FH Mini 107 - A Talk with Tom Holland!

[0:00] Hey, this is a Flophouse mini episode.

Stuart Wellington

[0:08] Now, here at the Flophouse, we normally watch a bad movie, then we talk about it, but tonight

[0:11] we are not doing that at all.

[0:13] We are going to be interviewing and talking with a very special guest, but to introduce

[0:18] ourselves, I'm Stuart Wellington, and joining me, as always, are...

[0:21] Dan McCoy.

Elliott Kalan

[0:22] And I'm Elliot Kalin, the third person who co-hosts this show.

Stuart Wellington

[0:26] And we have a special guest today.

[0:28] We have writer, director, author, Tom Holland.

[0:32] You would know him from Fright Night.

[0:34] You would know him from Cloak and Dagger.

[0:36] You would know him from Child's Play.

[0:38] Psycho 2.

[0:39] So many.

[0:40] Psycho 2, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[0:42] The class of 1984, one of the all-time great punk movies.

[0:45] Exactly.

Stuart Wellington

[0:45] Oh, thank you, thank you, thank you, Elliot.

[0:48] Thank you, Tom.

[0:48] I love it.

[0:48] So yeah, Tom, thank you so much for joining us.

[0:50] How are you doing today?

S3

[0:52] Oh, you don't want to know.

[0:56] I'm recovering from last night where I introduced a friend's movie.

[1:01] I did it from L.A. in Naples, Florida.

[1:06] Okay.

[1:07] As a hurricane barrels towards Florida, you know.

[1:11] Anyway.

Stuart Wellington

[1:11] Did that add urgency to your introduction?

S3

[1:16] Well, I was surprised they got that many people into the theater.

[1:22] You know, the theater was packed.

[1:24] But I mean, it's like 91 at night down there, I think, right now.

[1:28] Yeah.

[1:28] So maybe the theater's a good place to hide out.

Stuart Wellington

[1:32] Or maybe it's a sign of how enthusiastic they are for your friend's movie.

[1:36] Do you want to drop a plug as to what the name of that movie is?

[1:40] Yeah, his name's Peter Oguchi.

S3

[1:41] And the movie's called, oh my god.

[1:46] I'll think of it in a minute.

[1:48] Perfect.

[1:49] I'm turning into Joe Biden.

Stuart Wellington

[1:51] We all are.

[1:53] That's our curse.

[1:53] We all are.

[1:54] Yeah.

[1:55] Okay.

[1:56] So one of the big things, I already mentioned it, but we're really excited to talk about Fright Night today.

[2:05] I'm sure I speak for all three of the Flophouse in that Fright Night has been a really important movie to us.

[2:10] It's a movie that has been a favorite of mine for a very long time.

[2:14] It's always fun to revisit.

[2:17] But some of our listeners might not be familiar with Fright Night.

[2:21] Tom, how would you describe Fright Night to somebody who has never seen it before?

S3

[2:26] Fright Night is my love letter to horror fans everywhere.

[2:31] And it came out in 1985, and it was the second biggest horror movie that year from Columbia Pictures.

[2:39] Uh-huh.

[2:39] And it's really amazing.

[2:43] I mean, it is a once-in-a-lifetime experience.

[2:47] It's done nothing but grow.

[2:50] I mean, you know, when I was doing all these movies, you never expected anybody.

[2:55] Well, you thought you did them.

[2:56] They came out in the theaters, if you were lucky.

[2:59] And, you know, and then maybe they ended up on television and reruns for a year or two, and then they were gone, gone, gone.

[3:08] And what's happened with Fright Night is it's become multigenerational.

[3:12] It's the movie that grandparents showed to their grandchildren to introduce them to horror now.

[3:21] I mean, it's just amazing.

[3:23] It has become much loved.

[3:26] I mean, it's got a really avid fan base, and I never expected it.

[3:34] And it's just, it's grown over the last, I guess I noticed it around the beginning of this millennial or whatever the hell it is.

[3:44] Sure, yeah.

[3:45] Yeah, 2000.

[3:47] It's just amazing.

[3:50] So, you know, and it's loved.

[3:53] You know, I mean, I've got, all of it's been amazing.

[3:57] I'm going to sound like I'm bragging, but I mean.

[4:01] You're allowed to brag here on the Flapos.

[4:03] Yeah, well, I went to a blacklist dinner with all the big horror directors maybe 15, 17 years ago.

[4:11] And Psycho 2 was voted the best horror sequel ever.

[4:19] And, you know, when Psycho 2 came out, it was an enormous hit.

[4:24] It was the biggest hit that year after the first sequel to Star Wars.

[4:29] That's how big it was.

[4:30] Yeah.

[4:31] And then everybody forgot about it.

[4:34] I thought, you know, and then I don't know, about 15, 16 years ago, a guy named Rob Galuzzo showed up.

[4:43] And all they could think about was the Psycho series.

[4:47] And that was the beginning of what was a critical discovery, rediscovery, reassessment, I don't know, of Psycho 2.

[4:59] And I plug for myself.

[5:01] I have a book that you can find on Amazon called Oh, Mother, What Have You Done?

[5:05] Which is about the making of Psycho 2.

[5:08] Oh, that's great.

[5:10] Yeah, because the fans were asking me about it.

[5:15] And then an amazing thing happened.

[5:18] The Richard Franklin who directed it, who was an Australian who directed Road Games.

[5:25] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[5:26] And a scholar of Alfred Hitchcock.

[5:31] Richard died of prostate cancer a long time ago, 2009.

[5:38] And then through a variety of different things, his widow, Jennifer Haddon, sent me his memoirs that he'd done just before he passed.

[5:48] And he went through all of the movies that he'd made and what the experiences have been like.

[5:55] But the one that was the most complete and also had an uplifting story was Psycho 2.

[6:03] And I read that.

[6:04] And it was like stepping back into 1982 or 3 when I wrote it for him.

[6:13] And I did.

[6:15] I put it together.

[6:17] And then I put in my comments and my memories.

[6:20] And then I got the editor, Andrew London.

[6:24] He and I are the only two left of making the movie.

[6:28] Well, Vera Miles is.

[6:30] She won't talk to anybody.

[6:31] She's in her 90s.

[6:34] And so I had.

[6:37] So you read the book and it's like a roundtable, like everybody's still here, you know, talking about what it was like making it.

[6:45] And it was a blockbuster in the sense that the audience is lined up around the block to see it.

[6:53] And it ends with Richard talking about what it was like on Times Square to go to the first night's release of Psycho 2.

[7:04] And what happened there was that nobody at Universal wanted to.

[7:08] This is before they did sequels, you know.

[7:12] And everybody thought that it was the kiss of death to remake Psycho 2 because Psycho, at that point, was realized as a seminal horror film that it was.

[7:24] I would call it the beginning of the slasher genre.

[7:28] Big tip of the hat to Alfred Hitchcock.

[7:31] But everybody told Richard and me that if we had the temerity to try to make a sequel to Psycho to Psycho,

[7:40] that the reviews would be so savage, we'd never work again.

[7:46] And the problem was that it had no, it had no, it didn't have any interest unless I could get Anthony Perkins to play Norman Bates again.

[8:01] And I had to write a script that had such a terrific character arc and such an acting piece that Tony would say yes.

[8:14] And Tony had, to put it mildly, an ambivalent relationship with Norman Bates.

[8:21] You know, Tony had been a young lead.

[8:26] And then he did Psycho, which was like an afterthought.

[8:30] I think he worked like five or six days on it.

[8:33] And he flew back and forth to New York in between.

[8:36] He had no idea of the effect it was going to have.

[8:42] Or his role as Norman Bates.

[8:45] And so he felt that he, you know, that's the old song in Hollywood, be careful what you succeed at.

[8:52] Because you'll be doing it forever.

[8:55] Yeah.

[8:55] That's sort of how Tony felt.

[8:58] But he really loved the role, what I'd written for him.

[9:05] And he came in and he knocked it out of the park.

[9:08] They all did.

[9:09] They were all great.

[9:10] Jennifer Tilly, Vera Miles, God bless her.

[9:13] Robert Loja.

[9:15] You know, a hell of a cast.

[9:17] And Richard Franklin, the director, was spot on in his direction.

[9:22] That was probably the height of his power coming off of Rogue Games and Patrick, I think is the name of it.

Stuart Wellington

[9:30] And Anthony Perkins went on to direct Psycho 3.

[9:33] So in a way, you brought him back to that character and him loving Norman Bates again, I guess.

S3

[9:41] Well, that gave him the power to direct.

[9:43] Yeah.

[9:43] He had wanted to direct, too.

[9:47] You know, but Universal wouldn't allow it.

[9:51] And then Psycho 2 made something, I forget something, like $90 million worldwide back in the days when that was unheard of.

[10:01] And we did it for a smidge less than $5 million.

[10:09] Wow.

Dan McCoy

[10:10] Yeah.

[10:10] And we shot.

[10:11] I'm amazed here that the thing is, like, I'm a little too young to, like, have been aware of, like, the box office at the time.

[10:21] So I didn't know that it had been that huge because I do remember, like, critics being, like, hard on it because they were like, it's not Psycho.

[10:32] Like, it wasn't a time, you know, that sequels were as accepted.

[10:38] So they're like, oh, they're making a Psycho 2.

[10:40] And so I had no idea.

[10:42] And then I saw it years later.

[10:45] That's a movie that I have recommended on this podcast.

[10:48] I love Psycho 2.

[10:50] I think it's, I don't know.

[10:54] It's so clever in the way it takes your knowledge of Psycho and sort of uses it against you, I think.

S3

[11:00] Well, you end up sympathizing with a serial murderer.

[11:04] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[11:05] Yeah.

[11:06] And I love Richard Franklin, you know, another one of your movies, Cloak and Dagger.

[11:11] I watched that so much as a kid.

[11:12] Like, when Dabney Coleman just passed, like, I joked that, like, I'm one of the few people who probably thinks of Dabney Coleman primarily as an action star because I love Cloak and Dagger so much.

[11:24] Jack Flack.

S3

[11:25] Jack Flack.

[11:25] Yeah.

[11:26] Dabney is Jack.

[11:28] They're having a screening of it.

[11:30] And they're screening two Sundays in a row in a couple of weeks then at the New Beverly Theater here in L.A., which is Tarantino's Theater.

[11:40] And my son and I are going to go see it again because I haven't seen it in a 35-mil print in, gosh, decades.

[11:46] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[11:47] I don't think I've ever seen it in the theater.

[11:50] Like, it was such a, like, an HBO state bar for me.

S3

[11:53] Well, what happened was that they changed regimes at Universal.

[11:59] And Frank Price's regime came in, and they hadn't given the go-ahead, and they dumped it.

[12:06] Yeah.

[12:06] So it was a failure as a release, theatrical release, and then it came out on cable.

[12:13] And guys like you who were at that age then, I'm probably talking the 90s, the 1990s, the, you know, if you saw it when you were 14, 15, or 16, it stayed with you forever.

[12:30] Yeah.

[12:30] You know, I mean, because they make so few, they make no films now for adolescent boys, you know.

[12:40] So it has a huge fan base.

Stuart Wellington

[12:44] There was kind of an interesting, like, trope or connection I got from both Cloak and Dagger and Fright Night, and also a little bit in Child's Play.

[12:53] But, like, you have characters who, you have fatherless heroes who are kind of, like, searching for a father figure a little bit.

[13:01] And they're also, I feel like they came out to a, these movies were released to a generation of young men who were also, like, raised on television, like us.

[13:12] Yeah.

[13:12] So, like, I feel like there's some kind of, was that, was that intentional that you were trying to reach that specific audience with these movies?

[13:20] Like an audience of men raised by TV, basically?

S3

[13:24] I, I, I don't think so.

[13:27] I think that, I think that was me going into them.

[13:31] Yeah.

[13:32] You know what I mean?

[13:33] I mean, I mean, finally, there is a truth in, in, in, in writers that, you know, that, that a lot of themselves have to go into it.

[13:45] I don't think I had any control over it.

[13:48] Okay.

[13:48] You know, I mean, I think that, you know, if you, if you, if you're really, if it's really good, if, I mean, if you, if you're really living the life of your characters, you know, you go into it and it isn't, it isn't a cold commercial calculation.

[14:05] I mean, you know, I mean, I, I, I, I certainly, I certainly know when I'm, when I'm spot on and I know when I'm, I'm desperately trying to get into it.

[14:16] You know, and I've, I've had both experiences, but.

Dan McCoy

[14:19] You say that about, um, people like brought up on television and you said, uh, uh, sir, about the, the fright night, fright night being a love letter to horror fans.

[14:31] Like certainly in the case of, you know, having this horror host character, which like, I, uh, also didn't really experience the local horror host.

[14:44] But something about that performance just works nonetheless.

[14:48] Like, even if you don't understand the exact mechanics of it, you understand the idea.

Stuart Wellington

[14:53] Roddy McDowell as the character.

[14:54] Yeah.

[14:54] Vincent.

Dan McCoy

[14:55] And I don't know, like, even as a kid, I found that character so compelling and charming.

[15:01] Like, did you, were you thinking of, uh, specific people when you were, uh, doing that character or, uh, sort of.

[15:09] Oh yeah.

S3

[15:10] I was, I was thinking of Vincent Price.

[15:12] I wrote it for Vincent Price.

[15:15] And then I, then, then I got to go ahead in the movie and I reached out and his health wasn't, wasn't strong enough to be able to cast him.

[15:25] And I, I, I was blessed that I got Roddy.

[15:30] And then, then Roddy McDowell had, had me to dinner at his house with Vincent Price and his wife, Curl Brown, which was an amazing experience.

[15:40] I should have taken an autograph book with me back in those years.

[15:44] All I wanted to talk about were the, were the, were the, were the, the AIP and, and, uh, and, uh, uh, Roger Corman movies that Vincent had done.

[15:54] And all he wanted to talk about was food and art.

Elliott Kalan

[16:00] You know, so.

[16:01] I feel like he really missed out.

[16:03] He should have had the opportunity to do a movie about someone who murders people with painting or with, with fine cooking.

[16:08] Then I think he really would have gotten into it.

[16:10] Yeah.

S3

[16:11] Well, he was, Vincent Price was an incredibly sophisticated man.

[16:16] I mean, I'm from a small town, I'm from a small town in midstate New York called Highland.

[16:21] And, uh, uh, you know, I mean, it, it, it didn't have very many gourmets in that town.

[16:29] That's, that's, that's for sure.

Stuart Wellington

[16:31] But it's similar.

[16:32] Like, you, we all, we, I think we all like experience, at least when we were younger,

[16:38] experienced the world through movies and TV.

[16:41] Yeah, definitely.

[16:41] And that's how, uh, that's our touchstones.

[16:43] Yeah.

[16:44] Cause there's, there's a great line, like there's a great bit where Peter Vincent is, uh, you know,

[16:49] he's expounding on the current state of the horror genre and how they all want, you know,

[16:55] ski mask killers with machetes.

[16:57] Um, and so it, like.

[16:59] Hacking up young virgins.

[17:01] Exactly.

[17:02] And I, I was, I was, I was wondering, was, was that you speaking through that character

[17:07] from your own opinions?

[17:09] Yeah.

S3

[17:09] Oh yeah.

[17:10] Fright Night is my love letter.

[17:12] The fan, horror fans everywhere.

[17:14] I came on the, I came on the scene before, before horror was, was, was, was, it was even a,

[17:22] a, a vaguely respectable genre.

Stuart Wellington

[17:25] Certainly before it became self-referential, I feel like.

S3

[17:29] Oh God.

[17:29] Yeah.

[17:29] But I mean, it was, it was, my memory is, was me and three or the, three or four of the

[17:35] guys in high school and everybody thought we were weird and we, we read EC comics and this

[17:43] is when EC comics were banned.

[17:45] They were banned like in 1955 or 56 and we hide them in, in, in, in notebooks or in our magazines

[17:53] and slip up, slip into new additions to each other in high school.

[17:57] And everybody thought we were very weird.

[18:00] And even, even when I did Fright Night, which would be 1985, everybody that, that was in

[18:07] Hollywood told me I immediately had to get out of horror because horror was considered the

[18:13] redheaded stepchild in Hollywood, you know?

[18:17] So, you know, there's been a prejudice against it.

[18:20] And here we sit in 2024 and all it is, is horror movies and remakes and sequels.

[18:30] Yeah.

[18:31] But the only originality is horror.

Elliott Kalan

[18:34] And it feels like we've been, we've seen such a sea change in the way critically that horror

[18:39] movies are talked about because the, the fans of your generation and the generation after

[18:44] kind of have become the, the, the critics and academics.

[18:47] And so now it's almost, horror is almost seen as like the, uh, in many places as the, the

[18:52] purest of the film genres, the one that's most worth talking about, uh, as opposed to back

[18:57] then when you look at the, like, I'll occasionally go back and read old, like New York Times reviews

[19:01] of horror movies from the, you know, 50s, 60s, or 70s.

[19:04] And they're just so, they feel so insulted that they have to watch this movie and talk

[19:08] about it.

[19:10] Like how, how dare anyone make this and make them sit through it?

[19:13] And now it feels so different, gladly.

[19:14] Yeah.

S3

[19:15] Yeah.

[19:15] If you look at Roger, Roger Ebert's, uh, uh, review of Fright Night, which is good, but

[19:22] you said it's not a distinguished horror movie, but it has a lot of fun being undistinguished.

[19:28] Which is sort of a backhanded compliment, you know?

[19:31] Yeah.

[19:32] Yeah.

[19:33] The one, I'm sorry, go ahead.

Elliott Kalan

[19:35] No, I was going to say, the, the work you did with, with Fright Night and with Psycho 2,

[19:39] it's like, with making movies that play with, as, as, uh, I think Dan was saying earlier,

[19:44] plays with the preconceived notions that the audience has from knowing previous movies.

[19:48] It feels like that's, I think you did such a big part in making the genre more acceptable,

[19:55] more respectable, in, in helping it to become more kind of self-reflective in that way,

[20:00] or showing that the previous horror movies have things about them that can be commented

[20:05] on and can be moved forward in a way.

[20:07] I think that the way you were using them in those movies, um, yeah, you, you really helped

[20:12] to push things forward in that way, to make horror more than, more than just kind of straightforward

[20:16] scares, which allows more, more academic people to take it more seriously, even if they should

[20:21] have been taken seriously the whole time, you know?

[20:23] Thank you, Elliot.

[20:25] I mean, thank you.

S3

[20:26] I mean, yeah, but all of this was only, all of this was only in the last 15, 17, 18 years.

[20:33] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[20:34] I mean, I swear to God, swear to God.

[20:36] When Scream came out and people were like, oh, this horror movie is really, they're, they're,

[20:39] it's a horror movie that deals with the tropes of horror movies.

[20:42] And I was like, it's called Fright Night.

[20:43] Like, it exists.

[20:44] Like, come on.

[20:45] Like, it's been made.

[20:46] I was getting very frustrated with that.

[20:48] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[20:48] Well, that, that, that, that, that, that referential nature, the premise, I want to say,

[20:52] so I was rewatching Fright Night this morning and my wife, who is less of, less versed in

[21:00] horror, will like, was like, okay, well, what's, what's this about?

[21:03] You know?

[21:04] And I gave her the premise of like, okay, well, this vampire moves in next door to this

[21:10] boy.

[21:11] No one believes that there's a vampire over there, of course, because it's a vampire.

[21:15] And so he has to employ like the closest thing to a vampire expert he has near him,

[21:22] which is this horror host character.

[21:25] And she immediately was like, oh, that's a great premise.

[21:28] Like, she was hooked by the premise.

[21:30] And I think anyone who hears it is like, oh, great.

[21:33] But I'm wondering, like, was the seed for you, were you like, vampire moves in next door?

[21:39] Was the seed like, what if a horror host has to like go up against an actual threat?

[21:45] You know, do you remember?

S3

[21:47] Yes.

[21:48] Yes.

[21:48] Very well.

[21:49] Well, it came off of Cloak and Dagger.

[21:52] Cloak and Dagger is, is hype, supposedly a remake of The Window, which was Cornell

[21:59] Woolrich's juvenile version of Rear Window.

[22:03] But it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's sort of the classic boy who cried wolf story.

[22:09] And I said, if you really want to do this in an interesting way, have it be a mad teenage

[22:15] horror fan who becomes convinced that the guy next door is a vampire.

[22:22] And we went, it was Richard Frankler and I, we went into Universal and pitched it there and

[22:27] they threw us out.

[22:30] Because, because that was a moment in time when vampires were dead, dead, dead.

[22:36] You know, I mean.

Elliott Kalan

[22:37] Of all the places to throw you out, Universal should be most excited to do a vampire movie.

[22:42] Vampires kept that studio alive for so long.

[22:44] Oh, that's frustrating to hear that.

S3

[22:46] You can never underestimate how blind major corporations are to their catalogs.

[22:54] Yeah.

[22:56] You know, I mean, it always amazes me.

[22:59] But anyway, I, I had the idea in my head and I was in love with it because that was my teenage

[23:07] years.

[23:08] I mean, when I, when I was a teenager, you know, the only place you can watch horror movies

[23:15] were on Friday night and the Friday night frights at 11 o'clock on some independent TV channel.

[23:22] And they were uniformly God awful.

[23:24] Not really.

[23:26] There were, there were a few early ones who were brilliant.

[23:29] I mean, the original thing was, was 1951 or two.

[23:34] Them is a terrific movie.

[23:36] Yeah.

[23:37] You know, I mean, anyway, there's some really good movies, but a lot of them were really

[23:42] god awful, but they had these horror hosts like Elvira and Stagger Lee and Count Scavulli

[23:53] or whatever, you know, and, and they, they were all horrible ham actors, but great fun.

[24:00] Yeah.

[24:01] And they would step out of a crypt of paper mache and it would, you could see it shake,

[24:06] you know, and they'd, they'd walk in a graveyard and you'd see the, the, the, the, the prop man

[24:12] coming in with a, with a fogger and with a, with a thing to, to blow the fog.

[24:17] You know, it was really just god awful.

[24:20] But it was, it was huge fun.

[24:22] And I, I grew up with that because it was the only place you could watch horror movies,

[24:27] you know, otherwise you were, you were back in the day when you had to, to find them in

[24:32] a theater and nothing replayed after it first came out.

[24:36] I remember driving hours to watch a, a re-release of 20,000 Ligs Under the Sea.

[24:44] The, the, the, the, the, the, the James Mason Disney movie.

[24:49] I mean, now you have a plethora and now there's so much out there.

[24:53] Who the hell knows even what it is.

[24:55] But, you know, I mean, back and back when I was growing up, it was, it was hell to find

[25:00] the movies you love.

[25:02] Uh, but anyway, so Fright Night, uh, I, I, I, I couldn't sell it.

[25:07] I wrote Cloak and Dagger instead, which I'm also in love with and very proud of, but it,

[25:13] it never got, it never has grown to be as enormous.

[25:19] I think my most loved movie is Fright Night.

[25:22] But, you know, there, there, the other, all, almost everything has, has Phantom.

[25:27] Thinner is coming back now.

[25:29] Yeah.

[25:30] You know?

[25:31] And, and that was a failure when it came out.

[25:34] The, uh, so, you know, I mean, I think one of the lessons is if you, if you, if you hang

[25:40] around long enough, there are some pleasant surprises in store for you, maybe.

[25:46] You know, but here I am and I'm thrilled to be talking about, about these movies and I love

[25:50] Cloak and Dagger and I love, I, I love all of them, even the terrible ones.

[25:56] But I especially love Fright Night.

[25:59] Yeah.

[25:59] Let's not forget Child, let's not forget Child's Play.

[26:02] Yeah.

[26:02] Never forget Child's Play.

[26:03] Child's Play is, is big.

Dan McCoy

[26:05] Yeah.

[26:05] I want to ask actually about that because there's like a coziness to like Fright Night and a coziness

[26:09] to a lot of your other horror movies that like I enjoy because it's, I don't know, there's

[26:15] like this sort of warmth, but like Child's Play, I'm not saying it doesn't, it's not warm,

[26:20] but it's like meaner.

[26:22] It's a mean, it's a meaner movie.

[26:23] That doll is very mean, Dan.

[26:25] Yeah.

[26:26] Legitimately.

Stuart Wellington

[26:27] Well, I.

[26:28] He's not a good guy.

S3

[26:30] Yeah.

[26:32] Well, I was, I deliberately set out to make the scariest movie I could, but at the same

[26:38] time I put some huge laughs in there.

[26:40] Yeah.

[26:41] You know, you know, to break it, but no, the, the, it was, it was the quintessential killer

[26:47] doll movie.

[26:48] I don't think there'd been a killer doll movie before that.

[26:52] So it was, you know, it was, it was kicking, kicking down the, can you think at one, Stuart?

[26:58] I'm like, was there a Twilight Zone episode?

Stuart Wellington

[27:00] I'm trying to remember.

Elliott Kalan

[27:01] But not a movie.

[27:02] There's the Talking Tina.

[27:03] Talking Tina.

[27:04] Yeah.

[27:05] Yeah.

[27:05] And there's, there's an old movie called Dead of Night.

[27:09] Dead of Night.

[27:09] Yeah.

[27:09] And Dead of Night had a, had a, was it a doll or was it a ventriloquist dummy in Dead of

[27:13] Night?

[27:13] I can't remember.

S3

[27:14] It was a ventriloquist in Dead of Night.

[27:16] Yeah.

[27:16] And don't, and don't forget magic.

Elliott Kalan

[27:20] Yes.

[27:20] Magic.

[27:20] Yeah.

[27:21] But they, they, in magic, I was, magic frustrates me because they played ambiguous, whether it's

[27:26] him or whether it's the, whether it's the dummy or, and I did.

[27:30] Magic.

S3

[27:30] Magic was a failure.

Elliott Kalan

[27:32] Yes.

[27:32] I was, I, this is something, this is something I think about frequently now is I heard somewhere,

[27:38] I forget where, that they wanted Gene Wilder to play that role originally instead of Anthony

[27:42] Hopkins.

[27:42] And I just thought about what a different movie that would have been with Gene Wilder,

[27:45] how, how much more believable the ventriloquist would be as someone that a woman would want

[27:49] to fall in love with than Anthony Hopkins version of the character who's, who's, and also the,

[27:54] I was like, oh, he might've been funny if Gene Wilder did it.

[27:56] That's one of the things the movie is missing is he's not very funny.

[27:59] But anyway, we don't, you know, yet magic is not a movie we need to, we need to talk about

[28:04] child's play.

[28:06] Oh, that's funny.

[28:08] Right.

S3

[28:08] Well, I mean, I mean, I, I, I, well, I came up with a premise.

[28:14] It was a original script by Dan Mancini, but what it did, it didn't present the opportunities

[28:22] that I wanted for visual set pieces.

[28:25] Visual set pieces are defined by Alfred Hitchcock as where the story moves forward with a minimal

[28:31] amount of dialogue.

[28:33] And I think I learned so much by making Psycho 2 because Richard Franklin had me study.

[28:41] We ran every Hitchcock movie starting with the silence, Richard and I, and we pulled out

[28:47] those, those, those moments, the shots in those movies where Hitchcock scared the living

[28:53] hell out of Europe or, or, or raised a suspense.

[28:57] And what I did in child's play, if you think about it, the opening scene, you see Brad Dourif

[29:05] and you see him die and put his, his evil soul into a doll.

[29:10] And then you never see Brad again.

[29:13] Okay.

[29:14] But that, then you, the audience knows that that doll is murderous.

[29:21] But everything, but the characters in the movie, the mother and the little boy, they don't

[29:29] know.

[29:30] And that's the, that's the Hitchcockian definition of suspense for the audience.

Elliott Kalan

[29:37] You wanted the audience to know that Chucky was, was a killer.

[29:41] You didn't want to play that game of, is it the doll or is it not the doll?

[29:45] You want it to be the suspense of knowing that Chucky is dangerous and seeing the family

[29:49] dealing with it.

[29:50] I think that's, that's such a, that's such a, that's such the better way to do it.

[29:53] If you want to, if you see, if you watch an evil doll movie, you want to know the doll's

[29:56] evil.

Dan McCoy

[29:56] It's, it, it reminds me, you know, you talk about Hitchcock.

[30:00] It reminds me of that Hitchcock story about how he said, like a bomb blowing up is a surprise,

[30:06] but if you know there's a bomb.

[30:07] That's exactly it.

S3

[30:10] Yeah.

[30:11] That's what, that's the premise that I use.

Dan McCoy

[30:15] Yeah.

[30:15] The kid knows there's a bomb, but no one else knows there's a bomb.

Stuart Wellington

[30:19] And the audience knows it's a bomb.

[30:21] Yeah.

[30:22] Yeah.

[30:22] Like you said, if you buy a ticket to a killer doll movie, you don't want the movie to be

[30:27] like, but is it a killer doll?

[30:30] No.

[30:30] Yeah.

[30:30] You don't know there's a killer doll running around.

[30:31] Don't trick me like I'm an idiot.

Elliott Kalan

[30:33] Yeah.

[30:33] You want to see a doll pick up a knife and stab people with it.

[30:35] You don't, you don't want to have it be a question.

[30:37] Yeah.

S3

[30:38] Well, you did, you did after Child's Play, before Child's Play, I can't think, I can't

[30:43] think of an example that ever did it.

[30:45] Yeah.

[30:46] You know?

[30:47] So I mean, really, Chucky may be the last horror icon that was created in all of our generation,

[30:55] you know?

[30:56] He definitely.

[30:57] I mean, Scream Ghostface may be a little bit, but not.

Elliott Kalan

[31:00] But Ghostface is kind of like a mask in search of a character to wear it, whereas Chucky fits

[31:06] so well with like Jason and Freddy and Norman Bates of like these characters where you really

[31:11] are interested in the character and you want to see, you want to see what they're going

[31:15] to do and what's going to happen to them as opposed to, as opposed to wondering who's

[31:21] behind the mask this time.

[31:22] You're like, what's Chucky going to do now?

[31:24] Like, what's he up to?

Dan McCoy

[31:26] And Dorf is still doing the voice and Don Mancini is still doing, so there's a consistency

[31:30] of character too there that doesn't exist.

[31:33] Is Dorf still doing it?

[31:35] Yeah, he's up for the show.

[31:38] I think in large part because his daughter is on Chucky.

[31:42] Yeah, that is a large part.

S3

[31:43] He lives up in Woodstock, New York.

[31:46] And I mean, he's a brilliant actor.

[31:52] And I'm thrilled that I've given him a career that's carried him into his dotage, you know?

[31:58] Yeah, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[31:59] I mean, that's a great way to retire.

Dan McCoy

[32:01] I mean, it's still an amazing voice performance too.

[32:04] He's great.

S3

[32:06] Also, credit to Don Mancini's taken it in places that I never would have thought of.

[32:10] Yeah.

[32:11] But he's kept it going for 40 years.

[32:13] Yeah.

[32:14] Or 38 years or whatever.

[32:16] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[32:20] City pop to me is like a feeling.

S5

[32:23] City pop is beautiful music.

Elliott Kalan

[32:25] It's music that makes me emotional.

S5

[32:27] There's so many different sounds that fall into the city pop category.

Dan McCoy

[32:31] It just feels very home to me.

S5

[32:34] We're just about wrapped on our inaugural season of Primer.

[32:37] If you didn't know, Primer is a new podcast that explores music from outside the English-speaking world.

[32:42] And Vulture called us one of the best podcasts of the year.

[32:45] Our first season covered Japanese city pop, and you just heard a few of our past guests share what the genre means to them.

[32:51] Learn more about the world of city pop and listen to some cool tunes.

[32:54] And if you like what we're doing, you can make a one-time contribution and help us reach our goal to produce a second season about a new genre.

[33:01] Support Primer over at MaximumFun.org slash Primer.

[33:07] Throughout history, sirens have captured men's attention, enticed men with their feminine wiles, and fulfilled men's primal needs.

[33:14] The sirens allure persists.

[33:15] They have not.

[33:16] Unless the primal need is I need to be smashed on the rocks.

[33:20] Yeah.

[33:21] Smash me.

[33:22] Smash me, mama.

[33:28] The sirens allure persists.

[33:30] Why do we do this to ourselves?

[33:32] Strand me, baby.

[33:33] Strand me, mom.

[33:34] Strand me, baby.

[33:35] So, yeah, this is My Brother, My Brother and Me from Maximum Fun on Mondays.

[33:39] It's just like that.

[33:41] It's just like that, but more of it.

[33:44] There's more of that.

Dan McCoy

[33:50] Hey, it's Dan here to tell you that yesterday,

[33:53] tickets went on sale for Three Men and a Hallie, which is our next streaming show.

[34:00] It's once again beautifully shot and edited by the good folks at StagePilot.

[34:05] And this is our first regular format streaming show featuring Hallie Haglund, your favorite and ours.

[34:13] Your first chance to see her in one of these live show tapings.

[34:18] The show debuts on Sunday, August 4th.

[34:21] And you can get tickets for that show by heading to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

Stuart Wellington

[34:28] Now, I'm kind of dying to ask, but in Fright Night, especially near the end, there's a couple of special effects sequences.

[34:37] Both the werewolf, like evil's wolf transformation sequence.

[34:42] And then when the familiar character melts, there are these really long kind of lingering sequences that are both like kind of ridiculous and over the top.

[34:53] But they really take their time.

[34:54] And they're both like beautiful and sad.

[34:58] How did those come about?

[34:59] Was that a thing that was planned?

[35:01] Or was that something that like came out of working with the special effects team?

S3

[35:06] No, that was written.

[35:08] I mean, but I did make discoveries along the way.

[35:12] Amy Sharkmouth, I came up with while we were shooting.

[35:16] Because I saw an opportunity to really scare the hell out of the audience.

[35:21] But Billy Cole's melting, I had written.

[35:25] But I didn't know how to do any of that.

[35:27] The credit goes to Richard Edlin and Randy Cook and Steve Johnson, the effects people.

[35:36] I had a brilliant effects crew on Fright Night.

[35:40] And Fright Night was the throwaway movie that year for Columbia.

[35:45] I was so hot as a writer because of the success of Psycho 2 that they thought they'd take a chance at an original script that I wrote.

[35:58] And they had this slot.

[35:59] And they didn't give me any money.

[36:01] I think they did it for $7 or $8 million.

[36:04] And they wanted to keep the Ghostbusters crew on, employed, because they thought they were going to do an immediate sequel to Ghostbusters.

[36:13] And so I got the best effects crew in Hollywood in Richard Edlin, Steve Johnson, and Randy Cook.

[36:21] And they did brilliantly.

[36:23] I wrote those things.

[36:25] But I didn't have a clue how to do them.

[36:28] I mean, I had no idea how to throw Jerry Dandridge off the balcony and have him turn into a bat on the way down.

[36:35] That was Richard Edlin.

Elliott Kalan

[36:37] That's amazing that Ghostbusters 2's loss was your game.

[36:42] Yeah, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[36:45] So, do you have any other, like, are there any other particular stories from the Fright Night production that you haven't shared or you think fans would love to hear about?

[36:56] Well, I don't know.

S3

[36:57] I hinted at one that we were, I was blocking the scene in the basement on a Friday night.

[37:04] And Rami comes down the stairway as Charlie and Roddy are looking for Jerry's coffin.

[37:11] And he pulled out the cross and she turns away and says, oh, Charlie, you promised you wouldn't let this happen.

[37:19] And then we called it a night because we'd run out of time.

[37:23] And I said, wait a minute.

[37:24] Wait a minute.

[37:25] When she does the turn and the reveal, if she comes around with a horrible face, like a mouth full of teeth, we would scare the hell out of the audience.

[37:35] And I told Steve Johnson and he and Randy put together the shark's mouth over the weekend.

[37:42] Oh, wow.

[37:42] Awesome.

[37:43] Yeah.

[37:44] And then because he thought that it was, he thought it wasn't up to the standard, Steve Johnson promised me that except for a brief cut, we'll never see it again.

[37:54] And I said, okay, it's over after that.

[37:58] Yeah, I agree.

[37:59] And he got it to me on Monday and we shot the scene and I put it in the movie.

[38:03] And it was the universal scream from the audience when we played it.

[38:09] And then it ended up on the one sheet.

[38:13] So it's probably the most famous visual from Fright Night if Steve Johnson still rips me about it.

[38:22] It's so funny.

Stuart Wellington

[38:24] Yeah, I feel like between that and the shot of like evil with the cross burned on his forehead, those are the two that really like come to mind immediately.

[38:32] Yeah.

[38:33] Now, it was a fairly small budget, but it had a pretty big return.

[38:39] It was a big success for its budget, right?

S3

[38:42] It was the second biggest horror movie that year after the first sequel to Nightmare on Elm Street.

[38:51] Wow.

[38:52] That's how big Fright Night was.

[38:54] And they were going to do a sequel, too.

[38:58] And they fired Guy McElwain, who'd given the go ahead, who'd been head of Columbia, and brought in an Englishman called David Putnam.

[39:10] And David Putnam only did prestige movies like Chariots of Fire.

[39:16] And he threw me out.

[39:19] Columbia.

[39:20] Wow.

[39:20] Yeah, yeah.

[39:21] He looked down on horror.

[39:24] He didn't want to be associated with horror.

[39:27] And he threw me out.

[39:28] And that's how I ended up doing Fatal Beauty and so much of my career.

[39:33] There was such an anti-horror attitude in Hollywood in those years that it affected me and influenced me.

[39:44] And I was an idiot.

[39:46] I should have stayed and just done as many great horror scripts as I could.

[39:52] I was offered one of the sequels to Nightmare on Elm Street.

[39:56] And like an idiot, I turned it down.

[39:58] You know?

Stuart Wellington

[39:59] Were there any other, like, horror passion projects you wish you'd gotten to do during that time, but just weren't able to get off the ground due to the climate?

S3

[40:09] Boy, that's a good question.

[40:11] Hmm.

[40:12] Yeah.

[40:13] I have one called The God Game, which I'm working on right now.

[40:17] Oh, awesome.

[40:18] It goes to show you that projects never die.

[40:22] You may, but the projects never do.

[40:26] You know?

[40:26] Yeah.

[40:26] I wrote a 100-page treatment in 1977 with Stuart Stern.

[40:35] Who was Stuart Stern?

[40:37] Stuart was one of the three or four biggest scriptwriters in Hollywood.

[40:42] He wrote a little movie called Rebel Without a Cause.

[40:46] Okay.

[40:47] Okay.

[40:48] And he mentored me and was very, very kind to me.

[40:52] And he passed, I think, back around 2012.

[40:56] But, I mean, so I'm going back and I'm looking at those scripts that I never, that for one reason or another I couldn't get done or I had development deals on that fell by the wayside.

[41:11] And that's sort of how I'm spending my time right now.

[41:15] And also, you know, I mean, I'm giving myself a plug, but we have the Fright Night podcast.

[41:26] How did the-

[41:27] The second act just dropped today.

Stuart Wellington

[41:31] Oh, so how did that come about?

[41:33] Can you talk a little bit about how the Fright Night podcast came to be?

S3

[41:38] Yeah, there were, the guys at Manifest Media who do table reads asked me to comment as a voice actor on a horror segment.

[41:49] Oh, fun.

[41:49] And, you know, and I mean, you know, I mean, I thought, well, yeah, I'll do that.

[41:56] But I was curious about podcasts.

[41:59] Okay.

[42:00] Movies right now, as you guys know, are in a very difficult transition period and transitioning to what the, I don't know what the hell.

[42:08] You know, I go watch 70 millimeter movies and I saw Dune 2 and I saw Furioso and every one of them had 25, 30 minutes of previews and every preview was a sequel.

[42:23] Okay.

[42:24] There wasn't one original story there on every time.

[42:30] So that's where we are in Hollywood right now.

[42:33] And yet the area that seems to be growing and is interesting was, is dramatic podcasts, which I guess is a way it's saying it's radio coming on, but with much better sound and Foley and sound effects.

[42:50] And so I was curious about the genre.

[42:52] So I went and I did this thing for table read, Jack Levy and Mark Nell.

[42:57] And I thought it was, it was, it was an interesting experience.

[43:04] The, the, the, the, the, the, the, the studio where it took place was top grade.

[43:09] And I said, well, if you really want to do something, I happen to own the literary dramatic and, and, and, and dramatic and audio rights to an original script.

[43:23] And I wrote called fright night.

[43:25] Let's do fright night as, as, as, as, as a, as a, as a, as a podcast.

[43:31] And they went for it and we brought the original cast out.

[43:36] We flew them in from all over America, you know, two of them were here, but five of them weren't.

[43:43] And then I went and I, I got, I got some really terrific voice stars.

[43:51] I got Rosario Dawson to come in.

[43:53] Oh, wow.

[43:54] Play a number of the different female parts.

[43:57] And I got Mark Hamill to come in to replace Roddy McDowell as Peter Vincent.

[44:05] Yeah.

[44:05] He's, he's great.

[44:07] He's.

[44:07] I mean, so I mean, so you have Chris Sarandon in there playing Jerry Dandridge.

[44:12] So you have a, yeah, that, yeah, that's, that's nightmare before Christmas.

[44:16] You know, he's John.

[44:17] Yeah.

[44:18] So, I mean, you have a hell of a cast on this damn thing.

[44:22] And, uh, we came out with the first act last week and we, we, we, we were in, in, in Spotify's top 100 podcasts.

[44:34] We were 91.

[44:35] Oh, awesome.

[44:36] And then, yeah, then on Monday we had gone to be number one on, uh, on Apple podcasts and Apple and, and, and, uh, uh, act two of, of, of, of, of, of Fright Night, the, the, the, the, the original cast reading, uh, dropped today.

[44:55] And you got the third act a week from today.

[44:58] And the reception has been mind blowing.

[45:01] And also the, the, the, the, here's the, here's the, the, the power of, uh, of using established, uh, IP.

[45:12] Uh-huh.

[45:13] Which I'm usually very critical of because it's, it's, it's, it's, it's killed, you know, originality.

[45:19] Yeah.

[45:19] And it's, it's also killed the star system.

[45:23] But the one piece of original IP that I happened to own is mine.

[45:28] Yeah.

[45:29] And so when we came out with a press release on, on, on, on, on Fright Night, original cast reading and then, and Mark Hamill and everything, the, the, the, the, the, the media, how deep the media picked it up was just amazing.

[45:47] And I mean, I don't know, fellas, this isn't how many people read the press releases or listened to the podcast about it, but I saw figures, it, it, it had the possibility of reaching over 400 million people.

[46:03] Wow.

[46:04] Because so many outlets picked it up because of the, of the brand names and because of the stars involved.

[46:11] And my mouth fell open.

Stuart Wellington

[46:13] But that's gotta be satisfying that to see something that you put so much love into all those years ago is get, is still getting that kind of a reception.

S3

[46:24] I am pinching myself, Stuart.

[46:26] I mean, I, you know, no, I mean, it totally unexpected.

[46:30] Yeah.

[46:30] And it, it is the best feeling I've ever had, you know, in terms of, I feel like I've really accomplished something, you know, and for years I was totally unaware of all this.

[46:42] And it was just growing, you know, it was growing out there.

[46:46] Like you talked about class of 84, you know, the class of 84 is, I think it's, it's just terrific, you know, exploitation movie.

[46:58] The, and that was the success when it came out, but it was, you know, if you don't have the critics commenting on it, it doesn't get in the popular culture.

[47:08] You know, the, you know, the, and then, I mean, I mean, thinner was not a success, but thinner now seems to be growing in terms of at least audience awareness.

[47:21] And I am in love with Cloak and Dagger.

[47:24] Yeah.

[47:25] And I hope that, I hope that Tarantino keeps running it.

Stuart Wellington

[47:29] Yeah.

S3

[47:30] So, I mean, I mean, you know, yeah.

[47:32] So, yeah, so in my, in my semi-retirement here, it's, it's been amazingly, amazingly gratifying.

[47:40] And I want to thank the audience out there and you guys too for talking to me.

Elliott Kalan

[47:44] Yeah.

[47:44] Of course, you had to, you had, I'm going to say that it was all foresight and all planning that you had the foresight and planning too, that you, you made these movies that spoke so, so strongly and so viscerally to young people watching them.

[47:58] And as those people grew up, they couldn't forget them.

[48:01] You know, I remember seeing Class of 1984 and it already, it was already a movie that had been out for a little while.

[48:06] And I was seeing it on TV when I was a teenager and it just kind of like, it was like being punched in the face by a movie.

[48:11] And I just couldn't forget it after that.

[48:14] And so that you made these movies that just hit young people so, so hard.

[48:18] And so in such exciting ways that it stuck with us, you know, until we became old men that can force younger people than us to watch the movies we liked when we were young.

S3

[48:29] Well, a big, a big thanks to Mark Lester who produced and directed it.

[48:33] I think it's his best movie.

[48:35] He probably doesn't.

[48:36] But he didn't do it.

[48:40] Dramatically that works.

[48:42] And there's a stunning performance in Class of 84 by Roddy McDowell.

[48:45] Yes.

[48:46] Yeah.

[48:46] As the teacher.

[48:47] And that was one of the big reasons that I, I knew he could move you as well as dramatically involve you.

[48:54] But I knew he could, I knew he could play that scene with Charlie Brewster where Charlie's begging him to come and save Amy.

[49:03] And Peter's saying, I just can't.

[49:06] I'm too terrified.

[49:07] And Roddy moves you to tears.

[49:10] Yeah.

[49:11] And Mark Hamill does the same thing in the cast reading.

[49:14] Mm-hmm.

[49:15] You know, it's just, you know.

[49:17] Wonderful.

[49:18] It's wonderful.

Stuart Wellington

[49:20] Yeah.

[49:20] So, uh, for the, for the, uh, Fright Night cast, uh, original cast reading, that's available on all podcast platforms, right?

[49:29] And the third act.

[49:30] All, all, all.

[49:30] Yeah, the, uh, the second one just dropped today, which will be, you know, a while, a while ago from when this episode drops.

Elliott Kalan

[49:37] By the time this episode comes out, I think all the parts will be out by then, or part three will be about to come out.

[49:42] So that's a treat.

[49:43] That's great for everybody.

S3

[49:44] Well, that'd be great if you can watch one, two, and three at the same time.

[49:49] That's perfect.

[49:49] Because the, the, the, the, the script as a reading just involves you more and more as it goes along.

[49:56] Because the stakes keep rising.

Stuart Wellington

[49:58] And did you, did you have to do, uh, did you have to do much, uh, did you tweak the script at all before the reading?

[50:03] Or is it just straight from the, straight from the page from when you wrote it years ago?

S3

[50:07] No, I, what I did was I took out a lot of the narration.

[50:12] Okay.

[50:12] So I kept the drama moving along.

[50:15] That makes sense.

[50:16] Yeah.

[50:16] And I've got, I've got, I wrote a, I wrote a very long piece called Fright Night Resurrection about all of them getting together 30 years later.

[50:25] And I'm hoping that I can get sponsorship for that so we can do that as a podcast off of the success.

[50:32] Oh, cool.

[50:32] That'd be so cool.

[50:33] For the original cast reading.

[50:34] Oh, I'd love to do that.

[50:36] I'd love to do that.

[50:38] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[50:38] Well, it sounds like you have a good start.

[50:40] You have a good foot in the door for this kind of, uh, this kind of thing.

[50:44] Yeah.

S3

[50:44] Well, I may have found a different way to get out there.

Stuart Wellington

[50:48] Yeah.

S3

[50:48] You know, other than, I, I, I shouldn't be saying this, but I am saying it.

[50:53] I'm not doing, I'm not doing 12 to 14 hour days anymore.

[50:59] I mean, I don't recommend it.

[51:01] No.

[51:01] Yeah.

[51:02] No.

[51:02] And turnarounds because so much of horror is night.

[51:05] You're always going from, you're always ending up, uh, finishing work on Saturday morning

[51:10] at dawn and then starting out on dawn on Monday morning again, doing days.

[51:16] And if you do that for 40 or 50 days, they got, you got to need a stretcher to carry out.

[51:22] Yeah.

[51:22] So podcasts, you know, are just wonderful if I can get it going at this time of my life.

[51:30] Yeah.

[51:30] And still be, and still be creative and get my voice out there.

[51:34] I'm in love with this stuff, you know?

Stuart Wellington

[51:37] Yeah, yeah.

[51:38] Yeah, yeah.

[51:38] Like, I think that's one of the things that I think hits, uh, so like, it's so true with

[51:44] your work is that you're clearly a fan.

[51:47] And I feel like that comes through.

[51:49] I think it really comes through.

[51:50] And I think that's what people connect with.

S3

[51:52] Well, that's what Fright Night is.

[51:54] It's the ultimate fan letter to horror.

Stuart Wellington

S3

[51:58] Classical horror.

Stuart Wellington

[52:00] So, Tom, do you have anything else you would like to plug before we wrap up?

S3

[52:06] Uh, uh, let's see.

[52:08] Yeah, I have, I have books up on, uh, on Amazon.

[52:13] I think they're, uh, because of the other Tom Holland, Tom Holland's become like, Tom Holland's

[52:18] become like Dick Smith, you know?

[52:20] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[52:20] You've got two other Tom Hollands, at least, that you're competing with in the public square.

[52:24] Yeah.

S3

[52:25] Yeah.

[52:25] Now they're called, now I'm under Tom L. Holland.

[52:28] Congratulations on your relationship with Zendaya, by the way.

Dan McCoy

[52:32] Dan, no, Dan.

[52:33] I hate to break with you.

Elliott Kalan

[52:35] Very funny, very funny.

S3

[52:40] Anyway, anyway, you can find my books.

[52:43] You know, I mean, you can find, I've, I've written, I've written a novel called The Notch.

[52:47] I have a collection of short stories called Untold Tales or Twisted Tales.

[52:52] I can find them all on Amazon.

[52:54] Great.

[52:55] Anyway, please look.

[52:57] Uh, anything else, I have a website called terrortime.shop.

[53:01] Okay.

[53:02] If you, if you, if you, if you like items, look like items.

[53:04] And, uh, I, this has been great fun.

Stuart Wellington

[53:08] Great fun, fellas.

[53:09] Yeah, we'll put a, we'll put a link in the show notes to, uh, to that site.

[53:12] Yeah, please.

[53:13] Uh, yeah, this is so much fun.

[53:14] Um, it's so great that you, uh, were able to join us and talk about one of our, you know,

[53:18] some of our favorite movies.

[53:20] Yeah.

[53:21] Uh, and give us some insight into the making of them.

[53:23] Uh, for The Flophouse, I've been Stuart Wellington.

[53:26] I've been Dan McCoy.

Elliott Kalan

[53:28] And I'm Elliot Kalin.

[53:29] And joining us was?

S3

[53:31] I'm, I'm Tom Holland.

[53:32] God bless you and thank you all.

[53:35] Go ahead.

[53:35] Thank you.

Stuart Wellington

[53:36] Okay, bye.

[53:38] Thank you.

[53:44] Maximum Fun.

S5

[53:44] A worker-owned network.

[53:46] Of artist-owned shows.

[53:48] Supported.

[53:49] Directly.

[53:50] By you.

FH Mini 107 - A Talk with Tom Holland!

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