The Mandalorian and Grogu, with Will Hines

Dan McCoy

[0:00] On this episode, we discuss The Mandalorian and Grogu.

Elliott Kalan

[0:04] Because Hollywood said, what if the movie Dutch was Star Wars?

[0:10] Yeah.

[0:30] Hey, everyone, and welcome to The Flophouse.

Dan McCoy

[0:36] I'm Dan McCoy.

Elliott Kalan

[0:37] I'm Stuart Wellington.

[0:39] My name is Elliot Kalin.

[0:40] And before we get into the laughs and the giggles and the ribald jackanapes,

[0:45] I wanted to mention that we have a special guest with us today.

[0:48] Returning to the podcast, we have one of our favorite guests,

[0:52] even though we haven't had him on in a while.

[0:54] After like a decade's absence.

S3

[0:56] This is actor, improviser, author of the book,

Elliott Kalan

[1:01] How to Be the Greatest Improviser on Earth, which is a great book.

[1:03] I genuinely recommend it.

[1:04] Co-host of the podcast, Screw It, We're Just Gonna Talk About Comics,

[1:07] one of my two favorite comics podcasts.

[1:08] And the podcast, Screw It, We're Just Gonna Talk About the Beatles,

[1:10] my favorite Beatles podcast.

[1:12] We have joining us, Mr. Will Hines.

[1:14] Will, thank you so much for being with us today.

S3

[1:16] Every 15 years, I'm going to be on this show.

Elliott Kalan

[1:19] It's just like, there was a period in Spider-Man comics

[1:23] where every 15 issues, Venom would show up.

[1:25] You're our Venom, except it's years.

Dan McCoy

[1:26] Will is the Haley's Comet of the podcast.

Stuart Wellington

[1:31] Will, what was the movie on the episode that you were on before?

[1:35] Swing Vote.

[1:35] Swing Vote, yeah.

[1:36] That was an episode I was not on.

[1:39] Okay.

[1:39] You were not on it, yeah.

[1:40] I was just going to chalk everything up to a lifetime of drinking too much

[1:45] for my memory being bad.

Elliott Kalan

[1:47] That's why we haven't had, Stuart has been, his attendance record has been too good since then.

[1:51] We haven't had a need to break.

[1:53] We have a case that says, break in case of Stuart absence, and Will is in that case.

[1:57] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[1:58] And the funny thing is, I'm recording today with strep throat.

[2:03] So there's, I mean, what could stop me?

S3

[2:05] Nature wanted you to not be here.

[2:08] Yeah.

[2:08] The universe was fighting for the balance to be restored, and you did not be here and me.

[2:13] But Stuart found a way, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[2:13] No, Stuart heard that Will was going to be on our place, and he goes,

[2:15] no, I'll be there.

Dan McCoy

[2:18] I want to talk about comics for a change.

[2:22] Stuart, it's funny you weren't there too, because that was like an early Paul Schrader riff.

[2:27] That's right.

[2:27] While you were absent.

[2:29] Writer, director of Heart Peeps.

[2:31] Yeah, I know.

[2:32] It's the episode that gave us Chopin Goatables, I remember.

[2:35] Yeah, that's a great episode.

Elliott Kalan

[2:36] We should have Will on more often.

S3

[2:38] That was a great episode.

[2:39] You guys are really funny when I'm on.

[2:41] Yeah.

[2:42] I'm like, I don't know, I'm like a bass player, I guess.

[2:45] Wow, our guitar solos were good when you were here.

[2:47] Come back again.

Elliott Kalan

[2:48] This is going to sound like an insult when I mean it to be a compliment.

[2:52] I love it.

[2:52] Many have talked about how the Marx Brothers were better when Zeppo was with them,

[2:56] even though he seemingly does nothing, you know?

S3

[2:58] Yes.

[2:59] I'm proud to be the Zeppo of the Flophouse.

[3:01] I would love it.

[3:02] I truly would put it on my business card, which I just got business cards for the first time,

[3:07] and just confuse everybody.

[3:09] Hi, I'm Will Hines.

[3:10] I'm Zeppo of the Flophouse.

Stuart Wellington

[3:11] Traveling back in time or something?

[3:13] Yeah, I got to go door-to-door.

[3:15] Selling vacuum cleaners.

[3:16] They're so –

Dan McCoy

[3:17] It's like, what do you do with these things?

[3:18] I remember like I got – we got, you know, daily show business cards.

[3:22] I remember being like excited.

[3:24] I got a daily show business card, and like there was like this huge box of them,

[3:27] and I was finding them for years afterwards because I didn't do anything with them.

Elliott Kalan

[3:32] When I struck out on my own, I ordered business cards, and I still have almost all of them.

[3:36] Yeah.

S3

[3:37] I got them because I operate an improv theater in Los Angeles.

[3:42] Not to big dog, you guys.

[3:43] Yeah, you do.

[3:43] But it's like a physical space, and our box office staff once accidentally threw the trash

[3:49] out in the wrong dumpster out back.

[3:52] We threw it out in the back of this beauty supply store, and they were so mad at us that

[3:57] the landlord of our – because we're in like a shopping center – called me and was like,

[4:01] hey, they're really upset about whatever – you guys put too much garbage in their dumpster,

[4:05] and they're mad at you.

[4:06] And so I ordered business cards just to go over to the beauty supply store and hand them one

[4:12] and say, I'm so sorry that happened.

[4:14] Call me if there's ever any trouble.

[4:16] And so I ordered 1,000 business cards to use one.

[4:20] Classy.

[4:21] Because you can't buy business cards in units of less than like a million.

[4:25] You're not allowed to get just like 10 cards.

Elliott Kalan

[4:28] But someday when you break into the corporate improv market in Japan,

[4:32] you're going to be glad you had those business cards.

[4:34] Oh, yeah.

[4:35] Very elaborate trade-offs of those cards.

S3

[4:37] About just the right amount just so it's polite and hand over a business card.

Elliott Kalan

[4:41] They call that yes anding.

[4:42] It's you bow as well, but you and it.

[4:43] You bow a little bit more than the other person.

Dan McCoy

[4:46] Oddly enough, though, this is not a business card podcast.

[4:49] This is a podcast –

[4:50] Why not?

[4:50] It could be.

[4:51] Where we watch a movie that was either a flop critically or commercially.

[4:56] This is an unusual case.

[4:59] I would say –

[4:59] I'm going to add a corollary to that.

[5:01] Sometimes we just want to talk about a specific movie.

Stuart Wellington

[5:03] Let me finish my sentence.

[5:05] Okay, sure.

[5:05] This is the –

Dan McCoy

[5:06] Let's see where Dan's going.

Stuart Wellington

[5:08] Maybe it takes us in different directions.

Dan McCoy

[5:10] This had the lowest opening of a Star Wars picture.

[5:14] So – or a live action one.

[5:18] I don't know what cartoon ones got.

Elliott Kalan

[5:21] I think there have been no cartoon theatrically released Star Wars films.

[5:24] Oh, there's Clone Wars.

Dan McCoy

[5:25] That was in theaters.

[5:26] That was a TV show, right?

Elliott Kalan

[5:27] Yeah, but there was – no, there was a movie.

[5:28] It was an animated Clone Wars movie?

Dan McCoy

[5:30] They did it – they absolutely did a Clone Wars release in the theaters.

[5:34] Google, tell me if he's right.

[5:36] This is a fascinating argument.

[5:37] But my point is in Star Wars terms –

[5:41] Oh, you're right.

[5:42] Star Wars The Clone Wars 2008.

[5:43] I knew I was right.

[5:44] I knew I was right from the beginning.

[5:48] This is the patented Fluff House, you know, barely veiled hostility plus can't get the show started that you all tune in for.

[5:58] What was I saying?

[6:00] You said this was the lowest opening of a live action Star Wars film.

[6:02] On a Star Wars metric and has had some mixed reviews.

[6:06] And, yeah, we just wanted to talk about it as Elliot said.

Stuart Wellington

[6:10] Now, Star Wars movies rarely get all like stellar reviews, right?

[6:15] I feel like generally they're pretty mixed.

Elliott Kalan

[6:18] With the exception of –

[6:19] New ones.

Stuart Wellington

[6:20] New ones, sure.

Elliott Kalan

[6:21] I mean even the first ones got mixed reviews.

[6:23] But that was more a case of like people didn't really know what they were dealing with to a certain extent.

[6:28] But it's true that – I mean often big – often entertainment popcorn movies, even when they're great, don't always get great reviews.

[6:36] You know, because reviewers often they just don't know – it feels like it's relatively recently in the life of film reviewing that they have understood that there's a metric for movies that are not trying to be high art.

[6:47] But instead are just trying to entertain and recognizing that as a worthwhile achievement.

[6:51] That being said, this one I think got particularly kind of – there were a lot of reviews I saw where it was like the reviewers almost felt like it's going to be too obvious if I say I didn't like this movie.

[7:03] So I have to find a way to say that I didn't like it that doesn't feel like I'm just dumping on it because it is a movie based on a television show based on another movie.

Dan McCoy

[7:12] I also think that, like, to some degree – I mean this is much lesser than what you said.

[7:18] But like to some degree I feel like the art form of movies is now old enough that people have seen enough movies that were like, oh, this was just made for entertainment.

[7:29] Like, oh, yes, of course, like these things that we think of as established classics, like many of them were light entertainment.

[7:38] Like we can appreciate craft in a way that maybe they were averse to when it was like, okay, this is a new art form.

[7:44] We have to hold it to – like, I don't know.

[7:47] I'm just making stuff up now.

[7:49] But I think there's something in that.

S3

[7:51] I'm sure you guys have said this and said it better, so please correct me.

[7:54] But I feel like the Star Wars movie franchise has got to be the, like, fewest number of actually good movies proportional to its, like, real estate in the culture.

[8:08] You know what?

[8:09] We haven't said that.

[8:10] Real estate in culture I think is an important point.

[8:12] Yes, yeah.

[8:13] Like just like how much it occupies – everybody knows Star Wars, how, like, ubiquitous it is, how beloved it is, how powerful it is, how, like, truly iconic in a way that few movie franchises could ever hope to be.

[8:27] And yet almost all of the movies are mid or bad.

Elliott Kalan

[8:32] I think – well, I think it's because you have, like – I mean, you're right because it's one of the few movies that has, like, influenced – where people are like, yeah, I'll put Jedi down as my religion.

[8:42] You know, it's rare that a movie starts a religion.

[8:44] Yes, yes.

Elliott Kalan

[8:44] Right.

[8:44] But the – you're right.

[8:46] I think it's because what Star Wars really is is you have the original trilogy of movies, which are pretty great.

[8:53] Pretty great.

[8:53] Return of the Jedi is, like, a little bit of a drop.

[8:55] Like, they're still really great.

[8:57] And then you have people trying to recapture that spirit for decades now.

[9:02] Yeah.

[9:02] And it's – I think we're now – it feels like we're finally, like, fortunately or unfortunately, running out of the fumes from those original movies.

[9:10] Right.

S3

[9:10] They have to create new things that are good on their own, like Andor or, you know.

[9:15] Mandalorian season one of the TV show was delightful.

Elliott Kalan

[9:18] It's all right.

[9:18] And the –

[9:19] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[9:19] But in mainline film – I mean, those are both TV and mainline films.

[9:24] Like, you know, it's a contentious movie.

[9:29] And I think that the people who don't like it are wrong, but I don't care.

[9:32] Yeah, they're wrong.

[9:33] But Last Jedi was the one that tried to do something new, and it scared them so much that they're like, I don't know.

[9:40] Let's not.

[9:40] I'll admit.

Elliott Kalan

[9:41] When I saw Last Jedi in theaters, I really liked it.

[9:43] Watching it again recently, I don't like it quite as much, partly because they're taking the focus away from white people.

[9:50] Do not like that.

[9:51] But maybe it's –

[9:52] No, just kidding.

[9:52] That's not why.

[9:53] I'm kidding.

[9:54] I'm just kidding.

[9:55] That's a joke based on –

[9:55] New listeners who might be drawn in by Star Wars.

[9:56] Based on idiots who don't like the movie for that reason.

[9:59] But it's watching it again, especially watching it with my son, he found it very boring and confusing.

[10:05] And watching it again, I was like, yeah, this movie, the plot is like a little too complicated.

[10:10] And it's a – considering it's an action movie with cool set pieces, it works much slower.

[10:15] And so it's one of those things where I'm like, if there's a Star Wars movies, and setting Andor aside, which is a different kind of – they're aiming for something different.

[10:22] It's a TV show.

[10:23] If you release a Star Wars movie that a kid finds boring and hard to understand –

[10:27] Yeah, you missed.

[10:28] Then I feel like you're missing the mark somewhat.

[10:30] Yeah.

[10:31] As a childless man, I don't care.

[10:33] I don't think that my metric is your child.

[10:35] But as a guy who understands the place of Star Wars, a space fantasy series, I think that's interesting.

Dan McCoy

[10:41] I feel like there's a whole span of types of Star Wars things at this point.

Elliott Kalan

[10:44] But I would say that that's not – it's not successful as a whole span of Star Wars things.

[10:49] Star Wars at its best does a thing where it is taking –

[10:53] Childish entertainment and uplifting it onto a higher level of production, like storytelling.

[11:00] It's a – for lack of a better word, everyone talks about – or there was that period recently where people were talking about like sophisticated horror or like – what do they call it?

[11:09] Elevated.

[11:09] Elevated horror.

[11:10] Like Star Wars is – the original Star Wars essentially elevated B serial.

[11:15] Yeah.

[11:15] Like they're taking B serials or science – not necessarily even science fiction but space opera.

[11:19] Kind of the goofiest, least serious type of science fiction.

[11:23] I think it's –

[11:23] And doing it in an elevated way.

[11:25] And this – and so you've got to – I feel like – but if you try to elevate it too far, then it's like, well, this isn't really – you're not doing the thing you need to do.

[11:31] You know?

S3

[11:31] Everything – I agree with everything everybody's saying and yet I also want to talk.

[11:36] And –

[11:36] But I want to –

Elliott Kalan

[11:38] That was the subtext of everyone on a podcast ever.

[11:40] You've encapsulated it so well.

S3

[11:43] But, you know, Elliot, as you know, my comics podcast recently – not even – last year we did a thing on the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

[11:51] We did like a little look at the turtles, which you were a guest on.

Elliott Kalan

[11:53] I was grateful to poop here on one of those episodes.

[11:55] We talked about TMNT number three, I think.

S3

[11:58] Yeah, we accidentally gave you the least consequential of all the early issues.

[12:01] The one that's just a –

Elliott Kalan

[12:02] That's just a quick car chase on this whole issue.

[12:04] We didn't plan it.

S3

[12:05] Look, here's the thing.

[12:06] I was too old to have really been caught up in Turtle Mania Wave 1.

[12:10] And so I never really read any of that stuff.

[12:12] So out of a curiosity, my brother and I said, hey, let's read all the original Eastman and Laird Turtles books.

[12:17] And they were really delightful and great.

[12:19] And then sort of watched some episodes of the original Saturday morning cartoon and the original movie.

[12:23] And just kind of like, what were the rocket ship proponents of Turtle Mania 1.0?

[12:30] And, you know, I was like, oh, yeah, this stuff's all great.

[12:33] I can totally see.

[12:33] But it was like, oh, it opened my eyes to how a lot of these beloved franchises, which sometimes have well-crafted entries and sometimes have just kind of stuff that misses or is bad.

[12:48] They're like toy movies.

[12:50] They are toy designs first and foremost.

[12:53] And Star Wars was the first movie where the effects were good enough that it's like, look, say what you want about the plot or Mark Hamill's acting or the pace.

[13:02] These are the best toys that have ever been made on Earth to this point.

Elliott Kalan

[13:06] I will say I think Mark Hamill's really good.

[13:08] I like him a lot.

S3

[13:08] I like Mark Hamill, too.

[13:09] But he was a lightning rod, right?

[13:12] For criticism.

[13:12] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[13:12] I think it was easy for people to make fun of him because I think because that character is such a –

[13:19] Exactly.

[13:20] I think Hamill's a good actor, too.

[13:21] I think he's really good.

[13:22] Right, right, right.

[13:23] He's playing a dweeb and he's doing a really good job of it.

[13:25] Yeah.

S3

[13:25] The misfortune of being cast next to Harrison Ford, which is like –

[13:28] Yes, which is rough.

[13:30] The most charismatic –

[13:31] Even like Ryan Gosling next to Harrison Ford, who's that nerd Gosling?

Elliott Kalan

[13:34] But I think –

[13:35] Yes, yes, right, right.

[13:36] But I think, yeah, there's this like great, cool like toy design quality and stuff and that it's – those first movies I've talked about before on the podcast.

[13:44] That first movie I find to be such a miracle of storytelling where when it starts, you don't know anything about that world of those characters.

[13:50] And by the time they're going after the Death Star, you're so invested in it.

[13:53] And when Hans shows up, a character you met an hour and ten minutes earlier, when he returns to help Luke, you're like, yeah, he's back.

[14:00] Yeah.

[14:01] It's just amazing the way they pulled it off.

[14:03] It is a miracle.

[14:03] And I haven't seen that pulled off again in a movie the same way until The Mandalorian and Grogu.

[14:09] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[14:10] Hit the bullseye.

Stuart Wellington

[14:11] I was going to say, we've talked in our bibs and dig into this meal.

Dan McCoy

[14:17] We've talked a lot about Star Wars on the macro level.

[14:21] Let's talk about it on the micro level.

[14:23] Hang on.

[14:23] We don't have to talk really fast if we –

[14:24] Small people.

S3

[14:26] I'm going to stop you again because I've only been on this podcast once every 15 years.

[14:29] I've got to ask.

[14:30] Is this how it works?

[14:31] Everyone's dragging it off the rails and, Dan, you just like selflessly grab it with ropes and drag it back on the tracks?

[14:37] Well, I guess, I mean, Elliot passed me the ball there.

Dan McCoy

[14:41] So it wasn't – it's a team effort sometimes to drag it back on.

[14:45] But usually Elliot's the one throwing the ball out of the window.

[14:47] Things have changed since the swing vote days.

[14:49] Things have changed.

Elliott Kalan

[14:50] I am the guy – we're playing a baseball game.

[14:52] I'm the guy who, instead of catching a foul ball and throwing it into the stands, I'm catching a fair ball and throwing it into the stands.

Dan McCoy

[15:01] Micro level, you were saying.

[15:02] Yeah, yeah.

[15:04] Yeah, yeah.

[15:04] It was – you know, he's a little guy.

[15:06] Baby Yoda.

[15:07] Grogu is a little guy, yeah.

[15:08] Grogu.

[15:09] He's a little baby guy.

[15:09] The Mandalorian and Grogu.

[15:11] A title built to –

Elliott Kalan

[15:14] They're like, look, we're just telling you what it is.

[15:17] Look, we know this show is called The Mandalorian.

[15:19] We know you're in it for Grogu.

[15:21] Don't worry.

[15:21] He's in the title.

S3

[15:22] What's a title with zero poetry in any way?

Elliott Kalan

[15:28] Stamp it on the box.

Dan McCoy

[15:29] Tell them what's in the box.

[15:31] Yeah.

[15:31] Someone wakes up from a coma.

[15:33] The Mandalorian and Grogu?

[15:36] The and Grogu.

[15:37] Do that speak a nude language?

[15:38] Yeah.

[15:39] No, thank you.

Stuart Wellington

[15:40] I don't like foreign films.

Elliott Kalan

[15:42] And also, the way the title looks on the poster I think is very funny because it looks like it says The Star Wars Mandalorian and Grogu, which is like – just the way they placed it is very funny to me.

S3

[15:51] Oh, that's really funny.

[15:53] Grogu seems like an afterthought.

[15:55] It seems like it was called The Mandalorian for months and months and some studio execs like, where's that little green guy?

[15:59] And they're like, Jesus, just put it in the title.

[16:02] We can't have this guy constantly.

[16:03] Well, the problem is at first they misunderstood.

Elliott Kalan

[16:06] He goes, where's that little guy, Yogurt?

[16:07] They called it The Mandalorian Yogurt and Mel Brooks was like, I'm in this movie.

[16:11] Hold on a second.

[16:13] Finally, the space ball.

[16:14] I guess I got to start training again.

S3

[16:17] What if Mel Brooks entered this movie like with all the gravity of like, you know, the way like in sometimes like late period superhero movies like an old – like, you know, like in Deadpool and Wolverine like when Chris Evans enters as human torch or whatever.

[16:33] Like this is Mel Brooks' yogurt shows up in the real Star Wars.

[16:38] I would have reversed all my feelings about this movie.

[16:41] It would be the greatest movie ever.

Dan McCoy

[16:42] It would be so good.

[16:43] Yeah.

[16:45] Okay.

[16:45] So we start off The Mandalorian.

[16:48] We start off episode one of season one of The Mandalorian.

[16:51] We all know what The Mandalorian is.

[16:53] There's no reason to explain.

[16:56] No, The Mandalorian, of course.

[16:58] Look, I actually didn't even make it – I know that everyone loves the first season.

[17:02] I didn't even make it for the first season of The Mandalorian.

[17:05] I'm like, okay.

S3

[17:06] I'm just genuinely surprised by that.

[17:07] I found the first season, I mean, light but really watchable.

[17:12] I think it's super watchable and really fun, but he's such a thin character.

Elliott Kalan

[17:16] I loved Amy Sedaris.

[17:16] He doesn't really exist as a character.

Dan McCoy

[17:17] I found it –

[17:18] A lot of good guest stars, yeah.

[17:20] What I saw I found perfectly watchable.

[17:21] It was just like I think I was already feeling like I don't know if I need this much Star Wars anymore by that time.

[17:28] And Werner Herzog, come on.

Stuart Wellington

[17:29] He loves that baby.

Elliott Kalan

[17:30] Look.

[17:30] I mean the fact that – I love that Werner Herzog was in The Mandalorian show because they're like,

[17:35] we need another great director to suddenly appear as a surprise in the movie.

[17:39] We'll just get Scorsese.

[17:40] Like we did – like in The Mandalorian and Grogu 2, who's going to be the director that's in it?

[17:43] Like are they finally going to get David Lynch's ghost back in or something like that?

[17:48] Yeah.

[17:49] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[17:49] Ong Lee or something shows up.

[17:51] I mean Scorsese might be the best acting performance in this movie.

[17:56] Yeah.

[17:56] So the Mandalorians, are they like all bounty hunters?

[18:00] They're pretty much – so as we know from the Star Wars universe –

[18:03] Like a one race is like just like a certain thing.

Elliott Kalan

[18:06] So one, yes.

[18:08] In Star Wars, everyone in the one race does the same job.

[18:11] But two –

[18:11] It's like the Muppets.

[18:13] But the Mandalorians are also like – it's like a religion or like a culture, right?

[18:17] So you can be inducted into it.

[18:19] Yeah.

[18:19] They're like Jedis.

[18:20] Okay.

[18:20] Except their rules are we're bounty hunters.

[18:22] We never take off our masks, which is dumb because how do you eat, drink, any of that stuff?

[18:27] You never kiss.

[18:28] How do we make you Mandalorians?

[18:29] It's pretty easy.

[18:30] When they take the helmet off, it just pops right off, right?

[18:32] You know what I would do?

[18:33] If you never want anyone to see your face, you know what you put underneath your mask?

[18:36] A fucking ski mask.

[18:37] Just cover up your face.

[18:38] Yeah, yeah.

[18:38] A balaclava, sure.

[18:39] Yeah, balaclava.

[18:40] They don't have that technology.

[18:41] Oh, I guess you've got light speed technology.

[18:43] You don't have the ability to make fabric that doesn't cover your eyes and your mouth.

Stuart Wellington

[18:46] It's also weird that he like shaves down to a mustache.

[18:49] I would think it's weird to be all crazy.

[18:50] I have to assume the helmet does that.

[18:52] I have to assume the helmet does that.

Dan McCoy

[18:53] That's why you wear it.

[18:54] Yeah.

[18:57] All Mandalorians must have a secret mustache.

Stuart Wellington

[19:01] By pointing this out, we're highlighting, I think, one of the things that we had circled around before,

[19:05] which is the idea that the more we examine the Star Wars universe and the more we attempt to elevate it,

[19:10] I think the more it shows that there's just a general shallowness to the Star Wars universe.

[19:16] Yes, I think that's true.

[19:16] I feel like I'm not like, hey, I have loved Star Wars in my life, but I feel like there is – the more you start kicking over stones,

[19:28] the more you realize you're like, oh, there's nothing down here.

Dan McCoy

[19:31] It's empty.

[19:31] A large part of that by design.

[19:33] It's supposed to be simple.

Elliott Kalan

[19:35] Yeah, but the thing is when it's simple and then you explore it and you – it's like my younger son loves to play Minecraft,

[19:42] partly because he likes to explore the worlds, and it's like there's not really that much there.

[19:45] Like it's not – he's not discovering new things.

[19:47] It's just the same old trees and animals over and over again.

[19:50] But I think that with Star Wars, people talk about like, oh, the Star Wars world is such a cool world.

[19:56] There's so many corners to look into, but there really aren't.

[19:59] Like it's not – there's not that much going on.

[20:01] Yeah, well, there could be.

Dan McCoy

[20:03] There could be.

[20:04] There could be, but they just keep going back to the same wells.

Elliott Kalan

[20:06] Because the closest thing you can compare it to is probably like the Marvel universe, right,

[20:09] where there are a lot of corners of the Marvel universe.

[20:11] That's because it was – there's 80 years, 90 years of publishing behind it of people trying out different stuff

[20:17] and most of it not working.

[20:18] With multiple creators.

[20:19] With multiple – with many, many hundreds if not thousands of creators working on it.

[20:23] And so you have a – it's just tough.

[20:25] It's really tough.

[20:26] And it's just not – yeah, it's not the most complex world.

[20:28] But you also don't have the most complex character in The Mandalorian who is – so I didn't remember this from the show.

[20:34] Is he dumb in the show?

[20:36] No.

[20:36] Because in the movie, he's very dumb.

[20:38] He believes whatever anybody tells him at face value all the time.

[20:43] The bad guy he's looking for at first, nobody can find this Imperial commander.

[20:47] It turns out he didn't even change his name.

[20:48] He's just operating under the same name on another planet.

Dan McCoy

[20:51] Well, that's everyone's fault.

[20:53] That's not just him.

[20:53] That's everyone's fault.

Elliott Kalan

[20:54] But The Mandalorian in particular, two very obviously evil characters lie to him.

[20:58] And then when he goes to somebody else and he goes, oh, they lied to you.

[21:00] He's like, I don't think so.

[21:01] That's not what they told me.

[21:02] What?

[21:05] Explain.

[21:05] He's very dumb.

[21:06] He's very – he's a very dumb guy.

[21:08] Can I hear –

[21:09] But we'll talk about that.

Dan McCoy

[21:10] Well, let's get back to him because we haven't even learned what he's done yet.

[21:13] Okay.

[21:14] He's on a mission.

[21:15] At this point, he's working for the New Republic.

[21:19] He's hunting down –

S3

[21:21] Which are the good guys in this – not a right-wing like commentary magazine or something like that.

Dan McCoy

[21:27] He's basically a Nazi hunter.

[21:29] He's finding empire refugees.

Elliott Kalan

[21:33] He's like Marathon Man but with monsters and lasers.

Stuart Wellington

[21:37] Yeah, and this is what the empire has turned into like weird little like crime bosses and like –

Elliott Kalan

[21:43] Yeah, there's little warlord fiefdoms left over.

[21:46] And that's – I mean and that's a cool idea and that's a realistic idea that when the empire – when you kill the emperor, it's not like the empire just – everyone just suddenly goes, whoops, I guess we're not doing this anymore.

[21:53] Yeah, yeah.

[21:53] They all have their little power bases they're trying to maintain and he's going after them.

[21:58] And it turns out – he has one move which is walk into a room and start shooting people in the head.

[22:04] Yeah, that's true.

[22:05] He is not a master of stealth, strategy, planning.

[22:07] It works great most of the time except that it gets him to every – so I'll – I'll just give you a little bit.

[22:14] Like he comes back from a mission and goes, things went sideways.

[22:15] And it's like they didn't go sideways.

[22:17] You did a bad job.

[22:18] Yeah.

[22:19] Like you did the – you did this in the worst possible way.

Dan McCoy

[22:21] Yeah, well, this war – yeah, this warlord is abusing his like sort of like under – you know, like the local town leaders.

[22:30] Yeah.

[22:30] Yeah, and which leads to, you know, a joke that I would have found funny if it wasn't so telegraphed which is like when Mando comes in and like shoots everyone and like they're all supposed to cover his exit but they all just point to where he went.

[22:43] And I'm like it could have been funny but I don't know whether it was the direction or whatever.

[22:49] I just saw it coming so far away that – anyway, there's an AT-AT chase or AT-AT depending on how – if you're nasty, I guess.

[22:58] If you want to say it wrong, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[23:00] If you're nasty.

[23:01] Yeah, there's some AT-ATs walking on the most precarious little ledge.

[23:05] Yeah.

[23:06] Like goats.

[23:07] Like mountain goats.

Elliott Kalan

[23:08] Yeah, that's because – yeah, I guess AT-ATs are like goats in how well they're able to maneuver around rocky ledges, yeah.

[23:14] And Grogu shows up.

[23:17] You forgot Grogu blew a little robot.

[23:19] He's got his adopted child.

[23:22] You know that the Mandalorian is the hero of the movie because he shoots a lot of people dead.

[23:26] Right.

[23:27] He does not stop to help anybody if they are in trouble and he brings a baby with him into situations where he gets shot at and shoots people dead.

[23:34] Yeah, but that baby can handle itself.

Dan McCoy

[23:37] That baby is a powerful baby.

Elliott Kalan

[23:39] And the Mandalorian is really – he's really –

Dan McCoy

[23:41] He's got all those Yoda powers because, again, every race is the same.

[23:45] It's exactly the same.

Elliott Kalan

[23:45] So it's so funny because I was reading – someone was making the point that like Yoda looks the way he does in the Star Wars movies because he is elderly.

[23:51] Because he is 800 years old and the idea is that the force has been keeping him alive all this time.

[23:55] But then they're like, we got to have more Yoda aliens.

[23:57] I guess they all look like little old men and they all dress like Jedi and they all live hundreds of years.

[24:02] You know, it's –

[24:02] Yeah.

[24:03] Every race, they're all the same.

[24:04] You know, if you're a roadie, you're going to be a bounty hunter.

Stuart Wellington

[24:06] I would agree with you, but he's very cute, guys.

[24:10] He is very cute.

[24:11] He is very cute.

[24:12] And he is primarily – he at least appears to be primarily a practical puppet.

[24:17] He's a little puppet man.

[24:18] He's a very expensive puppet.

[24:20] I love a little guy.

[24:21] Give me little guys.

[24:22] And you know what?

[24:23] This movie delivers more little guys as we go on.

[24:25] It delivers handily with little guys.

Dan McCoy

[24:26] I don't care if it looks quote unquote fake.

[24:28] I love the way he looks when he's running around.

Elliott Kalan

[24:31] Dan, you would love it if you could see the puppeteer's arms sticking out of his butt the whole movie.

[24:34] You would be loving that.

Stuart Wellington

[24:36] If somebody – yeah, if somebody told me that they didn't like it because it looks fake, I think I'd slap their face.

[24:43] And I don't even care that much.

[24:45] I just – I'm like, that's the good part.

[24:47] Yeah.

[24:47] I mean, you have to –

S3

[24:48] Every Star Wars character, you have to evaluate how good of an action figure slash toy is this character.

[24:54] Yes.

[24:54] And Grogu is an A-plus five-star toy.

[24:59] One of the all-time greats.

[25:00] Yeah.

[25:01] Right up there with Boba Fett and Hoth Han Solo.

[25:06] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[25:06] The Rancor was pretty good.

[25:08] That was a great toy.

[25:09] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[25:09] I think – so Boba Fett and the Mandalorian, they show that if you have a cool-looking helmet and you don't say very much, you can get away with being pretty bad at your job and still be the coolest guy in the universe.

[25:20] Yeah.

[25:21] But – and because the Mandalorian also, he benefits – and he seems to be aware of that he's benefiting from what I would call Star Wars protagonist defense shield technology, which is if you are the hero of the movie, nobody is going to hit you when they're shooting at you with lasers.

[25:36] They could be an inch away firing straight at you.

Stuart Wellington

[25:38] But his armor is like super – he has like a John Wick suit on, right, basically, right?

[25:42] Yes.

[25:42] Yes, exactly.

[25:43] Bulletproof or blaster-proof outfit.

[25:44] It's made of that fancy steel.

Elliott Kalan

[25:46] It's super blaster-proof.

Dan McCoy

[25:47] Yeah, it's – you know, it's different IP, but it's basically adamantium.

[25:52] Yes.

[25:52] Let me say that because we saw this in the theater, I was not there with like a little glowy pen making notes.

[25:58] Because you don't care enough.

[25:59] I'm heavily relying on –

[26:00] I can jump in.

[26:01] I do care about my fellow audience members.

[26:06] Oh, so you weren't at the Alamo, I guess.

Elliott Kalan

[26:10] I mean, ironically, the Alamo is where you should have gone because they have lights underneath those little tables.

[26:15] So I've taken notes at Alamo movies and it makes it a little easier.

Dan McCoy

[26:19] No, no.

[26:19] I'm just saying I'm heavily relying on the wiki summary.

[26:22] So if anyone wants to jump in, please feel free.

Elliott Kalan

[26:26] So after a big snow battle with AT-ATs and AT-STs, he captures this guy, brings him back to Sigourney Weaver.

[26:32] But he doesn't capture the guy.

Dan McCoy

[26:32] He blows him up.

[26:33] Oh, he blows up that guy.

[26:34] That was the problem.

[26:35] Sigourney's like we wanted him alive because that's how we find other people.

[26:41] And, you know, Sigourney Weaver, you get to see her in a rebel suit.

[26:45] So that's a mark in the plus column for this.

Elliott Kalan

[26:48] Some nerd somewhere was just ejaculating into his pants at seeing Ripley in a rebel suit.

[26:54] I think I did.

[26:55] I was excited.

[26:56] At least looking in the mirror right now.

[27:01] But she wants –

[27:03] Look, when you nerd into the abyss, the abyss nerds back into you.

[27:06] Yeah, for sure.

[27:07] Yeah.

S3

[27:08] I don't know.

[27:08] I'm sure I was projecting and I did think Sigourney Weaver was cool casting.

[27:12] But every line she said, I felt like she was just a whisper away from bursting into laughter.

[27:17] Yeah.

[27:18] I mean –

[27:19] Especially when she ends up in the X-wing flying or whatever at the end of the movie.

[27:23] It just – it looked both great and insane to me.

[27:26] I mean she has – she is – I mean I love her.

Dan McCoy

[27:27] She's so great.

Elliott Kalan

[27:28] But it had a – there was this feeling of her like, all right, whatever.

[27:32] No, no, no.

Dan McCoy

[27:33] Totally.

[27:34] I love Sigourney Weaver.

[27:36] I was so happy to see her in this movie.

[27:37] It does – it has big like we have you for one day energy.

[27:41] Right, right, right.

Elliott Kalan

[27:42] She didn't have the dedication that she shows as the villain in the movie Holes with Shia LaMoss.

Dan McCoy

[27:48] But yeah, she – the next assignment for Mando is a big one.

[27:53] They got to find Commander Coyne who I guess is like the warlord of all warlords.

[27:58] And like she literally has like a deck of cards of like –

[28:02] Bad guys, yeah.

[28:03] The big – yeah, bad warlords trading set.

Elliott Kalan

[28:06] Yeah, I mean this is – and this is a takeoff of a real thing.

[28:08] Like when we invaded Iraq, I think it was.

[28:10] Oh.

[28:11] They handed out decks of cards with the images and names of like the high up guys and Saddam Hussein's –

[28:16] I forgot about that.

Dan McCoy

[28:17] Well, it was stupid when our government did it and it's stupid here.

S3

[28:20] I mean they used to.

[28:21] Especially when the main card she gives him has no information on it.

[28:25] That's actually the question mark.

Elliott Kalan

[28:26] They're like all we know about this guy, Commander Coyne, is that he – his name is Commander Coyne.

[28:31] He's the worst of the worst.

Dan McCoy

[28:32] He's a Nintendo villain, Commander Coyne.

Elliott Kalan

[28:35] But I was – this movie is so – and this is an overriding note for this movie.

[28:39] It's so boilerplate and flat and not detailed in the way you want a Star Wars thing to be.

[28:44] They don't even give him like a story of something particularly bad he did.

[28:47] They don't have – he's not like the butcher of Bespin or something like that, like Commander Coyne, the butcher of Bespin.

[28:52] Instead, he's just Commander Coyne, we don't have to tell you anything about him, who cares?

[28:55] There's so many places where they could have added a little bit of color, a little bit of like – be a good DM, you know, flesh out this world a little bit.

S3

[29:03] She's giving him a playing card, which traditionally in the world of playing cards there is info and stats and like a fun fact.

[29:11] And she gave him just truly a coaster with a silhouette of a humanoid.

Dan McCoy

[29:16] I have to object to you.

[29:18] Traditionally in playing cards we have clubs, spades, hearts, and diamonds.

[29:22] But in trading cards.

[29:23] In trading cards.

[29:24] Trading cards.

[29:25] Which is a form of play, you know, so.

[29:29] I just wanted to make a dumb joke.

S3

[29:30] You're absolutely right.

[29:32] But the funny thing is all she had was the name and as we've already said, that turns out to be all you needed to find this guy.

[29:37] That actually was the exact amount of info that you did need to find him.

Elliott Kalan

[29:42] If he had shown up on the world and said, hey, do you know where Coin is?

[29:45] They'd be like, oh, over there?

[29:46] Yeah, sure.

[29:48] He's in hiding.

[29:49] No one knows.

[29:49] He's like a ghost.

[29:50] He disappeared.

[29:50] But this was – I was talking to somebody about this the other day and they pointed out that that is a Star Wars universe thing is when you want to hide, you'd use your same name.

[29:57] Because then people assume, well, if I'm looking for the son of Anakin Skywalker, surely he would have chosen a different name than Luke Skywalker.

[30:04] So that would be crazy for him.

[30:05] Obi-Wan Kenobi.

Dan McCoy

[30:05] We don't have one of those.

[30:06] We've got a Ben Kenobi though.

Elliott Kalan

[30:08] What are the odds?

[30:09] Such a common name is Kenobi.

Dan McCoy

[30:12] That's a different guy.

[30:12] Different guy.

Elliott Kalan

[30:13] Different dude.

[30:14] Different – if he wanted to go incognito, he wouldn't use the same last name.

Dan McCoy

[30:17] I mean maybe it's a psyop.

[30:19] It's like, well, surely he would.

[30:20] Yeah.

[30:20] I think that's what he just said.

Elliott Kalan

[30:22] He's thinking one step ahead.

[30:24] Yeah.

[30:24] They'd expect – it's like – it's like a – it's Princess Bride.

[30:29] You want me – sorry, you're going to say a story.

Stuart Wellington

[30:31] It is the logic that contestants on the traitors use to determine who's a bad guy based on how they're voting.

[30:38] Yeah, yeah.

[30:38] It's that exact sort of thing.

[30:39] Sorry.

Elliott Kalan

[30:40] But so he goes to this planet where he's going to find Commander Coyne, right?

Dan McCoy

[30:43] Well, no.

[30:44] First he has to go to see the Hutt twins or whatever.

[30:48] Like there's a couple of Hutt siblings.

[30:49] Yeah, he's going to see the Hutt twins.

[30:51] So this new republic has made a deal.

Elliott Kalan

[30:53] The Hutt twins will give him – will give them where to find Commander Coyne if he – if

[30:58] Mandalorian first gets their nephew, Rod of the Hutt, son of Jabba the Hutt.

[31:02] Yeah.

[31:02] Oh, boy.

[31:02] And it is very clear –

[31:03] We're going to meet another Hutt.

[31:04] These Hutt twins are evil.

[31:05] They are literally big slimy grub worms who talk like this, oh, well, of course we miss our nephew.

[31:11] We just want him to be safe.

[31:14] So this is –

[31:15] And Manlon's like, checks out.

[31:17] You're loving uncle and aunt.

Stuart Wellington

[31:18] This is like the first time we see now Hutta, right?

[31:22] Yes.

[31:22] Which is –

[31:22] As a Star Wars fan is the Hutt home world.

[31:25] All the buildings are like these big like fungus-grown structures with like a little bit of metallic stuff.

[31:32] It looks kind of cool but it's all lit like dog shit.

[31:35] So any action later on just looks terrible.

Elliott Kalan

[31:38] It's too bad.

[31:38] It's all dim brown light.

[31:40] But the designs are cool.

[31:42] The designs have a real Mobius type of quality or like a Miyazaki quality.

[31:45] I think those are cool.

Stuart Wellington

[31:46] Yeah.

[31:46] And I feel like a lot of the designs in this one are drawn from classic sci-fi things as we'll see when we see the dragon – what?

[31:53] The dragon snake or whatever later on.

[31:55] Dragon whatever.

Dan McCoy

[31:57] But when it comes to the Hutts, definitely for me it is diminishing returns every time I see a different member of this species.

Elliott Kalan

[32:05] But they found two new ways to make the Hutts less cool.

[32:10] One, as we'll get with Rod and the Hut, is to make one jacked.

[32:12] Just have a swole Hut.

[32:14] And the other is –

[32:14] I fucking hate it.

[32:15] The other is that they speak English through most of the movie and they look ridiculous.

[32:19] And Huttese sounds awesome.

[32:21] And Huttese sounds so cool.

[32:22] It is the most fun Star Wars language to say, no job I want to go.

[32:27] Like that's the best.

Stuart Wellington

[32:28] Like their mouths are too big and gross to be able to speak galactic common or whatever.

Elliott Kalan

[32:33] Can you imagine if in the middle of a Star Wars movie Chewbacca turned to Han and said, so what are we going to do next time?

[32:38] Like you'd be like, what the hell is this?

[32:39] Seth Rogen says this.

Stuart Wellington

[32:42] Good casting.

[32:44] Yeah.

[32:44] It would be the casting, yeah.

[32:45] And like not only are their mouths too big and gross but also like the Hutts are fucking conceited assholes.

[32:52] Why would they speak this other language?

[32:54] They want to speak their perfect blah, blah, blah language.

[32:57] That sounds awesome.

Elliott Kalan

[33:00] So it's a couple of big mistakes there.

[33:02] And I think it's just for ease of – so you don't have to have a lot of subtitles up and then you can cast a famous name as Rod of the Hut because that's what makes the movie.

Stuart Wellington

[33:10] Parlaying is bear credit to be Rod of the Hut.

Dan McCoy

[33:15] Hey, he's in a Star Wars, man.

[33:17] You know, if you get offered a Star Wars, yeah, you're going to take that.

Elliott Kalan

[33:21] Again, I feel like that is currency that has been devalued over the course of the year.

[33:24] Do we have any –

Dan McCoy

[33:24] Even now, Elliot, you're going to say that if someone just wants to cast you in a Star Wars movie –

Elliott Kalan

[33:28] Someone said this to me yesterday.

[33:30] I was complaining to this movie.

[33:31] They go, so if they offered you a Star Wars movie, you wouldn't take it?

[33:33] And I go, of course I would.

[33:34] One, cha-ching.

[33:36] But also two, yeah, of course I would.

[33:37] I'd try to do the best job I could.

[33:39] It probably would come out.

[33:40] Not great.

[33:41] What are you going to do?

[33:41] Like, of course you're going to take it.

[33:42] That doesn't mean – like, just because you're going to take a job doesn't mean you think that everything they're doing is amazing or that they should do it.

Dan McCoy

[33:48] Well, no, that's a separate issue.

Stuart Wellington

[33:51] His work in this is maybe not –

[33:52] He should have insisted on speaking Huttese the whole time, honestly.

[33:55] Yeah.

[33:56] Will, you –

S3

[33:57] Yeah, I was like – with the Hutts, have we seen this many Hutts before in any of the other –

[34:04] We were lousy with Hutts in this movie.

Elliott Kalan

[34:06] Crazy with us.

[34:07] The twin Hutts, the nephew Hutts.

[34:09] And there's just that random Hut that you see sliding along a burrow and then going and slipping into a burrow.

[34:13] Yeah, just like NPC Hut.

[34:15] Yeah, a lot of this is –

Stuart Wellington

[34:16] They're walking through the halls and, like, looking down the hallways and seeing, like, Huts all over each other like it's fucking irreversible or something.

[34:24] Yeah, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[34:25] This is from the Clone Wars, right?

[34:28] I didn't watch the series, but I believe that –

[34:29] So these guys –

Elliott Kalan

[34:30] The Hutts twins show up in –

[34:32] At least Rada is.

[34:33] And the Hutts twins show up in either Mandalorian Season 3 or Boba Fett or something like that.

[34:38] I didn't see it.

[34:38] I just heard about it.

[34:39] They've been introduced in the show, in one of the shows.

S3

[34:42] But anyway –

Elliott Kalan

[34:43] I think it's a funny layout for the Hutts palace, which is that there's a tunnel that leads to a huge gate door, which just leads to one big throne room.

[34:51] And I'm like, what is the – the layout of this building doesn't make sense.

[34:54] And if I'm watching a Star Wars movie, I shouldn't be thinking about how the layout of the building doesn't make sense.

S3

[34:58] IP that gets like too successful, it's so funny when things that were probably initially decided, you know, to be good in one sequence then have to have like a whole like leg of the lore resting on them.

[35:14] It's like Jabba the Hutt in Return of the Jedi needs to be the big scary bounty hunter that's after Han.

[35:18] And he works great as this giant literal slug lord.

[35:22] Yeah.

[35:23] Just kind of gross.

[35:24] Who's limited in how much he can move.

[35:26] It works great for the sequence.

[35:28] He looks great.

[35:28] He sounds great.

[35:29] He's gross.

[35:29] He's a big fat crime boss.

Elliott Kalan

[35:30] He's Sydney Green Street.

[35:32] Like it works fantastically.

S3

[35:33] It works great.

[35:33] And now to have to build a whole Hutt world and like government system and like modes of entertainment.

[35:40] How do they get around?

[35:41] What are the streetcars for a slug land?

[35:43] Is it just huge flatbed trucks are going around?

[35:47] Is it just tanks of water like being dragged?

Dan McCoy

[35:49] If it keeps to the Star Wars thing and they're all mobsters, that's a terrible economy.

Elliott Kalan

[35:55] No.

[35:55] Yeah.

[35:56] Someone's got to have a legit job.

[35:58] To be fair, that is what the United States is turning into is a mobster economy.

[36:01] So we'll see what it's like to live in a Hutt world.

[36:03] Also like the idea like at a certain point you have to be like, so they're intergalactic gangsters.

[36:09] Do they have the wheel?

[36:10] I don't know that they do.

[36:12] So how have they accomplished all these things?

[36:14] You know?

Dan McCoy

[36:15] Anyway, Mando is looking for Rada.

[36:18] He goes to Shikari, which is kind of a Las Vegas planet or at least this part of it.

[36:23] Just this city.

Elliott Kalan

[36:23] I mean that's the other thing is in Star Wars, all planets are the exact same all over the entire planet.

[36:28] You're a desert world.

[36:29] You're an ocean world.

[36:30] You're a city world as opposed to in real life when all those things exist on our one planet.

[36:35] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[36:37] He finds out that – well, first he goes – he's like – the first thing he does is look for information.

[36:42] By talking to Martin Scorsese monkey.

[36:45] Monkey Scorsese, yeah.

[36:47] He's got forearms.

[36:49] He does what anyone would do.

Elliott Kalan

[36:50] He goes to the first street food vendor he sees and basically bullies him into accepting money for information.

[36:56] And this is Martin Scorsese, yeah.

[36:57] He's like a forearmed monkey man who –

[36:59] Pretty great.

[37:00] I mean this is a highly –

[37:01] I'm not mad at it.

S3

[37:02] Honestly, might be the best performance in the film.

Elliott Kalan

[37:05] I mean Martin Scorsese is great.

[37:08] It's not like this is his first time acting.

[37:10] The same with Werner Herzog in Mandalorian.

[37:12] These guys are professional actors in addition to being directors.

[37:14] Yeah.

[37:15] He seems genuinely –

S3

[37:17] He's better than Sigourney.

[37:18] I love Sigourney's casting.

[37:20] But I think Scorsese is a better performance.

[37:22] He's better than Pedro Pascal and I don't think that's Pedro Pascal's fault.

[37:26] Yep.

[37:27] I mean –

[37:27] Grogu I cannot count as a performance.

[37:29] Thank you.

[37:31] I think it's the number one – if they're going to go for Oscar bait, it's got to be Martin Scorsese, best supporting actor, Mandalorian and Grogu.

Stuart Wellington

[37:38] It's better than that old fisherman lizard guy on Malhada.

[37:43] I think he's better than that.

[37:44] Yeah, better than that.

S3

[37:46] Not like a lot better.

[37:47] All these other people are very functional and good at what they need to do.

Elliott Kalan

[37:49] Who plays the character who's like the Mandalorian's like sometimes co-pilot?

[37:54] Oh, yeah.

[37:55] Oh.

Dan McCoy

[37:56] That character for looking as sort of wild as he does makes no impact whatsoever.

Elliott Kalan

[38:03] No.

[38:03] Yeah.

[38:03] And he's a character from other stuff but I don't know the name or – they don't bother to – I don't know if they say his name in the movie.

[38:10] Maybe they do once but I don't remember it.

Stuart Wellington

[38:12] I do want to point out that the – when they get to – is it Scatari?

[38:18] Right?

[38:19] The Vegas planet?

[38:20] The planet Atari.

[38:20] Yeah.

[38:21] Shikari.

[38:22] Shikari.

[38:23] Shikari, sorry.

[38:23] Shikari.

[38:24] Because the tips don't lie.

[38:25] Yeah.

[38:25] Shikari, of course, is the foot soldiers of the Adeptus Mechanicus.

[38:30] But in Shikari –

[38:31] Of course.

[38:31] That's where the –

[38:32] That's where the –

Elliott Kalan

[38:32] The Sardukar from – who of course are devoted to the emperor in the Dune universe.

Stuart Wellington

[38:36] Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[38:37] The god emperor of Dune.

[38:38] Yeah.

[38:39] The –

[38:39] Well, the emperor of the universe is different than the god emperor of Dune of course.

[38:43] But anyway, continue.

[38:44] Yeah, yeah.

[38:45] Are we going to talk about 40K or are we going to talk about Dune?

Elliott Kalan

[38:49] I mean if you're honestly asking me which I'd rather talk about.

[38:51] But continue, Stuart.

[38:52] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[38:54] The soundtrack changes and we start getting like a – like a synthwavy –

[38:59] Synthwavy.

[38:59] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[38:59] And the song sounds – there's something about the melody that reminded me so much of Low by Flo Rida.

[39:06] I was very distracted.

Dan McCoy

[39:07] I loved a lot of the music in this.

[39:10] I liked when it got synthier.

[39:12] This is the guy who did Sinners and like a bunch of other stuff.

[39:16] This is like the Academy Award winner.

Elliott Kalan

[39:18] One of the strengths of The Mandalorian show is the music.

[39:21] The opening music is so good and it sets it all up.

[39:24] This movie, the music is really good.

[39:25] But that's also – that's always been a Star Wars secret weapon.

[39:28] Like that you imagine that first movie without John Williams' score.

[39:31] Oh, yeah.

[39:31] And it's like – it's just not quite as great a movie.

[39:34] Music has always been a really major thing in Star Wars.

S3

[39:38] Sound design in general is like incredible in the Star Wars franchises.

[39:41] Everything just kind of sounds cool.

Dan McCoy

[39:43] Yeah.

[39:43] But it's interesting.

[39:44] And this is really good.

[39:45] Like, you know, I know that they've done different things in the shows.

[39:48] But for a movie, I feel like this is the first time they've like gone away from like pure orchestral John Williams-y stuff.

[39:55] And so it's – this is one case where this movie is doing something different.

[40:00] Whereas it's mostly more of the same.

Elliott Kalan

[40:02] But it's aping what it did in the – it's the same composer who did the show.

[40:04] So Ludwig Goranson, right?

[40:07] Goranson.

[40:08] And so it's continuing the style from the show.

[40:12] But that was one of the exciting things about the show, right?

[40:14] When it started was that it sounded a little different, you know?

[40:16] But yes, it's funny that –

[40:18] Like Apple computers, they were thinking different.

Dan McCoy

[40:21] Even though they should have been thinking differently.

[40:23] But that's –

Elliott Kalan

[40:24] That's why you're a PC user, Dan, because you're not cool enough to drop the L-Y and get with Apple.

Dan McCoy

[40:30] I am an Apple user.

[40:34] What am I talking about?

[40:35] But you're like a PC user who in an Apple –

[40:36] So Martin – Monkey Scorsese.

[40:38] No, no, no.

[40:38] I wanted to say about Martin Scorsese.

[40:40] That's what it was.

[40:40] It is funny that like Mando keeps going back to this monkey vendor who like –

[40:48] There's no evidence that he like particularly knows more stuff than anyone else on the street.

[40:53] And he actively is like, go away.

[40:55] Go away.

[40:55] I'm not going to talk.

[40:56] I want to talk to you.

Elliott Kalan

[40:57] I mean also we should make it clear in case people don't write in mad.

[40:59] We don't see that – do we see if he has a tail or not?

[41:01] Because if he doesn't have a tail, then probably he's not a monkey but an ape of another kind.

[41:06] Sure.

[41:06] That's all right.

[41:07] Sure.

[41:07] He's a different kind of primate.

[41:08] A space ape.

S3

[41:09] Sounds of tons of email windows closing.

[41:11] All right.

[41:12] I won't say it in my comment.

[41:14] Fine.

Elliott Kalan

[41:15] Their void shields are up.

[41:17] He does have one of the funniest moments in the movie, which I think was legitimately funny but also makes that Mando look like an idiot also.

[41:25] Where he goes, I'm looking for Rod of the Hutt.

[41:29] And he's like, oh, you mean the most famous guy on the planet?

[41:32] And he points and Mando is standing next to a billboard that says like Rod of the Hutt with a big picture of Rod of the Hutt on it.

Dan McCoy

[41:38] Yeah, we find out Rod has been working as a gladiator for the local crime lord, Janu.

[41:46] And if there's one thing we know about Rod, he's not his dad.

[41:50] He doesn't want to be like his dad.

[41:53] He left town.

[41:55] His fucking waist is snatched.

Elliott Kalan

[41:57] There is no way he is his dad.

[41:59] No, no.

[42:00] He is so – he is a good –

[42:02] He's a good –

[42:02] A beef hunk of meat.

[42:03] Just a beef hunk of –

[42:03] Good space slug.

[42:04] He is a –

[42:05] So he is a real character arc where he starts out as seeing like a pretty good guy who doesn't want to be a gangster.

[42:11] And by the end, he joins the New Republic and becomes a pretty good guy who doesn't want to be a gangster.

[42:16] So this is the movie's idea of an arc is they introduce Rod of the Hutt.

[42:19] He's like, hey, I don't want to be a gangster.

[42:21] My aunt and uncle are trying to kill me so I'm just trying to stay away from them.

[42:23] And Mandalorian is like, no, they care about you.

[42:24] They really want you back because they love you so much.

[42:27] But he's always the same character.

[42:29] No one grows at all.

S3

[42:31] He's a freelancer in the beginning and he's on salary at the end.

[42:34] Okay, fair.

[42:35] He goes from 1099 to W2 is his arc.

Elliott Kalan

[42:38] They should have visualized his change then by him changing the paperwork he files.

Dan McCoy

[42:46] This is a bit of an overall critique maybe early in the show for it.

[42:51] But like that is the fundamental issue with a lot of this movie is that like no one has any sort of character arc.

[42:58] Everyone is the same at the beginning of the movie as they are at the end of the movie.

S3

[43:03] Setting aside Mandalorian stupidity, the basic structure of the story is we need somebody to get this bad guy.

[43:10] And Mandalorian goes in and does that.

[43:12] And that happens like five times.

[43:13] And then the movie is over.

Elliott Kalan

[43:15] Except by the end of it, it goes from we're trying to we're going to try to mop up the bad guys of the of the Empire.

[43:20] They're still around two.

[43:21] Yeah, I guess we'll bring in X-Wings just help the Mandalorian with his personal vendetta because he has to murder people who have seen his face.

Dan McCoy

[43:27] Well, I mean they do.

[43:28] No, they do.

[43:29] They justify it.

Elliott Kalan

[43:30] They're like, oh, it turns out those huts were also selling us out.

[43:33] So it was good that we blew them up.

[43:34] But you don't know that until after they bombed them to shit.

[43:37] But anyway, there is one character arc in it which was described to me by a coworker recently as at the beginning, the Mandalorian doesn't let Grogu press a button in the starship.

[43:47] And at the end, he lets him press the button at the starship.

[43:49] Oh, wow.

[43:50] Grogu's really grown in responsibility by the end of the movie.

Dan McCoy

[43:53] Yeah.

[43:53] So but anyway, Rod is like, hey, man, I'm not a prisoner here.

[43:58] I'm exactly where I want to be.

[43:59] I'm working off my debt to this Janu.

[44:03] He's going to let me go after the next fight.

[44:05] I'm going to be a hero on this planet.

[44:07] People love me because I fight good.

[44:10] And it's going to be great.

[44:12] And he doesn't want to be saved.

[44:15] So what happens next?

Elliott Kalan

[44:17] So the Mandalorian goes to see this.

[44:19] I think this is when is this when or is it after when when Jabba the Hutt is like, oh, yeah, Janu.

[44:26] He's the guy.

[44:27] He's Janu Coyne.

[44:28] No, that's later.

[44:29] That's later.

[44:29] He goes to see Janu at a salt bar.

[44:32] Right.

Dan McCoy

[44:32] He goes to find him at a bar.

[44:34] He like he intimidates one of his goons, like, you know, like knocks one of his tusks off the end of his tusk.

[44:41] Yeah.

[44:43] Janu comes out and he seems very civil, very civil with the situation.

Elliott Kalan

[44:49] Yeah.

[44:49] And so this is salt is very valuable on this planet.

[44:52] He's a gangster who trades in big hunks of salt.

[44:55] And he's like, Mandalorian beats up a bunch of people.

[44:57] That's like the real world for a time, you know?

Dan McCoy

[44:59] Yeah.

[45:00] Mandalorian, like, yeah, beats up the bar.

[45:02] I don't remember why Janu, like, tells him that, like, oh, I'm lying to Rada.

[45:07] I'm just going to kill him after this.

Elliott Kalan

[45:09] Because the movie needs to get moving forward and Mandalorian is not smart enough to figure it out for himself.

Stuart Wellington

[45:14] He's also trying to convince him to participate because he thinks that the Mandalorian would be his next great gladiator.

[45:22] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[45:22] But it is very funny for him to be like, he goes, you should join my stable.

[45:24] You're a great fighter.

[45:25] I'm going to kill Rada.

[45:26] I'm about to trick him and kill him.

[45:28] Then you should join and be my new guy.

[45:30] If you overperform, that's what happens.

[45:33] The Mandalorian seems to be considering it almost because he's so dumb.

[45:36] You know he's not going to do it, but he's always like, okay, you will have an opening.

[45:39] I've been looking for more job security.

[45:41] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[45:42] But he goes back to the jail late at night to tell Rada, like, hey, this is what's going on.

[45:48] You're going to get killed at the next thing.

[45:49] And Rada is so convinced of this crime lord's goodness for some reason.

[45:55] He wouldn't do that to me because everyone's dumb in this movie.

[45:58] And he calls for the guards and Mando gets gassed.

[46:02] It was a trap.

[46:03] It was all a trap.

[46:04] It was a trap.

[46:05] Yeah.

[46:05] He now has to fight.

[46:05] Where's Admiral Ackbar to tell him it's a trap?

[46:07] Oh, he died.

[46:08] He has to fight Rada in the gladiatorial arena.

[46:14] Meanwhile, Grogu is in a little cage by Janu's.

[46:18] It is cute.

Elliott Kalan

[46:19] Grogu forgets that he has force powers and just watches everything happen and doesn't do anything.

Dan McCoy

[46:23] So we get a gladiator fight.

[46:25] That's fine.

[46:26] Mando and this jacked hut.

Stuart Wellington

[46:29] Guys, I can't stress enough how much I detest the design of Rod of the Hut.

[46:34] I mean, if you told me there was a –

[46:36] Jabba the Hunk.

[46:37] There was a hut.

[46:39] There was a hut that was like a gladiator fighter.

[46:43] I'm like, okay, we got a big old fat slug rolling around knocking dudes over.

[46:47] That sounds great.

[46:48] Nope.

[46:48] They made him like weirdly muscular.

[46:51] And the more they – like I like Hudson Theory.

[46:54] But like them moving around all digital style looks like dog shit.

[46:58] It's horrible.

Elliott Kalan

[46:59] And there is –

[47:00] Not into it.

[47:00] To say there are – you could have him – like you're saying, you could have him be an intimidating fighter just by him being super tough and just a big thing that will get you.

[47:08] And there are wrestlers who are just big dudes.

[47:10] Digital strongmen are like huge.

S3

[47:12] Yes.

[47:13] Stuart, what do you feel about the Hulk Hogan aesthetic?

[47:15] Do you like wrestlers?

[47:16] Did you like the Hulk Hogan character in the world of wrestling?

[47:19] Because the other thing about this – about Rod is he can't stop doing the Hulk Hogan like lifting his arms over his head and flexing and stuff.

Stuart Wellington

[47:25] I mean I like the idea of like a peacocking wrestler type guy.

[47:31] I think that's fine.

[47:32] But I think it would be better if he was just a giant blobby slug.

Elliott Kalan

[47:36] But also he doesn't – Jeremy Allen White's performance as Rod of the Hutt is – you don't believe this is a character who would be peacocking for the crowd.

[47:43] He seems like he's like, yeah, well, you know, I just want to live my life.

[47:45] I don't want to be – I just want to get out from under Jabba's shadow and be my own man somewhere in the universe.

[47:49] So I became a famous gladiator fighter.

[47:51] Yeah.

[47:52] That's the only way to do it.

[47:53] Let me kill people, please.

S3

[47:55] It would be funny if it turns out that he's just a showbiz guy.

[47:58] Like he's like – like he becomes a tap dancer.

[48:00] Like he's the first like song and dance Hutt.

[48:03] I would love that.

[48:04] That would be great.

Stuart Wellington

[48:04] I feel like a Jackie Chan type background.

Elliott Kalan

[48:07] Yeah.

[48:07] Yeah, exactly.

[48:08] Yeah, a kid forced to perform and then trained to be the greatest martial arts star of all time.

Dan McCoy

[48:13] Hutt tap dancing would even work.

S3

[48:15] I mean he would kind of be the only one on this planet who would do it.

[48:17] It would be – he's got to get little prosthetic feet.

Stuart Wellington

[48:20] Yeah, is Star Wars showing us something we haven't seen before again?

[48:23] That is true.

Elliott Kalan

[48:24] Well, speaking of his –

[48:26] We have yet to have a big good – I mean they tried in Return of the Jedi Special Edition.

[48:29] But we've yet to have like a really good cool big musical dance number in a Star Wars movie.

Dan McCoy

[48:34] Yeah.

[48:35] Speaking of his peacocking, it's his undoing.

[48:38] He's flexing for the crowd.

[48:39] But that allows Mando to get the upper hand.

[48:42] But he tosses his weapons away.

[48:45] He yields.

[48:46] He's like, oh, you know, Rata won, so let him go.

[48:51] Forcing Janu to, you know, enact his evil plan with both of them in the ring.

[48:56] And they'll both have to fight all these monsters that he floods the ring with.

[49:00] Stuart, you're shaking your head.

[49:02] I disagree.

[49:03] So, because this ends – like this – they have this gladiatorial fight between all these monsters.

[49:07] It ends with like one of them like managing to disable the electric fence that's keeping them in.

[49:15] And monsters then rampage over the Star Wars city.

[49:18] I'm like, yes.

[49:20] I've not seen monsters rampaging through a city in a Star Wars movie.

[49:23] I like this.

Stuart Wellington

[49:24] I'm with you.

[49:24] I'm shaking my head because the monsters of choice are a direct reference to the first Star Wars movie.

[49:30] They're the holograms they play.

[49:31] The chess piece, right?

Elliott Kalan

[49:33] Oh, yeah.

[49:33] And so you see them do some of the same things.

[49:35] And that was what bummed me out is that I'm like, oh, they're just doing that.

[49:38] Well, and what bummed me out was – that didn't bother me as much, although I got kind of bored of it.

[49:43] At first I was like, oh, that's funny that they use some of the guys from the hologram chess game.

[49:47] And they're doing the same moves even.

[49:49] But what bummed me out was the monsters go on the loose.

[49:52] In a movie that has a hero, the hero has to catch Rod of the Hut, right?

[49:57] But he keeps getting distracted by these monsters because he's got to round up these monsters and save the innocent civilians who are now being attacked by these monsters.

[50:05] Instead, the Mandalorian goes, I don't give a shit and just flies after Rod of the Hut, leaving behind people being, I have to assume, killed by these monsters.

[50:13] I mean –

[50:13] That was one of the –

Dan McCoy

[50:14] Look, I don't know whether they deserve death for it, but they were all coming to a blood sport.

Elliott Kalan

[50:19] Dan, Dan, those monsters – no, those monsters are out on the streets.

[50:21] There are people on the streets who – not everybody in town went to attend this gladiator battle.

[50:25] Like if it was – if I was – if there was like a Freddy versus Jason match in an arena and you dropped an innocent person into it, that audience, they are culpable in whatever happens.

[50:35] But if Freddy and Jason get loose and are rampaging through – they've left Madison Square Garden.

[50:39] They're rampaging through New York.

[50:40] Not everybody in New York was tuning into this blood sport match.

Stuart Wellington

[50:43] Now, is Freddy in the real world or is he in the dream world?

[50:46] Because that's going to be different.

[50:47] They brought him into the real world, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[50:48] He had fewer powers.

[50:50] They wanted to stop being polite and start getting real.

[50:52] Yeah.

[50:52] So this was one of a couple moments in the movie where I feel like one of the issues with the Star Wars franchise beyond the quality of the storytelling or the characters, whatever, is that the moral underpinning of the series has degraded over time in a way that I find really troubling.

[51:09] Where in the first movie it's like the Empire is obviously bad.

[51:12] They do bad things.

[51:13] They kill Luke's parents or his aunt and uncle.

[51:16] And the good guys are against that.

[51:17] The bad guys are all faceless or effectless, almost robotic figures.

[51:25] And the good guys stand for freedom, individuality, life, et cetera.

[51:29] Over time it has become that the good guys are just the good guys because we say they're the good guys.

[51:34] The bad guys are the bad guys because we say they're the bad guys.

[51:35] And in the Mandalorian movie, the Mandalorian does not act – he's not a heroic character.

[51:39] He doesn't help people.

[51:41] And by the end of it, it's like, well, I have to kill these two huts because they saw my face.

[51:46] And I'm like, well, that is not something I can stand behind.

[51:49] If you're supposed to be a hero, if this is a movie like Payback or Point Blank with Lee Marvin, then I go, okay, I buy it.

[51:56] But if it's a Star Wars movie, I cannot accept that.

Dan McCoy

[51:59] But he's a bounty hunter.

[52:00] That's the thing.

[52:01] He's a different type of lead character.

Elliott Kalan

[52:03] But then you shouldn't make the movie as if he is a heroic character, which they're trying to do.

S3

[52:07] I mean this is a pro-capitalism movie.

[52:09] He's a freelancer.

[52:10] He had clear terms for his contract and they were violated.

[52:15] And you are allowed to stand up for it.

[52:17] And also if you're there to get Rod of the Hut and that is what you are being compensated for, that's all you should do.

[52:23] This is the most capitalistic movie I've ever seen.

[52:26] Maybe.

[52:26] Star Wars has moved away from its Marxist, communist roots.

Dan McCoy

[52:31] But it's on the side of the workers.

[52:32] He's slaughtering his bosses because they have not held up the contract.

Elliott Kalan

[52:37] I don't know about that.

[52:38] What it really comes down to me is that is this moment where the Mandalorian just lets innocent people get attacked by monsters,

[52:44] which would have been a cooler sequence if he has to stop these monsters.

S3

[52:46] I think that isn't true because he violates his own contract all the time.

Elliott Kalan

[52:49] He violates it multiple times.

[52:50] He's bad at his job.

[52:51] But also at the end when – he's the one who violates the contract to be honest.

[52:55] He does actually.

[52:56] No, that's right.

[52:57] But also when he – they take his helmet off to shame him and he says – they go, ha ha, now you're an outcast because we've seen your face.

[53:03] And he goes, or I could just kill you.

[53:05] And is the audience supposed to be like, yeah, exactly.

[53:07] Go ahead and kill them because they saw your face.

[53:09] Like that's a bad rule.

[53:10] That's a dumb rule.

[53:11] And I can't – if he's a bounty hunter who is a morally gray character or he's the villain, I totally buy he would have this rule of if you see my face, I have to murder you.

[53:20] But to be like, well, he's the hero of the movie because he's got this cute kid with him.

[53:22] But if you see his face, he has to murder you.

[53:24] I don't buy it.

Dan McCoy

[53:25] This is not –

[53:26] I don't buy it.

[53:27] This does not bother me.

[53:28] I'm like, oh, yeah, he is a morally gray character who happens to be being used as a weapon for people we like.

[53:37] And he has a cute kid.

[53:38] But that doesn't mean he's not doing these bounty hunter things.

Elliott Kalan

[53:42] But then I think it has to – I just feel like the movie has to present him in that way.

[53:45] And I feel like the movie is not presenting him in that way.

[53:48] They're presenting him in that way by having him do these things.

S3

[53:50] They didn't bear down on this point.

[53:52] You're absolutely right, Elliot, in what you're saying.

[53:54] But I don't remember that as being like – when he took his mask off, I just was like, oh, they want us to see Pedro Pascal.

[54:00] I think that's true.

[54:01] They're just like, oh, these – the Hutt twins, as you say, every single thing they say is so clearly evil that we don't mind when they meet an untimely end.

[54:12] Whatever the logic of – you're right.

Elliott Kalan

[54:14] No, but I would so much rather if he was like, you lied to me, you ruined people's lives as opposed to, oh, you saw my face.

[54:22] I got to kill you.

[54:23] I have to admit also – and we can get off the plot.

[54:25] I apologize.

[54:26] I have to admit that also I can't erase the fact that I'm seeing this movie at this point in time where it feels like morality is degrading all around me in the world that I live in.

[54:35] And we live in a gangster country now that is run by a Hutt essentially.

[54:39] Like there's no – if there's any fictional character that Donald Trump reminds me of, it is Jabba the Hutt.

[54:44] And so to then – to be thrown into a Star Wars movie where part of the fantasy of Star Wars is not just I get to be in space and shoot lasers but also there's a world of good and evil.

[54:52] And good is fighting evil and good will triumph over evil.

[54:55] And so to be thrown into that – I feel like if this movie had come out during the Obama era, I'd be like, eh, whatever.

[54:59] But coming out now, I'm like, Star Wars, don't you succumb to the darkness as well.

[55:03] Like I don't want you to be corrupted the same way that the government and the Justice Department and big business and tech have been corrupted.

[55:09] So maybe that's it.

[55:10] Maybe that's why I'm so frustrated with it.

Dan McCoy

[55:13] Anyway.

[55:13] Or sensitive to it.

[55:14] Rada tries to take it on the run but they chase him.

[55:19] They get him with the help of Zeb, the pilot friend I guess who makes no impression.

Elliott Kalan

[55:26] He just kind of shows up when they need him and doesn't do anything else.

Dan McCoy

[55:29] Yeah.

[55:30] And Rada is like, don't take me back to my uncle and aunt I guess.

[55:35] Don't take me back.

[55:36] They just want to kill me so they can take over the family business which would normally fall to me even though I don't want it.

[55:45] And Mando is like, no, well, I got to give you to them to get the location of coin.

[55:51] And Rada is like, oh, I know who coin is.

[55:52] It's Janu.

[55:53] And this is the point where I'm like, look, I know this movie is going to be just a series of kind of unconnected quests.

[56:00] But you really make me feel like I'm wasting my time when you're like, oh, is that guy we just left?

[56:05] You know?

Elliott Kalan

[56:06] But it's not even like they have to scramble letters in his name or something.

[56:10] Janu Noyak, Janu coin.

[56:12] He just goes, oh, yeah, Janu coin.

[56:14] That's my boss.

[56:15] Yeah.

[56:16] He doesn't have to like pull a mask off or anything.

[56:18] No.

[56:19] It doesn't even reach the level of complexity of a Scooby-Doo plot figuring out who the bad guy is in this one.

[56:24] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[56:25] So they've done Janu's mansion.

Dan McCoy

[56:27] Yeah.

[56:28] It is – I love that he does have like a mansion like an 80s like drug lord in an action movie.

[56:34] And they're like, oh, there's a bunch of stormtroopers here.

[56:36] Checks out that he's like an empire guy.

[56:40] They just do a big raid.

[56:42] They just capture him.

[56:43] Yeah.

[56:43] They capture him.

Elliott Kalan

[56:44] The sequence I have no memory of even though I saw it less than a week ago.

Dan McCoy

[56:46] Well, there's some goofy comedy stuff with like they're trying to – you know, Mando's trying to explain to Grogu over the comms like I need you to get the ship running.

[56:55] Oh, right.

[56:55] Press this button.

[56:56] And like he just keeps pressing buttons that shoot missiles.

[56:59] Oh, you know what?

[57:00] That's pretty funny.

[57:01] I was amused.

Elliott Kalan

[57:02] Him shooting the missiles was funny and I did like the designs of the luxury land speeders which look like sports cars basically.

[57:08] Like I thought that would be funny.

Stuart Wellington

[57:09] I thought it was crazy that these fucking stormies are just blasting away at the land speeder that's carrying their boss.

[57:17] Their boss.

[57:19] I criticized the –

[57:19] Yeah, this open top land speeder.

[57:21] One of these will probably hit him.

Dan McCoy

[57:23] I criticized the comedy filmmaking with the gag earlier but I do think – I really enjoyed –

[57:29] The missile stuff was funny, yeah.

[57:30] Well, the fact that he's like, no, no, don't do that.

[57:33] That's why there's a protector over it and then he just does it with the second one that has a case on it.

[57:39] I'm like, okay, that's good.

Elliott Kalan

[57:40] It's funny that it goes from it was an accident to he just wants to do this.

[57:44] Like Grogu is a kid.

[57:46] This is the most kid behavior from him the whole movie where it's like, yeah, but I want to do it.

[57:49] So I'm going to do it.

[57:52] Anyway, so what happened?

Dan McCoy

[57:54] So that is a good moment.

[57:55] That is funny, yeah.

[57:56] I do remember that now.

[57:56] He gets these Anzellans.

[58:01] They're babies.

[58:02] They're four Babu Fricks is what it is.

[58:03] Yeah, Babu Fricks.

[58:05] Remember Babu Frick?

[58:05] There's four Babu Fricks.

Elliott Kalan

[58:06] And I don't remember Babu Frick being so much like the Minions from the Minion movies but that's – they talk just like the Minions.

Dan McCoy

[58:12] He was pretty.

[58:13] I mean like he was a little bit more like old man like –

[58:16] But it's also the thing of every Star Wars race is the same.

Elliott Kalan

[58:23] So Babu Frick seemed like he was a little old man.

[58:25] So his race is just little old man.

[58:26] I would have –

[58:27] Well, and they're all mechanics.

[58:28] And they're also all mechanics.

[58:30] They're all little old man mechanics.

Stuart Wellington

[58:33] So these guys show up and they're going to be part of the adventure later on and I would have loved if either A, there had been like a little bit more variety between the Babu Fricks.

[58:43] Sure.

[58:43] That you could tell them apart in any way.

[58:45] Or if they did cool stuff other than just hung out.

Dan McCoy

[58:48] Like if they like built some cool shit.

[58:50] I love that they're constantly doing like sort of Popeye-style chatter where like it's like –

[58:55] Most of it's like –

[58:56] And every once in a while you'll hear like actual words just talk to them.

[59:00] Come on, baby.

[59:00] They always call me baby.

Elliott Kalan

[59:01] Baby, this way, baby.

[59:03] This way, baby.

Stuart Wellington

[59:04] Like I like – I love all that.

[59:06] I just went like, hey, I'm very happy with the meal that's been given to me.

[59:11] But could I like for it to be more interesting?

[59:13] Yes, sure.

[59:13] Yes.

Elliott Kalan

[59:14] It could have been – you want a better meal than what's been getting even though it's filling your tummy.

[59:19] Yeah.

[59:19] But I do think – and I do like – another gag that I did think they pulled off well was when they're taking the Mandalorian to their ship at the end to escape and he sees the Babu Frick ship is tiny and he can't fit in it.

[59:29] Yes.

[59:29] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[59:31] But this augers the best – you know, like the best sort of stretch of the movie is about to show up, which is when the tiny little guys take over.

[59:43] Take over, yeah.

[59:43] Yes, yeah.

[59:44] But anyway.

Elliott Kalan

[59:45] When it essentially becomes Star Wars minions for a short period of time.

[59:48] Grogu and the minions, yeah.

[59:49] Yeah, hell yeah.

[59:50] Give it to me.

Dan McCoy

[59:53] So he drops off coin.

[59:56] Yeah, they go to like – what's his face?

[59:59] The Mandalorian, our main guy.

[1:00:02] What's his face?

[1:00:03] That's appropriate.

[1:00:04] They go to his little white house, right?

[1:00:06] His little –

[1:00:06] Yeah, he's like, I need a break.

[1:00:08] I need to take a little vacation.

[1:00:09] I need some R&R.

[1:00:11] So he goes off with Grogu to just hang out in your shack for a while.

[1:00:15] With the little Babu Frick dudes.

[1:00:17] Yeah.

[1:00:18] And a bounty hunter from the Hutt shows up.

[1:00:23] And I like the design of this bounty hunter.

[1:00:26] He's a space ninja, you know?

[1:00:28] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[1:00:28] He's kind of a little bit Kung Lao and he's also a little bit taller and he has like a hat that is armor basically.

Elliott Kalan

[1:00:35] He's a tall, thin guy.

[1:00:36] He's got one of those wide hats that you see in like Ninja Scroll.

[1:00:40] But he uses that as a shield, you know?

[1:00:42] Yeah.

[1:00:42] It's hard to tell whether he's a robot or not at times.

[1:00:45] Does he have any lines of dialogue?

[1:00:46] I don't think so.

[1:00:47] No, I don't think so.

[1:00:48] I don't remember if his name is ever mentioned.

[1:00:50] And he's got a pet wolf.

[1:00:51] He communicates menace.

S3

[1:00:52] Yeah.

[1:00:53] For a guy who doesn't speak.

[1:00:54] Like the visual design is effective.

[1:00:56] It's a great design.

Stuart Wellington

[1:00:57] As the kids would say, he is constantly aura farming.

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:00] No, the kids would say that.

[1:01:02] But he's the Boba Fett of this movie.

Dan McCoy

[1:01:04] Now, what kids have you been hanging out with, Stuart?

Stuart Wellington

[1:01:05] I'm concerned about this.

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:07] I mean, I'm assuming kids on the –

Stuart Wellington

[1:01:09] I'm assuming most of the people who are posting on the internet are kids these days.

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:13] Mm-hmm.

[1:01:14] But he is – what Boba Fett is to – like the Empire Strikes Back, this guy is to the Mandalorian.

[1:01:20] He's the cool-looking silent bounty hunter who comes to do the job.

[1:01:23] And again, he's got a pet wolf.

Dan McCoy

[1:01:25] And so the Mandalorian manages to, you know, shoo Grogu and the four little guys off to safety before he gets captured.

Elliott Kalan

[1:01:37] I'm going to look up what the name of that species is.

[1:01:38] We can't just keep calling them the Boba Fett.

Dan McCoy

[1:01:40] Well, no, they're – and I just don't know how to say it.

[1:01:42] It's A-N-Z-E-L-L-A-N-S.

[1:01:45] I have it in front of me.

[1:01:47] And Zellen.

[1:01:47] Okay, that's what it is.

[1:01:48] And Zellen.

[1:01:48] Yeah.

[1:01:50] But, you know, Mando's taken to the twins.

[1:01:54] They are – they've got Rada.

[1:01:56] He didn't escape.

[1:01:58] They're going to slowly torture him over his hut lifespan of hundreds of years by zapping him in the brain, it looks like.

[1:02:07] Oh, my God.

S3

[1:02:08] This movie is so dumb.

[1:02:09] And they –

[1:02:10] Just here you have to say the events that happen in order and there's no connective tissue.

[1:02:16] There's none.

Elliott Kalan

[1:02:17] No, there's – it really – I mean this is –

[1:02:19] It's just like the next cut scene begins.

[1:02:21] This is the big criticism the movie has gotten, which it feels like two episodes of a TV show slammed together.

[1:02:27] And I think we can't deny that criticism.

[1:02:30] Like it really does feel like two episodes of a TV show slammed together.

[1:02:32] Not even a good TV show.

S3

[1:02:33] Like there's no cause and effect.

[1:02:35] It's just like another toy enters.

Dan McCoy

[1:02:38] You know, Will, I can't disagree with you.

[1:02:41] But also like the dumb is what I like about it.

[1:02:44] So I don't know.

[1:02:45] It's a tough one for me.

S3

[1:02:47] The point you're at in the movie now.

[1:02:48] I got to say like you guys told me you have to go watch this movie for your – if you want to be on this podcast, you have to go watch this movie.

[1:02:53] This is the price you have to pay.

[1:02:55] So I did.

[1:02:57] And I was kind of excited to do it.

[1:02:58] But just because of my schedule, I ended up having to watch a 10.30 p.m. showing of The Mandalorian.

[1:03:03] Wow.

[1:03:04] Up at the Americana, which is a fine theater.

[1:03:09] Oh, that theater is fine.

[1:03:09] I wish you didn't have to pay for parking.

[1:03:11] Do more local LA stuff.

[1:03:12] Oh, it's quite – I love going to the Americana.

[1:03:14] I like buying tickets on the old app.

[1:03:16] Yeah, yeah.

[1:03:17] But at this point in the movie where it's about like 12.45 a.m., 12.30 a.m.

[1:03:22] And I'm sitting there and it's like – and I'm like – I looked up at the screen and I go, what is the problem?

[1:03:29] Like what – why are – what's happening that's bad?

[1:03:33] Like just can't everybody just go home and like – everybody's free and they're out and like what – why are we stressed?

[1:03:40] And it was just like so insane.

[1:03:42] Because the Hutts are never going to forget.

[1:03:44] They're crime lords.

[1:03:45] It's like if you're cool with people seeing your face, this movie is over.

Dan McCoy

[1:03:51] No, they – yeah.

[1:03:52] Well, they punish him, as you say, by removing his helmet.

[1:03:56] The ultimate shame.

[1:03:58] And they drop –

[1:03:58] Which again, he's like, I don't care.

[1:04:00] Go home.

[1:04:01] Revealing that face.

[1:04:02] That mustache.

[1:04:03] Yeah.

[1:04:05] And they drop him into a pit of water beneath them.

[1:04:10] Classic Hut move.

[1:04:11] Yep.

[1:04:12] Which –

[1:04:12] Well, even that, it's like –

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:13] I guess all Hutts have monster pits with trapdoors that they put people in when they're mad at them.

S3

[1:04:18] So when they're like a housewarming party, they're like, show me your pit.

[1:04:21] Ooh, nice.

[1:04:22] What kind of monster you got in there?

[1:04:24] Ooh, very nice.

[1:04:25] Very nice, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:04:26] And first he defeats –

[1:04:26] This is where the magic happens.

[1:04:30] Welcome to my pit.

[1:04:32] First, he defeats these smaller monsters.

[1:04:36] And, you know, you're like –

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:37] I did like –

[1:04:37] These are –

[1:04:38] So my understanding, these are Amanamans.

[1:04:40] Yep.

[1:04:40] Like the –

[1:04:41] Classic toys.

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:41] So they took a background character from Return of the Jedi and they made them into kind of like creature from the Black Lagoon type.

[1:04:46] Well, when do –

Dan McCoy

[1:04:47] I didn't recognize him.

[1:04:49] When would we have seen it in Jedi?

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:50] I mean, in Jedi, he is so far in the background of Jedi at Jabba's Palace.

[1:04:54] It is one of those –

Stuart Wellington

[1:04:55] I had a couple of the figures, so that's how I remembered.

[1:04:58] They made a toy –

[1:04:59] You can see –

Elliott Kalan

[1:04:59] He's got like a staff with a skull on it and that's easier to see.

[1:05:02] In the background than the actual figure.

[1:05:04] He is –

[1:05:05] Like if they hadn't made a toy of him, nobody would remember this.

[1:05:07] Yes.

[1:05:07] You could barely see it.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:08] I am vaguely seeing this Kenner toy in my head.

[1:05:12] Yeah.

[1:05:13] But to get back to the –

[1:05:14] So he defeats these and you're like, oh, you know, he's defeated –

[1:05:18] Oh, no, no, no, my friend.

[1:05:19] There's a big skull-headed water dragon that is in there.

[1:05:25] That I thought looks cool.

Stuart Wellington

[1:05:25] And this is like a direct like 70s sci-fi paperback cover, right?

[1:05:33] It looks – I mean it looks exactly like – if it isn't a direct lift, it looks so much like that.

[1:05:38] It looks like that kind of monster, yeah.

[1:05:39] Okay.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:41] Well, maybe that's why I liked it.

[1:05:41] It's some kind of monster from a 70s paperback cover.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:44] Sure.

Dan McCoy

[1:05:44] Because I thought it looked cool and I don't care.

[1:05:47] No, I mean it looks great.

[1:05:48] It looks really cool.

Elliott Kalan

[1:05:49] It looks really cool and that's some of the best effects in the movie I think are that creature.

[1:05:53] It was scary.

Stuart Wellington

[1:05:54] And in a otherwise fairly drab environment, it's this like pale, sickly white color, which is cool.

[1:06:01] Yeah.

[1:06:01] It's this pop of brightness.

Elliott Kalan

[1:06:03] And I think the fight between him and the Mandalorian is one of the better fights in the movie.

Dan McCoy

[1:06:06] And we haven't mentioned – so he's fighting it.

[1:06:09] He gets – he defeats it but it's like he's poisoned by the bite.

[1:06:14] I have not mentioned this point.

[1:06:15] He doesn't have his helmet on so you know Peter Buskel had to be in these scenes.

[1:06:18] Yeah.

[1:06:18] Grogu and the Amzelans have been on their own adventure flying in their tiny little spaceship.

Elliott Kalan

[1:06:27] Maybe this is part of the thing.

[1:06:29] There's so clearly things in this movie that are meant to appeal to children, which is Grogu, the Babu Fricks.

[1:06:34] To then have that being the same movie as the character who's like, you saw my face.

[1:06:37] I have to murder you.

[1:06:38] Yeah, that's fair.

[1:06:39] It's a clash of tones.

Dan McCoy

[1:06:40] That's true.

[1:06:40] I would agree that that's a clash of tones now that you pointed out.

[1:06:43] It's a clash of tones.

[1:06:44] I was primarily thinking of this as a kid's movie.

[1:06:48] You know, like –

[1:06:49] Yeah.

[1:06:49] And like I was going to save this to the end but like, you know, Lucas said, oh, these are movies for kids.

[1:06:56] And that was always kind of annoying when it felt like it was a justification for why the prequels were bad.

[1:07:03] Yeah.

[1:07:04] But now there's been so much Star Wars – like there have been so many movies made that I am fine with the idea of like, yeah, this one's for kids.

[1:07:12] Like maybe it's not pointed at me.

[1:07:14] It's pointed at like younger audiences and the dad who brought them.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:17] But if it's for kids, make it a movie for kids.

[1:07:19] You know, don't try to have it both ways.

[1:07:20] But anyway, so – but they're having their adventure.

[1:07:22] Grogu, the Babu Fricks, they're running around in the woods.

Dan McCoy

[1:07:25] It's like this is like little rubber guys running around.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:28] Yes.

[1:07:28] And just constantly, over here, baby.

[1:07:31] Come over here.

[1:07:31] Oh, no.

[1:07:32] Watch out.

[1:07:33] Oh, no.

Dan McCoy

[1:07:33] Like it is very fun.

[1:07:35] If the whole movie was that stuff, man, it would be one of my favorite Star Wars movies.

S3

[1:07:40] There's like a lot of subspecies in Star Wars where they just kind of mumble and throw a word out every now and then like the Jawas.

[1:07:46] Yeah.

[1:07:46] I think you could get them all together in a room and it would be so fun.

Elliott Kalan

[1:07:49] If you did a movie called – you did a series called Star Wars Little Guys and it's the Jawas, the Babu Fricks, Baby Yoda.

[1:07:55] It would be great.

[1:07:56] Oh, my gosh.

Stuart Wellington

[1:07:57] Especially if in the background you have, you know, the high stakes crazy stuff going on.

[1:08:02] But it's the little guys like doing the little stuff that's important.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:05] So here's my pitch for what I think would have made this a better movie.

[1:08:07] You call it Star Wars, Grogu and the Mandalorian.

[1:08:10] Grogu is the star of the movie.

[1:08:11] It is his point of view.

[1:08:13] The Mandalorian stuff is kind of happening in the background.

[1:08:15] And so he's – but you're seeing like Grogu dealing with stuff.

[1:08:18] You get more of the fun stuff and less of the dumb stuff.

Dan McCoy

[1:08:20] No, no, I'm shaking my head because I'm like, man, like I think I enjoyed this movie more than you guys.

[1:08:25] But like this is the version of the movie that would have been great.

[1:08:29] Yeah.

[1:08:29] I cannot argue that you have fixed it in one idea.

Elliott Kalan

[1:08:34] Flip that title.

[1:08:35] Flip the billing.

[1:08:36] What is the – does Jin Jajaran – he has to have top billing all the time?

[1:08:39] Is that in his contract or what?

Dan McCoy

[1:08:40] But anyway, Grogu and the Anzalians arrive in time to get Mando out of like the pit he's trapped in.

[1:08:48] They all run off.

[1:08:50] You know, like Mando is poisoned at this point obviously.

[1:08:53] So he's – you know that he's in danger still.

[1:08:56] But like he's still got his strength enough to run away.

[1:08:58] And there's the great gag that Elliot mentioned before where he like goes to the spaceship.

[1:09:02] He's like, oh, I can't fit in that spaceship.

[1:09:05] That's for little guys like you.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:07] Because the spaceship is the size of a box that like the toy Millennium Falcon would have come in.

[1:09:10] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:09:10] So he tells them to go.

[1:09:13] He tells Grogu to go.

[1:09:15] We don't see Grogu going notably.

[1:09:17] Is that going to be important?

[1:09:20] We know we ain't going anywhere.

[1:09:21] No, come on.

[1:09:22] The Groguster –

[1:09:23] The Mandalorian shoots a bunch of people and then collapses.

[1:09:27] By people – we're talking about battle droids.

[1:09:29] They're all robots.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:31] At this point at least – from this point in the movie except for the two huts, anything he's shooting is a robot pretty much, right?

Dan McCoy

[1:09:36] Yeah.

[1:09:37] And so Grogu uses his force powers to like heal the wound but the poison's still in there.

[1:09:46] Like Mando's like basically in a coma at this point.

Elliott Kalan

[1:09:49] There's a very funny part where he makes like a hut to store – not a Jabba the Hutt.

[1:09:54] Yeah, thank you.

[1:09:54] He's not dwelling to store Mandalorian in and he's using his force to move him but the hut is not big enough and he keeps bonking Mandalorian's head against the back of the hut.

[1:10:01] Yeah.

[1:10:01] I'm like more of this, please.

[1:10:03] A lot more of this.

Dan McCoy

[1:10:05] Yeah.

[1:10:06] And then there's like a whole sequence where sort of Grogu's left to sort of fend for himself and care for the sick Mandalorian and he keeps running off to a local fisherman on the planet.

Elliott Kalan

[1:10:19] This character I found a little confusing about – just because it was like, oh, so there's other people on the planet who are not part of the hut kind of world?

[1:10:27] I guess there would have to be.

[1:10:28] It's a planet.

Dan McCoy

[1:10:29] No, that would make sense in a normal movie but in Star Wars that doesn't –

[1:10:32] Star Wars is very weird, yeah.

[1:10:33] Compute.

[1:10:34] Yeah.

S3

[1:10:35] I got to say this is very akin to the Beatles movie Hard Day's Night when Ringo breaks off from the band and walks around by himself.

[1:10:42] And it's like this sequence of kind of sweetness and innocence and it's also a break from all the loud mania.

[1:10:48] And it ends up being a lot of people's like favorite part of the movie.

[1:10:51] Not that it's got everything you want but it's such an oasis of joy and calmness.

[1:10:59] That's what – this is like – Grogu was like the Ringo of this group in a good way.

[1:11:02] In a good way.

[1:11:02] It's like just let me just – I don't need to see John Lennon cracking wise.

Elliott Kalan

[1:11:06] Let me see Ringo being sweet and earnest walking around.

[1:11:09] It is – it's such a – we can talk about the Beatles for a moment.

[1:11:11] One, I love that section of that movie.

[1:11:12] I mean that's a great movie but I love that section of the movie.

[1:11:14] But also what a – you have to give Ringo credit for having the understanding and not the like the ego that he's like, oh, if I'm portrayed as this kind of like simpler member of the Beatles who's not the fast-talking, fast-thinker.

[1:11:31] And I just have this moment where I'm kind of worrying about myself a little bit like that it's going to look great as opposed to like, well, I don't look cool in this section.

[1:11:37] Hold on a second.

[1:11:38] Because it really does seem like a lost child whose parents have let him wander away.

[1:11:43] He's like, well, I'm the third most popular member – at that time I guess the most popular member of the band, right?

[1:11:49] Because they always say he would get the most fan mail or something like that.

S3

[1:11:52] I mean there's nobody in the history of the human race who played the cards they were dealt better than Richard Starkey.

[1:11:59] That's true.

[1:12:00] You're a mediocre drummer in one of the least famous cities on earth.

[1:12:06] And you will become the most beloved human.

[1:12:10] If you and Paul McCartney walk into a room, they're more excited to see you.

Dan McCoy

[1:12:14] He's not a great technical drummer.

[1:12:15] He's not a great technical drummer.

[1:12:16] That's what I'm saying.

[1:12:17] That's what I'm saying.

[1:12:17] He brings a lot of joy to a scene.

[1:12:18] I would argue that he knew exactly what the songs needed.

[1:12:20] He was great with the Beatles.

S3

[1:12:21] Played the cards that he was dealt.

[1:12:23] You never have to do a complicated fill in your life.

Elliott Kalan

[1:12:27] Stuart is looking at his phone.

[1:12:30] Like the Beatles?

[1:12:34] Ringo is like, I'm on it.

[1:12:35] I'm on it.

[1:12:36] In a band where the third genius is George Harrison.

[1:12:40] I am working with three geniuses.

[1:12:42] I do not have to be a genius.

[1:12:44] I just got to be adorable.

[1:12:46] You know?

[1:12:47] So with them, be adorable.

[1:12:49] Eventually quit the band.

[1:12:50] Then kind of come back.

[1:12:51] And then who knows?

[1:12:52] And all that stuff.

Dan McCoy

[1:12:52] Let's take a trip back to Nalhuda and talk about how – so the whole point of this Fisherman character.

[1:13:00] So the –

Elliott Kalan

[1:13:00] Will, how would the movie be different if the Beatles were in it?

[1:13:02] Where would you put the Beatles?

[1:13:03] If you were either casting this movie in the 60s and you had to put the Beatles in, who would they play?

[1:13:08] Or would the Beatles be characters in the movie?

S3

[1:13:11] I mean, none of these characters are as interesting as the Beatles.

[1:13:13] But if I had to do it, I think I'd make the Mandalorian George because I think George is the most amoral Beatle.

[1:13:20] What?

[1:13:21] I think so.

Elliott Kalan

[1:13:22] Even with all his spirituality and all that?

S3

[1:13:24] Yes.

[1:13:24] He just was the most grumpy and kind of like, let's get on with it.

[1:13:27] Like I think he would leave everybody to die in the streets.

[1:13:29] Come on.

Elliott Kalan

[1:13:30] Not all the time.

S3

[1:13:33] George Harrison was the most like shoulder shrugging like, who cares?

[1:13:36] Want to go home and go to sleep?

[1:13:37] I think.

[1:13:39] Okay.

[1:13:40] Like when the Beatles got together in the 90s.

[1:13:41] I would make the quietest.

Dan McCoy

[1:13:42] That would be the argument for beating the Mandalorian in mind.

[1:13:44] Well, if you're both agreeing, it doesn't matter how you got there.

[1:13:46] George is amoral.

S3

[1:13:47] Okay.

[1:13:48] But I think he's the Mandalorian.

[1:13:50] Grogu's Ringo.

[1:13:52] Paul is the guy on the ship who's like flapping his arms around a lot and really doing a lot of activity, but we don't need him.

[1:13:59] And John Lennon is.

Elliott Kalan

[1:14:00] You know, you could have gotten a little bit easier on here.

[1:14:02] That kind of stuff.

[1:14:03] Yeah.

S3

[1:14:03] And I don't know who John.

[1:14:04] I guess John Lennon's Radha.

[1:14:05] I don't know where else to put John.

Elliott Kalan

[1:14:07] See, I think I might put.

S3

[1:14:08] Maybe John Sigourney Weaver.

[1:14:09] I don't know.

Elliott Kalan

[1:14:10] Maybe.

[1:14:10] I think I might put.

[1:14:12] Let's see.

[1:14:13] You know, I might make George Radha.

S3

[1:14:15] Okay.

[1:14:16] That's funny.

Elliott Kalan

[1:14:17] And Paul would be Grogu.

[1:14:19] I can't figure it out.

[1:14:20] No, I can't.

[1:14:20] I can't do it.

[1:14:21] Okay.

[1:14:21] I don't know.

[1:14:22] Ringo is really Grogu.

[1:14:23] Yeah.

S3

[1:14:24] Ringo's Grogu.

[1:14:25] It could be John is the Mandalorian.

[1:14:27] Paul is Radha.

[1:14:29] And George could be the Hutt twins.

Dan McCoy

[1:14:31] Hey, let's take this.

[1:14:32] Let's take this long and winding road back to Nalhutta where Grogu is.

[1:14:37] The whole point of this fisherman character is he's just there to give Grogu some magic medicine.

[1:14:45] Yeah.

[1:14:45] The antidote to the poison.

[1:14:46] And so he takes it back, gives it to the Mandalorian who wakes up and they go to the ship and he's like, we got two options here, kid.

[1:14:57] We can go on the run and we'll always be on the run or we can stay and fight.

[1:15:02] And Grogu's like, hell yeah, brother.

[1:15:05] He doesn't say it.

[1:15:05] No.

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:06] He's like, goo goo ga ga, let's fight.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:08] Grogu needs blood.

[1:15:10] He pulls out, you know, he like puts on his little gizmo from Gremlins 2 headband.

[1:15:15] I mean, 10,000%.

[1:15:17] I wish.

Stuart Wellington

[1:15:18] Gizmo walked so Grogu could run.

[1:15:20] There is no question.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:22] Yeah.

[1:15:24] So they break back into the twins palace.

[1:15:28] They battle through the droids out there.

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:31] I didn't even realize this bounty hunter that is coming after him throughout this, he's from other Star Wars.

[1:15:37] He was in Clone Wars and stuff like that.

[1:15:39] I didn't realize that.

[1:15:39] So this is not a first appearance.

Stuart Wellington

[1:15:41] Design wise, he feels very of a piece of the Clone Wars.

Dan McCoy

[1:15:45] It's my understanding that the new guy, the new Star Wars guy in charge is very keen on bringing back a lot of these Clone Wars things.

Elliott Kalan

[1:15:53] Yes, because that's what, Clone Wars was his thing.

[1:15:55] Yeah.

[1:15:56] Yeah, so he wants to bring those characters.

[1:15:57] But not knowing the Clone Wars at all, I was like, oh, that's a cool new guy.

[1:16:00] I guess I'll never know what his name is.

[1:16:01] But he was introduced in some other thing, you know.

Dan McCoy

[1:16:05] I don't care much about the stuff that happens in this last action sequence other than we get these two giant robots that are Phil Tippett animated things.

[1:16:17] Those seemed very Warhammer-y, those two giant robots.

[1:16:20] And that was cool.

[1:16:22] I like to see the stop motion on those things.

Elliott Kalan

[1:16:24] Yeah, and Grogu helps the Mandalorian to defeat them.

Stuart Wellington

[1:16:27] Yeah, yeah.

[1:16:28] The young protect the old and the old protect the young.

[1:16:30] That's the way, right?

[1:16:32] That is the way.

[1:16:33] Never take off your mask.

[1:16:34] That's wrong by fastball, actually.

Dan McCoy

[1:16:37] Oh, never mind.

[1:16:40] I don't know.

[1:16:41] They fight their way in.

[1:16:43] They free Rada.

[1:16:44] They fight the twins.

[1:16:45] Rada fights the twins.

[1:16:46] They all collapse into the pit.

[1:16:47] It's a big fight.

Elliott Kalan

[1:16:48] Everyone's split up into their different fights.

[1:16:50] So Mando is fighting Embo.

[1:16:52] Rada is fighting his aunt and uncle.

[1:16:54] Grogu is, I don't know what he's doing.

Dan McCoy

[1:16:56] Harpo is fighting Chico.

Elliott Kalan

[1:16:57] Harpo is fighting Chico.

[1:16:59] Harpo punches Margaret Dumas.

[1:17:01] Punches the old lady that he's playing cards with.

[1:17:03] Oh, yes, you can't take it there.

[1:17:04] Punches Margaret Dumas.

[1:17:07] He does.

Dan McCoy

[1:17:09] He does?

[1:17:10] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:11] Is it Margaret Dumas or is it the other woman that he punches?

[1:17:13] I can never remember.

[1:17:14] But they're playing cards.

[1:17:15] Yeah, you're right.

[1:17:16] It's not Margaret Dumas.

[1:17:17] It's one of the women in the card.

[1:17:18] And he instigates a fist fight and he punches her in the stomach so hard that it lifts her

[1:17:21] off the ground.

[1:17:22] And Chico goes, oh, yes, you can't take it there.

[1:17:24] It's...

[1:17:25] It's...

[1:17:27] It is such comedy fighting.

Dan McCoy

[1:17:30] Yeah, I mean, it's ridiculous.

[1:17:32] I feel bad we're all laughing at it.

[1:17:33] At no point do you think he's really hurt this person.

[1:17:35] Yeah, yeah, no.

[1:17:35] It is all very, very silly.

[1:17:37] It's clearly a gag.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:37] It was not a thing he did on set because he was so into the Harpo character and they left

[1:17:41] it in, you know.

[1:17:44] Anyway.

[1:17:45] Anyway, they're all fighting.

[1:17:46] They all collapse into the pool of...

[1:17:49] Yeah.

[1:17:49] Yeah, so the dragon's tank is going to kill them all.

Dan McCoy

[1:17:51] Yeah.

[1:17:52] Force powers to pull Rada up.

[1:17:55] So Rada is safe.

[1:17:57] So the good guys are safe and the bad guys are worm-based.

Elliott Kalan

[1:17:59] The bounty hunter just goes like, peace out.

[1:18:03] Just leaves.

[1:18:03] Yeah.

[1:18:04] Yeah.

[1:18:04] You paid me to fight for you, not to save you.

[1:18:07] He should have said that, but he doesn't talk, so.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:08] They got to escape.

[1:18:10] And so they call in the...

[1:18:15] No, they get out.

[1:18:16] Or they just appear.

Elliott Kalan

[1:18:17] They just show up.

[1:18:18] And they do an airstrike.

[1:18:19] They're like, we got to blow up the Hutt Palace.

[1:18:21] And they're like, but we're in the Hutt Palace.

[1:18:24] Well, we got to get out in time.

[1:18:25] And so they have to Butch Cassidy jump from a high point as the guy blows up behind him.

[1:18:29] It's so dumb.

Stuart Wellington

[1:18:30] They fire on his location.

[1:18:32] And they're like, are you sure, dude?

[1:18:33] And he's like, never been sure.

[1:18:34] Are you sure?

[1:18:35] We can't do that.

Dan McCoy

[1:18:36] Yeah.

[1:18:36] This is the beat of the movie.

[1:18:38] 100% I would lose if I was in charge.

[1:18:42] Yes.

[1:18:42] Like, it feels so much like, well, it's a Star Wars movie.

[1:18:47] It's got to end with some, like, X-Wings coming and shooting something.

[1:18:50] Yeah.

[1:18:50] But we don't need it at all.

Elliott Kalan

[1:18:52] It's so unnecessary.

[1:18:54] It raises even more questions for me about, like, so the mission of the X-Wings now, they're

[1:18:58] going to activate an entire X-Wing squadron to save this, like, free agent bounty hunter

[1:19:04] who keeps screwing things up for them.

[1:19:05] Like, they just blow up this hut building for no real reason since the huts have just been

[1:19:10] eaten by a giant snake.

[1:19:11] You know, there's no – it's just totally unnecessary.

[1:19:13] And they jump from a high height and Rado's like, that moat isn't that deep.

[1:19:17] But, of course, they're fine.

[1:19:18] It doesn't matter.

[1:19:19] It's just a waste.

Dan McCoy

[1:19:21] Who cares?

[1:19:21] Well, we learn after the fact, as I said before, they were feeding information to the Empire.

[1:19:26] Yes.

[1:19:26] So that's when they had to take them out, you know.

[1:19:28] But, yeah, Rado stays and decides to work with New Republic folks.

[1:19:35] And what's his name?

Elliott Kalan

[1:19:36] The co-pilot or whatever pilot is like, I think I've got a suit that'll fit you.

[1:19:39] It's like, no, you don't.

[1:19:40] Look at this guy.

[1:19:40] That's weird.

[1:19:41] He's wearing a New Republic muumuu.

[1:19:43] Like, there's no suit, flight suit that fits a guy with his slug body shape.

[1:19:47] Come on.

Dan McCoy

[1:19:49] Mando and Grogu is what I meant to say.

[1:19:51] They get in their ship and fly off into a new adventure.

[1:19:55] Mandalorian Season 4, who knows?

[1:19:57] Maybe that's where they're going.

[1:19:59] Maybe.

[1:19:59] That's it.

[1:20:01] That's the story.

[1:20:02] That's the movie.

Elliott Kalan

[1:20:03] So to boil it down.

[1:20:04] The Mandalorian and Grogu.

[1:20:05] As we said, to boil it down, the plot of this movie is the Mandalorian takes on a job,

[1:20:10] messes it up, gets in trouble, gets saved from messing up the job.

[1:20:15] End of the movie.

[1:20:16] And, like, if this was a – I could see a version of this where it's a stripped-down crime thriller version of a Star Wars movie

[1:20:22] where it works really well.

[1:20:24] But it still has to be so big and end with an X-wing blow-up at the end.

[1:20:28] And it's just – it's – yeah.

[1:20:29] It's a – the movie doesn't fit the – it's like – sometimes you see a movie and you're like,

[1:20:33] oh, this is like 10 pounds a movie in a five-pound bag.

[1:20:35] They put so much stuff.

[1:20:36] This feels very much like three pounds a movie in a 20-pound bag where you're like,

[1:20:39] I can't even find the movie in the bag.

[1:20:41] Yeah.

[1:20:42] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:20:43] Let's – we're, you know, we're trending there already.

[1:20:46] Let's do our final judgments whether this was a good, bad movie, a bad, bad movie, or a movie we kind of liked.

[1:20:52] I'm going to say that, like, yeah, what you're saying is correct.

[1:20:56] The biggest problem that this movie has, I think, is it doesn't justify why it's a movie.

[1:21:01] Yeah.

[1:21:01] Like, it doesn't feel like a movie.

[1:21:05] And I'm not saying the stakes have to be high, but there has to be a character arc.

[1:21:11] You know, like, it has to feel like things are happening sort of in a inevitable progression rather than like –

[1:21:19] and then this thing happened and then this thing happened.

[1:21:20] It has to feel like there's a story.

Elliott Kalan

[1:21:22] It is telling you a story, you know, and it just doesn't really feel like it's doing that.

Dan McCoy

[1:21:25] That said, I kind of like this movie.

[1:21:28] I think that it benefited from me having pretty rock-bottom expectations.

[1:21:33] I'm at a point now where, like, I still love the Star Wars stuff I love and the rest of Star Wars stuff, new Star Wars stuff.

[1:21:42] I don't know.

[1:21:42] Maybe I'll check in on it if there's a reason to, but I don't care that much anymore.

[1:21:47] So having those low expectations and feeling like, oh, this is a movie for kids, not necessarily for me, as I said before.

[1:21:55] I enjoyed it enough, particularly the stuff with the little guys.

[1:22:01] My whole Letterboxd review was, quote, let's do a silly one.

[1:22:05] And that's the way I felt about all that stuff where it's like, yeah, we can be a little goofy here.

[1:22:10] So, you know, I have almost already forgotten about it, as you can see from my trying to summarize it.

[1:22:19] But I enjoyed it enough while I watched it.

[1:22:21] What, Elliot, you give a –

Elliott Kalan

[1:22:23] Oh, sure.

[1:22:24] I'm going to say that similar to the movie Solo, I think that this was not a Star Wars movie and was otherwise the same movie.

[1:22:32] I probably would have liked it more.

[1:22:34] If it was just like this bounty hunter episode of an adventure in a far-off space fantasy world.

[1:22:39] But I think once you slap the Star Wars name on it and are in that world, even after the devaluation that that world has had over the past 20-some-odd years, I still feel like I'm expecting a little bit more.

[1:22:51] I'm expecting something a little bit more magical, a little more special.

[1:22:54] And I think this is the first Star Wars movie where I dozed off for like a minute in the middle of it while seeing it.

[1:22:59] Like this is the first – like seeing this with my – this was my son's first Star Wars movie that he was seeing in the theaters.

[1:23:05] And he seemed pretty kind of like not that engaged by it.

[1:23:08] And so even if this is supposed to be like one for the kids, like it didn't satisfy the kid.

[1:23:13] I was curious about that.

[1:23:15] Yeah.

[1:23:15] Afterwards, he was – I was like, did you like it?

[1:23:17] And he goes, it was okay.

[1:23:18] And like –

[1:23:18] That's pretty fair.

[1:23:19] How old is your son?

[1:23:21] He's seven and a half.

[1:23:22] Okay.

[1:23:23] But he's seen the other movies and he got so into the world of Star Wars as a thing to know about.

[1:23:28] Yeah.

[1:23:29] He liked the original movie so much.

[1:23:31] And so I think – and then there's that – for me at least, there's that tinge of like if this is the one for kids, why is this the one where the hero is supposed to be the morally gray character who has to kill to protect the memory of what his face looks like and things like that?

[1:23:46] It feels like this movie is – it's like a mishmash.

[1:23:48] And so I'm going to call it a bad, bad movie, but it's – we've seen worse movies.

[1:23:51] It's not like I was – while we were watching it, I was not like, ugh, ugh, ugh.

[1:23:56] Instead, I was just like, eh, all right.

[1:23:58] I wish they had – I wish they had like just tried a little harder instead of – it felt a lot like, oh, we have the release date for the Mandalorian movie, so we got to get something done.

[1:24:08] Yeah.

[1:24:08] As opposed to what's the greatest, coolest story we could tell with these characters or what's one moment with them that's going to be so memorable that we got to put it on the big screen because it's going to be so cool.

[1:24:19] Yeah.

[1:24:19] And that's the kind of stuff that I hope for when I see a Star Wars movie.

[1:24:22] Stu, Will, what do you think?

Stuart Wellington

[1:24:24] Yeah.

[1:24:24] I mean that's – I'm going to jump in.

[1:24:26] I'm going to say this is a movie that is just about a movie I kind of liked.

[1:24:32] I feel like it wastes a little bit too much time in a bunch of places.

[1:24:37] And as much as I like – you know, when I – watching the original Star Wars movies, like that stuff would be – like the establishing shots was the stuff that got me so excited.

[1:24:47] I feel like that – like I've kind of lost a little bit of that now.

[1:24:51] I don't know why.

[1:24:51] Maybe something changed inside me.

[1:24:53] But all the stuff with the little guys I was a big fan of and – but yeah.

[1:24:59] Yeah.

[1:24:59] I don't need to see a jacked hut.

[1:25:00] I'm not into that.

[1:25:03] Somebody is.

[1:25:04] Are you sure?

[1:25:04] But yeah, it's kind of missing any – it's missing any like magical moments that I feel like even – you know, I feel like Last Jedi had a few moments that were like, oh, wow, that's pretty crazy.

[1:25:18] To even – or what's the one with the prequel one?

[1:25:25] Oh, damn it.

[1:25:27] The one that Chris wrote?

[1:25:29] Yeah, yeah.

[1:25:29] Yeah, Rogue One.

[1:25:30] Yeah, I think that had some good stuff in it too.

[1:25:32] But yeah, I don't know.

[1:25:34] Yeah.

[1:25:34] This one didn't really have any magical moments for me.

Elliott Kalan

[1:25:38] Will, when you were just watching the movie, you just texted me, call the Oscars.

[1:25:41] So what did that mean?

S3

[1:25:44] It's a five-star transcendent statement of where we are as a country.

[1:25:50] It's a statement of what the Star Wars franchise should be.

[1:25:52] No, I'm only kidding.

[1:25:53] This movie forgot to exist.

[1:25:55] It's a bad, bad movie.

[1:25:57] It's sort of the equivalent of –

[1:25:58] Yeah, it forgot to have any point of view or stance or comment really on anything at all.

[1:26:04] It is like watching somebody else play with action figures for two hours and you have to every now and then be like, why is that guy doing that?

[1:26:12] And the kid kind of goes like, well, because he's bad.

[1:26:15] And it's like, okay.

[1:26:17] And that's what it was like for me.

[1:26:19] And again, it probably influenced that I started watching it at 11 o'clock at night.

[1:26:24] And so this movie finished at 1.12 a.m.

[1:26:27] And I've never been more glad to see the closing credits come up.

[1:26:29] I was like, thank God.

Dan McCoy

[1:26:30] And I just got out of there.

[1:26:32] And you're still tired from it.

S3

[1:26:34] I'll never recover.

[1:26:36] So it's a little bit of an unfair review.

[1:26:37] But I'm going to say it's not – it's inoffensive more than bad.

[1:26:41] But I'll say bad, bad movie.

Elliott Kalan

[1:26:43] I feel like we live in a world right now where the general feeling in terms of consumer products,

[1:26:49] things that are sold to people or stories they're told to people is that's good enough.

[1:26:53] This will be good enough.

[1:26:54] And I feel like Mandalorian broker is the equivalent to that.

[1:26:56] It's not terrible.

[1:26:58] But it's like this is good enough.

S3

[1:26:59] To me, it's like the smartest kid in class wrote a term paper an hour before it was due

[1:27:04] just so that he didn't get in trouble.

[1:27:07] It's like this is all right.

[1:27:08] I don't know.

[1:27:09] You obviously were not inspired when you did this.

[1:27:11] And there's enough glimmers of competence in here that I see you could do something interesting,

[1:27:16] but you didn't do it here.

[1:27:18] Jon Favreau is generally competent enough.

[1:27:21] I think the first season of Mandalorian is a really good time.

[1:27:24] And earned its runtime, basically.

[1:27:29] I don't think I needed any more seasons of it, but it was a delight.

[1:27:32] And it had a nice, simple story that a lot of Star Wars stuff didn't have,

[1:27:38] and it wasn't exposition heavy.

[1:27:40] And I thought it was...

[1:27:41] It did a Star Wars thing that I had not seen done before in a nice enough way.

[1:27:47] And this is sort of like a video game cut scene that goes on for two hours and 12 minutes.

[1:27:53] Put that on the poster.

Dan McCoy

[1:27:54] Yeah.

[1:27:54] All fair.

S3

[1:28:01] Sunscreen companies calculate SPF by testing it on volunteers' butts.

Elliott Kalan

[1:28:05] There is a can of spam in the Mariana Trench.

Dan McCoy

[1:28:08] A Nobel Prize winning physicist from the Manhattan Project invented modern speed bumps.

S5

[1:28:14] Mesoamerican native people invented kidney medicine that glows in the dark.

[1:28:18] On the podcast, Secretly Incredibly Fascinating, we explore this kind of amazing stuff.

[1:28:22] Stuff about ordinary topics like sunscreen and spam and speed bumps.

[1:28:27] Topics you'd never expect to be.

[1:28:29] The title of the podcast, Secretly Incredibly Fascinating.

Dan McCoy

[1:28:32] Find us by searching for the word secretly in your podcast app.

S5

[1:28:36] And at MaximumFun.org.

[1:28:42] If you like too many podcasts, you'll love Soundteap with John Luke Roberts.

[1:28:47] It's got clips from all your favourite podcasts such as Diary of a Tiny CEO.

S3

[1:28:51] Leonard Sprague, tell me how you make your money.

Elliott Kalan

[1:28:53] I go to the beach and I steal people's towels.

[1:28:57] Remember Armour.

S3

[1:28:58] I remember the trend of everyone whacking themselves on the head with hammers and mallets when they wanted to lose weight.

S5

[1:29:04] And Elty John's Lobbly Songs.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:06] I'm here today with Kiki D.

[1:29:08] Hello, Kiki D.

[1:29:10] Hello, Elton.

S5

[1:29:11] There's dozens of episodes to catch up on and brand new episodes going out right now.

[1:29:16] So if you want far, far, far too many podcasts, then look for Soundteap on Maximum Fun.

[1:29:23] Boop, boop.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:25] I'm going to take a moment to talk to you about Factor.

[1:29:29] The Flophouse is sponsored in part by Factor.

[1:29:32] I'm not just randomly bringing it up, guys.

[1:29:34] They're helping us.

[1:29:36] The show that we're on and you love.

Elliott Kalan

[1:29:39] They have paid us money to talk about them and why we like them.

[1:29:42] And we are going to do it.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:43] Luckily, we do like them.

Elliott Kalan

[1:29:45] Luckily, we do like them.

[1:29:46] Luckily, this is a product we do like.

[1:29:47] So that money is just the icing on the cake.

[1:29:49] The money icing.

Dan McCoy

[1:29:50] You know, eating well can be hard.

[1:29:53] But sometimes that's not about willpower.

[1:29:56] It's about setup.

[1:29:57] You got to have the stuff around.

[1:30:00] You got to have it easy to make.

[1:30:02] You can't, you know, you want to put as few impediments in your way if you want to eat well.

[1:30:06] Factor can help you hit your goals this season without planning grocery runs or cooking because they've got meals built around your nutrition goals.

[1:30:16] What goals might those be?

[1:30:17] They've got high fiber stuff, high protein, carb conscious options for strength and workout recovery.

[1:30:25] Stuart Wellington.

[1:30:26] Check out Factor's Muscle Pro collection.

[1:30:30] Factor is fresh, never frozen, over 100 rotating weekly meals, including globally inspired flavors like Asian and Mediterranean.

[1:30:39] So there's always something new to look forward to.

[1:30:42] And you don't have to go out and get it.

[1:30:44] Ooh, boo, boo, the outside world.

[1:30:47] Actually, as someone who works from home, I would love to go out in the outside world more.

[1:30:51] But most people don't have that problem.

[1:30:53] So they're delivered straight to your door and they're ready to eat in two minutes.

[1:30:57] So you have more time for everything you love this spring.

[1:31:02] I have eaten and enjoyed these meals.

[1:31:06] I can have high standards when it comes to foods.

[1:31:10] I don't typically enjoy pre-made stuff, but I have enjoyed these Factor meals quite a bit and I have enjoyed their convenience even more.

[1:31:19] So head to factormeals.com slash flop50off, that's the numeral 50,

[1:31:25] and use code FLOP50OFF to get 50% off and free daily greens per box with new subscription only while supplies last until September 27, 2026.

[1:31:39] See website for more details.

[1:31:43] Are you looking to connect with your family?

Stuart Wellington

[1:31:46] You know, our brains make memories, but we forget those sometimes, especially as we get older and we're parents.

[1:31:53] Probably me.

[1:31:55] One way to keep those memories front of brain is with photos.

[1:31:59] And one way to share those photos is with aura frames.

[1:32:03] The great thing about the gift of an aura frame is you can preload all the photos and add a gift message before it ships so that your dad can put that on the shelf when his friends come over and say,

[1:32:12] Hey, look at my cool kid.

[1:32:13] And he doesn't have to pull up his phone and pull up his Instagram and show you the pictures.

[1:32:18] He's got them on the frame and they just show him those pictures.

Dan McCoy

[1:32:21] His friends are going to have lost interest by that point.

[1:32:23] If you got to put those in.

Stuart Wellington

[1:32:25] No, you can have those photos on display in his aura frame.

[1:32:30] You can also share your photos and videos effortlessly.

[1:32:34] You can download the app on your phone and text the photos straight to the frame.

[1:32:38] So you don't have to worry.

[1:32:40] You can cut out the middleman.

[1:32:41] You do not have to worry about your parents figuring that sort of thing out.

[1:32:45] And you can keep adding anytime from anywhere.

[1:32:49] So maybe you get caught up in some kind of international game of esumenage and you're trapped and you need to – the only way you can survive is by sending an image of yourself to your parents' aura frame.

[1:33:00] You can do that from anywhere.

[1:33:02] That's actually a pretty good idea for like a movie thing.

Dan McCoy

[1:33:05] Anyway.

Stuart Wellington

[1:33:06] Now, this is an easy way to shop for your parents specifically if – I think we got Father's Day coming up.

[1:33:12] Hey, it's a great Father's Day gift.

[1:33:14] If you want the digital photo frame that is picked as number one by Wirecutter, you can save money on it now by visiting AuraFrames.com.

[1:33:25] For this limited time, listeners can get $35 off of their best-selling Carver Matte frame with code FLOP.

[1:33:34] That's A-U-R-A frames.com promo code FLOP.

[1:33:39] Support the show by mentioning us at checkout.

[1:33:43] Terms and conditions apply.

Elliott Kalan

[1:33:47] I'd like to take a few moments before we move on to mention some things I'd like to plug from the world of Elliot Kalin.

[1:33:53] And guess what?

[1:33:54] It's all the same stuff that I usually plug.

[1:33:57] My new comic, Barbarian Behind Bars, is roaring towards the finish of its five-issue miniseries.

[1:34:03] As we're recording this, issue four just came out.

[1:34:06] And issue five will be coming out soon.

[1:34:08] Find out the exciting, thrilling conclusion for now perhaps to the story of Darkor the Barbarian.

[1:34:14] Will he get out from behind bars?

[1:34:16] You're going to have to read issue five to find out.

[1:34:18] Harley Quinn, I continue to write for DC Comics despite the wishes of many Harley Quinn fans.

[1:34:25] And my Bat Quinn storyline, The Hark Knight Returns, is currently running.

[1:34:34] And it's actually getting some of the best feedback that I've gotten during the run so far.

[1:34:38] So I hope people enjoy it.

[1:34:39] This is Harley Quinn as her understanding of what a grim, gritty Batman would be like.

[1:34:45] And that one's continuing.

[1:34:47] And it's a six-issue storyline.

[1:34:49] And I think it's going along well.

Stuart Wellington

[1:34:50] So wait, it's a comedy book that features primarily female characters.

[1:34:54] I would imagine you're going to get weirdos complaining about you.

Elliott Kalan

[1:34:58] The weird thing is I mostly get complaints from people who don't like that it's a funny book.

[1:35:05] They want it to be an adventure book rather than a – or like this is – how are we supposed to take Harley Quinn seriously?

[1:35:10] I'm like the clown lady.

[1:35:11] The clown lady, yeah.

[1:35:12] Yeah, but I love writing it.

[1:35:14] So I hope that some people enjoy it.

[1:35:15] But this Bat Quinn storyline people seem to be liking.

[1:35:18] And my book, Joke Farming, How to Write Nonsense – sorry, Joke Farming, How to Write Comedy and Other Nonsense from the University of Chicago Press is still out there and will continue to be out there forever I guess.

[1:35:28] Pick it up.

[1:35:29] I just finished recording the audiobook version of it.

[1:35:32] People have asked me about will there be an audiobook.

[1:35:34] I just finished recording it.

[1:35:35] I'm not sure when that will be out but I think relatively soon.

[1:35:38] So stay tuned to this space for more information about that.

Stuart Wellington

[1:35:40] I heard when that comes out, if you listen to it on like two times speed, it's actually illegal to do it.

[1:35:46] You'll get arrested.

[1:35:47] It's too dangerous.

[1:35:48] Yeah, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:35:50] Hey, let's answer some letters from listeners.

[1:35:53] Sure.

[1:35:53] They've done so much for us.

[1:35:55] Let's do the bare minimum for them.

S3

[1:35:57] Yeah, and I'm sure they don't even know who I am but I'll get in on this.

[1:36:00] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[1:36:01] This first letter is a John –

[1:36:02] Grab a fork.

Elliott Kalan

[1:36:02] Let's get in on this.

[1:36:03] This first letter is from a John, last name withheld.

[1:36:05] Hey, guys.

[1:36:06] I just came out with a Mandalorian movie.

[1:36:07] I hope you like it.

[1:36:08] Can't wait to hear what you say about it.

[1:36:10] No, no.

S3

[1:36:11] From John, chef, last name withheld.

[1:36:17] John, you know, was an improviser.

[1:36:19] He was on an improv team in Iowa, Chicago.

[1:36:21] Oh, really?

[1:36:21] Back in the early 90s.

[1:36:23] Yeah.

[1:36:23] Like around when like Seth Meyers was doing it and Ian Roberts.

Elliott Kalan

[1:36:26] He's made other tremendous movies.

[1:36:28] I will never forget.

[1:36:29] The original Iron Man.

[1:36:30] I will never forget seeing Swingers for the first time when I was an adolescent.

[1:36:34] I used to do this thing where this guy in New Jersey had a program where you would see a movie before it was released.

[1:36:40] He would arrange to have a movie before it was released and sometimes he'd have speakers afterwards.

[1:36:43] And I would see this every week and they showed Swingers and it was just – it was like I was I think 14 or 15 or whatever age I was when it came out.

[1:36:50] But I was like – I thought it was so funny and I was like what a cool movie.

[1:36:54] Like what a cool – and I haven't watched it in years.

[1:36:56] But I'm like there's something about like seeing that movie and being like this guy is going to – I can't wait to see what else this guy is going to do.

[1:37:02] And I just – I want him to do more stuff that's his own stuff.

S3

[1:37:04] The funny parts of Swingers are really genuinely funny.

[1:37:07] It's got like a really sure hand on its comedy.

Dan McCoy

[1:37:10] And it was very cool until every uncool person who wanted to be cool started.

Elliott Kalan

[1:37:16] Well, it's like how Austin Powers – when Austin Powers came out, it felt like it was the cutting edge of movie comedy and it so quickly became like, oh, this again.

[1:37:22] The worst, yeah.

[1:37:23] Yeah, do I make you a horny baby?

[1:37:24] Great.

[1:37:24] No, baby, no.

[1:37:25] No.

Dan McCoy

[1:37:29] This letter is from Kevin Lastname Withheld who writes,

[1:37:34] Hey, peaches.

[1:37:35] In 2024, I finished the book The Brothers Kermasov by Dostoevsky.

[1:37:41] While reading it, I found my receipt for the purchase of the book in the pages.

[1:37:45] It was purchased from B. Dalton in December of 2006.

[1:37:50] This book had been in my possession through multiple moves for nearly two decades before I actually read it.

[1:37:57] What's strange is I read many longer and more difficult books in that span, but for whatever reason, I continued to pass over Brothers Kermasov again and again whenever I finished a book and needed a new one.

[1:38:09] Brothers Kermasov was excellent.

[1:38:11] I'm glad I read it.

[1:38:12] And now it's a title that's been on my shelf the longest without – sorry.

[1:38:15] And now the title that has been on my shelf the longest without being read is The Adventures of Augie March, which I'm sure I'll get around to eventually.

[1:38:24] Your recent episode on the film Mercy featured two book-related letters, so I figure this is fair game.

[1:38:31] What is the book or series or author you keep putting off even though you tell yourself you want to get to it someday?

[1:38:38] Best, Kevin Lastname Withheld.

Elliott Kalan

[1:38:40] I think this is a funny letter to me because I'm literally sitting next to a bookshelf with many books on.

[1:38:45] This is my to-read bookshelf, and there's so many books on it where I'm like, yeah, I've owned this book for a long time without reading it.

[1:38:52] There was a – I had a – I think it was a year or two ago I finally read the Science Fiction Hall of Fame Volume 2A, Volume 2B, books that I remember buying on vacation when my son was a baby and he is now 12 years old.

[1:39:07] And I'm like – but the – so I feel like nobody should feel ashamed for holding onto a book for a long time and never getting around to reading it and they finally get around to read it, especially when it's a book like The Brothers Karamazov, which is like – that book is already 100 years old, more than 100 years old.

[1:39:21] Like it's not going to – the time is only going to help you appreciate that book more because you're going to be older and you'll have more life behind you.

[1:39:28] That being said, I also have the first volume of Remembrance of Things Past or In Search of Lost Time, the Proust series, and I'm like I'll get to that at some point probably.

[1:39:39] But the other one is I keep telling myself when I finally finish the job that I'm on, I will finally take out from the library Gargantua and Pentagrol and I'll finally read it.

[1:39:50] I've wanted to read it for years.

[1:39:52] It sounds like it's super funny, as funny as a 17th century French philosophy book can be.

[1:39:57] But that's one where I've been putting it off for a long, long time.

[1:40:00] That being said, just on a whim recently, I got from the library and read the biography of Samuel Johnson, which is like 900 pages of just Samuel Johnson going out to dinner and saying witty things.

[1:40:10] So I should really pick up these books and finally read them.

Dan McCoy

[1:40:13] I can't remember whether I mentioned this specific thing on the show before, but that's never stopped us in the past.

[1:40:22] I don't think it's like been on my shelf for particularly long because I can remember exactly when I got it, and I'll get to that in a second.

[1:40:29] But the thing that sprung to mind is The Mirror and the Light, which is the third book from Hilary Mantel about the Tudor court after Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies.

[1:40:41] And the thing is like I read both of those books, the earlier books.

[1:40:45] I loved them.

[1:40:47] I was excited to read the third book, but I got it for Christmas right before COVID hit, and we all went into lockdown.

[1:40:55] And my brain was not equipped to read something that complex at that point.

[1:41:01] And now it's years later, and I'm like, I can't remember the hundreds of historical figures she has put into these books and what their relationship is to one another.

[1:41:13] And so I just haven't picked it back up again because I'm like, I don't think I'll follow it anymore.

[1:41:19] You know, much as if George R.R. Martin ever finished the next book, I'd be like, I have no idea what's going on at this point.

Stuart Wellington

[1:41:28] Oh, I could fill you in, buddy.

[1:41:31] Yeah.

[1:41:34] The – I have been meaning to read the Fofford and the Gray Mouser stories by Fritz Lieber forever.

[1:41:42] I know I would love them.

[1:41:43] I just never get around to it.

[1:41:45] So that I would really like to read a series of –

Elliott Kalan

[1:41:49] Stuart, you know what we should do?

[1:41:50] I just read – for the first – I started reading those recently, and I read volume four because it's the first one that fell into my hands, and volume one.

[1:41:56] We should read those together.

[1:41:57] You should –

[1:41:57] Okay.

[1:41:58] You should start reading them.

[1:41:59] Let's read them together because they're super fun.

[1:42:01] I'd love to talk about them with you.

[1:42:02] Yeah.

[1:42:02] Awesome.

S3

[1:42:02] I guess it's a boring answer, but when I hear this question, it's the book Dune.

[1:42:10] I've had Dune since I was 14 years old and been meaning to read it, and I'm sure I would like it.

[1:42:17] I love a lot of sort of adjacent things.

[1:42:20] I like – I mean, not that these things are all identical, but it's like I like Lord of the Rings.

[1:42:25] I like Game of Thrones, again, and I like all the Isaac Asimov Foundation series, and I like Stranger in a Strange Land.

[1:42:32] I mean, stuff where it's like, well, this is probably going to hit something for you, and I've had it since then.

[1:42:39] I don't know what it is.

[1:42:41] Every time I pick it up, I'm like, I don't know.

[1:42:43] There's just so much happening, and I just put it down.

Dan McCoy

[1:42:48] Even as someone who likes Dune less than people who like Dune, I find it very readable even at 800 pages or whatever.

Elliott Kalan

[1:42:55] I know.

[1:42:55] I think the thing about Dune is I think you should try to go into it – I've read the first book, Dune book, I don't know, probably four times.

[1:43:04] And the sequels I have – it's like as you get farther into the series, I have read them less and less until there are some I just have not read because you only really need to read the first book.

[1:43:13] But I think go into it being like – as you would with any science fiction or anything, there's going to be a lot of world stuff I don't quite get a hang of.

[1:43:23] But let me not worry about it because it's so – I think it's written so beautifully.

[1:43:28] Okay.

[1:43:29] For me at least, Dune casts a specific kind of spell.

[1:43:33] Yeah.

[1:43:33] The only thing I can really compare it to is when I finally took Stuart Wellington's advice and started reading Gene Wolfe novels.

[1:43:39] And it was like once I started reading Shadow of the Torturer where I was like, oh, man, this is like if – this is like Dune kicked up a notch even in terms of like I got to figure out what's going on here.

[1:43:49] But so I guess read Dune or read Shadow of the Torturer and then read Dune and you'll be like, oh, man, this Dune is a breezy read.

[1:43:55] This is – he's not using – every page doesn't have five antiquated words I have to look up on my phone to figure out what he's talking about.

Dan McCoy

[1:44:05] This second, you know, very, very important letter is from Jonathan Last, name withheld, who writes,

[1:44:13] Hello, Peaches.

[1:44:15] I was listening to an old episode of the show where Stuart explained he could make many songs into songs about him by replacing you with Stu.

[1:44:24] I realized you could do this with Man and Dan, giving you songs like The Beatles' Nowhere Dan, Leonard Cohen's I'm Your Dan,

[1:44:32] and the classic song where Neil Diamond explains to a girl that she will soon need a Dan.

[1:44:37] Songs about Elliot pending.

Elliott Kalan

[1:44:40] Yeah, this is a little harder.

[1:44:41] Jonathan, last name withheld.

[1:44:41] It was a real problem when my kids realized that Elliot is an anagram for toilet.

[1:44:46] That was not helpful.

[1:44:47] I mean I have one more L than the word toilet, but otherwise it mostly works.

[1:44:50] But, you know.

[1:44:52] But it's hard to fit into songs, yeah.

[1:44:53] Yeah.

[1:44:53] Will, there must be a lot of songs that you could put will into though, right?

[1:44:56] Yeah, sometimes –

[1:44:57] I'm just a will.

[1:44:59] Yeah.

S3

[1:45:00] Fool on a will.

[1:45:02] I'll get back to you, but I'm excited to figure that out.

Elliott Kalan

[1:45:10] Will crazy after all these years.

[1:45:13] Oh, will crazy.

[1:45:15] Jagged little will.

S3

[1:45:16] Schoolhouse rock, I'm only a will.

[1:45:20] Yeah.

[1:45:21] Mm-hmm.

[1:45:22] Mm-hmm.

Elliott Kalan

[1:45:23] And of course Metallica's first album, Will Em All.

[1:45:25] Uh-huh.

[1:45:26] And the willing moon.

[1:45:30] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[1:45:31] Anywho.

[1:45:32] License to will.

[1:45:34] Yeah.

[1:45:34] Shoot to will.

Elliott Kalan

[1:45:36] Hey, bungalow, Will.

[1:45:38] What did you will?

[1:45:39] Bungalow, Will.

[1:45:41] God, it ruins that just okay song.

Dan McCoy

[1:45:44] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[1:45:44] Just taking one name and replacing it with another name.

[1:45:48] Yeah.

[1:45:49] They're similar names.

[1:45:50] Bill and Will are basically the same names.

[1:45:52] I know.

[1:45:52] It's heartbreaking.

[1:45:54] It is heartbreaking.

[1:45:55] Yeah, yeah.

[1:45:56] Oh, I'm shattered.

Dan McCoy

[1:46:01] Let's recommend some movies.

[1:46:03] Movie we've seen recently or not so recently.

[1:46:06] It doesn't matter.

[1:46:07] I don't know why.

[1:46:07] I always specify that.

[1:46:09] That might be a better use of your time.

[1:46:11] I went out and saw The Sheep Detectives, a movie that the moment my wife – like, I saw this trailer.

[1:46:22] I sent it to my wife because I'm like, this is 100% going to be up Audrey's alley because it's a cozy mystery.

Elliott Kalan

[1:46:32] Yeah, murder mystery and cozy mystery with cute animals.

[1:46:34] Yeah, sure.

Dan McCoy

[1:46:35] We've made this mystery even cozier with the addition of sheep.

[1:46:39] Yeah.

[1:46:41] But it's kind of amazing.

[1:46:43] Like, the movie manages to be, you know, a functional mystery, extremely funny, and also, like, touching and about real emotions at the same time while also being a movie about sheep who are solving a crime.

[1:47:03] And I feel like, you know, there are certain, like, special family films that come along, like your Paddington 2s or your Babes, and I'm comfortable now adding The Sheep Detectives to that class.

[1:47:18] I really, really enjoyed it.

[1:47:21] So, that's my recommendation.

Elliott Kalan

[1:47:22] I saw that movie, and I also really enjoyed it.

[1:47:24] I thought it was really good.

Stuart Wellington

[1:47:25] Yeah.

[1:47:26] I'm going to recommend another big-budget sequel similar to Mando and Grog.

[1:47:33] But this one, I think, captured kind of the spirit of the original material a little better for me, and that, of course, was the recent smash hit, The Devil Wears Prada 2.

[1:47:45] As a fan of the original, I feel like it updates a number of the things.

[1:47:51] It omits the elements you don't like, specifically Adrian Grenier.

[1:47:55] And I feel like it's such a joy to get more of Meryl Streep doing this character.

[1:48:06] She's so fun, and she's such, like, I don't know, she's such a great performer.

[1:48:10] It's just great to have her in a movie being kind of mean.

[1:48:15] And the movie also takes advantage of putting her in situations that are comedic just because, of course, it would be very silly to see her have to go to a normal cafeteria or fly coach, for instance.

[1:48:29] So I found this to be a lot of fun, and it was, like, just what I was, like, kind of hoping for from this movie.

[1:48:38] Yeah.

[1:48:39] It delivered.

[1:48:39] Yeah.

S3

[1:48:41] And as a sequel, it kind of over-delivered because there's always a little bit of doubt with a sequel.

[1:48:45] Like, are they going to be able to recapture?

[1:48:47] So when they do it, it's kind of – it's a feat.

[1:48:49] It's a feat to be a good sequel.

Stuart Wellington

[1:48:52] Especially considering how much time has passed, you would think that there would be a lot of effort to just do a lot of, like, remember this.

[1:48:59] Sure, right.

Dan McCoy

[1:49:00] And they did not that much of that.

[1:49:02] Yeah.

S3

[1:49:04] I think a lot of the original team was involved.

[1:49:06] That's often – that can help.

[1:49:09] My recommendation is going to be Bone Temple, 28 years later, the Bone Temple.

[1:49:13] I just saw it last week, and I know it came out, like, a year ago.

[1:49:19] I was a – I was a fan of 28 Days Later.

[1:49:24] Didn't see 28 Weeks Later.

[1:49:25] 28 years later, I thought was good.

[1:49:27] But in a lot of Danny Boyle films, I – although I really enjoyed the ride, it felt like a little bit sort of disheveled in a way, although I enjoyed it well enough.

[1:49:37] And the Bone Temple was, like, awesome.

[1:49:40] It was just, like, a really well-constructed story with a terrifically fearsome villain.

[1:49:47] And I was compelled and just thrilled the entire time.

[1:49:51] And I'm not in the bag for zombie stuff always.

[1:49:54] I'm not a guaranteed give-a-crap about the zombie landscape.

[1:49:58] But I was – this whole movie had me, and I just was so grateful to be wrapped, you know?

[1:50:05] I just – just to be, like, my attention was just so thoroughly held that I had finished.

[1:50:10] I'm like, oh, yeah, good story, good movie.

[1:50:12] Just a solidly good movie in a way that I was – I loved it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:50:16] Yeah.

[1:50:17] It's really special.

[1:50:18] That means it's really good.

[1:50:19] And I feel – it's too bad that it was released so soon after 28 Years Later because I think that affected how many people went to see it and how well it did.

[1:50:27] I think it – if they – I think people kind of didn't realize it was a different movie.

[1:50:30] I didn't at first when it came out.

[1:50:32] Yeah.

[1:50:33] I remember seeing the billboards for it, and I'm like, didn't they just come out with one of these?

[1:50:35] Is this, like, DLC?

Stuart Wellington

[1:50:37] What's going on here?

Elliott Kalan

[1:50:38] Yeah.

[1:50:40] Downloadable content.

S3

[1:50:41] And 28 Years Later – I liked.

[1:50:43] I liked 28 Years Later, but this was – this was really a special film.

[1:50:47] Yeah.

[1:50:47] It's really incredible.

Elliott Kalan

[1:50:48] And that they – it's rare that you get to get into the psychology of the zombie, you know, to –

[1:50:53] Yes.

[1:50:53] Like, which was really good.

S3

[1:50:54] And I was genuinely moved by that whole bit.

[1:50:56] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[1:50:57] That's a good movie.

[1:50:58] I'm going to – I'm also going to recommend a movie that's got a little bit of the spooky, a little bit of the creepy about it.

[1:51:05] And is it a Czech comedy directed by Oldrich Lipsky?

[1:51:08] Yes, indeed it is.

[1:51:09] That's right.

[1:51:10] This is a movie that was mentioned briefly in our Evan Dorkin episode.

[1:51:13] This is The Mysterious Castle in the Carpathians.

[1:51:15] This time it is a parody of a specific Jules Verne novel but with a lot of added stuff to it.

[1:51:23] And it was not as immediately funny to me as Dinner for Adele or Lemonade Joe, the other Lipsky movies that I've recommended on this podcast.

[1:51:33] But it gets really, really funny.

[1:51:35] And it's just like these guys are – this opera singer is vacationing in the Carpathian Mountains.

[1:51:41] And the whole thing is he's singing is constantly shattering glass and things like that.

[1:51:45] And his love has disappeared and he's got – he's looking for her and he becomes convinced that she is in a castle near this village that he's in where people think that the devil is there and there's spooky things going on.

[1:51:56] It turns out to be a little bit more science fiction-y.

[1:51:58] And there are some gags in it that I think are so funny.

[1:52:02] And there's a lot of Jan Svankmeyer designed kind of like steampunk things.

[1:52:07] And it looks really good.

[1:52:09] As it went on, I thought it got sillier and sillier and funnier and funnier.

[1:52:13] And it's readily available on Tubi.

[1:52:16] So there's nothing stopping you from watching it.

[1:52:18] And that's The Mysterious Castle in the Carpathians.

[1:52:20] Again, this – Oldrich Lipsky, his movies are the closest I feel like I've come to finding Mel Brooks movies made by someone who is not Mel Brooks.

Dan McCoy

[1:52:28] And I think they're really funny.

[1:52:29] Elliot, I came close to dialing one of these up the other day.

[1:52:32] I know that's not as good as actually watching it, but that is the furthest you've gotten me toward watching a Czech New Wave movie yet.

Elliott Kalan

[1:52:40] Well, these are not Czech New Wave movies.

[1:52:41] These are just Czech movies.

[1:52:42] These are not part of the New Wave.

[1:52:44] Maybe you can make an argument that Lemonade Joe is a little New Wave-y in some ways.

Stuart Wellington

[1:52:47] You've got to sneak like a bikini in the title or something and dance all over it.

Dan McCoy

[1:52:50] No, the thing is like I'll know I'll like it.

[1:52:52] I don't know what's – this is like that book question.

[1:52:56] I don't know why I haven't.

[1:52:57] I should watch a genuine classic of – I should watch Closely Watch Trains or something.

Elliott Kalan

[1:53:01] Yeah, you should watch – Closely Watch Trains is legitimately a movie on a different level.

[1:53:05] That's just – I think that's an amazing movie.

[1:53:07] But there's something – there can be something as much as it makes me feel like a philistine sometimes.

[1:53:11] There are times when I'm like I don't know if I want to watch a subtitled movie right now.

[1:53:15] But then when I watch them, I really enjoy them.

[1:53:18] You start – I start to forget that I'm having to check the subtitles and it makes me look at the screen and not get distracted.

Dan McCoy

[1:53:25] But you do have to be in a movie – sorry, a mood already where you're like I'm not going to be distractible right now.

[1:53:32] Like sometimes I'm like I know that I can't do this.

[1:53:35] My attention is not where it needs to be even if I'm going to like it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:53:38] I think the one you might like the most, Dan, is Dinner for Adele or Adele has not had supper yet or whatever because that's the most – it's not a parody of Sherlock Holmes.

[1:53:45] It's a parody of like American detective pulp fiction but it's a –

[1:53:49] Like that too.

[1:53:50] There's something kind of – I think you might like that one more but I don't know.

[1:53:54] I think his movies are very funny.

[1:53:55] I saw another one of his movies recently called Four Murders is Enough, Dear.

[1:53:59] And like that one I think – didn't think it was quite as funny as the others that didn't quite hang together the same way.

[1:54:04] But there was still some very funny stuff in it.

[1:54:06] It is a great title.

Stuart Wellington

[1:54:07] That's a Giallo title right there, baby.

[1:54:09] It's true.

Elliott Kalan

[1:54:11] That was one where – this was one where there are two – there's two competing crime gangs that are looking for a million-dollar check that has fallen into the hands of this schoolteacher who's kind of a nevishy guy.

[1:54:21] And they keep killing each other, the different gangs.

[1:54:23] But he keeps getting caught with bodies.

[1:54:25] So people think that he's a serial murderer and he becomes famous in the town and everyone is afraid of him and respects him now because they think he's a serial killer.

[1:54:32] And he's like every time he opens a door, a body falls out.

[1:54:35] And there's a scene where he's with the police.

[1:54:36] He's like every time I open a door, a body falls out.

[1:54:38] See?

[1:54:38] And he's just opening doors in his apartment as dead bodies fall out.

Dan McCoy

[1:54:43] Amazing.

[1:54:44] Well, before we close up shop on another episode, Will, is there anything you want to plug?

S3

[1:54:51] I guess just my podcasts, which are Screw It, We're Just Going to Talk About The Beatles and Screw It, We're Just Going to Talk About Comics.

[1:54:59] They are What Is Advertised.

[1:55:00] It's just folks chatting about those things.

[1:55:03] So check them out.

Elliott Kalan

[1:55:04] You say that there is another podcast inside of Screw It, We're Just Going to Talk About Comics,

[1:55:08] called Screw It, We're Just Going to Talk About War Games.

[1:55:09] And that comes up a fair amount.

S3

[1:55:11] It's coming up more and more, which is weird because that movie is less and less important as time goes on.

[1:55:18] And we somehow keep finding reasons to go into our sub-podcasts.

Elliott Kalan

[1:55:22] But there's a couple of podcasts where when a new episode comes out, I put them right to the top of my queue.

[1:55:26] And Screw It, We're Just Going to Talk About Comics is one of them.

S3

[1:55:30] I do with my brother and his opinions are steadfast and immovable.

[1:55:35] We've bristled recently because if I don't like something and he likes it, he will not let the podcast move on until I change my opinion out loud.

[1:55:46] And then we can continue and it's kind of funny.

[1:55:48] And you and your brother Kevin are both master improvisers.

Elliott Kalan

[1:55:50] You're so funny at picking up a bit and then just running with it.

S3

[1:55:53] I think that's an overstatement, but I do appreciate it.

Elliott Kalan

[1:55:57] You invented improv.

[1:55:58] When you and Kevin started the Compass Players.

S3

[1:56:01] I mean, I have two brothers and none of us are emotional people.

[1:56:06] We are deadpan, low energy, non-dynamic.

[1:56:09] And all three of us do improv comedy on stage.

[1:56:12] And to me, it's the funniest thing that any of us have ever done is just that we do that.

[1:56:18] At Thanksgiving dinner, our three of the stoniest, most still men.

[1:56:23] And we'll be like, what did you think of how's your improv going?

[1:56:26] How's your improvised comedy career going?

[1:56:31] Three guys who should be librarians and arguing about how to properly categorize encyclopedias.

[1:56:37] And yet we go on stage.

Elliott Kalan

[1:56:39] Well, but I would say if you're interested in improv and you live in a place where they don't have an improv class or theater to go to,

[1:56:46] Will's book, How to Be the Greatest Improviser on Earth, is a genuinely really good book about it.

[1:56:50] It is.

S3

[1:56:50] And honestly, if you want a free copy, this is true.

[1:56:52] I'm going to say my email address right here.

[1:56:54] Wines at Gmail.

[1:56:55] W-H-I-N-E-S at Gmail.

[1:56:57] I'll give a free copy to anybody.

[1:56:58] If you're curious.

[1:56:59] I wish I'd known that before I bought a copy of it.

[1:57:01] That's right.

[1:57:03] Just because I know improvisers are broke a lot.

[1:57:05] Yeah, that's true.

Elliott Kalan

[1:57:06] I certainly would appreciate it if you buy it.

[1:57:08] But when I – it was a text that I went to multiple times when I was writing my book, Joke Farming,

[1:57:14] because I thought – what you said about improv and how it works, I thought was –

[1:57:18] just really helped me get to the heart of some comedy principles.

[1:57:22] That was very helpful.

Dan McCoy

[1:57:22] And, you know, I'm a deadpan, unemotional man.

[1:57:28] And I have –

[1:57:29] Shut up.

[1:57:30] I've done okay in podcasting and I'm not a good improviser.

[1:57:35] So, if you want someone who has those qualities but also is talented in some way, then you should listen to Will's shows.

Elliott Kalan

[1:57:42] Dan is – Stuart and I are constantly like, how is it that Dan's the only one of us that has any improv training of any kind when he's so quick to shut down bits?

[1:57:51] We'll start a bit and he'll go, don't put me on the spot.

[1:57:53] I don't know.

S3

[1:57:57] It's honestly a very funny response.

Dan McCoy

[1:57:59] Well, I mean there are rules in improv where you're not supposed to just like throw someone else into a thing that you invented.

[1:58:07] Yeah, I don't know.

Stuart Wellington

[1:58:07] I haven't taken any improv classes.

Dan McCoy

[1:58:09] Yeah, I wouldn't either.

[1:58:10] Yeah.

[1:58:12] Anyway, thank you for being here.

[1:58:14] We'll try and make it less than how many –

[1:58:16] 15 years.

[1:58:17] – plus years it's been.

[1:58:18] Yeah, let's have Will back.

S3

[1:58:19] Hey, no.

[1:58:20] I'm happy with every 15-year schedule.

[1:58:22] I'm happy.

[1:58:24] I'm truly proud to be a part of this podcast universe to whatever degree that has happened.

[1:58:28] So, I love it.

[1:58:29] Two episodes.

[1:58:30] I'm psyched about it.

[1:58:32] Thank you for going out and seeing this movie, making the effort to leave your home for this podcast.

[1:58:38] My honor to be the least happy member of a four-person audience, 1030 at the American.

Stuart Wellington

[1:58:46] At my theater, there were some old people who were cheering every time Grogu did anything and that kind of made me happy.

[1:58:53] That's cool.

[1:58:53] That's nice.

[1:58:54] Some like wine moms were in the Nighthawk.

[1:58:57] That's great.

[1:58:57] Just loving it at 3 p.m.

[1:58:58] It was –

Elliott Kalan

[1:58:59] People loving a movie is great.

[1:59:00] It was a noticeably stony audience when I went to see it.

[1:59:03] They did not seem to be reacting to it much at all.

[1:59:05] But maybe they were still dealing with the hangover having to sit through the Masters of the Universe trailer.

Dan McCoy

[1:59:13] Hey, maybe it will be on a future episode.

[1:59:15] Maybe not.

[1:59:16] But stick around.

[1:59:18] Find out.

[1:59:19] If you like this podcast, we're part of a network.

[1:59:21] Hey, we're part of a network of podcasts.

[1:59:23] It's called Maximum Fun.

[1:59:24] Go to MaximumFun.org.

[1:59:26] Check out the other great podcasts on said network.

[1:59:30] Also, thank you to Alex Smith.

[1:59:33] He goes by the name Howell Doughty on the internet.

[1:59:35] He is our producer and makes this all work.

[1:59:38] It's kind of important to have someone do those things.

Elliott Kalan

[1:59:42] The reason when you're listening to this episode you won't hear my younger son walk in and ask me when am I going to be done is because Alex will do the work of removing that from the audio.

Dan McCoy

[1:59:50] So thank you, Alex.

[1:59:51] You're doing great.

[1:59:51] Thank you, Alex.

[1:59:53] But for the Flophouse, I have been Dan McCoy.

[1:59:57] I'm Stuart Wellington.

[1:59:59] I'm Elliot Kalin and we've been joined by guest Will Hines.

S3

[2:00:04] Expert.

[2:00:04] Expert improviser.

[2:00:05] Pick that cue right up.

[2:00:07] Yeah.

[2:00:08] It takes years of training to be able to do what I just did.

[2:00:12] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[2:00:19] So we're talking about a movie about a little kid and his dad, adopted dad, going on an adventure.

[2:00:26] It's called Dutch.

[2:00:28] Man, we can't stop talking about Dutch.

[2:00:31] We can't stop talking about Dutch.

[2:00:33] Just like America.

[2:00:35] Dutch fever.

S3

[2:00:36] Join the national conversation.

[2:00:38] Watch Dutch.

Elliott Kalan

[2:00:40] It would be so funny if they're like, to bring America together, to heal us, we're starting something called the national conversation.

[2:00:45] We're all going to watch the same movie and then talk about it together.

[2:00:49] And that movie is Dutch.

[2:00:50] They have like a rotating barrel with movie names in it.

[2:00:52] They pick it up.

[2:00:53] The movie is Dutch, starring Ed O'Neill.

[2:00:55] Yeah.

S3

[2:00:56] And that's how the Civil War finally started.

[2:00:59] Again.

[2:01:02] Maximum Fun.

Dan McCoy

[2:01:03] A worker-owned network.

S3

[2:01:04] Of artist-owned shows.

[2:01:06] Supported.

[2:01:07] Directly.

[2:01:07] By you.

The Mandalorian and Grogu, with Will Hines

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