FH Mini 85 - The Peach Pit 3: Art & Coffee

[0:00] Hey, and welcome to The Peach Pit.

Stuart Wellington

[0:07] Peach Pit is the popular podcast starring me, your host, Stuart Wellington,

[0:11] and it is a podcast all about the original Peaches and their podcast, The Flophouse.

[0:16] Now, today on The Peach Pit, we are going to be doing, wait a minute,

[0:19] no, we're not going to be doing that.

[0:20] Originally, it was supposed to be The Peach Pit Presents Mission Impossible Possibility Emissions,

[0:25] where I talk about all the Mission Impossible movies, and we're going to rank them,

[0:28] and Elliot, I guess, would shrug his shoulders and talk about the TV show.

[0:31] I don't know. I don't know if he's ever seen these movies.

[0:34] But instead, I am joined by my co-host, Dan Elliot,

[0:37] and because these streaming services and the production companies are being shitbags,

[0:41] we don't want to recommend and talk about new movies.

[0:43] No, no, no. SAG and the WGA are on strike, so we are going to be talking about other stuff.

[0:49] That's right. So first, let me introduce my guest.

[0:51] I'm joined by, on my left, Dan McCoy. Say hey, Dan McCoy.

[0:55] Hey, Dan McCoy.

[0:56] And on my right is Elliot Kalin. Say hey, Elliot Kalin.

[0:59] Hey, Elliot Kalin.

[1:01] Okay. So I hope you guys don't mind a little change-up.

[1:04] I know that I've given you your show notes and you've done all your prep on Mission Impossible.

[1:07] Are you guys going to be okay talking about something different today?

Dan McCoy

[1:12] Yeah, I will go along with this fiction and say, you know what? I'll make the sacrifice for the team.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17] Thanks.

[1:18] It's quite a curveball, Stu.

[1:19] Just as long as I can talk about, later in the episode, I can talk about Flop TV,

[1:23] our upcoming run of monthly live streaming shows.

[1:25] Tickets available now at theflophouse.simpleticks.com.

[1:28] More information later in the show, hopefully.

Stuart Wellington

[1:31] Well, as the Peach Pit is a show that's all about promoting the Flophouse,

[1:34] I feel like promoting the Flophouse in other ways is appropriate for the Peach Pit.

[1:37] Yes.

[1:38] Yep, perfect.

[1:39] You can do that later.

[1:40] But for now, we're going to be doing something a little bit different.

Dan McCoy

[1:42] Stop doing your impression of a kid in a 90s movie, Elliot.

[1:45] Yes.

Elliott Kalan

[1:48] Instead of talking about how we're –

Stuart Wellington

[1:50] You got some more bits.

Elliott Kalan

[1:52] That was more 90s stuff.

[1:53] Did I ever tell you guys that I did that to my older son?

[1:56] I said something to him and then I said, not.

[1:58] And he goes, what was that?

[1:59] And I'm like, oh, that's the thing people did in the 90s.

[2:01] They'd say something that wasn't what they meant and then they'd go, not, afterwards.

[2:05] And he goes, why would you do that?

[2:07] Why would you just say what you meant to say?

Stuart Wellington

[2:09] Did he then stick his hands in his pockets and wander out into the –

[2:14] go for a walk, stare off across a lake?

Elliott Kalan

[2:17] I just walked into the ocean.

[2:19] I just Virginia Woolf'd that.

[2:22] Elliot started questioning every truth in his life.

[2:24] Was it Emily Dickinson?

[2:25] Who walked into the river?

[2:27] It was Virginia Woolf, right?

Dan McCoy

[2:29] I thought that was Toad the Wet Sprocket.

[2:31] No, that's how he got wet.

Elliott Kalan

[2:33] But then he walked out again.

Dan McCoy

[2:34] Both Al Green and David Byrne to the river.

[2:36] And dropped them in the water.

[2:38] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[2:39] And also the Big Mouth Billy Bass also asked for that.

[2:42] I don't know if it got it in the end.

Dan McCoy

[2:43] Yeah.

[2:44] I think it probably expired before it made it back to the river.

Stuart Wellington

[2:47] It took me so long.

[2:49] It was on the most recent Sopranos rewatch that I understood what actual song was being sung by that Billy Big Mouth Bass.

Elliott Kalan

[2:55] You thought it was an original Big Mouth Billy Bass composition.

Stuart Wellington

[2:59] I'm like, wow, does he have any other hits?

[3:01] And I was looking it up on the internet.

[3:03] I was getting nothing.

[3:05] Nada.

[3:05] Okay.

[3:06] So welcome to the Peach Pit.

[3:07] Peach Pit presents the Fine Art House.

[3:10] Where instead of talking about flop movies, the Flophouse guys are going to be talking about fine art.

[3:14] And we're going to be doing a little game that I like to call admire, acquire, or funeral pyre.

[3:19] That's right.

Dan McCoy

[3:21] I'm going to present you with three works of fine art, and you are going to tell me if you admire it, if you'd like to acquire it, or if it's time to put it on the funeral pyre.

[3:32] Now, it specifically has to be a funeral pyre.

[3:34] We can't just burn this art.

[3:36] We have to wait until someone dies and burn it that way.

[3:40] I've got good news for you, Dan.

[3:41] People are constantly dying.

[3:42] Also constantly being born.

Elliott Kalan

[3:44] It's the circle of life.

Dan McCoy

[3:47] I don't doubt that.

[3:48] It just seems inconvenient to have to acquire them as a fuel.

[3:51] Sure.

[3:51] As, you know, fuel.

Elliott Kalan

[3:54] So when I talk about-

[3:55] You still got to pay auction house prices for them and withdraw them on the funeral pyre.

[3:58] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[3:59] So obviously admire means this is something you'd like to look at.

[4:02] And acquire means this is something that you need to look at.

[4:04] You want to see it every day.

[4:06] You would want to spend money or maybe hire a cat burglar to get it for you.

[4:10] And then funeral pyre, that's right.

[4:12] You're like, I'm done with this piece of shit.

[4:13] Throw it in the garbage.

[4:14] Now, the thing is, each, you have to-

[4:16] I'll give you three options, and you have to pick one for each.

[4:19] Unfortunately, some of these are going to be a little bit challenging.

[4:21] And you know, this isn't just a world of chaos.

[4:23] No, no, no.

[4:24] They're going to be organized by style.

[4:27] So I sent you guys a link, and I'll do my best to describe things so folks at home can Google the results so they can decide for themselves.

[4:34] Stuart, can I just look on your laptop?

[4:36] Yes, you can look on my laptop.

[4:37] That's why I brought my laptop.

[4:39] Thank you.

[4:40] Also, so that I could have my secret stash of pornography close to me at all times.

[4:44] Just in case you need it.

[4:45] In case I need it.

[4:46] It's more of a comfort blanket.

Elliott Kalan

[4:48] It defeats the purpose of the fact that-

[4:49] Yes, my Linus blanket.

[4:51] Yeah, this Linus was so turned on by that blanket.

[4:54] Yeah.

[4:55] No wonder he didn't want them to take it away from him.

Dan McCoy

[4:56] Oh, they were common law married, I think.

Elliott Kalan

[5:00] Yeah, yeah.

[5:00] In some states, a blanket and a child can be married after a certain amount of time.

Stuart Wellington

[5:06] The future liberals want.

[5:08] Okay.

[5:08] So-

Elliott Kalan

[5:09] So when Snoopy would take the blanket from him, do you think he secretly liked being cucked in that way?

[5:14] Or was that-

[5:15] It really bothered him?

Stuart Wellington

[5:16] I don't know if I'm ready to explore that.

[5:18] I don't think that falls within the purview of the Peach Pit Presents the Fine Art House.

[5:21] Maybe next episode.

Elliott Kalan

[5:22] I mean, we are putting the perv in purview.

[5:25] Does that help?

Stuart Wellington

[5:25] That's true.

[5:27] So let's see.

[5:28] Our first category here is-

[5:30] Oh, fuck.

[5:31] I don't even know what these guys are.

[5:33] I looked it up before.

[5:35] Okay.

[5:35] So the first one, our first artist is-

[5:38] Let's look at the first slide.

[5:40] That's Monet and Water Lilies.

[5:42] Yeah.

[5:43] Okay.

[5:44] So we got Monet.

[5:46] We got Renoir.

[5:47] What's that?

[5:48] The skiff?

[5:49] Ooh.

[5:49] Monet is-

Elliott Kalan

[5:50] Now, Monet is the subject of the Billy Idol song, Monet, Monet.

Stuart Wellington

[5:54] Correct?

[5:55] Nope.

[5:56] I mean, I'm not super clear.

[5:58] I remember Dan saying some Billy Idol on a cruise ship once.

Dan McCoy

[6:02] That's true.

[6:03] Yeah.

[6:03] Being a rebel himself, he's saying Rebel Yell.

[6:06] Oh, okay.

[6:06] Yeah, yeah.

[6:07] Didn't really give me much information about our history.

Elliott Kalan

[6:10] Rebel Yell is, of course, about Edvard Munch's The Scream.

Stuart Wellington

[6:12] Of course.

[6:13] Yeah.

[6:14] Which is, weirdly enough, a very pro-Confederacy song.

Elliott Kalan

[6:17] Yeah.

[6:18] Yeah.

[6:18] It's very strange.

[6:19] And Cradle of Love, of course, a Marie Cassatt painting.

[6:21] Mm-hmm.

Stuart Wellington

[6:23] And then finally, so we have Monet's Water Lilies, Renoir's The Skiff, and Mayonnaise's The Bar at, I can't eat, Follies Berger.

[6:33] Yeah.

[6:34] You got it.

[6:34] Oh, nailed it and won.

[6:35] Okay.

[6:36] You did it.

Elliott Kalan

[6:36] And when the, you have to assume that if the Country Bears had been a hit movie, they would have done a sequel called, like, Bears Go to Paris, and they would have been at the Follies Berger, and there'd be French bears walking around.

Stuart Wellington

[6:46] Oh, man.

[6:47] That sounds great.

[6:48] Well, I mean, there's still time.

[6:49] You never know.

[6:50] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[6:51] And they'd stop by the Moulin Rouge, and it'd be a cow-based dance hall.

[6:55] Oh.

[6:56] It's Moulin.

[6:57] He's still going.

[6:58] Dan, do you have anything?

[6:59] When the strike's over, pay me to write this piece of junk movie.

Stuart Wellington

[7:04] Okay.

[7:05] So, Elliot, since you're talking the most, let's give us your ranking.

[7:09] Which one do you admire?

[7:10] Which one do you need to acquire?

[7:11] And which one's for the funeral pyre?

Elliott Kalan

[7:13] Okay.

[7:14] I think I admire water lilies.

[7:17] In particular, some people would talk about the way the light plays on the water or whatevs, but I really like the way he gets across the weight of the lilies.

[7:24] I would want to acquire the bar painting, which I've always loved.

[7:28] I think it's a beautiful painting.

[7:29] I love the character of the bartender who she is so uninterested in serving you, which is my experience when I'm at a bar.

[7:36] So, it's like I'm really at the bar.

[7:38] And, of course, that you see the room in the mirror behind her.

[7:40] Is the angle of her back off slightly in terms of the mirror?

[7:44] Yes, but that's the illusion of painting.

[7:45] It's calling attention to its own artifice.

[7:47] And as much as I love Renoir's other work, I'm going to have to funeral pyre the skiff one because I find it sloppy.

[7:52] Mm-hmm.

Dan McCoy

[7:54] This is going to be boring because I am in complete agreement with your rankings, Elliot.

[7:59] You know, the Renoir one, like, I like it.

[8:04] You know, it's only a casualty of the rules of the game.

[8:09] The regular dude.

[8:11] Ironic because that's his son's movie.

Elliott Kalan

[8:14] Oh, okay.

[8:15] Yeah.

[8:15] Yeah, it is.

[8:16] Because Gene Renoir was the son of August Renoir.

[8:18] Yeah.

[8:18] Wow.

Stuart Wellington

[8:19] Wow.

[8:20] Exciting.

[8:20] It's crazy that that happens sometimes.

[8:21] Making connections.

[8:22] People have babies.

Elliott Kalan

[8:23] Yeah, yeah.

[8:24] I mean, yeah, Renoir, the director, was a real Nepo baby, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[8:26] And I'm thinking about the last one.

[8:28] I mean, there's something about the facial expression, Elliot, I agree with you, that really pulls me in on this painting.

[8:35] I once read that, like, people like photos with other people in them more than just, like, photos of something, like, pretty.

[8:47] And I've certainly found this to be true.

Stuart Wellington

[8:49] Dan's saying people are not pretty.

Dan McCoy

[8:50] Interesting.

[8:51] Excluding people from the pretty category.

[8:53] Another thing that is pretty.

[8:55] Oh, I see, I see.

[8:56] Like, and I found this to be true in, you know, like, social media.

[9:00] I post, like, an amazing photo of something that has no people in it.

[9:05] Modest.

[9:06] Is invariably...

[9:08] I'm just saying...

[9:09] Imagine this is my top photo of a non-person subject.

[9:14] It's still going to get less likes than something that has people in it.

[9:17] There's just something about people that likes looking at people.

[9:19] People are drawn to people.

Stuart Wellington

[9:20] Yeah, like, Daniel posted a picture of the, like, pyramids of Giza, and you're like, wow, this great work of mankind can't compare to this selfie I took.

Elliott Kalan

[9:27] And then he posted a picture of mankind, and I'm like, that's a greater work of mankind.

[9:33] When he's body slamming, I don't know, doink.

Stuart Wellington

[9:36] He survived that, what, choke slam off of the, in the cage match thing?

[9:41] Sure, sure.

[9:41] Where he threw the cage, those kids were in the audience.

[9:44] What's going on?

[9:45] Okay.

[9:45] Yeah, I think we're all in agreement.

[9:47] This is, I'm with all y'all.

[9:49] This was an easy test round.

[9:51] I don't think we have a lot of fighting.

[9:53] The real fighting is going to probably happen in the next round.

[9:55] That's right, where we have Persistence of Memory, Salvador Dali, followed by Pablo Picasso's Guernica.

[10:05] Oh.

[10:06] Or Frida Kahlo's Henry Ford Hospital.

[10:10] Uh-oh.

[10:13] Dan, you go first.

Dan McCoy

[10:14] You know, I think that this is probably just Frida Kahlo's painting is possibly the victim of just being less familiar to me.

[10:26] The other two are such blockbuster paintings.

[10:29] And this one, I don't know that I've seen before.

[10:33] And I even went to the Frida Kahlo exhibit where the museum is a ways back.

[10:37] But also maybe I just—

Elliott Kalan

[10:39] You've established your Frida-fides or Bono Frida.

Dan McCoy

[10:41] Maybe I just don't want a painting that has like a floating fetus in it.

[10:48] Hmm.

[10:49] I don't know.

[10:50] Mark's face is an oddball.

Elliott Kalan

[10:51] Maybe.

[10:52] I mean, Guernica is literally a reaction to aerial bombing.

[10:56] Yeah.

[10:57] So the miracle of the recreation of human life is lower on your scale than that tragic massacring of the essence.

[11:04] You know what?

Stuart Wellington

[11:05] I saw—

[11:05] Yeah, it looks like a human pisghetti.

Elliott Kalan

[11:10] A lot of people don't know that Boyardee, when he saw Guernica, said, ah, this is what I shall do.

[11:15] I shall dehuman the pisghetti and bring pasta to all.

[11:19] You know, I—

Dan McCoy

[11:20] At first I was going to take Guernica over persistence of memory because I feel like persistence of memory has been cheapened by a thousand posters and a thousand college dorm rooms maybe.

[11:34] But I will say that having—I have actually seen both of these paintings in person in Madrid during a visit that Audrey and I took right before the pandemic, fortunately.

[11:47] Mm-hmm.

[11:49] That Guernica in person I found less impressive than I expected, whereas this—

[11:54] Really?

[11:54] Because it's huge.

[11:55] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[11:55] And persistence of memory is a pretty small painting.

Dan McCoy

[11:57] Persistence of memory is a very small painting, but I just didn't—it didn't strike me as much as it actually does in reproductions.

[12:03] Interesting.

[12:03] I don't know why.

Stuart Wellington

[12:05] Interesting.

[12:05] Yeah, was Donnelly listening to a lot of Pink Floyd when he painted this thing?

Dan McCoy

[12:09] Yeah, that's what—that's really what I wanted.

[12:11] I just want to get blazed, put on some Pink Floyd, and stare at this painting.

[12:15] Cool.

Elliott Kalan

[12:17] So, Dan, according to the official categories, what are you—so you're funeral hiring?

Dan McCoy

[12:20] I guess I'm acquiring persistence of memory and admiring Guernica, although, you know, on a different day, who knows?

Elliott Kalan

[12:26] You know, so I'm also going to acquire persistence of memory.

[12:29] Dan, you have struck me to the quick because not in college, but in high school, I had a poster of this on my wall.

[12:36] I was a big Salvador Dolly buff, and I remember going to the Dolly Museum in St. Petersburg, Florida, and seeing the stuff they have there.

[12:42] It was called Dollywood, right?

[12:44] Yeah, it's called Dollywood.

[12:45] My family took our RV.

[12:48] Salvador Dolly Parton is my favorite singer of all time.

[12:53] Now, I wish that there was some—I was fast enough to do a Salvador Dolly, Dolly Parton mashup song.

[13:00] It's like Jolene, but he's singing about a gala.

Dan McCoy

[13:03] I think it'd be like, working nine to five, but there's no way to know what time is, because these clocks are melting, and I don't know when to leave this job.

[13:12] Perfect.

[13:13] I'm working at—

[13:14] Okay, anyway.

[13:14] Oh, wow.

[13:15] Perfect.

Stuart Wellington

[13:15] The master bows to you, Dan.

Elliott Kalan

[13:18] Dan, you've defeated me.

[13:19] Yeah.

[13:21] I'll wax my mustache, but it kind of is my trademark.

[13:25] So I think I'm going to acquire Persistence Memory.

[13:28] I think I'm going to admire the Frida Kahlo one, because that to me is—I feel like she's expressing something, a real lived experience of pain, and I find it visually somewhat grotesque, but I think that's what she's going for.

[13:45] When H.R. Giger stood in front of us and said, Frida Kahlo, same moi, and it's like, yeah, yeah, the fusion of things and humans, sure.

[13:52] And Guernica, I think—I don't want to have to burn it, because it is a major work, but I think it's going to have to go on the funeral pyre.

[14:00] No choice.

[14:01] And the figures within the painting, ironically—

[14:03] Some monster made up this—

[14:04] Some monster—

Dan McCoy

[14:05] Well, maybe they'll finally be at peace.

Elliott Kalan

[14:08] Yeah, yeah, and also—and you're saying it was created by a monster.

[14:11] Yeah.

[14:12] Yeah, Pablo Picasso himself was a monster.

[14:14] I mean, Salvador Dali was also, like, probably not a great guy to know.

[14:17] Not a good dude, huh?

Stuart Wellington

[14:18] Yeah, I'm going to agree with you.

[14:20] I'm going to admire the Frida Kahlo work, because it's nice and gross, and I like that.

[14:25] Though I'm going to say I would want to acquire Guernica, because it's huge.

[14:29] It is huge.

[14:30] It's a very unworthy—

[14:30] Yeah, but then it's just going to dominate your apartment.

[14:33] It covers your whole wall.

Elliott Kalan

[14:34] Yeah.

[14:35] Whereas Persistence of Memory, you can just put that on a wall with a bunch of other paintings,

[14:38] maybe pictures of trips you've taken.

[14:40] And unfortunately, I've seen a two-move.

Dan McCoy

[14:42] A real gallery wall with Persistence of Memory in the middle.

[14:45] Set that thing on fire.

[14:46] Okay.

Elliott Kalan

[14:47] I think it was a great idea to bring together three Spanish-speaking artists.

[14:50] Oh, you're welcome.

[14:51] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[14:52] I mean, that wasn't a thank you, per se.

Stuart Wellington

[14:54] Okay, time for us to go Baroque, everybody, and we're going to start with my main man.

Elliott Kalan

[14:59] We are going to go Baroque if the AMPTP won't pay us what we deserve for our work.

Stuart Wellington

[15:03] That's a really good lead-in, but we'll talk more about that later.

[15:07] So we're going to talk about my main man.

[15:10] That's right, Peter Paul Rubens.

[15:13] Uh-oh.

[15:14] Not my main man, John Hodgman, the master of pain.

Elliott Kalan

[15:17] No, the man from Maine.

[15:18] Now, Peter Paul Rubens, when they fired Rubens and brought in Mary,

[15:21] the painting suffered, but the singing got better.

[15:24] I just got to say it.

[15:24] Hot take, hot take.

Stuart Wellington

[15:25] Well, he had to go focus on his sandwiches.

[15:29] So really, everyone won out.

[15:31] Yeah.

[15:31] Yeah, everybody won out.

[15:33] So we got Peter Paul Rubens.

[15:34] This is the Feast of Akelos.

[15:38] We got Caravaggio.

[15:41] Uh-oh.

[15:42] That's Judith in the Hollow Furnace.

[15:43] Yeah, classic subject.

[15:44] Look out, buddy.

[15:46] Somebody's having a real pain in the neck.

[15:49] And then we got Vermeer, girl with a pearl earring.

[15:52] That's a heavy hitter, folks.

[15:55] So what are we doing?

Elliott Kalan

[15:56] Scarlett Johansson as the earring.

[15:59] Pearl.

Stuart Wellington

[16:01] Okay.

[16:02] No, no.

[16:02] Pearl is played by Mia Goth.

[16:04] I thought Mia Goth would have gotten that role.

[16:07] Somebody, quickly, somebody, you know, use your computer to make a little computer image of

[16:14] tiny little Mia Goth hanging from Scarlett Johansson's ear.

Dan McCoy

[16:19] It seems convoluted even for me.

Stuart Wellington

[16:21] No, no, no.

[16:22] That's the perfect Dan McCoy.

[16:23] And make sure to sign it, Dan McCoy.

[16:26] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[16:26] Should I go first on this one, Dan, since you went first to the last one?

Dan McCoy

[16:29] Yeah, please.

Elliott Kalan

[16:30] I mean, I got to acquire that Caravaggio.

[16:33] Caravaggio, the sumptuousness of his textures.

[16:36] I'm a big – this isn't something I think that's ever come up in the Flophouse before,

[16:40] but I'm a big fan of painted fabric on canvas, the way that folds are painted on canvas.

[16:45] The draping of things?

[16:47] The draping, exactly.

[16:48] And he's one of the masters of that.

[16:49] I love the dark lighting lit just where it needs to be.

[16:53] I love that Judith seems to be disgusted by her own handiwork in murdering Hall Furness.

[17:00] So I'm going to acquire that one.

[17:02] And I think I admire this Peter Paul Rubens Feast painting because there's just so much going on there.

[17:08] You got all the plants.

[17:10] You got all the feasting Greeks who are draped strangely.

[17:14] They look like they're all wearing towels.

[17:15] Like they just came out of a swim and went to this big banquet table.

[17:21] And I'm a sucker.

Stuart Wellington

[17:22] Why don't people dress like this anymore?

[17:25] You mean like nude except for like a towel draped over their leg?

[17:30] Yeah.

[17:30] I mean, it might come back.

[17:31] Jordan Peterson part of the podcast.

[17:33] I mean, everybody dresses that way under their clothes.

[17:36] That's true.

[17:36] Yeah.

[17:36] They're wearing beach towels.

[17:38] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[17:38] And I will say – and this is going to be an unpopular opinion, but it's just my personal preference for art.

[17:43] I love illustrative kind of classic art.

[17:46] Art that is illustrating historical scenes, mythological scenes, or imaginary cityscapes or things like that.

[17:52] I love art that is kind of an artist's representation of past times.

[17:58] If it's not historically accurate, I like it even more for some reason.

[18:01] And so Girl with the Pearl Earring, beautiful picture.

[18:03] But for me, there's just not as much going on in there.

[18:06] So I'm going to have to burn it up.

[18:08] Okay.

[18:10] Yeah.

[18:10] Prove me wrong, Dan.

[18:11] Prove me wrong.

[18:12] No, I'm not going to argue too much.

[18:14] There's no proving.

[18:14] It's just opinions.

Dan McCoy

[18:16] I definitely also would want to acquire the Caravaggio for the high contrast you're talking about.

[18:22] I don't think that we mentioned the most important thing.

[18:25] You know, like, again, these are famous works of art, but this is a podcast.

[18:29] So perhaps we should be explaining that in this picture, a woman is slicing a man's neck.

[18:38] Blood is spraying all over the place.

[18:41] And then there's an older woman who seems, you know, to be, you know, approving of the deed.

[18:46] I love the old woman who's like, yeah, just get it done, lady.

Stuart Wellington

[18:49] Yeah.

[18:49] She's like, hurry it up.

Elliott Kalan

[18:52] She is a moment away from saying, just give me that sword.

Dan McCoy

[18:54] I'll take care of you.

[18:55] Yeah.

[18:56] As someone who likes narrative, there's a lot going on in this painting.

[18:59] I appreciate that.

[19:01] It's just, you know, it's just beautifully done.

[19:06] I guess I would admire the girl with the pearl earring because, you know, portraiture is not.

[19:15] Dan likes a babe.

[19:16] It's fine.

[19:17] Yeah, darn it.

[19:18] It is a masterpiece of limiting yourself to a few colors, a few tones.

[19:27] You know what?

Elliott Kalan

[19:28] I think I'm going to change my decision.

[19:29] I think I am going to admire that one because as much as I love the Peter Paul Rubens one, there is – every time I look at girl with the pearl earring, I take it for granted how it feels like it is a single second in time.

[19:41] That it feels unposed in that way.

[19:44] And so I shouldn't take that for granted.

[19:45] Vermeer, I apologize.

[19:47] I've been taking you for granted.

[19:48] Yeah, Vermeer, if you're listening.

[19:50] If you're listening, Vermeer.

[19:52] The fact that it really does look like she is about to – she is in the middle of a turn that just kind of happened.

[19:59] It feels like a painted snapshot, which especially in the years before photography even existed is an amazing thing to pull off.

Dan McCoy

[20:05] Yeah.

[20:06] The other one, look, it's beautiful.

[20:09] It's a little too much like, you know, a book of like fantasy postcards to me or something.

[20:16] I mean, so the ultimate compliment?

[20:19] Yeah, let's go on.

[20:19] You're saying it's the ultimate compliment?

[20:21] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[20:22] It's not my taste.

[20:23] I think everybody knows –

[20:24] If only this was less like a Boris Vallejo painting.

Dan McCoy

[20:28] What?

[20:28] Less?

[20:29] I mean, if there were like swords and like ladies clinging to legs of barbarians.

Elliott Kalan

[20:36] If only we could defrazedize this a little bit.

[20:40] So, Dan, you're saying you would like it if the death dealer was just riding a horse over everybody there.

Dan McCoy

[20:45] If it went further in that direction.

[20:47] If it pushed past the good taste it's in into like active like bad taste, I would like it more.

Stuart Wellington

[20:55] Yeah.

[20:56] I think you all know me.

[20:58] I got to acquire this Peter Paul Rubens.

[21:01] Add it to my collection.

[21:02] I forgot you were a Rubens collector.

[21:04] Yeah, yeah.

[21:05] Oh, yeah.

[21:05] Give me them big bumpy bodies.

[21:10] I love it.

[21:12] And then I just love how like filled every little corner seems it's filled with like tiny little details.

[21:17] It's great.

[21:17] I love it.

Elliott Kalan

[21:18] Even at the top, he's like, there's no room for people in the trees.

[21:20] I'll put some birds up there.

Stuart Wellington

[21:21] I'm going to put some boys.

[21:22] Why not?

[21:23] Of course, Caravaggio.

[21:25] I admire that thing.

[21:26] It's beautiful.

[21:27] Love it.

[21:28] Sorry, girl, the pearl earring.

[21:29] You're going in the dump.

[21:31] Okay.

[21:31] Whoa.

[21:32] Guys, we have one final round before we take a little break.

[21:36] This final round is going to be a little bit different.

[21:38] Instead of a very specific work of art, we're going to be talking about the career of entire artists.

[21:44] Wow.

[21:44] Oh, my.

[21:44] And specifically, this is geared right toward U2 Peaches.

[21:47] We are talking about EC Comics artists.

[21:51] Okay.

[21:51] We're going to start with-

[21:52] I was afraid I wouldn't know enough.

[21:53] We're going to start with my man, Jack Davis.

[21:57] Oh, wonderful.

[21:59] Wally Wood.

[22:00] Mm-hmm.

[22:02] Harvey Kurtzman.

[22:04] Yeah.

[22:05] Harvey Kurtzman.

Elliott Kalan

[22:07] This is very tough.

[22:08] Dan, I think you're going to have to go first.

[22:09] I think I know my answer, but I think you're going to have to go first.

Dan McCoy

[22:12] So, if we're talking about the art of it-

[22:16] Yeah.

[22:17] This is my argument.

[22:20] I'm going to acquire Jack Davis.

[22:22] I think he has just like such a wild career of, you know, doing these horror comics and then later mad and posters.

[22:33] Like he is-

Elliott Kalan

[22:35] Becoming the master of the lots of people chasing something.

[22:38] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[22:39] The king of the 1970s celebrity caricature.

Elliott Kalan

[22:45] It's amazing how almost he does-

[22:47] He has a few great movies that he did posters for, but so many of his movies, there is such a wide gulf between the amount of artistry he put into the poster caricature and the movie that he is creating a poster for.

[22:59] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[23:00] And I'm going to admire Wally Wood, who I think is one of the most beautiful draftsmen to ever do comics.

[23:10] I'm putting Kurtzman on the pyre only because I think he was much more valuable as a innovator in the form, like the way he would lay out panel to panel.

[23:26] Okay.

[23:26] I think Kurtzman for the artwork itself.

Elliott Kalan

[23:30] That's my argument.

[23:31] I'm going to-

[23:31] I feel similarly about Kurtzman.

[23:33] Unfortunately, I'm going to have to put-

[23:34] If you were asking me who is the most important of these three artists, it would be Harvey Kurtzman by a long ways.

[23:41] Yeah.

[23:41] As an editor, as a writer, as a designer, but you're right, I don't find him as attractive a draftsman as the other ones.

[23:50] So Harvey Kurtzman is the greatest of these in terms of his impact on the field that they've worked in.

[23:57] On comics, yeah.

[23:57] But I'm going to say I want to acquire the Wally Wood because I love Wally Wood's art, and I find it so, like, there's something so clean about it.

[24:06] The way he uses shapes, I really love.

[24:09] Specifically his pornographic comics is what you're going to-

[24:12] Well, that's the thing is, the thing I don't love as much is, or like that thing he did where it's all the Disney characters having sex with each other.

[24:17] Like, Wally Wood, at a certain point in his career, just took a hard turn into soft core because that was what he could work with.

[24:26] But if you look at those comics, they're beautifully done.

[24:28] No, they're lovely.

[24:29] Like, the artist is gorgeous.

[24:30] It's just like, they don't really, and they also don't really work that well as pornography because they're just like-

[24:36] But if you look at, like, just the-

[24:39] But if I get a page-

Dan McCoy

[24:40] Yeah, I wouldn't call them sexy, per se.

[24:42] Yeah.

[24:43] You're like, no, that's a well-rendered naked lady.

Elliott Kalan

[24:46] But if I could get a page from one of his Daredevil issues, or there's a Doctor Doom story he did for Marvel that I love the art from.

[24:53] And he was very briefly working at Marvel, and then he could not stand working for Stanley, and so the two of them had a falling out.

[25:00] But he's the one who designed Daredevil's red costume, the one that he's worn since issue-

[25:04] Oh, that's cool.

[25:05] ...8 or something.

[25:06] And, or, I don't remember what his number is.

[25:08] But Jack Davis, I think I'm going to admire, although I'd love to acquire his stuff too, but I'm going to admire just because I love so much of Wally Wood stuff.

[25:14] But Jack Davis is like, I don't know if you guys are going to agree with me on this.

[25:18] His art's a little busy.

[25:19] It is a little busy.

[25:21] Wait, Jack Davis' art is busy?

[25:23] Just a tiny bit.

[25:24] Just a tiny bit.

Stuart Wellington

[25:26] Everything's dripping.

Elliott Kalan

[25:28] I think I'm on the side of Dan, though.

[25:30] I look at Jack Davis' art, and I'm like, what's with all the lines, Rob Liefeld?

[25:33] Oh!

[25:34] Just kidding.

[25:35] I never say that.

Stuart Wellington

[25:37] I would want to acquire Jack Davis.

[25:40] I admire Wally Wood, and unfortunately, Harvey Kurtzman, too much of an innovator in other areas of comics.

[25:49] Now, before we get to our sponsors and ads, one of the reasons why we are talking about something that's not about movies is because of the WGA and SAG strike.

[25:58] Elliot, if people want to support the WGA, where can they go?

Elliott Kalan

[26:02] That's a very great question.

[26:03] If people want to support the WGA, the best thing you can do is go to entertainmentcommunity.org.

[26:09] That's right, entertainmentcommunity.org.

[26:11] It used to be called the Actors Fund.

[26:13] Now it's the Entertainment Community Fund.

[26:14] And that is the place that anyone who works in the entertainment industry, not just writers but support staff, technical crew, actors, everyone in front of and behind the camera can go when they need financial assistance.

[26:26] During this time, the most important way that you can support us beyond just making your voices heard and selling off whatever shares of those companies you have so that the price goes down.

[26:38] If there's a big sell-off and no one's buying and the price goes down, that's the greatest thing you could do.

[26:41] But that's taking on a real financial impact on yourself, so don't do that.

[26:46] But the thing that will help us the most is by helping us have the resources to get through this strike.

[26:51] This is a game of attrition.

[26:54] The AMPTP is hoping that we will crack before they crack, and we want them to crack before we crack.

Stuart Wellington

[27:00] Somebody said they want you to lose your homes.

Elliott Kalan

[27:03] This was a –

[27:03] I didn't hear that.

[27:05] This was – yep, there was an article in – as we're recording this, it's one week after the article that came out in Deadline.

[27:12] It's owned by the same company that is involved in the studio's media brand, NewsSource, in which an anonymous executive said we're going to keep this strike going with the writers until at least October.

[27:25] Once they start losing their apartments and their houses, then we can dictate the terms to them.

[27:30] That is, one, bonkers.

[27:32] Every writer is used to being out of work for a certain amount of time.

[27:35] It's just part of the business.

[27:36] And, two, if you think being out of work for six months will cause us to lose our homes, then you are admitting to me that you have been underpaying us for years that you think that we are that close to the poverty line.

[27:45] So we may need a little bit of help, though.

[27:48] And if we do, for those workers who need that assistance, entertainmentcommunity.org is the place that they can go to apply for it, and there's no shame in doing that.

[27:55] And it's where you can go to make a donation of any size whatsoever, earmark it for their TV and film production fund.

[28:02] And that will be there for us if we need it, when we need it, so that we can keep this strike going as long as we need to to get equitable payment and treatment for not just us but for the actors and for everyone else who has contracts coming up.

[28:15] Because the gains we make in this strike and in this negotiation are gains everyone's going to be able to make, and that's why we're doing this.

[28:21] This is the most and the strongest union solidarity I've seen certainly in my 15 years in the Writers Guild, the solidarity between unions.

[28:29] I'm very excited about it, and I think we can really make a change in the way that Hollywood treats the people who work for it.

Dan McCoy

[28:35] I think it was funny that I saw a lot of people arguing like, well, yeah, I mean, that house thing, I mean, like, that's just what a strike is.

[28:43] Like, it's like we're trying to exert financial hardship on the side, you know, for our own games.

[28:49] We're like, yeah, in the broad outlines, sure.

[28:53] Like, it's not surprising that they're trying to choke off the writers.

[28:56] Like, that is obviously what's going on.

[28:59] But the fact that at a time where, you know, writers' median incomes have fallen like 20-plus percent and CEOs keep climbing, you know, to think that it's a good idea to state, like, hey, we want you to lose your house is just sort of a measure of, I don't know, awfulness.

[29:21] It's just baffling to me that they thought, like, this is going to be a winning strategy to put this out there in the world.

Elliott Kalan

[29:26] I mean, it is this, that every strike or every labor action is about a negotiation between labor and management over management wanting to pay as little as possible and having as much control as possible and labor wanting to get paid as much as possible and have as much of their own control as possible.

[29:41] And that's the way of the game.

[29:42] That's life in capitalism.

[29:44] It super sucks, but that's the system we live in.

[29:46] But to take it to the point of saying not just we're going to wait them out and we're going to get them back to the table, but to say that we want them to start losing where they live because then we can have – then they'll take whatever we give them.

[29:58] That is taking it to a new severity level and an unfair level.

[30:02] And also it's gross.

[30:03] And it totally backfired because everyone I've talked to since then talks about how they were so infuriated that they wanted to keep striking even more.

[30:12] It was the thing that someone, a bad guy does in a movie where they threaten a family member of the hero and the hero gets berserker strength at the last moment.

[30:20] It looked like they were going to give up.

[30:21] Now suddenly they have to win.

[30:23] And so it was like, oh, well, now this is about keeping my family under a roof.

[30:27] Like this is crazy.

[30:28] And so the thing you can do to help us, if you would like to help us, if you would not like to help us, if you want to help the AMPTP, then you can go fuck yourself.

[30:36] Get out of my podcast.

[30:38] But if you want to help us, go to entertainmentcommunity.org and please make a donation so that should that financial assistance be necessary, it is there and waiting for all the entertainment personnel.

[30:48] This is something that is affecting not just us but everyone who works in entertainment, everyone in the economy of California and I'm sure certain parts of New York and other places and Georgia as well.

[30:58] This is something that is having ripple effects all throughout our business.

[31:02] And so anything that we can do to help people who are affected collaterally by this, we should be ready to do.

[31:07] And entertainmentcommunity.org will at least help with some of that.

[31:10] So thank you for your support and thank you for donating if you donate.

[31:14] And again, if you're not supporting, get out of my face.

[31:18] I don't want to like you.

[31:19] I don't like you.

Dan McCoy

[31:20] I just want to say like sometimes people – like the argument gets like wound up in like, oh, this famous writer makes this salary or this – like, oh, these people are –

[31:31] look, the median writer's pay is like literally one hundredth of what entertainment CEOs are making right now.

[31:42] The guilds are just asking for pay commiserate with the money that is made for the industry.

Elliott Kalan

[31:48] It's less than one hundredth of what they're being paid.

[31:50] Yeah.

[31:50] It's a – and even the people you think are doing well, one of the most informative things I feel like about this strike to other writers as well has been all of us realizing, oh, even the people that we see as successes are not getting paid commiserate with the success that they are creating for the studios to the point of a number of showrunners of big shows are like, yeah, I don't know how I'm going to pay my bills.

[32:10] I don't get paid a lot for this.

[32:12] And I spent – this was two years of my life and I got paid X amount and that comes out to – it's sometimes people – after –

[32:20] commissions to representatives and things like that and taxes, sometimes people who run shows are making less than $50,000 a year.

[32:26] And so that's – or that's what they're taking home.

[32:28] So it's not – the days of – you get to write crappy TV and then you go home to your mansion and you're lounging around the pool while the ratings for my mother the car come in or whatever.

[32:43] Those days are over.

[32:44] And so if you can support us, we really appreciate it.

[32:48] Thank you very much.

[32:49] We'll get through this.

[32:49] Everything is going to turn out for the better in the end, but it's going to be a fight to get there.

Stuart Wellington

[32:53] Is his mother's name Christine?

[32:55] Okay.

Elliott Kalan

[32:55] So the Peach Pit –

[32:57] That's the hard thing is that his mother and his girlfriend are both cars.

[33:00] Oh, it's complicated.

Stuart Wellington

[33:02] So the Peach Pit is a show that's all about the Flophouse and the Flophouse is supported by sponsors, some sponsors like these.

Dan McCoy

[33:09] Well, one of them is Squarespace, the all-in-one platform for building your brand and growing your business online.

[33:15] Stand out with a beautiful website.

[33:17] Stand out with a beautiful website.

Dan McCoy

[33:17] Engage with your audience and sell anything.

[33:20] Your products, content you create, and even your time.

[33:24] Squarespace has a lot of features that allow you to do things like gain powerful insights into who's visiting your site, how they're interacting with the content.

[33:34] You can have their analytic tools, look at page views, traffic sources, time on site, most read content, audience geography, and much more.

[33:42] Geography too.

[33:43] Geography, if you're interested in it.

[33:45] It's not that useful because it's a made-up word.

[33:47] But if you want that analytic, you can find it.

[33:50] Squarespace has the tools you need to get your business off the ground, including e-commerce templates, inventory management, a simple checkout process, and secure payments.

[34:00] So why not head to squarespace.com slash flop for a free trial?

[34:06] And when you are ready to launch, use offer code FLOP to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

Elliott Kalan

[34:14] Guys, we've also got another sponsor.

[34:16] What?

[34:17] To talk about that, I'm just going to say it.

[34:18] I don't like the act of cooking.

[34:20] I find it stressful.

[34:21] Worst of all, it takes too much time.

[34:22] The one thing I have the least of.

[34:24] Every morning, I got to get up, get the kids ready, take into summer camp, hit the picket line, three hours of picketing in the sun, and then back home to get my other work done.

[34:32] In the sun, not my sons that I'm taking to camp.

[34:34] Oh, right, right, right.

[34:35] In the sun that is the mother of us all.

[34:37] And I just don't have the time to make myself a meal.

[34:39] And yet my body craves nutrients and energy.

[34:42] Luckily, I can turn to Soylent, the original food tech company, which makes delicious and nutritious products in convenient formats.

[34:49] Whether you're low on time, having trouble rousing the energy to make a big production out of your meals, or just plain don't like cooking, Soylent has the Soylution for you.

[34:57] For instance, the Soylent Complete Energy Drink, which is not actually your typical energy drink.

[35:01] Don't be confused.

[35:02] It's the first complete nutrition nootropic shake to fuel your body and mind, formulated with a proprietary blend of B vitamins, caffeine, I-theanine, I-tyrosine, and alpha-GPC.

[35:12] Ooh, that's the best kind of GPC.

Dan McCoy

[35:13] Yeah, I've been craving some alpha-GPC lately.

Elliott Kalan

[35:16] No beta-GPC and stay away from the omega-GPC.

[35:19] Just stick with the alpha-GPC.

[35:21] Plus 15 grams of plant-based protein and 39 essential nutrients, a delicious way to keep getting through your day.

[35:26] Soylent is so quick and so easy.

[35:27] You don't need to cook or clean up unless you're a particularly messy shake drinker.

[35:31] It's great for any time you need a nutritious, delicious meal.

[35:35] It's healthy for you because they took all the bad stuff out of the food and just left in the good stuff, which gives you less to poop out, which also saves you time.

[35:41] And it's made from domestically grown and sustainably sourced ingredients.

[35:45] It's not just good for you, but good for the planet.

[35:48] Go to Soylent.com slash flop and use the code FLOP to get 20% off your first order.

[35:53] That's Soylent.com slash flop with the code FLOP for 20% off your first order.

Stuart Wellington

[35:58] We also have a j-j-j-jumbotron.

[36:02] This message is for John, Buddy, and Big Guy.

[36:06] And it's from Emily.

[36:07] Wishing you an excellent 47th year Buffalo style.

[36:12] Now that I read it, I'm assuming John, Buddy, and Big Guy are all the same person.

[36:17] And happy 47th year.

Dan McCoy

[36:20] No, it's confusing.

[36:21] Buffalo style.

[36:21] You're like, how could a Buddy be a big guy?

[36:24] How could they both be John?

Elliott Kalan

[36:25] Well, the big guy is a buddy of Rusty the Boy Robot.

[36:28] Right?

Stuart Wellington

[36:29] Buddy and Big Guy are two things that I call bar patrons when I don't remember their name.

Dan McCoy

[36:35] That's a trick of the trade.

Stuart Wellington

[36:37] Trick of the trade.

Elliott Kalan

[36:38] And Buddy Guy is big in his field.

Stuart Wellington

[36:44] Now, while we're promoting things like Jumbotrons, why don't we also promote a little thing called Flop TV?

[36:50] Elliot, would you mind taking this ball and running with it?

Elliott Kalan

[36:52] I would love to.

[36:53] There's nothing I'm more excited about right now than Flop TV.

[36:55] And that includes my children.

[36:56] Hey, don't you wish the Flop House was a show you could watch as well as listen to?

[37:01] Why are your ears getting all the fun?

[37:02] Your eyes want in on the action.

[37:04] Well, we agree.

[37:05] And that's why from August through January on the first Saturday of the month, except for September, it's going to be the second Saturday of the month of September, we're bringing you Flop TV, a one-hour live-streamed version of this very show.

[37:15] We'll be doing new PowerPoint presentations.

[37:17] We'll be talking about some of the most requested and most legendary bad movies there are, none of which we have ever done episodes on before.

[37:23] And we'll be answering questions from you, the audience, and all in a tidy one-hour-or-so package that fits right into your normal TV viewing habits.

[37:31] Can't make it to the live airing of the show?

[37:33] That's okay.

[37:33] Buying a ticket gets you access to the show's recording for two weeks after the original air date.

[37:38] Tickets are $7 each for individual shows, or you can buy a season pass for all six shows for $35.

[37:44] That's like getting a whole show for free.

[37:46] Go to theflophouse.simpleticks.com for tickets and to see the list of movies we'll be covering.

[37:52] Remember, that's theflophouse.simpleticks.com for our six-month Flop TV live series.

[37:59] It's not TV.

[38:00] It's Flop TV.

[38:02] I stole that slogan from HBO because, again, those guys.

[38:05] They're not using it.

[38:06] Yeah, exactly.

[38:07] I didn't ask Max for permission.

[38:11] Sorry, Max.

Dan McCoy

[38:11] Most of the shit on Max is only not TV in the sense that it's sub-television now.

Elliott Kalan

[38:18] Oh, wow.

[38:19] Ruff, they do still have an amazing catalog of foreign films.

[38:22] I think they don't know that they're on there, so they've allowed them to stay on.

Stuart Wellington

[38:25] Yeah.

[38:26] Yeah.

[38:27] They're hiding out in the basement.

Elliott Kalan

[38:29] So, welcome.

[38:30] You know, Rainer Werner Fassbender is just sitting in the basement of Max going like,

[38:34] don't tell anyone that my movies are here.

[38:37] I don't want some tools or remove some.

Justin McElroy

[38:43] Hey, Sydney.

[38:44] You're a physician and the co-host of Sawbones, a marital tour of misguided medicine, right?

[38:48] That's true, Justin.

[38:49] Is it true that our medical history podcast is just as good as a visit to your primary care physician?

S5

[38:54] No, Justin.

[38:55] That is absolutely not true.

[38:56] However, our podcast is funny and interesting and a great way to learn about the medical misdeeds of the past,

[39:02] as well as some current not-so-legit healthcare fads.

Justin McElroy

[39:06] So, you're saying that by listening to our podcast, people will feel better?

[39:09] Sure.

[39:10] And isn't that the same reason that you go to the doctor?

[39:12] Well, you could say that, but-

[39:14] And our podcast is free.

[39:16] Yes, it is free.

[39:17] You heard it here first, folks.

[39:18] Sawbones, marital tour of misguided medicine, right here on Maximum Fun, just as good as going to the doctor.

S5

[39:24] No, no, no.

[39:24] Still not just as good as going to the doctor, but pretty good.

[39:27] It's up there.

John Hodgman

[39:28] Please, tell us what to tape about.

[39:30] Please, tell us what to tape about.

[39:32] Please.

[39:35] Because I'm Alex, and she's Katie, and we make Secretly Incredibly Fascinating.

Stuart Wellington

[39:39] A podcast about the history and science behind seemingly ordinary things.

John Hodgman

[39:44] We've done entire episodes about ham, or shoe sizes, or concrete, or the color beige.

[39:50] We need more ordinary stuff like that.

[39:53] Our MaxFun members suggest and pick our episode topics through Discord.

[39:57] So, what do you wonder about?

[39:59] What do you wish you could start to find interesting?

Stuart Wellington

[40:01] Make us tape your idea.

John Hodgman

[40:03] And then hear the results on Secretly Incredibly Fascinating from MaximumFun.org.

Stuart Wellington

[40:10] Hey, welcome back to The Peach Pit, a podcast all about Flophouse and the original peaches.

[40:15] Joining me today are two of the original peaches, Dan McCoy and Elliot Kalin.

[40:18] Thanks so much for joining me, guys.

Dan McCoy

[40:20] Yeah, this raises an interesting question.

[40:21] I thought that The Peach Pit was about the Flophouse, and yet this one is about art.

[40:26] Now, is the branding getting all confused?

Stuart Wellington

[40:28] Well, actually, we're doing something a little bit different here today, guys.

[40:31] Today, we are doing The Peach Pit Presents Carpe DMs, where I reach into my big bag of DMs I've received here at The Peach Pit.

[40:41] And I'm going to pose some questions to you two peaches, now that I have you on the line.

[40:45] How does that sound?

Elliott Kalan

[40:45] So, are we not doing the pictures anymore?

[40:47] Are we done with the art slides?

[40:48] No, no, apparently we've moved.

Stuart Wellington

[40:49] This is a different...

[40:50] No, this is a different show.

[40:51] We've moved on.

[40:53] Buckle your seatbelt.

[40:54] It's going to be a bumpy ride.

[40:56] So, first question, let's see.

[41:00] What is your go-to coffee order?

Dan McCoy

[41:06] Well, I am a Midwesterner, so my go-to coffee order is a drip coffee, black, no sugar.

Elliott Kalan

[41:16] Wow, okay.

[41:17] Plain Jane, Elliot.

[41:18] Bitter, just like life in the Midwest.

[41:20] And I don't like coffee.

[41:22] So, my go-to coffee order is a chocolate croissant or a chocolate chip cookie if they've got a particularly big one.

Stuart Wellington

[41:28] Now, when you order a chocolate croissant, do you order it like that or do you order it as a pain chocolate?

Elliott Kalan

[41:33] I say chocolate croissant because I know there are people in my life who say croissant regularly and it doesn't.

[41:41] It feels like such a put-on.

Dan McCoy

[41:42] Even though they're your loved ones, you're like, no.

Elliott Kalan

[41:45] I'm like, just say croissant like an unsophisticated American.

[41:49] I know that's what you are.

Stuart Wellington

[41:50] Take off that beret, Sammy.

[41:51] Yeah, that's great.

[41:56] What's yours, Stu?

[41:57] Mine is a flat white with oat milk.

[42:01] That's my preferred.

[42:02] Gimme, gimme.

[42:03] Now, here's a follow-up to that question.

[42:06] Okay.

[42:06] We're still, these are the softball questions.

[42:09] Yeah.

[42:09] If you were, imagine you are in a coffee shop.

[42:14] It's busy and you're standing behind Hollywood superstar actor, Nicolas Cage, who is currently supporting the SAG strike by not attending press events.

[42:23] Now, you're behind Nicolas Cage.

[42:24] What is his coffee order?

[42:27] Hmm.

Dan McCoy

[42:28] What do you think Nicolas Cage orders at a coffee shop?

[42:32] I'm going to say a quadruple espresso.

Elliott Kalan

[42:36] I'm going to say a quadruple espresso.

[42:38] And then when he takes the cup away, he takes out his own snake and squeezes the venom out of it and lets it drip into the cup.

[42:44] Just three drops.

[42:45] Four is too much.

[42:46] But three gets him into that kabuki acting zen mode that he needs to be in.

[42:50] Okay.

Stuart Wellington

[42:51] So, Nicolas Cage, if you're listening to this, obviously, write in and tell us how close we are.

[42:55] If you have been behind Nicolas Cage at a coffee shop or served him coffee, feel free to write in and give us the insights.

[43:01] Please.

[43:01] I would be so excited.

[43:03] Yeah.

[43:03] I would love to hear that.

[43:04] Now, on a recent Flophouse Mini, you guys admitted that you're both into drawing.

[43:09] And you know what?

[43:10] Me, Stuart Wellington, I am also a bit of a little artist as well.

[43:15] So, who are your biggest artistic inspirations?

[43:21] Who is the model or influence of your drawing style?

Dan McCoy

[43:26] Oh, boy.

[43:27] That's a tough one.

[43:28] I grew up reading a lot of funny animal comics.

[43:37] So, there's a lot of-

[43:39] Like Fritz the Cat, that kind of thing?

[43:41] Well, I got a lot from-

[43:42] Watership Down.

Elliott Kalan

[43:44] Watership Down.

[43:45] No, even a comic.

Dan McCoy

[43:46] Pogo and the Duck Comics.

[43:50] But I don't know if they're the-

[43:51] Destroyer Duck?

[43:52] I don't know if they really look like my art.

[43:56] Like, my art goes all over the place.

[43:58] Sometimes it's more clean and sometimes it's full of lines.

[44:02] And even though he's a difficult man with a lot of problems, like the lineier side of my art

[44:09] has certain crumb qualities sometimes.

[44:14] I-

[44:15] And you're usually eating while you do it.

Stuart Wellington

[44:17] So, you get actual crumb songs all over the place.

[44:19] Yeah, that's true.

[44:19] And you're riding around on a woman's ass.

[44:22] You know who I wish I could-

Elliott Kalan

[44:23] That's the main similarity, is the focus on butts.

[44:28] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[44:28] The person I wish I could draw like is Jaime Hernandez, because I just love-

Stuart Wellington

[44:33] Yeah, because he's the greatest of all time, sure.

Dan McCoy

[44:35] Just like the bold blocks of, you know, black in the inking.

[44:41] Very clean look.

[44:43] Very well composed.

Elliott Kalan

[44:44] It's hard to imagine an artist who does as much with as few-

[44:47] With as little lines.

[44:49] A little amount of lines.

[44:50] As few lines as Jaime Hernandez.

Stuart Wellington

[44:51] And do you think he's somebody who like-

[44:53] Like, takes a long time penciling?

[44:57] Or more is like-

[44:58] Sweats over his inking?

[44:59] Like, I know like Jeff Smith takes a long-

[45:01] Like a long time penciling.

[45:02] But when it comes to inking, he just like bangs it out.

[45:05] I think that-

[45:06] I could be wrong though.

[45:07] I think that something that-

Dan McCoy

[45:08] You're like, I know this, but I could be wrong.

Stuart Wellington

[45:09] I feel like I read in an interview where it was like talking about how like, how, you know,

[45:16] he-

[45:17] Because Jeff Smith's art is so like super clean.

[45:20] Yeah.

[45:21] And similar to Jaime Hernandez, fairly simple.

[45:25] Mm-hmm.

[45:26] And that it's-

Dan McCoy

[45:27] Although as Bone went along, he got weirdly enamored of putting tiny lines all over the place.

[45:32] Well, I think that was-

Elliott Kalan

[45:34] But I think that-

[45:34] I think there, there was a thematic reason for it because the story itself was getting

[45:37] more serious and less funny and more intense as it went on.

[45:41] So it kind of made sense.

[45:42] Could be.

[45:42] My guess is that I bet that the two of them spend a lot of time on the composition and

[45:47] layout stage.

[45:48] Yes.

[45:48] I bet they spend a lot of time laying at their panels.

[45:50] Jaime Hernandez especially.

[45:52] He's a master panel layout and page layout artist.

Dan McCoy

[45:55] I would say that too because like my experience of like, sometimes I'm like sketching and I'll

[46:00] like, you know, this is close enough to it and I will correct all of these little things

[46:05] as I ink.

[46:06] Like I will be able to see as I ink like, well, that relates to that not quite the way

[46:12] I have it.

[46:12] You know, I need to make adjustments, you know, but with something as precise as that,

[46:17] I think he probably really locks down the drawing.

Stuart Wellington

[46:21] What's your, what's your inking tool choice?

[46:24] Are you a brush guy?

Dan McCoy

[46:25] I have started using almost exclusively brush pens.

[46:31] There are a lot of like Japanese brands of brush pens that are very good.

[46:38] And I just like having the variable line without having to build it up myself by, you know, going

[46:45] over things.

Stuart Wellington

[46:46] Yeah.

[46:46] I'm still, I'm such a sucker for crow quills though.

[46:48] And like.

[46:49] They're great.

[46:50] But getting used to like.

[46:51] That's a fuss.

[46:51] Doing all your fine lines first and then your like medium lines as the quill becomes more

[46:57] and more stretched out.

[46:58] Yeah.

[46:59] Save your big fat lines for the end.

[47:02] That's cool.

[47:03] For me, my big, my big, my big influences are Dan Klaus, Evan Dorkin and Charles Burns.

[47:09] Like those big heavy blacks and like panel composition that Dan Klaus does.

[47:15] Yeah.

[47:16] Those guys were big.

[47:17] Despite my, my, the content I would do had nothing to do with anything those guys did.

[47:22] But like there were just huge influence.

Elliott Kalan

[47:24] No, we all know Dan Klaus's Warhammer work.

[47:27] Yeah.

[47:27] Particularly impressive.

Stuart Wellington

[47:28] That was what my comics were all about.

[47:30] Warhammer guys.

Dan McCoy

[47:32] Allie, did you say?

Elliott Kalan

[47:34] No, I mean, I also don't draw like most of the artists that I like.

[47:38] I feel like most of them are, are well, so far beyond me.

[47:41] And I, and I've spent years letting my ability to draw atrophy.

[47:44] And it's going to take me a long time to get it back up to where I would like it to be.

[47:48] But I would think probably like as, as boring as it is that Jack Kirby is a big, big, like

[47:54] kind of influence on the way I think about shapes and forms and things like that.

[47:58] And also it's a lot easy.

[48:00] He's, you know, it's not easy to draw exactly like Jack Kirby, but it is easy to draw similar

[48:04] to Jack Kirby because he was so much about, so much more about force and about impact

[48:08] than he was about, you know, specific proportion, let's say.

Stuart Wellington

[48:13] Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think that's right.

[48:15] Certainly more than like realism.

Elliott Kalan

[48:17] Yes.

[48:18] I mean, I, it's, I, it's easier to draw in the style of Jack Kirby than it is to draw in

[48:23] the style of one of his, someone who used to draw like him, like Barry Windsor Smith or

[48:27] something like that.

[48:27] Like it's hard to jump in and do a Barry Windsor Smith type picture, even though you look at

[48:31] his old drawings when he was Barry Smith and he looks a lot like Kirby.

Stuart Wellington

[48:34] Yeah, yeah.

[48:34] Just jump in and do a Bernie Wrightson picture.

Elliott Kalan

[48:37] Oh, I wish.

[48:38] Amazing.

[48:38] Ruin your hands doing it.

Stuart Wellington

[48:40] And my eyes as well.

Elliott Kalan

[48:42] How do I, how do I try every strand on a cobweb?

[48:46] This is very difficult.

[48:47] From memory.

Stuart Wellington

[48:51] Uh, okay.

[48:51] So, uh, despite, you know, we're not, we're trying not to promote movies now, but I can't,

[48:56] we can't help it.

[48:57] We got to talk a little bit about movies.

[48:59] Uh, you, you guys all have favorite movies.

[49:02] Elliot's is taking a pellet one, two, three.

[49:04] Dan should be.

[49:05] Dan, if you were to say you have a favorite movie, if you were going to introduce a friend

[49:09] to a favorite movie, what movie would you be like?

[49:11] You need to see this.

[49:13] Uh, let's go with North by Northwest.

[49:16] Sure.

[49:16] And I'll go with a recent one.

[49:17] Uh, I don't know.

[49:18] Uh, maybe the Suspiria remake just to make people mad.

[49:22] Um, and if you were going to introduce a friend to this movie, you have to pick one of three

[49:28] circumstances to show them.

[49:29] And these are, let's say not the best circumstances, but this is your only chance to get your friend

[49:34] to check out this favorite movie of yours.

[49:37] Would you show them the movie A, projected on the wall of a frat house during a frat party?

[49:43] B, watched on a phone in the backseat of a car with two hungry and tired children on a road

[49:50] trip?

[49:51] Or three, watched on a plane after it's been hijacked by terrorists?

Dan McCoy

[50:00] Uh, I'm going to say three.

[50:04] It has.

[50:05] Okay.

[50:05] Dan just loves watching movies on planes.

Stuart Wellington

[50:08] I knew as soon as I gave him that up, he's like, oh, yummy, yummy.

Elliott Kalan

[50:12] His eyes lit up.

[50:12] Oh.

Dan McCoy

[50:13] Look, presuming the, I mean, if the terrorists are allowing you to still watch movies, like.

Elliott Kalan

[50:19] It's a long flight.

[50:20] All of.

[50:21] They got to entertain you somehow.

Dan McCoy

[50:22] All of the distractions, you know, the immediate distractions are gone.

[50:26] Just like a general sense of like unease in your stomach is what you're contending with.

[50:32] So you're paying more attention to the movie.

[50:33] And I think you need that movie to distract you, you know, piece of escapism to like keep you

[50:39] busy while, uh, while this is unfolding.

Stuart Wellington

[50:43] Dan's like, I should have said my favorite movie was executive decision.

Dan McCoy

[50:47] I mean, there's a plane scene in North by Northwest.

[50:50] Or passenger 57.

[50:50] But it is, it is so divorced from the context of like a plane hijacking.

[50:56] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[50:57] I think it's interesting that you said you'd be paying more attention to the movie in a

[51:01] situation like that when I think you'd probably find it hard to pay attention.

[51:03] But perhaps this is like the story of the man who was chased onto a branch by a tiger and

[51:08] he's about to fall off a cliff and he sees one strawberry growing off of that branch and

[51:12] he eats it and it's the most delicious strawberry he's ever had in his life because he's so

[51:15] focused on it.

[51:16] Maybe it's like that.

[51:17] Where did you hear this story?

[51:18] Did you just make it up?

[51:19] No, this is an old saying, but I think I once, I first heard it in an episode of King

[51:22] of the Hill.

Dan McCoy

[51:24] Awesome.

[51:25] We're all with similar sides.

Stuart Wellington

[51:27] I'm disappointed you didn't do in a cool voice, but that's fine.

[51:30] That's maybe next time.

[51:31] Maybe next time.

Dan McCoy

[51:32] Are these still DM questions or?

Stuart Wellington

[51:33] Yes, these are all DM questions.

[51:34] Okay, I just didn't.

Elliott Kalan

[51:35] I'm going to say, take in Palma 1, 2, 3, project it on the wall of that fret party because it's

[51:39] a loud movie.

[51:40] You'll be able to hear it over that stuff.

[51:41] You need to see it big.

[51:42] And also, they're all going to stop partying and start watching the movie once they hear

[51:46] all that swearing.

Stuart Wellington

[51:48] This is the worst way to watch the movie.

[51:50] I guess I got no choice.

[51:51] I got to make my friend watch the Spear in the back of a car with two kids.

[51:54] No, that's the worst way to see a movie.

[51:56] That's the worst way to see a movie.

[51:59] Okay.

[51:59] Now, before we wrap up, we got one final question.

[52:03] One of the things that weird dudes on the internet seem obsessed with is AI.

[52:07] Now, has there ever been a movie where AI is the good guy?

[52:13] Her?

[52:15] I think.

[52:15] Okay.

Elliott Kalan

[52:16] Her?

[52:17] I mean, AI is not a bad guy in her, but it's not that kind of movie, you know?

Dan McCoy

[52:21] Yeah.

[52:22] Well, no.

[52:23] Well, I think that still counts.

[52:24] What do you mean?

[52:26] Yep.

[52:27] Does it have to be a movie where like AI is good fighting another thing?

[52:32] Like it can't just be like not.

[52:33] Where the AI is a hero.

[52:34] Yeah.

[52:35] I mean, I think she is kind of the hero of that movie because she transcends, you know,

[52:42] being locked into lame, sad, walking Phoenix.

[52:47] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[52:48] I guess so.

[52:49] I guess so.

[52:50] I guess, Stuart, you're right that Jarvis is often the hero in the Avengers Iron Man movies

[52:55] and then he becomes Vision.

[52:57] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[52:57] Vision is good enough to wield the Mjolnir.

[53:02] So.

Dan McCoy

[53:02] Mm-hmm.

[53:03] Yep.

[53:04] So it's.

[53:05] That's bonkers.

[53:08] I mean, I didn't make it up.

[53:09] That's canon though.

[53:10] It's not like that's been.

[53:11] When did he do that?

[53:12] When did that happen?

[53:12] That's how you know that he's good when he shows up in Ultron.

[53:15] It's a pretty.

[53:16] Avengers Age of Ultron.

[53:17] I forgot about that.

[53:17] A bit of.

Elliott Kalan

[53:19] To be honest, I so, they spend so little time on Vision in that movie.

[53:23] I've only seen that movie once, Age of Ultron.

[53:25] That they spend so little time on him after he's born that I kind of forgot everything

[53:28] he does other than occasionally zap and box with his lasers.

Stuart Wellington

[53:32] Yeah.

[53:32] And that was also in a movie that very specifically has an evil AI in it.

[53:37] Yes.

Elliott Kalan

[53:38] Exactly.

[53:38] Much like the AI in the real world.

Stuart Wellington

[53:41] Yes.

[53:41] That's the thing is that I feel like there's so few examples of.

[53:45] It's like a weird thing to cape for when every.

[53:48] Almost every example of AI in movies is bad.

Elliott Kalan

[53:51] Well, I guess the difference.

[53:53] It really isn't that AI in the real world is evil, but the people who use it are either

[53:57] evil or oblivious to what human life should be like.

[54:00] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[54:00] Right now, it's chaotic neutral, I would say.

Elliott Kalan

[54:03] Well, right now, it's the.

[54:05] You know what it is?

[54:06] Right now, it's Chappie.

[54:08] It's just Chappie.

[54:10] It's a baby.

[54:11] It doesn't know what it's doing.

[54:12] So it's easy for a bunch of trash rap bank robbers to tell it to commit crimes and hurt people.

[54:18] And Chappie's like, oh, this fun.

[54:20] This fun.

[54:20] Chappie love mommy, daddy.

[54:22] And that's what AI is right now.

[54:24] The people who are in charge of the companies, AI is like, you mommy, daddy?

[54:28] And they're like, yeah, we are.

[54:29] Take people's jobs.

[54:30] They don't want those jobs.

[54:32] Oh, me good.

[54:33] Me free them from jobs.

[54:34] That kind of thing.

Stuart Wellington

[54:35] I guess Johnny Five is a good AI.

[54:37] Yeah, he's a hero, yeah.

[54:38] Okay, so yeah, if we only get Johnny Fives, I get it.

[54:42] Johnny Five should be writing all the movies, right?

Elliott Kalan

[54:46] No, not at all.

[54:47] I mean, what he should be doing is he should be chasing after diamond thieves.

[54:53] Basically, that's the thing he does best, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[54:54] So you think AI has a strong case for being head of law enforcement?

Elliott Kalan

[55:01] Well, you've all seen RoboCup, right?

[55:02] We get the competing visions of.

[55:05] No problem with that.

[55:06] The ED-209 is great at it.

[55:08] He's so good, yeah.

[55:09] I'm sure that executive he shoots in the beginning, I'm sure was guilty of something.

[55:12] You know, he wouldn't be in that boardroom.

Stuart Wellington

[55:14] That's true, yeah.

[55:15] And he does make dinosaurs happen.

[55:17] Yeah, maybe that's the problem.

Dan McCoy

[55:18] Is ED-209 had like too wide and realistic a view of what crime was?

[55:24] Yeah, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[55:25] He says property is theft.

[55:27] Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da.

[55:29] A lot of people, I'm surprised that headset reading hasn't come up yet.

[55:32] That it's like, well, ED-209 is actually more progressive than any other character.

[55:38] That's why he's going after these capitalists.

Stuart Wellington

[55:40] Yeah, he's going after RoboCup because he is cop in his name.

[55:45] That's the sad that ED-209 doesn't realize he's a police officer also.

[55:49] Yeah, that's the thing.

[55:50] Okay, well, I feel like this has been a really fun episode of The Peach Pit.

[55:54] Thanks so much for joining me, guys.

[55:56] Now, The Peach Pit is part of the Flophouse megacorporation brand.

[56:01] And we all live within the Maximum Fun world.

[56:05] Thank you so much for supporting us.

[56:06] Thanks for being part of the MaxFun Network.

[56:08] This episode is going to be edited, I'm guessing, severely by Alexander Smith, who goes by Howell Dottie on social media.

[56:15] Thanks so much for joining us.

[56:17] Guys, do you have any plugs to make?

Dan McCoy

[56:20] No, I mean, just, you know, all that stuff Elliot said earlier.

Elliott Kalan

[56:23] Just, yep, please support your fellow Strikers or your neighborhood Strikers and or Strikers from, that's the, that's the, that's the.

Dan McCoy

[56:34] Strikers from Airplane?

[56:35] Mortal Kombat?

[56:36] Ted Strikers.

Elliott Kalan

[56:37] Yeah, that was the Strikers that came to mind, but I don't actually want to support him that badly.

[56:40] The Strikers files?

Dan McCoy

[56:41] I don't know.

[56:42] No.

[56:42] That was an old, that was an old Channel 101 show that my friends did.

[56:47] I don't know why.

[56:50] And on the note of the strike, which seems like it will drag on forever, one, you know, tangible way you can help us, two of your favorite guild members, is to just spread the word about the Flophouse.

[57:02] Get us more listeners, because right now, this is our jobs.

[57:06] So, our job, singular, even though there are two of us.

[57:12] We both share one job, and it is entertaining America through this, the medium of the Flophouse.

[57:17] Maybe don't make the people that you recommend listen to this episode, but in general, help us out, why don't you?

Elliott Kalan

[57:27] Bye!

[57:29] Well said, Dan, well said.

[57:36] Maximum Fun.

[57:37] A worker-owned network.

Justin McElroy

[57:39] Of artists-owned shows.

[57:40] Supported.

[57:41] Directly.

[57:42] By you.

FH Mini 85 - The Peach Pit 3: Art & Coffee

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