, he's new money.

[1:34:06] Yeah, I didn't quite understand the logic of this,

[1:34:09] where it's just like, okay, well, we blew up the bad guys,

[1:34:11] so now I guess I'm rich, but whatever.

[1:34:14] That's the thing, he secretly has been running

[1:34:17] the exact same con that Harding has been doing,

[1:34:21] and Harding was his last rival in the game, right?

[1:34:24] Yeah.

[1:34:25] Now he controls Bloodshot.

[1:34:27] But he's an artist.

[1:34:29] Although his Bloodshot control, we don't know.

[1:34:30] Yeah.

[1:34:31] That's what he's been telling people anyway,

[1:34:33] but then they, now they're all, it's really funny

[1:34:36] because Vin, and then Vin Diesel tells KT,

[1:34:38] he's like, now we get to choose our own destinies,

[1:34:40] and they all drive off together, and I'm like,

[1:34:41] so why are you guys a team now?

[1:34:44] Yeah.

[1:34:44] Like, there's nothing holding you together except

[1:34:47] that you were all part of this, but like, why?

[1:34:48] What is keeping them together?

[1:34:49] What are things they can do together?

[1:34:50] But it's also perfect.

[1:34:52] Yeah, what can they do together, Elliot?

[1:34:54] Well, she can breathe shit while he's punching people,

[1:34:58] and Wiggins codes sounds like a perfect trio to me.

[1:35:02] No, I mean, in terms of powers, yes, it meshes perfectly.

[1:35:06] So complimentary.

[1:35:07] But it's like, Wiggins is like, hey,

[1:35:10] I've known you for a couple days,

[1:35:11] and you tried to kill me for a little bit,

[1:35:13] and KT is like, hey, I've seen you be used

[1:35:16] over and over again as a robo-assassin.

[1:35:18] I guess we're a family now?

[1:35:19] And Vin Diesel, I guess everything with Vin Diesel

[1:35:21] is about family.

[1:35:22] Every Vin Diesel movie is about family.

[1:35:24] And also,

[1:35:24] Fast and Furious, Bloodshot, Olive Garden,

[1:35:26] it's all about family for him.

[1:35:27] And Vin Diesel also, or not Vin Diesel,

[1:35:30] but the movie at large, including Vin Diesel,

[1:35:33] plays the total recall card,

[1:35:36] which is you have this shot of them driving into the sunset,

[1:35:39] and then they literally lampshade it and say,

[1:35:42] driving off into the sunset,

[1:35:44] are we sure this isn't a sim-you,

[1:35:46] and it cuts off Lation and goes to credits.

[1:35:49] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1:35:50] It's like, yeah, it's the spinning top

[1:35:52] at the end of Inception.

[1:35:53] Yeah, well, the end scene is so perfect

[1:35:56] that it does, it is impossible not to have that thought,

[1:35:59] like, is this just another level of manipulation?

[1:36:02] And then the movie, as you say, lampshades it.

[1:36:05] And I like how kind of lightly they treat it,

[1:36:08] but also, the more I think about it,

[1:36:11] like, the idea that maybe they were trying

[1:36:13] to start a valiant universe, like,

[1:36:15] it's much more ballsy that they end the movie this way,

[1:36:17] because it suggests that any possible sequels

[1:36:20] are also just a fantasy that Bloodshot is having.

[1:36:22] And it's all in the same elsewhere kid's head,

[1:36:25] ultimately, all these movies.

[1:36:27] But that, I was waiting for the mid-credits sequence

[1:36:29] where they're like, sir, sir, this killer on the loose,

[1:36:32] don't worry, we'll stop him with the Harbinger Project.

[1:36:35] But then, what you said makes sense

[1:36:37] that they don't have a scene like that,

[1:36:38] but they, I was waiting for that mid-credits sequence

[1:36:41] in a set of characters no one has heard of ever.

[1:36:43] Yeah, yeah, they're like, excuse me, Mr. Toyoharada,

[1:36:46] we have information about the Hardcore Project, or whatever.

[1:36:51] Yeah, I mean, aside from the fact that the audience

[1:36:53] wouldn't recognize those names,

[1:36:54] it also just feels like, to your point, Dan,

[1:36:57] and I think, to this movie's credit,

[1:37:00] whether or not it was intentional on the filmmakers' parts,

[1:37:04] few films have ever felt less conducive

[1:37:06] to building out a bunch of spinoffs,

[1:37:08] since the movie, it is like they tried

[1:37:12] to make a total recall universe,

[1:37:14] and they'd be like, oh yeah, yeah, all that stuff was real.

[1:37:16] All the stuff happened, you went to Mars,

[1:37:17] and all that stuff.

[1:37:18] You're like, what the fuck happens parallel to this?

[1:37:20] What are you talking about?

[1:37:22] Like, I love that the movie is sort of such a failure

[1:37:25] at building out a cinematic universe

[1:37:26] that it becomes a perfect self-contained movie.

[1:37:30] It did such a bad job at it that if they were to say,

[1:37:32] Bloodshot 2's coming out next summer,

[1:37:34] we would all be like, yes, please.

[1:37:36] Yes, yes.

[1:37:40] So yeah, why don't we go into final judgments, guys?

[1:37:42] Yeah, this is where we say whether it's a good, bad movie,

[1:37:45] a bad, bad movie, or a movie we kind of liked,

[1:37:47] but I think we all know that we enjoyed this movie, so.

[1:37:51] I think there's a continuum of enjoyment.

[1:37:53] I think we all kind of liked it.

[1:37:55] I think that Griffin may be the only one

[1:37:57] who loves it entirely, purely.

[1:38:00] I think it's the best movie

[1:38:01] you've ever covered on this podcast.

[1:38:03] And I want to plant this flag now

[1:38:07] before there's some five years later

[1:38:09] John Wick, Jack Reacher style reassessment

[1:38:13] from the people, not you guys,

[1:38:15] but the people who have dismissed this movie out of hand.

[1:38:18] Here's another thing,

[1:38:19] another little nuance I like in this movie.

[1:38:21] There's this scene where KT comes to Guy Pearce

[1:38:26] and is like, I want out of my contract.

[1:38:28] Like, I want to go on to appear in Marvel movies

[1:38:31] or whatever Constance Wu was trying to do instead.

[1:38:35] And Guy Pearce tries to make the argument

[1:38:37] for why what they're doing is still like artistically valid.

[1:38:40] And she's saying, like, he deserves

[1:38:45] to like be let go of this.

[1:38:46] He deserves to not be run through this simulation

[1:38:49] over and over again.

[1:38:51] And Guy Pearce really earnestly says

[1:38:53] what he deserves is a military funeral.

[1:38:56] Because I feel like, unlike a lot of movies

[1:38:59] where they try and fail to build up a sort of ideology

[1:39:02] that the villain thinks that he's the good guy,

[1:39:05] this is a movie in which the villain

[1:39:07] wants to get brownie points for being woke.

[1:39:10] Like he wants to pretend that he is actually

[1:39:13] the most considerate and empathetic

[1:39:15] and that he is doing this for a better reason

[1:39:17] and a greater cause and the ends justify the means.

[1:39:21] Not just that like, you know,

[1:39:24] ultimately this will pay out,

[1:39:25] but also like you don't understand

[1:39:26] I'm actually more considerate than you are.

[1:39:29] I recognize that he's a fucking hero.

[1:39:33] Yeah, he's the real ally in this situation.

[1:39:35] He's the ultimate ally.

[1:39:38] I mean, I will say like, I may overvalue this movie

[1:39:41] just because there are a few things I like better

[1:39:44] than like a scrappy little sci-fi action movie.

[1:39:50] Or a Scrappy-Doo.

[1:39:51] Or Scrappy-Doo, love them.

[1:39:53] Most people say you ruined Scooby-Doo, not me.

[1:39:56] He perfected it.

[1:39:57] No, but like, it's a.

[1:40:00] Kind of like, knowingly B-level genre movie that I am programmed to respond to anyway.

[1:40:08] But this is a fun version of that.

[1:40:10] Totally.

[1:40:11] And I think, like, sort of, parallel to what you're saying, it's one of the reasons I for

[1:40:15] so long would always argue the value of the, you know, annual January, February, Liam Neeson

[1:40:22] action film.

[1:40:23] Because I was like, these are the only movies that are disconnected from any fucking cinematic

[1:40:28] universe, even the one series he has taken is clearly making it up as it goes along.

[1:40:34] And they're just like, so in control and like, full ownership of what they are and not trying

[1:40:41] to be what they aren't.

[1:40:42] And like, living in the beautiful space of just like, this is just like, it's a 20 million

[1:40:47] dollar action movie that comes out in the winter.

[1:40:50] And so rarely do we get a film like that, that also is a sci-fi film or, you know, has

[1:40:56] special effects or is based off intellectual property.

[1:41:00] Because the second those elements get involved, they're like, this has to be a four quadrant

[1:41:05] start of a larger franchise.

[1:41:07] And it feels like this movie just backed away from all of that, whether by design or whether

[1:41:12] by just sort of a lack of conviction at the studio level that this could lead to any sequels.

[1:41:18] It's like this movie is just so fully what it is.

[1:41:22] And I would say, I would say that it's the Liam Neeson parallel also like, how many other

[1:41:27] films are dealing with the things that the elderly have to face than Liam Neeson's movies

[1:41:32] or The Farewell?

[1:41:33] That's pretty much it.

[1:41:34] Yeah.

[1:41:35] It's like last year, if you wanted to see a movie about the elderly, it was just The

[1:41:36] Commuter or The Farewell.

[1:41:37] That's all you got.

[1:41:38] It really deals with like, how many cuts an old man needs to get over a fence.

[1:41:42] To make it look like he's jumping over a fence.

[1:41:45] Yeah, that's it.

[1:41:46] I mean, so many, so many, like, if I want an action fix and it isn't going to be like

[1:41:52] a big, like a big budget franchise movie, I have to go to like VOD Scott Adkins action

[1:41:59] movies.

[1:42:00] Yeah.

[1:42:01] So this is, yeah, this is pretty nice.

[1:42:02] The movie this reminds me of the most now that you've pulled out Scott Adkins, Stuart,

[1:42:08] is I think it's the fourth Universal Soldier movie, Universal Soldier Day of Reckoning,

[1:42:13] which is also about a sort of guy who is reprogrammed over and over again to think

[1:42:20] that he is acting out a sort of self-righteous mission, but is actually just like fulfilling

[1:42:25] everyone else's desires.

[1:42:32] Welcome back to Fireside Chat on KMAX.

[1:42:35] With me in studio to take your calls is the dopest duo on the West Coast, Oliver Wong

[1:42:41] and Morgan Rhodes.

[1:42:42] Go ahead, caller.

[1:42:43] Hey, I'm looking for a music podcast that's insightful and thoughtful, but like also helps

[1:42:44] me discover artists and albums that I've never heard of.

[1:42:45] Yeah, man.

[1:42:46] Sounds like you need to listen to Hate Rocks every week.

[1:42:47] Myself and I'm Morgan Rhodes and my co-host here, Oliver Wong, talk to influential guests

[1:42:48] about a canonical album that has changed their lives.

[1:42:49] Guests like Moby, Open Mic Eagle, talk about albums by Prince, Joni Mitchell and so much

[1:42:50] more.

[1:42:51] Yo, what's that show called again?

[1:42:52] Hate Rocks.

[1:42:53] Deep dives into hot records every Thursday on Maximum Fun.

[1:43:19] Hello, this is Amy Mann.

[1:43:20] And I'm Ted Leo.

[1:43:21] And we have a podcast called The Art of Process.

[1:43:23] We've been lucky enough over the past year to talk to some of our friends and acquaintances

[1:43:27] from across the creative spectrum to find out how they actually work.

[1:43:30] So I have to write material that makes sense and makes people laugh.

[1:43:33] I also have to think about what I'm saying to people.

[1:43:37] If I kick your ass, I'll make you famous.

[1:43:39] The fight to get LGBTQ representation in the show.

[1:43:43] We weirdly don't know as many musicians as you would expect.

[1:43:46] I really just became a political speech writer by accident.

[1:43:49] Realizing that I have accidentally pulled my pants down.

[1:43:52] Listen and subscribe at MaximumFun.org or wherever you get your podcasts.

[1:43:57] It's like if the guinea pig was complicit in helping the scientist.

[1:44:03] The Flophouse is sponsored in part by Squarespace.

[1:44:07] Aw.

[1:44:08] Hey, everyone.

[1:44:09] We're all at home.

[1:44:10] You know, well, not all of us.

[1:44:12] Some of us are forced to work and my hearts are with you if you're one of them.

[1:44:17] I said hearts.

[1:44:18] My multiple hearts.

[1:44:20] This ad read is going great, but if you are stuck at home, maybe it's time to start your

[1:44:30] own website.

[1:44:31] You know, you can turn your cool idea into something we can all enjoy on the internet,

[1:44:35] blog or publish content, sell products and services of all kinds, and much, much more.

[1:44:43] Squarespace allows you to do this by giving you beautiful, customizable templates created

[1:44:47] by world-class designers.

[1:44:50] Everything is optimized for mobile right out of the box.

[1:44:52] People can look at it on their phones, their tablets, their whatchamacallits, a new way

[1:44:55] to buy domains and choose from over 200 extensions, free and secure hosting.

[1:45:02] Hey, head to squarespace.com slash flop for a free trial and when you're ready to launch,

[1:45:09] use the offer code flop to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

[1:45:15] Now, Dan, I had a question.

[1:45:17] So I have a website idea and I was wondering if Squarespace could help me with it.

[1:45:22] You know, I thought you might have this question and I think the answer is probably yes, but

[1:45:27] why don't you expound upon it at length?

[1:45:29] So the technology, I'm just not sure if it's there yet.

[1:45:31] I was so inspired by this movie, I wanted to start a website called Brainspace where

[1:45:35] with Brainspace, we've got customizable templates that you can change the memories, fantasies

[1:45:40] and also vengeances of individual people, maybe yourself, maybe someone else.

[1:45:45] I was just so impressed in the movie at how easy it was to just go into Vin Diesel's memory

[1:45:49] and change what things look like, add a machete here, change a guy's face to that.

[1:45:54] I want to make that kind of thing available to people for a reasonable price.

[1:45:56] So it's called Brainspace.net.

[1:45:57] Brainspace.com of course was taken by my previous website where it was places to put your brain

[1:46:04] if you're not using it.

[1:46:05] It's like a storage space for your brain.

[1:46:07] Didn't go great.

[1:46:09] A lot of people paid the deposit and then did not pay the fees for the monthly rate

[1:46:14] and we end up having to throw a lot of brains out, you know, just in the garbage, it's in

[1:46:18] the contract.

[1:46:19] But so Brainspace.net of course would be like, hey, go into someone's brain and like I want

[1:46:25] one of these things to be able to scale from dreams to memories.

[1:46:29] I want 24-hour customer service and templates.

[1:46:31] Do you think they could help me set that up?

[1:46:34] I think they could.

[1:46:35] I just, I'm distracted by like, I know it was just a throwaway gag but I am still enjoying

[1:46:41] how casually horrifying your previous website was.

[1:46:44] Brainspace.com?

[1:46:45] Yeah.

[1:46:46] Yeah.

[1:46:47] I mean, to be fair, it was the website for a physical storage space for brains.

[1:46:52] Because let me, you know what?

[1:46:53] Have you ever heard someone say, hey, this movie, like Bloodshot, just check your brain

[1:46:55] at the door?

[1:46:56] Sure.

[1:46:57] Where do you put in your brain when you're checking it?

[1:46:58] That's a good point.

[1:46:59] You're supposed to hold it in your hands the whole time, that's where your popcorn goes,

[1:47:02] in your hands.

[1:47:03] And then eventually your mouth.

[1:47:04] Yeah, it says specifically at the door, so you wouldn't do that.

[1:47:06] Yeah, yeah, but where at the door?

[1:47:08] I've been to movie theaters, there's not like a bucket you can just put your brain in.

[1:47:10] Yeah, that's true.

[1:47:11] Where am I supposed to, I'm just supposed to leave it on the floor where it's going

[1:47:13] to get, you know, fuzz all over it?

[1:47:15] Or in that box with all the 3D glasses?

[1:47:17] Exactly.

[1:47:18] And then someone reaches in to get some 3D glasses so they can see a movie the way it's

[1:47:21] meant to be seen, right in your face, coming at you, and they come out with a brain in

[1:47:24] their hands?

[1:47:25] And worse yet, it's your brain?

[1:47:26] Nobody wants that.

[1:47:27] That's a nightmare for them and for you, because now they've got to figure out where this brain

[1:47:30] goes, or worst case scenario, they just throw it away.

[1:47:33] And you come back from the movie and you're like, oh, that was great, I really enjoyed

[1:47:36] Jingle All The Way, and you get into the bucket and your brain's not there, and it's like,

[1:47:40] where to put my brain?

[1:47:41] Now I've got to find it?

[1:47:42] Oh, man.

[1:47:43] So Brainspace.com was, it was really a storage space so that you could have a place where

[1:47:47] you knew your brain was.

[1:47:48] But a lot of people, we'd take the brain, they'd pay their deposit, we'd remove the

[1:47:52] brain, and then put them in a cab and send them off their way, and we'd never get the

[1:47:57] check in the mail for the first month's rent.

[1:47:59] You'd be like, I'm putting you in a cab, where do you live?

[1:48:02] I don't remember.

[1:48:04] All this again.

[1:48:05] Yeah, yeah.

[1:48:06] And so, anyway, speaking of which, do you guys need any brains?

[1:48:13] Like for eating, or?

[1:48:14] I don't, hey, it's not my job to tell you what to do with them, or even to ask what

[1:48:18] you do with them.

[1:48:19] I'm just saying I've got a surplus of a certain product, human brains, and I was wondering

[1:48:22] if you guys had to use for it.

[1:48:24] I mean, you know, normally I'd say yes, but at this time of scarcity, you know, send them

[1:48:29] on over.

[1:48:30] Okay, because otherwise I'm just going to have to use my other website, Spacebrain.com.

[1:48:34] That's where we fire brains into space.

[1:48:36] We don't have rocket ships, per se, it's more of a catapult, and we never see them again.

[1:48:42] So we just kind of assume that they leave the atmosphere and enter probably low orbital

[1:48:45] space.

[1:48:46] We won't find out for a while until NASA tells us they have brains in them.

[1:48:50] Yeah, they could just be landing in your neighbor's yard or something.

[1:48:52] It seems likely.

[1:48:53] He definitely said he wanted to talk to me about something, and I've been kind of dodging

[1:48:56] him for a couple of weeks.

[1:48:57] Now, Griffin, you are an expert improviser.

[1:49:00] What would you say about Elliot's technique?

[1:49:01] How do you?

[1:49:04] I don't know about expert.

[1:49:06] I'm loving it.

[1:49:07] I'm all the way in.

[1:49:09] And speaking of improv, look, I know this episode is running long.

[1:49:13] I tend to be verbose, and I seem to make all podcasts longer when I guest on them.

[1:49:18] I hope you guys don't mind the arrogance, but I did come prepared with my own sponsorship,

[1:49:23] if that's fine.

[1:49:24] I'd like to do a quick ad.

[1:49:25] Oh, sure.

[1:49:26] Sure.

[1:49:27] If that's okay.

[1:49:28] At least we can do it for your being with us.

[1:49:29] Sure, yeah.

[1:49:30] Oh, of course.

[1:49:31] So this is my sponsorship.

[1:49:32] It is the official bloodshot action figure.

[1:49:35] Let me unblur my camera here.

[1:49:37] Oh, wow.

[1:49:39] It looks like a bloodshot, the comic book character, but it very much has been Diesel's

[1:49:45] face, despite him never looking like this in the movie.

[1:49:48] I bought this two months before seeing the film, have just had this around my apartment.

[1:49:55] And this was manufactured by Todd McFarlane, another 90s comic.

[1:50:00] edginess

[1:50:01] luminary

[1:50:02] So I like that. Oh, you think that people manufacture it for you? No, no, I know at home

[1:50:07] He makes them at home. I I have a feeling he's probably about to lose a lot of money on this

[1:50:12] So I want to just advertise them tell people to go out

[1:50:16] It's the one reason to break self quarantine to leave your house

[1:50:20] Go out and buy an American bloodshot action figure and Dan to answer your earlier question about whether bloodshot in the comics

[1:50:27] Uses like guns or just nanite punches people, of course bloodshed comes with a giant knife

[1:50:35] Stab that's my ad read

[1:50:39] Okay, great

[1:50:42] McFarlane from taking a bath on that one. Look Tommy's fallen already has he he wishes he had that money

[1:50:46] He spent on Mark McGuire's home run ball. You gotta you you gotta help him

[1:50:50] So not not, you know, I don't have the money so we can waste out on more stuff to buy more balls

[1:50:57] Took a photo of Griffin holding up the bloodshot action figure

[1:51:01] This is the one time I'm gonna tell people to tweet at me if I make a mistake

[1:51:05] Tweeted me if I've forgotten to post this on the Instagram and Twitter feeds

[1:51:10] Once this episode drops and I'll remember to get it off my phone and onto the internet so you can all enjoy this action figure

[1:51:18] But now let's move on

[1:51:21] to letters from listeners

[1:51:24] listeners like you

[1:51:27] First one. Yeah, we do

[1:51:31] That's the kind of devil may care attitude

[1:51:38] Jen last name withheld right? All right. Hi peaches

[1:51:43] Yesterday, I got offered my dream job

[1:51:45] I'm simultaneously incredibly excited about it while also fighting the nauseous feeling that I don't deserve it and

[1:51:52] Or I'm going to fail at it

[1:51:54] You've all had some pretty amazing jobs in your time while also being pretty open about mental health

[1:51:59] So my question to you is what have you done to deal with feelings of imposter syndrome?

[1:52:05] Thanks for all you do Jen last name withheld

[1:52:09] I

[1:52:11] Mean like I know that it took me

[1:52:15] Multiple years to feel comfortable at the Daily Show as a writer

[1:52:20] And some of that was just learning that like

[1:52:23] The whole thing doesn't necessarily depend on me like any organization you're in

[1:52:30] like you have to realize that you're in it together and so

[1:52:34] That takes a little of the like stress that might hurt yourself off of it. But you also just have to like

[1:52:40] This is gonna sound like a platitude, but you you can't worry so much about

[1:52:45] Meeting others expectations of you. You have to worry about like what you can control

[1:52:50] You can't control what they think of you. You can control the work that you put in

[1:52:55] Which will sort of help you feel good about yourself if you feel good about your own work and can take pride in your own

[1:53:01] work

[1:53:03] Well, I to add on to that. Is that

[1:53:05] remember that their

[1:53:07] Expectations for I don't know what the job is, but congratulations on getting it. That's fantastic

[1:53:11] Like Dan was saying

[1:53:13] You're probably part of a team even bloodshot was part of a team even though the business really did seem to rely on his work

[1:53:19] Mostly, yeah, if he failed then the whole operation was gonna fall apart

[1:53:23] Which is not a great way to build a business that relies on one person who you have to brainwash to do the job

[1:53:28] Yeah, but but there you know

[1:53:30] You if you are part of a team then like you don't have to be a hundred percent every day

[1:53:34] The best is that you try to get as close to working as hard as you can to your job

[1:53:38] But also to remember that like they want you to succeed if they gave you that job. They think you can do that job

[1:53:44] Yeah, they're not you're not an imposter to them. You are someone who is starting out doing a job and so

[1:53:49] They probably understand that you're not gonna be perfect right off the bat. It takes time

[1:53:53] I remember when I started as a writer at the Daily Show

[1:53:56] I already worked there for a number of years and so I was like, I know this place

[1:53:59] I'm gonna hit it out of the park instantly and it took me like a year until I was consistently doing well and

[1:54:05] They knew that and they were like

[1:54:07] I'm sure in their mind. It was like we're hiring because we know he can do this job

[1:54:11] We don't expect him to be the best at this job

[1:54:14] Immediately, this is how anything works

[1:54:16] What Ellie just said remind me of something that has helped me when it comes to performing, but I think it comes

[1:54:22] To just regular work as well

[1:54:25] I always think of that scene in The Simpsons where Lisa has that dream where she's performing on stage and everyone is

[1:54:33] Booing and it's her and Art Garfunkel and all the other yeah, and then she says to herself

[1:54:38] Why would they come just to boo us?

[1:54:41] And I don't think of that whatever like I have to go on stage for like a live show for the podcast or whatever

[1:54:46] I'm just like they're not gonna come just to boo us if they came they want us to succeed like Elliot said

[1:54:51] And so your audience wants you to succeed and your your bosses want you to succeed and they they the situation that

[1:54:57] They've put you in and they're very aware of it is this is a person that we feel can do this job and they are

[1:55:01] Learning how to do this job and they've just started and they know that and you know that because you are not an imposter

[1:55:06] You are a person who is starting a job and that's a real thing that you are

[1:55:09] Yeah, only you're only you're only your enemies and jealous friends want you to fail

[1:55:14] And unless you got the job under false pretenses

[1:55:16] like if this is catch me if you can then you should have imposter syndrome because you're pretending to be a doctor and you're not

[1:55:21] One and that's terrible. My guess is that you went in there under

[1:55:25] true pretenses and they know it everybody's aware of the deal that you were starting this job and you're gonna do great as long as

[1:55:31] Try your best and learn it, you know work as hard as you can. That's why it's called him

[1:55:36] That's why we're talking about imposter syndrome

[1:55:38] I thought it was you have to convince your loved one to shoot the imposter of you

[1:55:44] Instead of you because they're evil and you're doing in that case. You just look for the goatee, sir

[1:55:49] It's pretty easy. No, but what if you already have a goatee? Oh, that's yeah, if you're Kevin Smith your screws. No one knows

[1:55:56] I'm just regular Kevin Smith. Yeah

[1:56:00] affable stoner Kevin Smith I

[1:56:02] Imagine that would be one of those situations where a Kevin Smith would be like shoot him. I'm the one in the bathrobe

[1:56:08] I feel imposter syndrome with literally everything I do in my entire life

[1:56:14] But as someone who has had a largely unsuccessful career working with

[1:56:19] People who are successful at different times

[1:56:22] The biggest common thread I have found is

[1:56:25] everyone who I respect

[1:56:27] and especially respect more after I've worked with them and see how they work also feels imposter syndrome and

[1:56:33] Everyone I know who is completely certain that they know what they're doing

[1:56:37] Tends to be pretty lazy and hacky at their job

[1:56:41] In creative fields at least I have found that to be the case

[1:56:45] Well, who is the person who has the least amount of imposter syndrome is the president and he is the worst at his job

[1:56:51] He's the best and like you that's not what you want to be, right?

[1:56:55] So I think all offered really good lessons about how you should learn to believe in yourself a little more

[1:57:01] But also it is important to have a little bit of fear that you might be an imposter

[1:57:07] Yeah

[1:57:08] There's actually been psychological tests on this like people who yeah

[1:57:12] I think that they have imposter syndrome tend to be better than their jobs and the people who have this blind faith in themselves

[1:57:17] There's there's a thing that a that

[1:57:19] David Bowie said that I only know about because I think it was the moment of Zen on The Daily Show after he died because

[1:57:24] It's not like I know everything about David Bowie

[1:57:25] We're just talking about how

[1:57:26] when he was working on something and he felt really kind of frightened and unsure of himself when it felt like he had gone too

[1:57:32] Far into the ocean and couldn't feel the ground beneath his feet

[1:57:34] That's when he did his best work and that's when he did his most exciting work because he was kind of

[1:57:39] He didn't know what he was gonna do and he was afraid of it and like I've certainly found in my career

[1:57:42] I do better work when I am

[1:57:46] Unsure of myself and have to work to prove myself and really put the effort in then when I'm like, oh, yeah

[1:57:51] I can do this. This is fine, whatever and I don't put in the work and it's it comes out fine

[1:57:55] you know, so I think if there's a way for you to

[1:57:58] Instead of running from that feeling to kind of accept it and use it to help motivate yourself

[1:58:03] That's a good thing and if it locks you up and makes you freeze

[1:58:06] Then it's not a good thing. You should just remind yourself like

[1:58:09] Everyone knows who you are. That's a good thing. You're not fooling anybody because there's nothing to fool about and you're gonna do fine

[1:58:18] Second specific. Oh

[1:58:20] Sorry. Yeah

[1:58:21] If I get there a 30-second specific story one of my earliest jobs was playing a personal assistant to Carla

[1:58:27] Gugino on a very unsuccessful TV show and she's one of those people who I think is just like total pro good in everything

[1:58:34] She does

[1:58:35] Backs and all different types of things different sized roles. It's just like consummate professional actor to me

[1:58:41] Flop house listeners. No, I have no specific opinions about Carla Gugino

[1:58:48] But

[1:58:49] She's in no way my deepest crush of all living

[1:58:53] She she rules and I will say working with her only deepened my crush for her as well, but

[1:58:59] Shit, we were on set and it was the last episode

[1:59:02] What would turn to be a last episode of this thing ever and she was saying like I have no idea what I'm gonna do

[1:59:07] When this show is done, I don't know if I'm ever gonna work again

[1:59:09] And I was like you're Carla Gugino. You're like you you do 18 things a year

[1:59:14] I like I can't believe you wouldn't think that

[1:59:18] Clearly some other things are gonna come along and she said to me like I just had this moment

[1:59:23] I remember my first big job when I was a kid was working on a movie where I played Donald Sutherland's daughter and on the

[1:59:30] Last day of filming he said to me and then this wraps and I don't know if I ever work again

[1:59:35] and I couldn't believe that Donald Sutherland didn't know that he was gonna work again and I now realized that I

[1:59:42] Feel the same way

[1:59:45] Yeah

[1:59:47] Ellie do you need to do any family stuff? I saw one of your children

[1:59:52] Come in behind you as if we were in that viral video

[1:59:56] It was very funny from my point of view my

[2:00:00] It was my younger son and my wife bursting at the same time, pulling him away as if he was...

[2:00:07] It was a pretty good recreation of that.

[2:00:09] It was really funny.

[2:00:10] It was great.

[2:00:11] It just means he's up from his nap.

[2:00:13] He's at the point in his life where whichever parent he's with is not the one he wants to be with.

[2:00:17] He wants to be with the other one.

[2:00:19] He's got FOMO.

[2:00:20] Yeah, exactly.

[2:00:21] That's fear of momming him.

[2:00:23] Well, let's...

[2:00:24] Father or mom, oh no, that's FOMO.

[2:00:29] Well, try and keep the speed up with the rest of the show then so you can go comfort Gabriel.

[2:00:35] So I can get back to my family who I love?

[2:00:39] I mean some would argue that the podcast is a great source of semi-reliable income during this time of uncertainty.

[2:00:48] I mean it still doesn't trump love.

[2:00:51] You're right, Dan.

[2:00:52] You're right, Dan.

[2:00:53] I should put the money over my family and then rain it down on them.

[2:00:58] Let's see here.

[2:00:59] John, last name with L, writes our second and final letter of the show.

[2:01:04] Dear Floppers, I'm writing about your episode on Mortal Engines.

[2:01:08] On it, Elliot heckled the movie writers for picking stupid names for its characters, which hit home as our daughter is named Hester.

[2:01:17] We named our daughter Hester.

[2:01:22] Wow, I like Hester.

[2:01:25] This is everyone going like, oh, I can't believe Elliot did that.

[2:01:29] We named our daughter Hester because we enjoyed the name and the nice literary tie-in to the Scarlet Letter.

[2:01:35] When we saw that Mortal Engines was coming out with a lead protagonist named Hester, we were afraid it would be a hit and everyone would think that we named her after it.

[2:01:45] Thankfully, it was as unpopular as it was terrible.

[2:01:49] My question is, what other times has a movie ruined a name for you that would have been otherwise nice to use?

[2:01:55] Keep flopping, John.

[2:01:57] Elliot, I'm pretty sure you have opinions about names and movies.

[2:02:01] I don't have a direct answer for his question, but I would say that my life being named Elliot, which I don't know if the letter writer is available.

[2:02:09] It was also the name of the main character of what was at one point the biggest movie in the history of movies in the world.

[2:02:15] That certainly has been a minor cross for me to bear through my life.

[2:02:20] I have to say that as much as I love that movie, that movie of course being Pete's Dragon, in which the dragon is named Elliot.

[2:02:27] That E.T. came out when I was I think half a year old, so it was my entire life that's been the go-to point people have for the name Elliot.

[2:02:38] But at the same time – and it was really horrible because every time I'd meet someone, they'd go, Elliot.

[2:02:44] It's a specific way of saying the name.

[2:02:47] But I have to admit that I got through it, and now I never get that from anybody, and it makes me a little sad now that E.T. has I guess slipped so far off the popular consciousness that when people hear my name, they're like, hey, nice to meet you, and they don't even make the joke.

[2:03:03] I mean it might be partly because you're interacting mostly with adults now.

[2:03:07] I would get it from adults all the time until like a few years ago.

[2:03:11] And Mr. Jason Jones of The Daily Show with Jon Stewart would do it every time we had a conversation even after I'd known him for years.

[2:03:18] He's kind of a jerk.

[2:03:20] Well, he's just a guy that he needles people.

[2:03:22] A lovable jerk.

[2:03:23] But yeah, so I would say I think it's good for your name to be – your child's name to be something that is associated with them and not already associated with something else.

[2:03:36] But on the other hand, I lived through it, and look at me.

[2:03:38] Now I'm the most famous Elliot in the world probably, right?

[2:03:42] I will say also I still on a daily basis have to deal with both Gryffindor and Newman from Seinfeld.

[2:03:50] I'm getting it from both angles.

[2:03:52] Oh, yeah.

[2:03:53] That's terrible.

[2:03:54] So I used to get Cato Kaelin for Elliot Kaelin, and it was like – and luckily that's not something that happens anymore.

[2:04:00] But yeah, it's bad when both your names are.

[2:04:02] I got a guy that I used to work with that – I think Dan still works with it.

[2:04:06] He's still at the Daily Show, right?

[2:04:07] The guy whose last name was Blog, and he was like, yeah, I used to just get made fun of for having a weird name, but now I get made fun of for having a name that's a word.

[2:04:14] Wonderful.

[2:04:15] Yeah.

[2:04:16] I get Stewie from Family Guy or the Stewart character from the sketches on the hit Mad TV television show, which is great because when people bring up those references, I'm like, great.

[2:04:29] I don't have to talk to you at all.

[2:04:31] You have no sense of humor, person.

[2:04:33] Very strange.

[2:04:34] And I also – I have a friend named Junior, and I am an enormous asshole because I can't not say it with a Sean Connery accent.

[2:04:43] I'm such a fucking dick.

[2:04:46] I will say, though, I mean like I see a silver lining in what the letter writer said because the only sort of bright side to Bloodshot bombing theatrically is that I can get away with naming my future son Bloodshot Newman.

[2:05:01] The name is now clear.

[2:05:04] And no one will think that's weird.

[2:05:05] No.

[2:05:06] And he has to be a piano player in a tavern.

[2:05:11] Oh, of course.

[2:05:13] And I want to make it clear to the letter writer that I think Hester is a very nice name in real life.

[2:05:18] I just thought it's one of those names where when you give it to a character in a fantasy story, you're like, oh, okay.

[2:05:23] That's the way it's going to be.

[2:05:25] Like if I met someone named – like there's an actress who's on the show Foils War whose first name is Honeysuckle, and it's like, okay, great.

[2:05:33] But if I saw a movie and they were like, what's your name?

[2:05:36] Oh, I'm Honeysuckle.

[2:05:37] I'd be like, forget it.

[2:05:38] Get out of here.

[2:05:40] Like in a fictional world, it's just like I'm going to take – I can take less whimsy.

[2:05:46] I don't know.

[2:05:47] Yeah.

[2:05:48] Understandable.

[2:05:49] Okay.

[2:05:50] Well, let's – I mean we all liked Bloodshot.

[2:05:52] But normally our recommendation section is sort of a don't watch that.

[2:05:57] Watch this sort of thing.

[2:05:59] But if you are one of the many people who are spending more time indoors these days, maybe you've got time to watch both.

[2:06:07] Bloodshot and whatever nonsense we'll recommend.

[2:06:10] I just rewatched a movie that I know I saw as a child but I've forgotten everything about it.

[2:06:16] So it was new to me, which was Funny Face, the Audrey Hepburn, Fred Astaire movie.

[2:06:24] Now, I'm not going to make – I'm going to present the counterargument to Funny Face first and then present the pro-argument.

[2:06:32] The counterargument is that Fred Astaire was 30 years older than Audrey Hepburn, which plays very strangely.

[2:06:40] Although I did some research.

[2:06:42] Apparently she was a supporter of him for the role.

[2:06:45] And also Fred Astaire always seems so sexless that it's not as creepy as it might be with a different actor.

[2:06:52] But it is not the greatest.

[2:06:54] And also the central romantic conflict is Fred Astaire getting immediately possessive of Audrey Hepburn once they are briefly together.

[2:07:03] And the movie makes a feint at presenting his possessive behavior as a bad thing before showing that the guy that Audrey Hepburn was talking to is a cad and possible assaulter.

[2:07:18] So it excuses his behavior.

[2:07:20] The pro case is that it's funny.

[2:07:25] It's colorful.

[2:07:26] It's got the George Gershwin music.

[2:07:30] If you want to hear what Audrey Hepburn sounds like singing, don't go to My Fair Lady where she's dubbed.

[2:07:36] Go to this movie.

[2:07:37] She was a trained ballerina and she did some dance numbers that are pretty impressive when you don't think of Audrey Hepburn in that light.

[2:07:46] Also Audrey Hepburn and Fred Astaire, two of the most charismatic people ever to be on movie screens.

[2:07:53] And also Kay Thompson, the third lead in it, I did some research on her.

[2:07:59] She was the coach for a bunch of big Hollywood stars like Judy Garland and Fred Astaire – I'm sorry, and Frank Sinatra.

[2:08:08] But she only had four film roles and this was by far the biggest.

[2:08:13] And she all but steals the movie.

[2:08:16] She also –

[2:08:17] She wrote Eloise, right?

[2:08:18] She wrote Eloise.

[2:08:19] That's the other weird thing about her.

[2:08:20] She had an amazing career.

[2:08:22] Look her up.

[2:08:24] But it's just a – it's a fun light movie in these trying times.

[2:08:29] It was exactly what I needed to see at that time, so funny face.

[2:08:33] Cool.

[2:08:34] Who wants to go next?

[2:08:36] I'll jump in.

[2:08:37] I'm going to recommend a movie that is – it's a bit of a selfish recommendation.

[2:08:42] But I am recommending a documentary called Death by Metal.

[2:08:47] It is a documentary about the heavy metal band Death and the front man, Chuck Schuldiner, and kind of tracks his –

[2:08:56] it's kind of like a VH1 behind the music for this extreme heavy metal band and the rise and eventual death of this kind of phenomenal heavy metal musician.

[2:09:10] They're one of my favorite bands.

[2:09:12] It's really interesting for me and it's cool to see a bunch of these guys give interviews, these crusty old heavy metal dudes give interviews years after.

[2:09:23] Years after they were like young denim-clad maniacs making music in their parents' garage.

[2:09:29] And it includes like interviews with Sean Reinhart who passed away a few months ago, which is pretty sad.

[2:09:35] But it's one of my favorite bands, Death, and it's a pretty fun little documentary.

[2:09:40] It's on Amazon Prime.

[2:09:41] Now, you say that that's selfish and you're saying that just because it is a thing that you like, Stuart?

[2:09:47] Well, I say it's selfish because it's – I don't know how interesting it would be for people who are not interested in that specific sub-genre of extreme heavy metal.

[2:10:00] like death metal you know it's it's like eating spicy food like it would be like

[2:10:06] eating a fucking ghost pepper first and like working your way up like it'll

[2:10:10] sound like garbage if you haven't listened to this sort of thing I guess

[2:10:14] you're saying it might not have the same wide interest as the usual Korean shock

[2:10:19] horror or direct-to-video ninja movies that you'd like to recommend that's true

[2:10:24] yeah more of a selective audience than as you know the you know the family

[2:10:31] features I usually recommend yeah I mean I yeah I just I brought it up because I

[2:10:35] think that there's a certain level of if you don't know us by now of all of our

[2:10:40] recommendations that it can be assumed that if you like this kind of thing that

[2:10:44] Dan or Stuart Kelly like maybe you'll like this other thing speaking of if you

[2:10:49] like this kind of oh sorry when you say no I mean you go first I have a

[2:10:53] connection to what was just then you then you go and then I'll go last you

[2:10:58] go and then I'll go last well if I can alley-oop off of what what Stuart likes

[2:11:03] I'm gonna recommend a movie that by chance already came up in this

[2:11:08] conversation Universal Soldier Day of Reckoning the fourth a Universal Soldier

[2:11:14] movie the second direct-to-video one with Scott Atkins king of VOD action it

[2:11:20] is a movie that is very very similar to bloodshot in a lot of ways in certain

[2:11:25] countries and on certain platforms it seems to have been retitled Universal

[2:11:30] Soldier a new dimension now so if you're looking for it that's the same movie but

[2:11:36] it's similarly about memories and someone who has sort of been programmed

[2:11:41] to be in an action movie and is is the kind of movie that you should be

[2:11:47] comparing bloodshot to and not Iron Man yeah yeah and it it also has a little

[2:11:54] bit of the same meta commentary because it has Van Damme as this act a star and

[2:11:59] Dolph Lundgren is this aging guy both of whom are like Van Damme gives his best

[2:12:04] like Colonel Kurtz impression in this movie I'm gonna recommend a movie that

[2:12:11] similarly also to these if you like the kinds of things that I like then you

[2:12:15] might like it I'm gonna recommend this is a Western called Doc from 1971 it's

[2:12:19] about Doc Holliday and is meant to be a kind of like gritty anti-heroic retelling

[2:12:25] of the gunfight of the O.K. Corral and stars Stacey Keach as Doc Holliday Faye

[2:12:30] Dunaway plays Kate and a Harris Ulan plays Wyatt Earp Harris Ulan you may

[2:12:34] remember best as the judge who put away the Scolari brothers and Ghostbusters 2

[2:12:39] and he's and he's there there it's a real like it's a movie that I was not

[2:12:48] super familiar with it's directed by Frank Perry who directed like The

[2:12:52] Swimmer and Mommy Dearest and Diary of a Mad Housewife this guy who had this

[2:12:55] very idiosyncratic career and it's and it was written by Pete Hamill the the

[2:13:02] like newspaper columnist and memoir writer and it manages to sometimes be a

[2:13:08] little too like super grit for its own good and that characters call each other

[2:13:12] like bitch out of nowhere and stuff like that but it's such a strangely like low

[2:13:18] key and yet tense and at times very exciting and at times very like touching

[2:13:25] story about a guy who is now trapped in a life that he can't seem to get out of

[2:13:31] and also the breakdown in a friendship between Doc Holliday and Wyatt Earp and

[2:13:35] things like that and they're all really great in it and I really liked a lot

[2:13:39] it's a movie that I was not filming it familiar with before and I want to walk

[2:13:43] away from being like oh I'm surprised I haven't heard more about this so that's

[2:13:45] Doc starring Stacey Keech Faye Dunaway and of course Harris Ulan for

[2:13:52] recommendations plus bloodshot yep okay well this is the point of I guess where

[2:13:59] we normally would just be like you know go out and spread the word of the

[2:14:01] flophouse but I think that at least for the duration of the of the pandemic we

[2:14:07] want to more spread the message of take care of yourselves if you're in a place

[2:14:12] where you have the emotional and or money resources to take care of others

[2:14:17] we would encourage you to do that as well you know we're glad that we can

[2:14:23] provide whatever service we ever provide to anyone during this time and we want

[2:14:29] you all to be well and that's what I have to say about that we got a lot of

[2:14:36] nodding from everyone else a lot of empathetic nodding I mentioned before

[2:14:41] but I've been pretty sick with symptoms matching the COVID-19 and I am feeling

[2:14:49] almost a hundred percent better and I feel very lucky that I've been able to

[2:14:53] isolate and get healthy again yeah if anybody was worried about me no I feel

[2:15:00] very lucky that you were been able to get help you get Stewart so you could

[2:15:04] have found a new Stewart no I mean Griffin seems to like a lot of the same

[2:15:09] stuff that you mean heaven I mean the definition of heaven on earth to all of

[2:15:24] our listeners we hope you're healthy we hope the people in your lives are

[2:15:26] healthy if you're not doing well right now we hope you are through it and

[2:15:29] feeling better soon and what Dan said do what you can to help other people and

[2:15:33] otherwise please take care of yourself and as my my friend Jenny Jaffe has said

[2:15:39] to me let's not all for any of the creative types listening out there let's

[2:15:43] not all feel bad if at the end of this we haven't written the great American

[2:15:46] novel with this time we supposedly have on our hands job one is just taking care

[2:15:50] of ourselves and take caring of each other and well she's busy being on the

[2:15:53] fucking front page of reddit right I do not I don't know about that I don't have

[2:15:58] the focus to read a novel during this time let alone write one so I'm doing a

[2:16:05] lot of dress-up right it's a lot of Elliot you made fun of that earlier I

[2:16:09] mean like that is the love distraction I was only making fun of it in terms of

[2:16:18] that you sent us the the letter questions this morning when I was like

[2:16:23] oh he seems to have a lot of time on his hands coronavirus thing but now that we

[2:16:29] have elected to not promote ourselves Griffin do you have anything you want to

[2:16:33] yeah I mean I'm definitely gonna plug taking care of yourself and taking care

[2:16:37] of others in this weird time that's my primary plug I'm gonna I'm gonna second

[2:16:41] that from all of you guys what a hero and then blank check podcast my podcast

[2:16:47] with David Sims is a critic for the Atlantic which all three of you have

[2:16:51] been on we just like the candidate remake yeah yeah it's the Cadillac a

[2:16:57] movie podcast oh no I don't I don't actually don't know enough about cars to

[2:17:02] figure out what we are it's it's the I feel like if the pipe the blank check

[2:17:06] podcast is kind of like a flop us if we knew what we were doing and put work

[2:17:09] into it like if we if we were any good at this and also we're better at it but

[2:17:14] also I think you can vaguely map our personalities onto the totally

[2:17:19] personality totally so if you like this show you'd like that show as well it was

[2:17:23] it was a shame our producer Ben was not there when you guys recorded and that's

[2:17:29] a pretty clean mapping of three on to three yeah my only request is that

[2:17:34] listeners from this podcast go listen to blank check podcast but come back and

[2:17:39] also listen to listen to both I don't feel like your needs are being met just

[2:17:44] by the other one because I know how I know what the feelings you know the

[2:17:47] favorite one you don't have to tell us which one you like better we would

[2:17:50] prefer not but yeah think of the other one is methadone sure yeah the one you

[2:17:55] like the best no just yeah just you can fit both of them in your life just put

[2:17:58] them on two times speed and have your brain leak out of your nose you're not

[2:18:03] taking it to get high anymore you're just taking it to stay even you know

[2:18:06] yeah just to reach zero and I also I want to promote very relevant topical

[2:18:10] thank you for reminding me Dan I'm doing a weekly Instagram live show with my

[2:18:17] younger sister called Meryl and Vin where she picks a Meryl Streep movie and

[2:18:22] I pick a Vin Diesel movie our two favorite movie stars respectively and we

[2:18:27] compare them so I'm doing that every Monday night at 9 p.m. Eastern Standard

[2:18:31] Time but then it stays up online for I think 24 hours afterwards what movies

[2:18:37] have you done so far we've just started it we did it the first installment was

[2:18:42] bloodshot versus Mamma Mia to here we go again but that was before we figured out

[2:18:48] how to save the video so this remains my only record of bloodshot opinions so you

[2:18:54] guys have the exclusive and then we got scooped week two was Babylon ad versus

[2:19:00] the hours was that our lost episode that was really a lot of babies we recorded

[2:19:08] it and then somehow it disappeared so that's pretty perfect because that movie

[2:19:11] pretty much doesn't exist yeah yeah I I'm eager for you to do the a man apart

[2:19:20] I don't know Ricky in the flash yeah I think a man apart is gonna be this week

[2:19:26] at the time that we're recording because that is a Babylon ad man apart and

[2:19:31] knockaround guys are the only Vin Diesel movies I had not seen before trying to

[2:19:36] fill in the blind spots before I go into rewatching everything I think I may have

[2:19:40] seen knockaround guys and remember nothing about it as I think most of

[2:19:46] America yeah feels about not most of America saw knockaround guys most

[2:19:52] profitable movie in the history of film it was set up with the census forms

[2:20:00] Please classify your ethnicity and how many people are in your household. What did you think about knock around?

[2:20:07] It was a coupon the movie

[2:20:11] All right, well, thank you Griffin for being here

[2:20:13] I think that we can say that this movie or this movie this podcast was 100% better having the world's

[2:20:20] Most foremost and funniest Vin Diesel fan on to talk about it my pleasure and no title

[2:20:26] I will wear with more honor than the ones you just assigned

[2:20:30] So until next time I've been Dan McCoy, I'm Stuart Wellington, I'm Elliot Kalin and

[2:20:38] Griffin is oh, I didn't know I was to say my name. I'm sorry. I'm Griffin Newman

[2:20:43] Bye

[2:20:54] Blood shot yes

[2:20:56] Now Dan something I do often is I have notes

[2:20:58] I have a rundown of the episode on my computer and I have the name of the movie on there

[2:21:15] Maximum fun org comedy and culture artists owned audience supported

Ep. #310 - Bloodshot

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