FH Mini 101 - The Razzies Are Always Wrong

Elliott Kalan

[0:00] Hey, Floppers, this is Elliot talking.

[0:01] Before we get into this episode's classic Flophouse shenanigans,

[0:05] I wanted to make sure you knew about some upcoming live events we are very excited about.

[0:08] On April 27th at 7 p.m. Eastern, we are premiering online the professionally shot,

[0:13] professionally edited online video of our Speed 2 live show.

[0:17] Dan Stewart and I will be there watching the show with you,

[0:20] text chatting with the audience throughout the entire thing.

[0:23] Can't make it on the 27th?

[0:24] The video will be available to watch at your leisure through May 19th.

[0:28] To see the trailer and buy tickets, go to stagepilot.com slash flop dash house dash speed dash 2.

[0:36] If you want to see us in person and you live in England, remember that on the 24th of May,

[0:40] we'll be in Oxford doing our first and second ever UK live shows in one night.

[0:44] 7 p.m., we're talking The Avengers.

[0:46] 9 p.m., we're talking Spice World.

[0:48] Two shows, one night.

[0:49] For tickets and more information, go to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

[0:54] Now that's enough live show hype from me.

[0:56] Let's get to that patented flophouse silliness.

[0:59] Take it away, peaches.

Dan McCoy

[1:05] Hey, everyone, and welcome to the Flophouse Mini for this week.

[1:09] I'm Dan McCoy.

[1:10] I'm Stuart Wellington.

[1:11] I'm Elliot Kalin, still.

[1:13] Now, what's a Flophouse Mini?

[1:14] Well, normally, as you know, the Flophouse is a podcast where we watch a bad movie and then we talk about it.

[1:20] But on every other week, we do these slightly shorter episodes that are more free form.

[1:27] I'm in charge of this one.

[1:28] So let me take us out of the garage, back us out of the station by saying this is inspired, of course, by the Criterion channel.

[1:41] I say, of course.

[1:41] I don't know why.

[1:42] Of course.

Stuart Wellington

[1:42] I was going to say, you said of course as if we knew what you were talking about.

[1:44] All the clues were there, Mr. Policeman.

Dan McCoy

[1:47] In fact, I had given you none of the clues at this point because I just started talking.

[1:51] You know, like many people of…

[1:54] Like many people?

[1:55] Like me?

[1:55] Small people?

[1:55] What I thought he said, too.

[1:57] Like several people.

[1:59] Most people of non-unlimited budgets.

[2:03] Like the movie Several Samurai?

[2:05] Like…

[2:06] Let me get the premise out at least.

[2:10] Like several people in the world, like most of us who don't have unlimited money, we cycle through streaming channels.

[2:19] You know, like we'll take a little time off from one, try another one.

[2:22] I am glad that we are now back to having Criterion.

[2:28] Recently, they had a…

[2:30] They put a Razzie's collection on.

[2:32] It's got a lot of press there.

[2:34] The Razzie's.

[2:36] These are…

[2:37] Of course, the Golden Raspberry Awards, we all know, was founded in…

[2:41] And it's…

[2:43] Underwater?

[2:43] It was made to, you know, make fun of the worst in Hollywood filmmaking.

[2:50] It's an excuse for a press release.

[2:53] I don't know.

[2:53] It's publicity for itself, essentially.

Elliott Kalan

[2:56] I don't…

[2:57] Yeah, they don't like make money off of anything.

[2:58] I don't know what they do.

Dan McCoy

[3:00] Not quite sure what their deal is.

[3:01] But they award, you know, awards for cinematic non-excellence.

[3:08] The Criterion channel, as many have noted, noticed that many of these Razzie movies are pretty good, or at least worthy of more fair assessment than their reputation would suggest.

[3:23] And so, they highlighted a bunch of those.

[3:26] Now, a little sidetracking to personal history.

[3:30] One of the things that made me want to be friends with one Mr. Elliot Kalin…

[3:35] That's me.

Elliott Kalan

[3:37] Who I met…

[3:37] Mom, mom.

[3:39] He mentioned me on the podcast.

Dan McCoy

[3:41] Yeah, yeah.

[3:42] That's pretty cool.

[3:43] Now, I met Elliot, of course…

[3:44] My day will come, you know.

[3:45] Yeah, someday.

[3:46] …through our mutual friend, Eric Marsizak, and his various comedy theaters that he managed.

[3:54] When I first met Elliot, I'm like, who's this joke-a-minute guy in a polo shirt looking all skinny and attractive?

Stuart Wellington

[4:02] I don't like his confidence.

[4:04] Long, flowing hair.

Dan McCoy

[4:05] Yeah, yeah.

[4:06] No need for glasses ever.

[4:11] But one of the things that deterred me from that initial unfair reaction was…

[4:18] Uh-huh, yeah.

[4:18] Okay, yeah.

[4:19] You saved it.

[4:20] I discovered Elliot's blog, the Oscars are always wrong.

[4:26] And Elliot's…

[4:27] You know, I knew that Elliot shared my love of classic movies, something that Elliot has only increased in over the years.

[4:35] And me, I've somehow found a way to waste my time with a lot of unworthy films.

[4:42] But anyway, the point is, he had a blog called The Oscars Are Always Wrong, talking about how perhaps the Oscars did not pick the best things to elevate every year.

[4:53] And so, in that spirit, goddammit, and connected to this Criterion thing, I thought I would offer the Razzies Are Always Wrong.

[5:04] Oh.

[5:05] Oh.

[5:06] Oh.

[5:07] I get it.

Stuart Wellington

[5:08] I get it.

[5:09] Oh, okay.

Dan McCoy

[5:09] I'm picking up what you're putting down.

[5:11] There are 11 Razzie movies on the Criterion channel right now, but we're only going to talk about six of these because we don't have a lot of time.

[5:19] But I'm going to go through some of these Razzie years for specific movies they have on there.

[5:24] Let's Raz them up.

[5:26] I'm going to talk, and maybe we'll decide what the more deserving candidate is because I'm going to talk about the other Razzie nominees for that year.

[5:34] Mm-hmm.

[5:35] And I'm going to throw in some ones I found from that year that I thought maybe are more worth being in the discussion.

Elliott Kalan

[5:42] Oh, very in keeping with my old blog.

[5:44] I was going through the Oscars year by year, and I'd say which nominee I thought should have won or what other movie should have won.

[5:51] And at this point, I actually – I'd like to go back and redo those because I've seen a lot more movies since then.

Dan McCoy

[5:56] Well, hopefully this will inspire you to take on yet another project.

Elliott Kalan

[6:00] Yeah, because I've got the time to write a free blog about the Oscars now.

Stuart Wellington

[6:04] Maybe someday your sons will do this.

Elliott Kalan

[6:06] Yeah, they'll pick up my legacy.

[6:09] Now, of course –

[6:10] My Tron legacy.

[6:11] Mm-hmm.

[6:12] Of course, one of the key problems –

Stuart Wellington

[6:13] Which should have won Best Picture, you said.

[6:15] Sure.

Elliott Kalan

[6:16] Yeah.

[6:16] Certainly at the Tronsters.

Dan McCoy

[6:18] For glowiest movie.

[6:21] Now, to undermine my premise right from the jump, one of the key problems with this is, of course, one of the key problems with the Razzies themselves, which is the what are we doing here question.

[6:36] Because if it's –

[6:37] Well, no.

[6:38] If the goal is to pick the worst movie of the year in the truest sense, then none of the movies nominated for the Razzies should be in the conversation.

[6:47] These are all, like, glossy Hollywood films with at least some understanding of narrative.

[6:52] Like, you would probably be shitting on something that someone made somewhere with no money.

[6:58] And, like, why would you do that?

[6:59] So, like, maybe it's not that – like, is it, like, worst Hollywood film?

[7:04] Or – but also, is it, like, worst movie, genuinely worst movie?

[7:08] Or is it a fun bad movie?

[7:11] Because I feel like sometimes the Razzies are like, what's this?

[7:15] You know, and, like, that – if that's what it is, you know, I can respect it a bit because it's like, yeah, let's look at this silly movie.

Elliott Kalan

[7:23] Except they'll often – as I'm sure you're going to get to – they'll often pick an artistically done movie and say, this is bad because it doesn't fit, I guess, what a normal movie should be.

[7:34] Right.

Dan McCoy

[7:35] That's the – and that is the fundamental problem with them.

[7:38] Holy motors!

Elliott Kalan

[7:38] I never get the sense that the people who do the Razzies like or understand or know about movies, which I'm sure is unfair on my part.

[7:47] But there's times when they're like, this is not – it's a little bit like the guy in Cat Person who's like, yeah, I love movies.

[7:54] I love Empire Strikes Back, you know.

[7:56] It's great.

[7:57] There's more than one kind of movie.

Dan McCoy

[7:58] I don't think you're wrong to say that.

[8:00] I think that it seems to me that often the Razzies are like, what movie got a lot of bad press this year?

[8:07] Yes, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[8:08] But it's kind of like the Golden Globes too where people are like, oh, it won a Golden Globe.

[8:11] And I'm like, who votes for that?

[8:13] Like, who decides these?

Dan McCoy

[8:15] So let's start off in 1988, a little movie that inspired a song to bedevil Elliot, Cocktail.

[8:25] Cocktail won the worst picture Razzie in 88 over –

[8:30] He has the worst song.

[8:31] The other nominees, Caddyshack 2.

Stuart Wellington

[8:34] Okay.

[8:35] Which is bad.

Dan McCoy

[8:36] Rambo 3.

[8:39] Debatable.

[8:40] Mac and Me.

[8:42] Okay.

[8:43] Hot to Trot.

[8:45] And now I'm going to toss in my editions.

[8:48] And I got to say, I'm starting with 88 because, like, honestly, all of the Razzie movies aren't that bad.

[8:57] And there weren't, like, that – like, there were some dumb other movies from that year.

[9:01] But nothing that I thought was like, oh, we got to hold this up for ridicule or anything.

Elliott Kalan

[9:06] So this is not a year where you feel like they were totally off the mark.

[9:09] Perhaps.

Dan McCoy

[9:10] Perhaps.

[9:11] Because, I mean, I will say Cocktail seems like a weirdly bankrupt idea for a movie.

[9:16] But –

[9:17] So the other ones I wanted to toss in.

[9:19] This movie is fun.

[9:21] But maybe I just want to shine a light on it.

[9:24] Rotor.

[9:25] The low-budget RoboCop and Terminator mashup with the stress janitor robot that Elliot loves.

Elliott Kalan

[9:31] So here's the thing.

[9:32] I recently watched that movie again.

[9:33] I was a guest at a science fiction convention in Florida.

[9:35] And we did a thing where we were riffing over Rotor, me and some of the other people there.

[9:39] And I find that movie – it's so bad.

[9:43] I find it so entertaining.

[9:44] I enjoy it so much.

[9:45] But I always remember that robot as a janitor, he's a security guard, actually.

[9:49] Oh, okay.

[9:49] I always remember it wrong.

[9:50] But he is the same character I remember.

[9:52] But that movie, everyone else was like, oh, oof, oh, I can't believe we've got to sit through this.

[9:57] And meanwhile, I was like, I'm loving it.

[9:59] This is the fourth time I've seen this movie and I'm enjoying it more and more every time.

Dan McCoy

[10:03] Yeah.

[10:04] Yeah.

[10:04] And the one other one I wanted to toss in here is High Spirits, the Neil Jordan comedy that squanders Peter O'Toole by putting him opposite Steve Guttenberg.

Stuart Wellington

[10:15] Man, that was definitely a movie I rented as a kid.

[10:18] Yeah.

[10:18] At the time, I was eight years old.

[10:21] So I wasn't necessarily a bastion of good taste.

Elliott Kalan

[10:24] That was – I've never – that's not true.

[10:26] I've seen High Spirits.

[10:26] But I've never fully been able to get it to stick in my memory because when I was a kid, I remember asking another kid – and I don't remember who it was – another kid at school about that movie High Spirits because he said he had seen it.

[10:37] And he goes, oh, yeah, it's super violent.

[10:39] It starts off and this woman, this guy like stabs her in the vagina.

[10:43] And I was like, what is this movie?

[10:44] I'm not going to watch this.

[10:45] And then years later, saw it on the screen.

[10:47] I was like, nothing like this happens.

[10:49] A lighthearted comedy.

[10:51] To this day, I'm like, what was that kid thinking about?

Stuart Wellington

[10:53] I think that kid is remembering the animated movie Wicked City.

Elliott Kalan

[10:58] So now I've associated this movie with that scene even though it doesn't exist in my head.

Dan McCoy

[11:04] Yeah.

[11:04] So this is a tough one here because like –

[11:08] 88 is a tough year.

[11:09] 88.

Dan McCoy

[11:09] If we were going to go into what the iconic bad movie from that year is, it's of course Mac and Me.

[11:16] Yes.

[11:16] I would say.

Elliott Kalan

[11:17] That's one of the longest lived, I think.

[11:19] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[11:20] If it's the movie that like I would have the most difficulty watching, I think it might be Caddyshack 2.

[11:26] Yeah.

[11:27] A nearly jokeless film.

Elliott Kalan

[11:29] Now, I don't remember – I saw Hot to Trot so many times as a kid and I have not watched it since then.

[11:33] So I'm wondering how that holds up.

[11:34] Is that Jackie Gleason who plays?

[11:36] Yes.

[11:37] Jackie Gleason is playing the Rodney Dangerfield type role.

[11:39] Yeah.

[11:40] Now, Hot to Trot, this is of course –

[11:41] Oh, no, not Jackie Gleason.

[11:42] I'm sorry.

[11:42] Jackie Mason.

[11:44] Sorry.

[11:44] Yeah, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[11:45] Hot to Trot is a racehorse comedy?

Elliott Kalan

[11:49] Bobcat Goldthwait has a racehorse that has – it's like – I forget if the horse can talk because it's the reincarnation of a person or if horses can just talk.

[11:58] Yeah, I don't remember.

Stuart Wellington

[12:00] That horse definitely does cocaine or something in the movie, right?

Elliott Kalan

[12:03] I think so.

[12:03] It throws a party and there's a part where someone gets reincarnated – I think the horse's dad maybe gets reincarnated as a fly.

[12:10] Or maybe it's Bobcat Goldthwait's dad gets reincarnated as a fly.

[12:12] Anyway, I've saw it so many times as a kid and I barely remember the plot of it.

Dan McCoy

[12:16] Here's a question I have for you.

[12:17] Is Annie Potts in it or am I transposing her from Who's Harry Crumb into Hot to Trot?

[12:21] Or you think it's called Hot to Potts?

Elliott Kalan

[12:24] Hot to Trot with Annie Potts?

[12:26] I don't think she's in it.

[12:28] No, Virginia Madsen is in it though.

[12:29] I'm looking up the cast now.

Stuart Wellington

[12:30] Oh, she brings a little bit of credibility.

[12:34] Sure.

Dan McCoy

[12:35] A little bit of heat for your treat.

[12:38] Yeah.

[12:39] Please don't ever say that.

Elliott Kalan

[12:40] Don't ever do that again.

Dan McCoy

[12:43] So I don't know.

[12:45] What do we say for this?

Stuart Wellington

[12:47] Man, I would say Caddyshack 2 is the worst of those.

[12:50] Yeah.

[12:51] I mean, Cocktail is very dumb.

[12:53] And as a bartender, I find it offensive.

Elliott Kalan

[12:56] I mean, Mac and Me is a very bad movie, but it is a fun one to watch.

[13:01] It's an enjoyable film.

[13:02] It's a bad movie.

[13:03] Yeah.

[13:03] I'm going to say, I don't know.

[13:05] I'm going to put, having very little memory of it, I might put Hot to Trot on there just

[13:09] because there's part of me that's like, this was a movie that existed where Bobcat Goldswaite

[13:14] is like a stockbroker with a talking horse.

Stuart Wellington

[13:16] On some level, I feel like this process is Dan winnowing down what movies we're going to

[13:20] do for live shows.

[13:21] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[13:22] And I think, yeah, you know what?

[13:23] Probably Caddyshack 2.

[13:25] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[13:25] Going up next, we got in the year 1995.

[13:30] I was 15 years old.

[13:32] So full of life and hope.

[13:34] I was 17, which meant I was of age to see this film, Showgirls, won the whatever, you know,

[13:45] the Razzie for Worst Picture, a film that has been reclaimed by many.

Stuart Wellington

[13:51] Yeah.

[13:52] The Razzies are straight tripping, boo, if you were to ask me.

Elliott Kalan

[13:55] I think that is a movie that is not fully successful at what it's trying to do, but

[13:58] people understand what it's trying to do now.

[14:01] Yeah.

[14:01] And they didn't before.

[14:01] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[14:03] Other films that were nominated by the Razzies, we got Congo.

[14:08] Okay.

[14:09] Which I think is a perfectly enjoyable film.

[14:11] Serviceable, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[14:12] And certainly the episode of AP Bio where the prom theme or whatever is Congo, is the

[14:19] movie Congo.

[14:20] Almost makes the movie worth it.

Dan McCoy

[14:22] We have It's Pat, a film that looks only worse as the years go by.

[14:28] Yeah.

[14:29] Perhaps thrown into a pit.

[14:32] Disowned by the Pat themselves.

Elliott Kalan

[14:36] Thrown into a pit, but not thrown into a pat.

Dan McCoy

[14:39] No.

[14:40] The Scarlet Letter, of course, covered on this podcast.

[14:44] Waterworld covered on this podcast.

[14:46] And so those are the ones that were nominated.

[14:49] I've added to this Theodore Rex, the Whoopi Goldberg buddy top comedy on Dino.

Elliott Kalan

[14:56] Now, was Theodore Rex a – was it released in theaters or was it a video-only release?

[15:00] That's a good question.

[15:00] Might affect its eligibility.

[15:02] Good question.

Stuart Wellington

[15:03] Yeah, I mean, it premiered at Cannes, right?

[15:05] And it got a – how long was the standing ovation?

[15:08] 17 minutes.

[15:09] 17 minutes.

[15:10] Only 17 minutes.

[15:11] We should do Theodore Rex at some point.

Elliott Kalan

[15:13] The movie that a judge made Whoopi Goldberg make because he ruled that she was breaking

[15:19] her contract for refusing to make it.

Dan McCoy

[15:21] Yeah, we've referenced it so many times and also like I've also never seen it.

Stuart Wellington

[15:26] I definitely feel like Dan is self-watching the –

[15:29] Very curious.

[15:29] The Slayer for Flop TV season two on this right now.

Dan McCoy

[15:33] Could be.

[15:35] What else do we have that I put down here?

[15:38] We got Fair Game, the combined acting power of Billy Baldwin and Cindy Crawford.

[15:44] Right.

[15:45] Yeah, I saw that.

[15:47] Jury Duty.

Elliott Kalan

[15:48] I certainly saw – there was one or two scenes of that that I saw more than once.

[15:51] Uh-huh.

[15:52] Mm-hmm.

Dan McCoy

[15:53] Jury Duty featuring some of the finest work by the weasel.

[15:57] Uh-huh.

Stuart Wellington

[15:58] Human name withheld.

[16:00] I feel like I remember that one the least well of his movies.

Dan McCoy

[16:05] There's the Jerky Boys movie.

Elliott Kalan

[16:07] That is a movie I saw in the theaters and I have so little memory of it that I think we

[16:12] might have showed up during – at the wrong time, seen the very end of it and then left.

[16:18] It's hard for me to believe that movie exists and I saw it.

[16:21] Anyway.

Dan McCoy

[16:22] Yeah.

[16:22] It's so bizarre.

[16:24] Like, why can't we make a movie out of prank calls?

[16:30] That one's on the Criterion channel, right?

[16:32] Yeah.

[16:33] We've got The Mangler where Toby Hooper tries to make Stephen King's industrial clothes dryer.

Stuart Wellington

[16:42] I definitely feel like I've watched that.

[16:43] Scary.

Dan McCoy

[16:46] So, what do you think, guys?

[16:48] What do you think about this?

[16:49] I've given you a lot to chew on.

[16:51] Too much.

[16:52] I've already forgotten some of them.

Stuart Wellington

[16:53] I haven't watched the Jerky Boys movie, but I'm terrified of it.

[16:57] I don't know if I can watch it.

Elliott Kalan

[16:59] That would be the pick for me for sure.

[17:02] I mean, the fact they have Waterworld on there, which is a serviceable science fiction

[17:05] kind of action movie.

[17:07] That they have Congo, which is a serviceable science fiction action movie.

[17:11] Scarlet as a hot Gary Oldman.

[17:13] Ernie Hudson is very fun in Congo.

Dan McCoy

[17:14] Yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[17:15] And Tim Curry.

Dan McCoy

[17:16] I mean, how can Tim Curry not be fun?

[17:17] Tim Curry's always fun.

[17:18] Yeah.

[17:19] Even when he's not supposed to be.

Elliott Kalan

[17:19] And a cameo from Bruce Campbell.

[17:21] Yeah.

[17:22] But yeah, the Jerky Boys movie.

[17:24] The fact that that exists.

[17:25] It's also, it's such an artifact of a worse time when the Jerky Boys were famous and very

[17:31] successful.

[17:32] When we're like, these boys are jerks.

[17:34] Let's make them famous.

[17:35] And you listen to those.

[17:36] I remember, I don't know why I went to see the movie because I remember not being a fan

[17:39] of theirs and having a friend who had one of their CDs and listening to it.

[17:42] And they're just like, hey, sizzle chest.

[17:44] And I'm like, what does this even mean?

[17:45] Like, I don't understand.

Stuart Wellington

[17:47] I don't get what the joke is here.

[17:49] You know?

Dan McCoy

[17:51] These pranks aren't properly constructed.

Stuart Wellington

[17:55] Jerky Boys seems like an appropriate name to me, says L.A.

[17:58] Catelyn.

Dan McCoy

[17:59] This lacks the subtlety of cranky anchors.

[18:02] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[18:02] I mean, cranky anchors didn't exist yet.

[18:04] I guess they refined it, you know?

[18:05] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[18:06] They, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[18:07] They learned their lessons.

Stuart Wellington

[18:08] I would say, wait, of that list, I think the one I would most likely want to watch is

[18:16] Showgirls.

[18:19] I feel like Showgirls is the most, is my favorite of the list.

[18:23] Yes.

[18:24] But there's a few I haven't seen.

[18:27] And I think the one that I haven't seen that I'm most nervous about, of course, is Jerky

[18:31] Boys.

[18:31] Well, it's Pat.

Dan McCoy

[18:33] I'm pretty nervous about it.

[18:34] Oh, yeah.

[18:35] Oh, I forgot about it.

[18:35] I forgot you mentioned it.

[18:36] I think those probably tie for the bottom of the barrel desire.

Stuart Wellington

[18:43] We couldn't even do that on the show.

Dan McCoy

[18:45] No, we wouldn't.

[18:46] Why would we want to?

[18:47] Yeah.

[18:48] Okay.

[18:49] Well, let's move on to 2003.

Stuart Wellington

[18:53] You couldn't make a podcast on this nowadays.

Elliott Kalan

[18:57] Nowadays, you couldn't make a terrible, unfunny movie about this.

Dan McCoy

[19:02] Let's move on to 2003.

[19:05] The final year closing out the first half of this mini.

[19:09] A film that we covered in one of our recent live shows.

[19:13] It was our San Francisco Sketch Fest show.

[19:15] We released it for scheduling reasons on a normally mini week.

[19:20] So if you missed it, go back and check it out.

[19:23] This is, of course, Gigli, the film that ended Martin Brest's directing career and put

[19:30] a lot of road bumps in a few other people's acting careers.

Elliott Kalan

[19:33] But at least Jennifer Lopez and Ben Affleck got back together again, eventually, even though

[19:38] that wrecked their relationship for a little bit.

Dan McCoy

[19:41] Or did it start their relationship?

[19:43] I think it started their relationship.

Stuart Wellington

[19:45] I would probably say on a bad note.

[19:48] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[19:48] It was sort of like, you know, at the end of Speed when, like, Sandra Bullock's like,

[19:54] you know, relationships on this pressure don't work out.

[19:57] And they didn't.

Elliott Kalan

[19:58] The Cat in the Hat was also nominated that year.

Stuart Wellington

[20:01] Rough.

[20:01] That's a rough one.

[20:02] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[20:03] Charlie's Angels, Full Throttle.

[20:05] I think that that's a movie that sort of ensures itself against fatigue.

Elliott Kalan

[20:09] That's the bad guy's Justin Theroux, right?

[20:11] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[20:13] We got from Justin—

Elliott Kalan

[20:14] It's actually Henry David Theroux.

[20:15] Theroux is the bad guy in that one.

[20:16] Oh, cool.

[20:17] Yeah, yeah.

[20:19] Welcome to Walden Pond, my utopian society.

[20:23] Yeah.

[20:24] Yeah.

[20:25] Mm-hmm.

[20:26] From Justin to—

Stuart Wellington

[20:27] From Justin to Kelly.

[20:28] He got his trademark cackle down.

Elliott Kalan

[20:30] Yeah, he fucking killed it.

[20:31] Yeah.

[20:32] He got tired of it.

[20:33] People would be like, Theroux, do the cackle.

[20:34] Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

[20:35] No, really do it.

[20:36] Emerson would be like, I love it.

[20:38] I love that cackle.

Stuart Wellington

[20:38] I do see with something like From Justin to Kelly is like a—

[20:43] There's a lot of these like very of the time—

[20:47] Yes.

[20:48] —sort of movie.

[20:49] I'm assuming the year that Cool as Ice came out, that was—

[20:52] It was nominated or won or something.

Elliott Kalan

[20:54] They do dogpile and piggyback onto whatever is, like Dan said earlier, the movie that gets

[21:00] razzed the most that year.

[21:01] Did we do From Justin to Kelly?

Dan McCoy

[21:03] We did From Justin to Kelly, the movie that came out to capitalize on American Idol.

[21:09] Kelly's still a big star.

[21:11] Yeah.

[21:12] I mean, that film is pretty bad.

[21:15] It is bad.

[21:16] Did I watch it, though?

[21:17] But it's bad in the way—

[21:19] Check the archives.

Elliott Kalan

[21:21] What do you want from me?

[21:23] That movie is bad in the way that a million teen movies are.

[21:26] There's not—I don't remember anything particularly like—

[21:28] Yeah.

[21:30] —disgustingly offensive or horrendous about it.

[21:31] Elliot was like, not another teen movie.

Dan McCoy

[21:35] Meet the Spartans, I guess.

[21:37] Yeah, I think the problem was neither of them were particularly good actors, and the movie's

[21:42] plot was like even thinner than the usual version of like—

Elliott Kalan

[21:47] It was even thinner than the plot in the movie Thinner.

Dan McCoy

[21:49] Yeah.

[21:50] The last other nominee, another time capsule, The Real Cancun.

[21:57] Oh, wow.

Stuart Wellington

[21:58] Oh, wow.

[21:58] I haven't thought about that movie in a long time.

[22:00] I've never seen that.

[22:00] There's no way that's streamable, right?

[22:04] Like there's no universe where you can stream that somewhere.

Dan McCoy

[22:06] If you were not alive at the time or don't remember, that was, you know, reality programming

[22:10] was Ascendant, and this was like—instead of a documentary, this was more of a reality

[22:15] show movie.

Elliott Kalan

[22:16] They were like, can we do for movies what reality shows have done for TV?

[22:20] Yeah.

[22:20] And it turned out they couldn't.

[22:22] Yeah.

[22:22] Which was good for everyone.

[22:24] Also—

[22:24] And that was one of those ones where it was like—they were kind of promising.

[22:28] I never saw it, but I felt like the ad campaign was like, you are going to see Spring Breakers

[22:33] having sex a lot in this movie, and I have to assume it did not fulfill that promise.

Dan McCoy

[22:40] Uh, I—yeah.

[22:41] I mean, well, I mean, I don't think there was like penetration.

[22:44] Is that what you're looking for?

[22:45] I can drag you to some place on the internet.

[22:47] That's certainly what it was.

[22:47] That's not really what I'm looking for.

Elliott Kalan

[22:49] I'm just saying that it was—it was not—they were not—the movie was not positioning itself

[22:52] as a documentary, you know?

Dan McCoy

[22:54] No, no.

[22:55] It was definitely salacious.

[22:57] Mm-hmm.

[22:58] Salacious Grom, the director.

[23:00] I'm going to toss in a few other options.

[23:03] Salacious Grom and Henry David Thoreau, they just hang out cackling together.

[23:06] God.

[23:07] Yeah, it is.

[23:08] Yeah.

[23:09] Okay.

[23:10] We also have from that year House of the Dead, Uwe Boll, of course.

[23:16] Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[23:16] Did that one.

Stuart Wellington

[23:17] Dumb and Dumberer.

[23:18] House of the Dead that famously does not feature a house, I think.

[23:22] No, no.

Dan McCoy

[23:22] It's an island, I believe, of the dead.

Elliott Kalan

[23:24] Well, isn't just an island a house for trees?

[23:27] I guess you're right, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[23:29] And isn't a tree just a house for birds?

Elliott Kalan

[23:31] Mm-hmm.

[23:32] Exactly.

[23:32] And a bird is just a house for whatever's inside a bird.

[23:34] Bones, I guess.

[23:36] Yep.

[23:36] Bird bones.

Dan McCoy

[23:38] We got Dumb and Dumberer, When Harry Met Lloyd.

[23:41] Of course, the film that features neither of the stars of Dumb and Dumber.

[23:45] Yeah.

[23:45] And none of the interest.

[23:49] And of course, Boat Trip, the gay panic comedy.

Elliott Kalan

[23:52] Roger Moore's in that, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[23:54] Roger Moore.

[23:54] Like, Roger Moore is kind of the only thing that makes me-

[23:58] He classes it up.

[23:58] That I think I would enjoy in Boat Trip were I ever to watch Boat Trip, which I have not done.

[24:04] So, I got to say, out of these, I have avoided watching Boat Trip and The Cat in the Hat for years.

[24:13] Yeah.

[24:14] I think they're the ones I, I mean, maybe I'm just making assumptions because I have not seen them, but the ones I feel like have the most-

Stuart Wellington

[24:22] Notice that Dan didn't say that he has not watched The Real Cancun.

Dan McCoy

[24:27] I've not seen The Real Cancun, but at least The Real Cancun, yeah, it's hard to say.

[24:32] The Real Cancun, I assume, delivers on some of what it's trying to promise me.

[24:39] Yeah.

[24:39] So, at least it succeeds on its own level, I guess.

Elliott Kalan

[24:44] Well, we can hypothesize that, again, in not having seen it.

[24:48] In the absence of data, we can only theorize.

Stuart Wellington

[24:51] Boat Trip delivers on being a boat trip.

[24:54] I will say, Jiggly was both weirder than, it was bad in ways that I wasn't expecting it to be, but better in ways that I wasn't expecting it to be, too.

Elliott Kalan

[25:07] Jiggly was tough in that it's not good, and it's too long, and the characters are not likable, and the story doesn't always make sense, and it's offensive.

[25:15] But it is offensive in trying to do something progressive and failing, you know?

[25:21] Yeah.

[25:22] Jiggly is not good, but yeah, it has good intentions for much of the time, I guess.

[25:26] But those good intentions come out in bad ways.

Stuart Wellington

[25:29] Mm-hmm.

[25:30] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[25:30] Stuart moans quietly.

Stuart Wellington

[25:33] Yeah, Marge Simpson-ing over here.

Dan McCoy

[25:37] Yeah, so let's say boat trip to take us into our ad break, where I will tell you, the listener, about Factor Meals.

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[26:27] Yes.

[26:30] Try meats.

[26:31] Vegans out there?

[26:32] No, don't.

[26:33] Dan is really taking a stance in the culture wars all of a sudden.

Stuart Wellington

[26:36] I'm sorry.

[26:38] I'm sorry.

[26:39] That's so good.

Dan McCoy

[26:40] Words are failing me, and I mean that in the most literal sense.

[26:43] I was trying to say, looking for gourmet meals, well, why not try meals that feature premium ingredients?

[26:52] What are premium ingredients?

[26:54] Well, why not truffle butter?

[26:56] Hello?

[26:58] Shrimp?

[26:59] Filet mignon?

[27:00] Broccolini?

[27:02] Dan, you're grabbing my arm.

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[27:32] I was impressed by them.

[27:34] And I am honestly, I'm not a picky eater, but I'm a, I think, discerning eater.

[27:38] And I was like, these are really delicious and great.

[27:42] And it's nice to have a convenient way to make a meal once or around the house once in a while.

[27:49] If you don't want to go through the whole hullabaloo of cooking, even for someone like me who loves to cook.

[27:55] So, why not head to factormeals.com slash flop50 and use code flop50 to get 50% off your first box plus 20% off your next box.

Stuart Wellington

[28:16] This episode is brought to you by the spring cleaning champions, Manscaped.

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[28:35] Like, I was going through a bit of a blue patch.

[28:37] I was feeling kind of down.

[28:39] And, you know, a little bit of-

[28:41] I want to know where this is going.

Elliott Kalan

[28:43] But I also hate to laugh when you're talking about depression, but it sounded like you meant a blue patch of hair.

Stuart Wellington

[28:47] So, like the beast, you were shaving the beast.

[28:49] Yeah, I was shaving the beast.

[28:50] And I was like, oh, there's a man underneath.

[28:53] Hank McCoy.

[28:54] Yeah, Hank McCoy.

[28:55] Hello.

[28:57] This is the new Dan character.

[28:59] I was going through a bit of a blue patch.

[29:00] And I got to say, one of the best ways to get myself out of a funk is a little bit of sprucing up.

[29:06] And when sprucing up, you should always take into consideration your nether regions.

[29:12] And Manscaped just introduced the Lawn Mower 5.0 Ultra.

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[29:22] A standard one for taking a little off the top.

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[29:40] I'm a big fan of their nose hair and ear hair trimmer so that my nose hairs don't grow super long and I become some kind of weird Spider-Man villain.

[29:50] So, get 20% off.

Elliott Kalan

[29:51] Yeah, he has a lot of hair-themed villains.

Stuart Wellington

[29:53] Yeah.

[29:53] There's like a million of them, right?

[29:55] Get 20% off and free shipping with the code FLOP at Manscaped.com.

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[30:05] Nothing like a little spring cleaning in your pants.

[30:10] Mm.

Elliott Kalan

[30:11] Speaking of spring cleaning, more like spring streaming because the Flophouse has an all-new streaming event.

[30:17] You may have heard about it before this very episode.

[30:19] But I want to remind you that the Flophouse Sync Speed 2, our all-original live show where we talked about Speed 2, is going to be premiering on your computer Saturday, April 27th, and will be available to watch for three weeks after that until May 19th.

[30:34] If you go to stagepilot.com.

[30:35] If you go to stagepilot.com.

[30:36] You can buy tickets to see it whenever you want between April 27th and May 19th at your leisure.

[30:42] You can buy VIP packages where you can talk to us through your computer, mostly at your leisure.

[30:48] We'll schedule something.

[30:49] And you can also buy exclusive merchandise, some of it with art by Xander Cannon, one of the greats working in comic books today.

[30:57] Very exciting to have him doing stuff with us.

[30:59] That's stagepilot.com slash speed for all new presentations, a whole new Speed 2 talk and show.

[31:05] It was shot and edited by the people at Stagepilot, and they did a really fantastic job.

[31:10] We worked with them in the past.

[31:12] I hope to continue working with them in the future.

[31:14] It's been really great.

[31:15] We hope that you join us as we chat live with you in the chat box at that April 27th premiere.

[31:22] But if you can't make it for that, that's okay.

[31:24] Get your tickets.

[31:25] You can still watch it whenever you want until May 19th.

[31:28] That's stagepilot.com slash speed for the Flophouse Sync Speed 2.

[31:32] But hey, we've also got a live show that's not on your computer.

[31:35] It's in a venue.

[31:36] It's in a real live place.

[31:38] That venue, England.

[31:40] What?

[31:40] I should explain.

[31:41] Not the whole country.

[31:41] That's the whole venue?

[31:43] Okay.

[31:43] Oxford, England.

[31:44] We'll be at Oxford Town Hall.

[31:48] I almost said Oxford Town Hall, which is a different place that we will not be.

[31:51] Oxford Town Hall.

Dan McCoy

[31:52] We might take a look at the hole while we're there.

Elliott Kalan

[31:55] The famous Oxford Hall.

[31:56] That's true, possibly.

[31:58] Oxford Town Hall.

Dan McCoy

[31:58] Toss some shillings into it.

Elliott Kalan

[32:00] Sure.

[32:02] I'd get a wish.

[32:03] Oxford Town Hall on May 24th.

[32:05] That's right.

[32:05] May 24th, we're doing two shows in one night at Oxford Town Hall.

[32:08] We're at 7 p.m.

[32:09] We're doing The Avengers.

[32:10] At 9 p.m.

[32:11] Spice World.

[32:12] Now, that's The Avengers based on the British TV show.

[32:15] Just another example of Americans coming in and ruining a British thing, just like we did with, what, Doctor Who and a number of other properties.

[32:23] At 9 p.m.

[32:23] We're talking about Spice World, the official movie of England.

[32:27] Can't wait to talk about it.

[32:29] Just go to flophousepodcast.com slash events and then go to the Oxford English – Oxford England, not the Oxford English Dictionary.

[32:37] Go to that lookup link and then follow internet link.

Dan McCoy

[32:42] And then follow link to defeat Ganon.

Elliott Kalan

[32:45] To defeat Ganon and get the Triforce.

[32:47] Go to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

[32:49] Go to our Flophouse in Oxford England entry and then you'll find links to the shows there.

[32:55] Don't click on the buttons that say get tickets.

[32:57] For technical reasons, those just lead you back to the same page that you're already on.

[33:02] Apologies.

[33:03] So it's a little bit of a game.

[33:06] Yeah.

[33:06] And for some reason, the URL to go straight to it is flophousepodcast.com slash events slash the dash flop dash house dash in dash Oxford dash England dash late dash show.

[33:16] So just, you know what?

[33:17] It's easiest.

[33:17] Go to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

[33:20] Click on the Oxford England entry and you'll find links there for both the 7 p.m. and the 9 p.m. shows.

Dan McCoy

[33:25] You know why I did that?

[33:27] So, hey, if there's anyone out there who wants to be a webmaster for the Flophouse, get in touch with me.

[33:33] Because we had a wonderful person design our website, but they couldn't stay on as a webmaster for their own reasons.

[33:41] And so I'm working with the template that has been set long ago.

[33:46] And I couldn't do a thing that accommodated having a late and an early show in the same place without confusing the system.

[33:57] And so I put the links in separately.

Elliott Kalan

[34:00] So if anyone knows how to hack the planet and help us with that, please get in touch with Dan.

[34:04] But otherwise, go to flophousepodcast.com slash events.

[34:07] Click on the Flophouse in Oxford England two shows link and it'll take you to where you can find direct links for those tickets.

[34:14] We're super excited.

[34:15] I've said this before.

[34:16] I'll say it again.

[34:16] We've been wanting to do a show in England for a long, long time.

[34:18] We're very glad to be there.

[34:19] We love our English and general UK fans.

[34:21] It is a culmination of a dream.

[34:23] Yeah.

[34:23] Yes, not just English, but all of our fans in the UK.

[34:27] Scots, Welsh, Northern Irish, and everyone outside of the UK as well.

[34:31] We also would like you to join us.

[34:32] So if you're within flying distance of Oxford England and you like our show, why not come see us May 24th?

Stuart Wellington

[34:39] Ever since like a decade ago, and I was bartending at a beer hall in Fort Greene, Brooklyn,

[34:44] and I had some listeners show up to the bar on a Saturday night from Denmark.

[34:50] And they were like, are you Stuart from the Flophouse?

[34:52] And I was like, this was the first time anybody had ever tracked me down in a bar.

[34:56] I've been like, I have to go over the sea.

Elliott Kalan

[35:00] It took me a decade, but I did it.

[35:03] You did it.

[35:04] Yeah, finally.

[35:04] That's right.

[35:05] May 24th in Oxford, England as part of the Saint Audio Podcast Festival.

S4

[35:13] It's webby season.

[35:15] Hi, I'm Sequoia Holmes, host of the Black People Love Paramore podcast.

[35:19] And we are nominated for a webby for the episode where I interviewed Haley Williams.

[35:24] In case you're unfamiliar, Black People Love Paramore is a podcast delving into the common

[35:29] and uncommon interests of Black people in order to help us feel more seen.

[35:34] We would love your vote to help us win this webby.

[35:36] Please take a second and go over to the Black People Love Paramore podcast social media accounts,

[35:41] and you can find them at BPLPPod across all social media platforms.

[35:46] Hit the link in bio and vote for Black People Love Paramore.

S5

[35:51] Hi, I'm Travis McElroy.

S6

[35:52] And I'm Teresa McElroy.

S5

[35:54] And we're the hosts of Schmanners.

S6

[35:56] If you're looking for a good place to jump into our show,

[35:59] we really recommend either the Playgrounds episode or the Job Interviews episode.

S5

[36:05] Or if you want to go way back, you can check out the episode where we compare the differences

[36:08] between afternoon tea and high tea.

[36:11] So check out those episodes and new episodes every Friday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts.

Elliott Kalan

[36:20] And now, Dan, why don't we get back to rezzing it up on the razzle with some rezzies.

Stuart Wellington

[36:25] Razzle dazzle with the old razzle master, Dan Badazzle McCoy.

[36:32] I want Dan to be a Batman villain now called the Razzle Dazzler.

[36:35] Yeah, we're right in the name of the episode as we speak.

[36:38] So take us back in time, Dan.

[36:41] Where are we?

Dan McCoy

[36:41] Yeah, we're going to hop in the old cinematic time machine.

Elliott Kalan

[36:45] We're going to go back in time.

[36:48] Metaphorically.

[36:48] Gonna go back in time.

[36:50] But not literally.

[36:52] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[36:53] So, 2001.

[36:56] Oh, Space Odyssey.

[36:57] Mm-hmm.

[36:58] The film that won that year was Freddy Got Fingered, starring Tom Green and Rip Torn.

Stuart Wellington

[37:06] Had a little bit of a cultural re-evaluation, right?

[37:08] There's some things.

[37:09] You know what?

Elliott Kalan

[37:11] I feel like the pendulum swings on that one pretty fast.

Dan McCoy

[37:14] I wouldn't call myself a fan per se, but I respect it.

[37:18] It's a film that goes all out in its vision of assaultive comedy.

[37:23] What else we got?

[37:24] That year that was nominated, we have Driven.

[37:29] Stallone?

[37:29] Stallone, right?

[37:30] He's the race car driver.

[37:31] Oh, right.

[37:32] He's a race car driver.

[37:33] Yeah.

[37:34] Glitter?

[37:36] Mariah Carey?

[37:37] Mariah Carey.

[37:38] Yeah.

[37:38] Mariah Carey.

[37:39] Sorry.

[37:40] Pearl Harbor, of course.

[37:42] Flopper.

[37:43] Michael Bay's historic travesty.

[37:45] Oh, we didn't actually do that.

[37:46] No, we did the other one.

[37:47] We did Battleship.

[37:48] Yeah, we did Battleship.

Elliott Kalan

[37:49] A very different movie from Pearl Harbor.

[37:51] But I guess all those old Pearl Harbor survivors join at the end, right?

[37:55] And help them save the day.

[37:57] Yeah, that's why I thought that.

[37:58] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[37:58] And, of course, 3,000 miles to Graceland.

[38:02] And here's a few additions courtesy of yours truly.

[38:09] We could also add to that Corky Romano, when America collectively said,

[38:14] no thank you to Chris Kattan as a leading man.

[38:18] Crocodile Dundee in Los Angeles, a film with no jokes in it.

Elliott Kalan

[38:23] Is that the third one?

Dan McCoy

[38:25] Yes, it is the third one.

Elliott Kalan

[38:27] It must be.

[38:28] It's no jokes on purpose.

[38:29] It's a kitchen sink drama, right?

[38:30] About life on the streets.

Dan McCoy

[38:31] Well, it's like the movies became progressively more just action movies starring in Crocodile Dundee.

[38:39] That's the character's name, not, of course.

[38:42] Paul Hogan is the actual star.

[38:43] Paul Hogan.

[38:43] Yeah.

[38:44] I'm going to toss in Tomcats because...

[38:48] Fuck that shit.

[38:49] Wow, that's what I really haven't thought about in a long time.

[38:51] Bucked off with that shit.

[38:52] Wow.

[38:53] Put that in the trash.

[38:54] If the phrase Jerry O'Connell and Shannon Elizabeth in a sex comedy doesn't immediately date this to 2001,

[39:01] I don't know what else might.

Stuart Wellington

[39:04] And, of course...

[39:05] My old roommate, who's a mutual friend of Dan and mine,

[39:09] when she moved in, I think that was like one of two DVDs she owned.

[39:14] She had Tomcats?

[39:16] Yes.

[39:16] Why?

[39:18] Ask her.

[39:19] I'm going to text her right now.

Dan McCoy

[39:21] And, of course, lastly, I'm tossing in Final Fantasy, The Spirits Within.

[39:26] The film's so boring, I apologize to my ex-wife for taking her to it.

[39:31] So...

Elliott Kalan

[39:32] That's the opposite of what happened when I was dating my now wife,

[39:35] and I was going to go see Superman Returns, and it was a very hot day.

[39:39] And I'm like, oh, I'm going to see this movie.

[39:40] And she goes, it's hot out.

[39:42] Why don't I go with you?

[39:42] It'll be air-conditioned there.

[39:43] And I'm like, well, you're not going to enjoy it.

[39:45] I don't even know if I'm going to.

[39:47] It will be very...

[39:47] I think you're going to be bored.

[39:48] And she's like, I'll just go.

[39:50] And then after, she was like, you were right.

[39:51] That was very boring.

[39:52] So I feel like I pre-apologized.

Stuart Wellington

[39:54] But it did feature Elliot's favorite actor, Kevin Spacey.

Elliott Kalan

[39:57] Oh, yeah.

[39:57] Love him.

[39:58] Can't wait for his return.

[39:59] Ugh.

Dan McCoy

[40:02] Yeah, this one's tough only because I feel like, again,

[40:06] the two most sort of promising contenders for me

[40:11] for a film that I personally would dislike the most,

[40:15] I have not seen because my, you know,

[40:18] I have to protect myself a certain amount,

[40:19] even though I've made a...

[40:20] Yeah, you got to guard your heart.

[40:22] A life of watching bad movies.

[40:24] I do have my limits,

[40:25] and my limits are not watching either Corky Romano or Tomcat.

[40:29] Yeah, that's the right choice.

Elliott Kalan

[40:31] I feel like, as Stuart said before,

[40:33] though, you are curating Flop TV season two as we speak.

[40:37] I feel like it too, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[40:39] I haven't seen some of these.

[40:42] I feel like, I don't know, Pearl Harbor.

[40:46] I feel like Pearl Harbor's worthy of some critique

[40:49] because it's, like, it's this big budget thing

[40:52] that's a mess and shitty.

Dan McCoy

[40:53] Well, certainly if the Razzies were, I think,

[40:55] what their ideal version would be,

[40:57] which is, like, really, like, okay,

[41:00] here are the big movies of the year.

[41:03] Which one of these failed, you know?

[41:06] Pearl Harbor would certainly be a movie that,

[41:09] yeah, it's just, it's the dumbest,

[41:12] like, wrong, glossy version of history.

[41:16] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[41:16] But it also, it shows you how much the Razzies

[41:18] just lean into things that have celebrities in them,

[41:20] like, Driven is a pretty nothing movie for the most part,

[41:24] but I guess because it has Stallone in it,

[41:26] and, like, 3,000 Miles to Graceland

[41:28] is perfectly serviceable, you know,

[41:30] but it has big stars in it.

Stuart Wellington

[41:32] And it does open with that really cool CGI scorpion fight.

Elliott Kalan

[41:37] Yeah, they saw the Wild Bunch,

[41:39] and they were like, we don't need real things,

[41:41] real bugs fighting.

[41:42] We use CGI.

[41:44] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[41:44] Wild Bunch and ants, same movie.

[41:50] But, yeah, it's, yeah, it's hard to,

[41:52] I mean, the thing is also,

[41:53] I also have not seen Tomcats or Corky Romano,

[41:56] and I'm worried that I am unfairly.

[41:57] I'm gonna say Tomcats fucking sucks.

[42:00] Have you seen it?

[42:01] I guess your roommate owned the DVD, yeah.

Stuart Wellington

[42:03] There was definitely a,

[42:04] I mean, we're in our 20s.

[42:06] We had a limited DVD collection.

[42:09] We all got really fucking high,

[42:11] and I think we watched Tomcats,

[42:14] and then former host of the Flophouse,

[42:16] Simon Fisher, got really sick

[42:17] because he can't handle weed and barfed.

[42:20] That's what happened.

[42:21] That's the story.

[42:22] And he's not gonna listen to this,

[42:23] so he can't say I'm wrong.

Dan McCoy

[42:25] He also can't handle Tomcats.

Stuart Wellington

[42:28] Yeah, that could have been it, actually.

[42:29] That would make actually more sense.

[42:30] Maybe the Tomcats is the problem.

[42:31] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[42:31] Let us, you know,

[42:34] go ahead another year,

[42:36] 2002.

[42:37] Oh, man, just one year.

[42:38] Swept away.

[42:40] Guy Ritchie's collaboration with-

[42:43] Kind of stalled out his career, right?

[42:44] Madonna, his then wife.

Elliott Kalan

[42:46] I feel like he makes a movie,

[42:47] three movies a year.

[42:48] I mean, I think it stalled it out temporarily.

[42:51] For a little bit, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[42:53] That was what took the prize.

[42:54] Also nominated, we've got The Adventures of Pluto Nash.

Elliott Kalan

[42:59] Very bad and expensive.

Dan McCoy

[43:02] Yes.

[43:02] Crossroads, the Britney Spears movie.

Elliott Kalan

[43:05] Another pop star movie.

[43:07] That seems unfair.

Dan McCoy

[43:08] Pinocchio.

[43:09] This is the Benigni version.

[43:11] And Star Wars Episode II, Attack of the Clones.

[43:14] It's a little indie film called Star Wars Episode II.

Stuart Wellington

[43:17] Around the Jedi perimeter create.

[43:21] That's all I can say.

Elliott Kalan

[43:22] I mean, to be honest,

[43:23] Star Wars Episode II is an indie film.

[43:25] Yeah, I mean-

[43:27] Once Empire starts,

[43:27] I think Lucas was funding all those himself.

Dan McCoy

[43:30] I guess so.

[43:31] I've got some additions here.

[43:33] Okay.

[43:34] Fear.com.

[43:35] Imagine how scary it would be to log on to fear.com.

[43:40] That's a bad one.

[43:42] I'm not a fan of fear.com.

[43:44] Ballistic, X vs. Sever.

[43:46] Of course, we covered that on the last season.

[43:47] Pretty fantastic.

Elliott Kalan

[43:49] Yep.

[43:49] Can't trap us into watching that in season two.

[43:51] We watched it in season one.

Dan McCoy

[43:52] A movie we watched entirely because of how much we referenced the name.

[43:56] And I think it was my least favorite of the season.

Elliott Kalan

[43:59] That is the most-

[44:02] I mean, the thing is, what makes a bad movie?

[44:04] If something is memorably bad or if it is nothingly bad?

[44:07] Because that's the thing with X vs. Sever.

[44:08] I was like, this movie is just-

[44:09] It's like, there's nothing there.

[44:11] Like, there's nothing in it.

[44:12] It's just a-

Stuart Wellington

[44:13] I do love that Ellie just dropped a like a Gear Metal Toro movie

[44:17] monologue there.

[44:19] What is a bad movie?

[44:22] Yeah.

[44:22] Is it the ghost of a feeling?

Dan McCoy

[44:24] Allow me to open my cabinet of curiosities and see what we have.

Elliott Kalan

[44:31] I'm sorry.

[44:31] This is my wonder emporium.

[44:33] Never mind.

[44:34] I'm borrowing it from Mr. Magorium.

[44:35] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[44:37] We also have Joanna Mann.

[44:40] Okay.

[44:40] Well, that's going to get my vote, I think.

[44:42] Mann dresses like a woman to get into women's basketball comedy that is offensive in multiple

[44:47] ways.

Elliott Kalan

[44:47] You can't make a comedy like that anymore.

[44:50] I feel like there are many big name comedians who are essentially making that comedy in

[44:54] your match right now.

[44:55] Yes, all the time.

[44:56] And Netflix is like, yes, please.

[44:57] We love it.

Dan McCoy

[44:58] Yum, yum, yum.

[44:59] Master of Disguise.

[45:01] Apparently not turtly enough to get into the Golden Raspberry Club.

Stuart Wellington

[45:04] Oh, was that the comment that they said?

Dan McCoy

[45:06] I still haven't seen it.

Stuart Wellington

[45:07] I want to see that shit.

[45:08] Let's put it on.

[45:08] That's another good season two possibility.

Elliott Kalan

[45:12] The Hot Chick, another probably insensitive cross-dressing comedy with Rob Schneider in it.

Dan McCoy

[45:19] I'm sure he handled it sensitively.

[45:22] And Sorority Boys.

[45:25] What the hell was with this year?

[45:26] What was going on that year?

Elliott Kalan

[45:28] What was going on?

[45:31] You know what?

[45:32] I mean, what year is this?

[45:33] 2002?

[45:34] Yeah.

[45:35] I mean, to be honest, it's like I'm saying this is a lot of people.

[45:38] This is not a good thing.

[45:39] This is wrong.

[45:40] But I feel like at a time when the 90s was at least my experience growing up absorbing that culture.

[45:48] So much of it was people being forced to start recognizing the LGB community at least.

[45:55] Not yet the T community, but the LGB community as human beings that exist and have feelings.

[46:01] And so gender roles were changing and Hollywood reacted by making a bunch of shit that's real offensive and isn't good.

[46:08] But it feels like – I understand why that element is in the air, you know.

Stuart Wellington

[46:11] And like 9-11, guys, you know.

[46:15] You're right.

[46:16] We're going to blame The Hot Chick on 9-11.

Dan McCoy

[46:18] I'm all for it.

[46:19] Why not?

Elliott Kalan

[46:21] No, no, Dan.

[46:22] The Hot Chick's hands are not clean.

[46:24] Don't say it was in the wake of the tragedy.

Dan McCoy

[46:26] I think we have to bundle these three comedies that we can leave in the garbage and move on to 19 –

Elliott Kalan

[46:35] Yeah, it's a three-way Razzie tie, yeah.

Dan McCoy

[46:39] 1987.

[46:39] Oh, we're going back again.

[46:41] 1987.

Elliott Kalan

[46:42] Got to go back even further in time.

Dan McCoy

[46:45] Now, this is one case for – on the Criterion channel, the film that they're featuring is not one worst picture for the Razzies that year.

[46:54] I think they just wanted to feature this film because it has been re-evaluated.

[47:00] That is, of course, Ishtar.

[47:02] Elaine May's Ishtar.

[47:04] Which we did on the podcast.

[47:05] Leftover from their Elaine May series.

[47:09] I'm not sold on Ishtar.

Elliott Kalan

[47:12] I love the Criterion channel, but they do occasionally reshuffle the same movies into different collections, and I'm like, Criterion channel.

[47:18] But I do love them.

[47:19] They're my favorite streaming service.

[47:20] I also, Stuart, am not sold on Ishtar.

[47:22] I think it is not as bad as people say, but it is not as good as the people who like it say.

Dan McCoy

[47:26] Yeah, I also agree.

[47:28] For more thoughts on Ishtar, for a longer version that ends up in that conclusion, listen to our Ishtar episode.

Elliott Kalan

[47:35] Is Hodgman on that one?

[47:36] I think Hodgman may have been.

[47:38] We've had a guest.

[47:39] I think it's – I think it's – he was definitely on our –

[47:41] No, he was on 1941.

Dan McCoy

[47:43] I think that's what you're thinking of, 1941.

[47:45] Oh, maybe.

Elliott Kalan

[47:47] I mean, it's certainly not my favorite Isabella Gianni movie.

Dan McCoy

[47:50] There's certainly no way of finding out.

[47:53] Here, I'm going to Google Ishtar Flophouse to find out about our own show.

Stuart Wellington

[47:58] Okay, well, let's – I'm just going to watch over Dan's shoulders.

Elliott Kalan

[48:01] He types.

[48:01] Narrate it.

[48:02] He's only using one hand to type.

[48:03] I'm going to watch over Zoom.

[48:04] I'm going to watch Stuart's face as he watches Dan type.

[48:07] Episode 237.

Dan McCoy

[48:08] Now, there's no listed guest, but it was the last episode recorded altogether in my apartment.

[48:16] Oh, wow.

[48:16] Where you moved, Elliot.

[48:17] So, I think that maybe that's the special thing that you're remembering.

Elliott Kalan

[48:20] Maybe that's it.

[48:21] And it's certainly my feelings on Ishtar.

[48:23] I had to leave that part of the country and go somewhere else after watching it.

[48:27] Well –

[48:28] I think Ishtar is mediocre, but not a business.

Dan McCoy

[48:31] The winner that year – this may be a rare case of the Razzie's getting it right.

[48:36] We'll see.

[48:37] Leonard Part 6, a laughless spy comedy starring a sex girl.

Elliott Kalan

[48:43] Starring a monster.

[48:44] Yeah, sure.

[48:45] And not the fun kind of monster like Dracula or Frankenstein.

Dan McCoy

[48:49] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[48:51] Or Charlize Theron.

[48:52] Come on.

Dan McCoy

[48:54] The other films nominated that year, Jaws of the Revenge.

[49:00] Okay.

Elliott Kalan

[49:01] That's a fun bad movie.

[49:02] We've done a live show about it.

[49:03] That's a fun bad movie.

[49:04] Not available.

[49:04] The shark.

Dan McCoy

[49:05] But we did it once.

[49:05] Has a personal grudge against the Brodies.

[49:09] Who's that girl?

[49:10] Another Madonna.

[49:11] Never seen it.

[49:11] Oh, I've never seen it.

[49:12] It's okay.

[49:13] It's like Madonna and Griffin Dunn kind of doing an updated screwball.

[49:16] I actually don't mind it.

[49:18] Tough Guys Don't Dance.

[49:20] A movie that is nutty.

[49:22] Yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[49:22] That's the movie that I went to.

[49:25] When I was a teenager, my grandmother took me to the Museum of Modern Art.

[49:28] And they had a series going on of films in their theater that were writers directing films.

[49:35] And Tough Guys Don't Dance was the one they were showing that day.

[49:37] And my grandmother was like, well, let's go see it.

[49:38] Norman Mailer.

[49:38] Let's go see it.

[49:39] And within 10 minutes, she said, this is not for us.

[49:41] And walked out.

[49:43] And I later saw the rest of the movie.

[49:44] And it's a bonkers one.

[49:46] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[49:46] It's an experience.

[49:48] That's one that I think is, if you have fondness for bad movies, it's worth watching that one.

Elliott Kalan

[49:53] It's worth at least just for the, oh, wow.

[49:54] Oh, man.

[49:55] Oh, no.

[49:56] Whatever the scene is where he's having trouble emoting at how much trouble he's in.

Dan McCoy

[50:02] And I have the most additions for this year.

[50:05] Okay.

[50:05] This is a.

[50:06] 87.

[50:06] 87 is a banner year for big, bad movies.

[50:10] For crap.

[50:10] Listen to what I got here.

[50:13] We got Superman 4.

[50:16] John Cryer has Lex Luthor's nephew.

[50:19] My favorite of the series when I was a kid.

Stuart Wellington

[50:21] We did a riff show on that in Chicago.

[50:24] Yeah.

[50:25] Yeah, we did.

[50:25] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[50:26] We've got Mannequin, a movie that gave me Audrey and Mize.

[50:32] Karaoke duet of choice and de facto then wedding song.

[50:37] Nothing's going to stop us now, but still not good.

[50:40] Now, that wasn't the music you walked down the aisle, though, to, which was the Twin Peaks theme.

[50:44] That was true.

[50:45] We did walk down the aisle to the Twin Peaks theme.

Elliott Kalan

[50:48] A stirring tale of immortal love, the Twin Peaks.

Dan McCoy

[50:54] Walk Like a Man.

[50:56] Howie Mandel is raised by timber wolves and sniffs people's butts.

Elliott Kalan

[51:00] Oh, I'm thinking of a different movie.

[51:01] What's the movie with, I'm thinking of Heart and Souls, which uses the song Walk Like a Man in it with Robert Denny Jr.

[51:06] Never mind.

Dan McCoy

[51:09] Munchies, a movie that is nearly unwatchable, even though it has little puppet monsters in it.

[51:13] Yeah.

[51:14] Yeah.

[51:15] We've got Disorderly's, where the fat boys are going to bring up Disorderly's.

Elliott Kalan

[51:19] Bad nurses.

[51:20] They said, what if the Three Stooges were the fat boys, and that's it.

[51:23] That's the whole movie.

[51:26] Nuki.

[51:27] Elliot's beloved Nuki.

[51:28] Also covered on Flop TV.

Dan McCoy

[51:30] Oof.

[51:31] Rough.

Elliott Kalan

[51:32] Although, again, I have come to reevaluate it since watching the Garbage Pail Kids movie again.

Dan McCoy

[51:36] Well, you know what else was released in 87?

[51:37] The Garbage Pail Kids movie, which we just did here in Brooklyn.

[51:42] It'll show up on the main feed eventually.

[51:44] They don't make years like they used to.

[51:46] So, wow.

[51:47] 87.

[51:48] What?

[51:48] Yeah.

[51:48] Perhaps the worst year in cinema.

Stuart Wellington

[51:51] Yeah.

[51:52] 1939 in reverse.

[51:54] What won best picture that year?

[51:56] I'm going to look it up.

Dan McCoy

[51:56] Garbage Pail Kids.

[51:58] What?

[52:00] Yeah.

[52:01] I mean, the thing is, these are bad movies, but with the exception, I would say, of Nuki,

[52:07] and Elliot would say of Garbage Pail Kids for different reasons.

[52:11] I think Nuki's just too boring, but I think that these are a lot of fun bad movies.

[52:16] Some of them are, yeah.

Elliott Kalan

[52:17] So, if we're looking at, just to answer your question, Stuart, so usually the Oscars, they're

[52:21] for the movies from the previous year, right?

[52:23] So, in 1988, covering the movies that came out in 87, the winner was The Last Emperor.

[52:30] So, this was the year that, and nominated, and I think should have won, was Moonstruck.

[52:35] So, the same year Moonstruck and the Garbage Pail Kids came out in theaters.

[52:40] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[52:41] Two films about love.

Stuart Wellington

[52:45] Of a sort, yeah.

[52:46] There's some real stinkeroonies in that year.

[52:49] But I think, I mean, I feel like Leonard Part 6 is a solid choice.

[52:52] Yeah.

[52:53] I think they did it right that time.

[52:54] We've got to give it to the Razzies.

Elliott Kalan

[52:56] Well, even a stopped clock is right sometimes when it comes to a criminal being in a movie.

Dan McCoy

[53:00] Even a stopped clock razzes correctly every once in a while.

[53:07] So, yeah.

[53:08] That was a little trip down memory lane of bad movies past.

Stuart Wellington

[53:13] And also, Dan's off-launching a slate of films for us to watch.

Elliott Kalan

[53:18] Yeah.

[53:18] Next time, can we take a trip down Nathan Lane?

[53:20] That sounds like more fun.

Stuart Wellington

[53:22] I highly recommend watching Dick's the Musical if you're looking for a trip down Nathan Lane.

Dan McCoy

[53:28] Yeah.

[53:28] And if Criterion Channel wants to toss us a couple of bucks for this unpaid advertisement for their service.

Stuart Wellington

[53:35] I keep asking Shudder to do the same thing.

[53:38] Yeah.

Dan McCoy

[53:39] You know, some swag would be fine, too.

[53:42] That's also good.

[53:42] I mean, we should.

[53:43] Whatever we can squeeze out of this.

Elliott Kalan

[53:45] I mean, the fact is also that we know someone who works there, so we can get swag.

Dan McCoy

[53:51] Yeah, but it's not as much fun that way.

[53:53] Yeah, that's true.

Elliott Kalan

[53:53] One of my best friends of all time.

[53:54] You have to earn it.

[53:55] So, it works there.

Stuart Wellington

[53:55] So, that's true.

[53:56] It's different when you have to call in a favor from a friend as opposed to getting swag for just being like Dan McCoy.

Dan McCoy

[54:04] Yeah, man.

[54:04] You know?

[54:05] Yeah.

[54:05] Just being the coolest dude.

[54:06] The coolest dude.

[54:08] On that note.

[54:10] Stuart finally giving me.

Elliott Kalan

[54:12] The quote that's on his posters now.

[54:14] The coolest dude.

[54:16] Oh, wow.

[54:17] Dan already got business cards.

Dan McCoy

[54:19] Sunglasses giving a big thumbs up.

[54:25] Hey, thanks for listening.

[54:26] This has been the Flophouse.

[54:28] Flophouse mini edition.

[54:30] And if you enjoy this, maybe give us a good review on iTunes.

[54:35] Tell a friend.

[54:36] Do whatever you got to do to get the word out there.

[54:37] You don't got to do anything, but do whatever is in your heart.

[54:41] Thanks to Alex Smith.

[54:42] Our producer.

[54:43] He goes by Howell Dottie on the internet.

[54:47] Just to make it harder for us to direct people to him at the end of these podcasts.

[54:52] Because people don't know how to spell that.

[54:54] Made up name.

[54:56] But we love him.

[54:57] All names are made up.

[54:58] He does great things.

[55:00] We also love our network, Maximum Fun.

[55:02] Go to MaximumFun.org.

[55:04] Check out other podcasts on the network.

[55:07] I'm sure you will find something that you enjoy.

[55:10] But for now, I have been Dan McCoy.

Elliott Kalan

[55:14] I've been Stuart Wellington.

[55:15] And I'm Elliot Kalin saying, hey, when life gets you resin, make resin-aid.

[55:29] Maximum Fun.

[55:30] Maximum Fun.

Dan McCoy

[55:32] A worker-owned network.

[55:34] Of artist-owned shows.

[55:35] Supported.

[55:36] Directly.

[55:37] By you.

FH Mini 101 - The Razzies Are Always Wrong

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